I really want to like this game but it is terrible for new players...

[ModeratelyFatman.4381]

I'm really not a brand new player any more (150 hours in) but I have been trying to play this game in the correct order. I've finished the main campaign, cleared most of the main map and currently working my way through Living World, season 1 and 2.

I'd have to say that Living World 1/2 has been a truly horrible experience. I spent three hours trying to get through the Tower of Nightmares before I found out it was a group dungeon. I quit that and skipped ahead to finish season 1.
In season 2, I'm currently trying to fight a dragon in the Mystery Cave. I have spent 2 hours dying again and again. The problem is that I can't move enough and the moment I get hit, I get CC'd and bounced around until I'd dead. So it looks like I'm skipping this part of the story too.
I don't know if this is because I'm playing this game incorrectly: are Living World episodes meant to be done by a small group or can they be soloed by relatively inexperienced players?
Do the later additions to the game follow this same format or does the story content become more single player friendly?

Edited October 7 by ModeratelyFatman.4381

[Randulf.7614]

Tower of Nightmares is a group instance, but the story section doesn't require more than the entrance event. All of LS1 can be done solo, but it's an outlier because LS1 is a recent re-introduction that had to be changed from its original, temporary form from 2013 which was a series of month long group encounters. I'd argue skipping LS1 is fine since it wasn't available for a lot of the game's lifespan and many players didn't experience it until 2022 (I think).

All of the LS2 story is soloable and is much easier now than it was in 2014 due to power creep. But bosses in LS2 (and in some later seasons) focus heavily on mechanics to beat. The Dragon in the cave requires understanding of how to use the torches and defeat the shadows. It feels hard because the game has jumped in difficulty from the core game which can feel very different from the rest of the game. From here onwards it's a mixture. Some of it gets easier, some of it inserts similar boss difficulties. All of it is designed and balanced for single players.

Suggestions:

- Check and make sure you have decent armour. Using exotics and stats to match what your class is doing. Are you all defence? All offence? Or balanced?

- Are your traits, utility skills and weapons the right ones? Experiment if they aren't working. The game's combat encourages switching it up when needed

- Have you understood the mechanics in the instance and ensured you have a good understanding of how to mitigate damage - primarily from dodge, but also class specific sources

If you are confident with all of the above, then don't feel you can't ask for help. It's a multiplayer game and whilst the story is designed to be soloed, people will always be happy to come and help if need be. 

Edited October 7 by Randulf.7614

[Tinker.6924]

2 hours ago, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I spent three hours trying to get through the Tower of Nightmares before I found out it was a group dungeon

How can you NOT know this was a group instance??  It literally asks you about joining with a party/squad when you talk to the npc.

[Lucy.3728]

2 hours ago, Randulf.7614 said:

All of it is designed and balanced for single players.

Except this one instance in Ice Brood Saga where you need ppl to handle the forge dude. I've one char stuck there.

[Randulf.7614]

38 minutes ago, Lucy.3728 said:

Except this one instance in Ice Brood Saga where you need ppl to handle the forge dude. I've one char stuck there.

If you are on EU I am happy to help with that one

[Schimmi.6872]

1 hour ago, Lucy.3728 said:

Except this one instance in Ice Brood Saga where you need ppl to handle the forge dude. I've one char stuck there.

Forging Steel is often called a strike, but it's actually a bit different because it scales down depending on the player numbers, so it can be done by soloplayers too, like DRMs.

[Lucy.3728]

48 minutes ago, Schimmi.6872 said:

Forging Steel is often called a strike, but it's actually a bit different because it scales down depending on the player numbers, so it can be done by soloplayers too, like DRMs.

How do you do the phase alone where several people have to stand on the platforms/pushers at the forge to trigger something to move on?

[Schimmi.6872]

1 hour ago, Lucy.3728 said:

How do you do the phase alone where several people have to stand on the platforms/pushers at the forge to trigger something to move on?

Haven't done it for a long time, but I think the buttons just had to be activated and you didn't had to stay on them

[Zev.3489]

1 hour ago, Lucy.3728 said:

How do you do the phase alone where several people have to stand on the platforms/pushers at the forge to trigger something to move on?

Did you try standing on one then the other? 

[Antycypator.9874]

7 hours ago, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

The problem is that I can't move enough and the moment I get hit, I get CC'd and bounced around until I'd dead. So it looks like I'm skipping this part of the story too.

Some skills have a "break-stun" function and it's really good to have one on your skill bar.

Don't want to die? Then be prepared for everything — mobility, stun-break, condi cleanse, additional healing. Honestly, the most valuable thing you can do — read traits/skills and create a build that fits your playstyle.

[Teknomancer.4895]

1 hour ago, Lucy.3728 said:

How do you do the phase alone where several people have to stand on the platforms/pushers at the forge to trigger something to move on?

Look around the environment for interactable rocks/boulders/heavy objects? If there are any, pick one up and put it down on the pads as needed, stand on the last one. I'm not sure about that specific mission but there are a few here and there like that: put thing on pad A, stand on pad B, unlock achieved.

[anninke.7469]

14 hours ago, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I'm really not a brand new player any more (150 hours in) but I have been trying to play this game in the correct order. I've finished the main campaign, cleared most of the main map and currently working my way through Living World, season 1 and 2.

I'd have to say that Living World 1/2 has been a truly horrible experience. I spent three hours trying to get through the Tower of Nightmares before I found out it was a group dungeon. I quit that and skipped ahead to finish season 1.
In season 2, I'm currently trying to fight a dragon in the Mystery Cave. I have spent 2 hours dying again and again. The problem is that I can't move enough and the moment I get hit, I get CC'd and bounced around until I'd dead. So it looks like I'm skipping this part of the story too.
I don't know if this is because I'm playing this game incorrectly: are Living World episodes meant to be done by a small group or can they be soloed by relatively inexperienced players?
Do the later additions to the game follow this same format or does the story content become more single player friendly?

You know what? The Mystery Cave IS horrible. I hate it with passion to this day (been playing for 9 years) and whenever I need to do it again for whatever reason, my husband has to go with me and practically carry my sorry behind through the fight. Which is also my recommendation - get someone to suffer with you, if you can.

[corwin.3495]

On 10/7/2024 at 3:31 PM, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I'm really not a brand new player any more (150 hours in) but I have been trying to play this game in the correct order. I've finished the main campaign, cleared most of the main map and currently working my way through Living World, season 1 and 2.

I'd have to say that Living World 1/2 has been a truly horrible experience. I spent three hours trying to get through the Tower of Nightmares before I found out it was a group dungeon. I quit that and skipped ahead to finish season 1.
In season 2, I'm currently trying to fight a dragon in the Mystery Cave. I have spent 2 hours dying again and again. The problem is that I can't move enough and the moment I get hit, I get CC'd and bounced around until I'd dead. So it looks like I'm skipping this part of the story too.
I don't know if this is because I'm playing this game incorrectly: are Living World episodes meant to be done by a small group or can they be soloed by relatively inexperienced players?
Do the later additions to the game follow this same format or does the story content become more single player friendly?

What class are you playing? 

[Cyninja.2954]

On 10/7/2024 at 3:31 PM, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I spent three hours trying to get through the Tower of Nightmares before I found out it was a group dungeon. I quit that and skipped ahead to finish season 1.

and

Quote

In season 2, I'm currently trying to fight a dragon in the Mystery Cave. I have spent 2 hours dying again and again. The problem is that I can't move enough and the moment I get hit, I get CC'd and bounced around until I'd dead. So it looks like I'm skipping this part of the story too.

You seem to be the sort of player which enjoys banging your head against a wall, hoping the next time it'll hurt less and eventually the wall will come down. While that migh be seen as commendable tenacity, here is my advice to you:

Once you notice something is not working, change your approach. If need be go and consult a guide if you can't figure this out on your own. The living world season 2 story is ages old content and has dozens if not more guides out.

If you are struggling with build craft (you are), then go and try to read up or watch guides on how to improve your build.

Quote

Do the later additions to the game follow this same format or does the story content become more single player friendly?

Let me put it this way: the entire story is very single player friendly. Some steps require a minimum understanding of game mechanics, which you currently lack. If you stick with your approach of not adapting, you will have a bad time at some of the later fights. Otherwise it can be very easy going.

[ModeratelyFatman.4381]

14 hours ago, corwin.3495 said:

What class are you playing? 

I'm on an overland virtuoso.

[Teknomancer.4895]

2 hours ago, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I'm on an overland virtuoso.

"Overland?"  OK whatever, no clue what that's supposed to mean but anyway:

1. Switch to Chrono. That gives you 25% faster movement speed, skill rewinds and all kinds of fun tricks (including better access to Alac/Quick) that let you evade or ignore incoming. Mirage could also be decent here with Jaunt and Mirage Cloak, but you won't have the same access to increased speed. YMMV.
2. If Blink is not on your skillbar for this mission, put it there.
3. After lighting the fires try to stay in the middle as much as possible, otherwise you'll have a hard time reaching and burning down the fire-snuffers.
4. Stick with a good high-DPS ranged weapon; melee is not terribly useful in the Mystery Cave. I haven't been to that mission since land-spears happened, but since they're mainly melee AoE, I don't think it will be all that much better for this.
5. If you can't get under Braham's prot domes in time, then DODGE or DISTORT your way out of incoming whenever possible.
6. Pray to Lyssa that it will all be over soon.

This mission was released before any e-specs existed, so it is entirely possible to complete it solo on a Core build. You need to adjust your approach.

Edited October 9 by Teknomancer.4895
clarity, minor add

[ModeratelyFatman.4381]

2 hours ago, Teknomancer.4895 said:

"Overland?"  OK whatever, no clue what that's supposed to mean but anyway:

1. Switch to Chrono. That gives you 25% faster movement speed, skill rewinds and all kinds of fun tricks (including better access to Alac/Quick) that let you evade or ignore incoming. Mirage could also be decent here with Jaunt and Mirage Cloak, but you won't have the same access to increased speed. YMMV.
2. If Blink is not on your skillbar for this mission, put it there.
3. After lighting the fires try to stay in the middle as much as possible, otherwise you'll have a hard time reaching and burning down the fire-snuffers.
4. Stick with a good high-DPS ranged weapon; melee is not terribly useful in the Mystery Cave. I haven't been to that mission since land-spears happened, but since they're mainly melee AoE, I don't think it will be all that much better for this.
5. If you can't get under Braham's prot domes in time, then DODGE or DISTORT your way out of incoming whenever possible.
6. Pray to Lyssa that it will all be over soon.

This mission was released before any e-specs existed, so it is entirely possible to complete it solo on a Core build. You need to adjust your approach.

Thanks!

[corwin.3495]

4 hours ago, ModeratelyFatman.4381 said:

I'm on an overland virtuoso.

Yeap not all classes are good for open world, even the story. Virtuoso might be good in instanced 5/10 man content but it can be tricky to play solo, from the little experience I've had. It seems that the guy above knows a lot more about it. 

[Teknomancer.4895]

Honestly waiting for Rox and Braham to do their jobs while you're locked in the arena is the most irritating part of the thing.

Their "help" often comes too late, too soon or too far away, then you have to deal with the treacherous arena environment until they get their acts together again.

Yes it's very frustrating, but entirely soloable.

Edited Thursday at 04:32 PM by Teknomancer.4895
link

[Lucy.3728]

I had a terrible situation yesterday:

Played Story in Istan (I think) with someone. He opened the instance. He was crushed by big stompers. And I couldn't operate the chains that stop these stompers (to rez him). Because only the opener can interact with story content (that's so stupid - anti team game system).
I couldn't rez him either because the stompers kept coming down, on his corpse. A self-rez would also be useless because he would have been crushed again immediately.
I also had the achievement of getting to the end of the last chain without dying. That's why I didn't want to die.

In the end, we had no choice but to play the whole thing again from the beginning because the system is so unfriendly. So team-unfriendly. Team just means someone else does it. Apart from the one who starts, everyone else can't do anything in such situations.

It would be really great if the dead player could simply revive himself at a checkpoint (that was before the stomping). This is also offered when the whole group is dead. But it's no use to the group if the non-death achievement is ruined (he didn't need it anymore, but I did).

 

Edited October 9 by Lucy.3728

[Teknomancer.4895]

I'm pretty sure that part of the mission is right before the first checkpoint. 🤬

37 minutes ago, Lucy.3728 said:

I couldn't operate the chains that stop these stompers (to rez him). Because only the opener can interact with story content (that's so stupid - anti team game system).

Agreed, that really should be something any player in the party can do. Especially if the instance owner is downed or defeated.

[willow.8209]

On 10/7/2024 at 11:48 AM, Schimmi.6872 said:

Forging Steel is often called a strike, but it's actually a bit different because it scales down depending on the player numbers, so it can be done by soloplayers too, like DRMs.

it's possible (I have soloed it and I'm no better than middling--but it took me a very long time), but it is not easy because of the mechanics and the HP of that last boss. If you can find even get 1 person to come with you that will help a lot. 

There was this one story, I forgot which now, where I had to do kill adds near the boss to damage it (not to make it vulnerable to normal weapons but to just to damage it in any way), yet avoid getting killed by the boss which had a lot of AOE dmg. And the adds didn't respawn in case the boss ran away while you were killing adds, or in case you had to dodge out of AOE and the adds followed you. Even after guessing the add mechanic, confirming it on the wiki, I couldn't do it. But, the wiki said the boss was vulnerable to two kinds of damage and one sounded like something necro could do. I gave my necro a core minion spec and finished that way. I felt that shouldn't have been necessary but I really couldn't do it on the other (which was normally a reliable class to me). 

[Futeko.9405]

On 10/7/2024 at 7:17 PM, Lucy.3728 said:

Except this one instance in Ice Brood Saga where you need ppl to handle the forge dude. I've one char stuck there.

There are a few mechanics you need to experiment with/understand before you can effectively down that boss solo:

1. The "Blast Doors" buttons that light up are very difficult to activate solo due to the short time to get onto them. They are however not necessary for the fight at all - they just raise doors to protect the area from some of the boss' AoEs. They are more useful with a higher number of players/with some CMs enabled because the pressure on the tank's HP is much more intense then, and raising blast doors to protect it becomes almost essential.

For solo play you can essentially ignore those blast door buttons - just make sure to avoid the AoEs yourself and keep the tank alive with scrap dropped by the dwarves.

2. Essentially, your biggest moment to deal damage is during the "burn phase" - when the boss gets a CC bar and you can stun it. This is on a timer, there's nothing you can do to make it happen faster - so you just need to run around, destroy portals, collect ammo, stay alive and keep the tank alive until the burn phase happens (you'll get an advance warning, something about "vents" opening in 30 seconds, you'll see that under the event objectives).

Now, when the CC bar appears, the tank will position itself in front of the boss; hop into the tank and use the harpoon to break the boss' CC bar. What is not intuitive there, is that it's not a "fire and forget" skill. You need to spam that key. Imagine you're pulling on the chain each time you hit that key - it's what's actually happening: each key press is CC damage. Ignore whatever cooldown is displayed on the button, there's actually practically none as long as the harpoon is attached. If you just throw the harpoon and don't spam the key, you'll do minimal CC damage and will not manage to break the CC bar before the phase ends.

When the CC bar breaks, shoot the boss with the tank (spam 1). Make sure you have full ammo before the burn phase so you don't run out. You might need 2-3 phases to bring the boss down.

(IMHO Forging Steel was the best part of IBS for me. Great writing, great music. Really exacerbated how horribly lazy and stiff the writing was for the rest of IBS - like having a great rock band as the opening act to a 5-year old fumbling on a recorder for the rest of the set).

[Randulf.7614]

20 hours ago, Lucy.3728 said:

I had a terrible situation yesterday:

Played Story in Istan (I think) with someone. He opened the instance. He was crushed by big stompers. And I couldn't operate the chains that stop these stompers (to rez him). Because only the opener can interact with story content (that's so stupid - anti team game system).
I couldn't rez him either because the stompers kept coming down, on his corpse. A self-rez would also be useless because he would have been crushed again immediately.
I also had the achievement of getting to the end of the last chain without dying. That's why I didn't want to die.

In the end, we had no choice but to play the whole thing again from the beginning because the system is so unfriendly. So team-unfriendly. Team just means someone else does it. Apart from the one who starts, everyone else can't do anything in such situations.

It would be really great if the dead player could simply revive himself at a checkpoint (that was before the stomping). This is also offered when the whole group is dead. But it's no use to the group if the non-death achievement is ruined (he didn't need it anymore, but I did).

 

Story instances aren't designed for teams, they're designed for solo. So yes, in that respect they are team unfriendly

I do agree everyone should be able to interact with the objects. Didn't the person get the prompt to rez back at the start of the puzzle though?

[willow.8209]

15 hours ago, Futeko.9405 said:

What is not intuitive there, is that it's not a "fire and forget" skill. You need to spam that key. Imagine you're pulling on the chain each time you hit that key - it's what's actually happening: each key press is CC damage. Ignore whatever cooldown is displayed on the button, there's actually practically none as long as the harpoon is attached.

oh thanks, I didn't know that part.