Thief worries me. It will dominate hard.

Fat Disgrace.4275 · March 2, 2018

@Kondor.2904 said:Remove ecto from the game. Thank you.

ectos are needed for crafting :angry:

Alatar.7364 · March 2, 2018

@Kondor.2904 said:Remove ecto from the game. Thank you.

I agree that it's rather funny I win button, but on the other hand only certain aspects about it could be nerfed. For example 2,5 sec Resistance when chained with Improvisation for 5secs is on the edge of OK, while the doubling up on Quickness, Resistance (for 2x5sec) and Protection (2x10) can be really too much. Especially in S/D build due to Endless Stamina trait.

Turk.5460 · March 2, 2018

@Alatar.7364 said:
@Kondor.2904 said:Remove ecto from the game. Thank you.

I agree that it's rather funny

I win

button, but on the other hand only certain aspects about it could be nerfed. For example 2,5 sec Resistance when chained with Improvisation for 5secs is on the edge of OK, while the doubling up on Quickness, Resistance (for 2x5sec) and Protection (2x10) can be really too much. Especially in S/D build due to Endless Stamina trait.

Ehhhh, people still think Consume Plasma is op? Meanwhile professions like Elementalist and Engineer fart out protection whenever they take a step....

MithranArkanere.8957 · March 2, 2018

I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.

Fortunately, now we have a tool to have it both ways: Skill ammo.

Give several of their skills an ammo count, and you can balance them by altering the number of charges and the recharge of each charge. Still allowing bursts and spam of skills, but at the same time being able to control how much some skills can be spammed.

Alatar.7364 · March 3, 2018

@Turk.5460 said:
@Alatar.7364 said:
@Kondor.2904 said:Remove ecto from the game. Thank you.

I agree that it's rather funny

I win

button, but on the other hand only certain aspects about it could be nerfed. For example 2,5 sec Resistance when chained with Improvisation for 5secs is on the edge of OK, while the doubling up on Quickness, Resistance (for 2x5sec) and Protection (2x10) can be really too much. Especially in S/D build due to Endless Stamina trait.

Ehhhh, people still think Consume Plasma is op? Meanwhile professions like Elementalist and Engineer fart out protection whenever they take a step....

I don't think it's OP.

Aza.2105 · March 3, 2018

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

PearlJam.4607 · March 3, 2018

D/p will beat anything, if player is good. Also don't forget, thief is not 1 vs 1 character, it's +1. His main power capping, decaping and assisting. S/d is only good if another team doesn't have d/p. About other builds...they aren't thieves...they are just mehhh...

Legatus.3608 · March 3, 2018

@Lexani.6152 said:D/p will beat anything, if player is good. Also don't forget, thief is not 1 vs 1 character, it's +1. His main power capping, decaping and assisting. S/d is only good if another team doesn't have d/p. About other builds...they aren't thieves...they are just mehhh...

First of all even sindrener I am pretty sure will tell you this is flat out false. Anyone in top bracket pvp will tell you its false, DP thief does not 1v1 anything.Second, even the fights thief can win 1v1, many of them are time-sink losses in the end because the thief cannot stand on the point while fighting the opponent.

This is just more obvious thief hate spam from someone who probably tried to run glass ele and got killed by a dp thief.

The true part of this post is that thief is mainly capping, decapping, and assisting. But if thief is so good at everything why is thief relegated to stealing nodes?

TLDR contradicting yourself in your own post to what ends, I have no idea. I'm not even sure what the point is of this post tbh. Are you saying thief is OP? You saying its OK? I can't tell actually, pls clarify what your point is

MithranArkanere.8957 · March 3, 2018

@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

Crab Fear.1624 · March 3, 2018

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

MithranArkanere.8957 · March 4, 2018

@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

Alatar.7364 · March 4, 2018

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.What....

PearlJam.4607 · March 5, 2018

@Legatus.3608 said:
@"Lexani.6152" said:D/p will beat anything, if player is good. Also don't forget, thief is not 1 vs 1 character, it's +1. His main power capping, decaping and assisting. S/d is only good if another team doesn't have d/p. About other builds...they aren't thieves...they are just mehhh...

First of all even sindrener I am pretty sure will tell you this is flat out false. Anyone in top bracket pvp will tell you its false, DP thief does not 1v1 anything.Second, even the fights thief can win 1v1, many of them are time-sink losses in the end because the thief cannot stand on the point while fighting the opponent.

This is just more obvious thief hate spam from someone who probably tried to run glass ele and got killed by a dp thief.

The true part of this post is that thief is mainly capping, decapping, and assisting. But if thief is so good at everything why is thief relegated to stealing nodes?

TLDR contradicting yourself in your own post to what ends, I have no idea. I'm not even sure what the point is of this post tbh. Are you saying thief is OP? You saying its OK? I can't tell actually, pls clarify what your point is

Dude, you should read before answering. When I say "can beat anything" I am also stating that it's not 1 vs 1 class, thief job is to be +1 and when he is +1 he can do anything. And I am talking about d/p build. I honestly can't understand why you answering if you haven't read my post. I main thief, and it's d/p. I also roam with it in wvw, it's harder ofc, but it's fun. Any class played by a player who knows it will be good class. Thief weak? Depends on you only, good thief avoids battles he can't win and supports his teammates, is mobile. Like I said, read before answering.

Legatus.3608 · March 5, 2018

@Lexani.6152 said:
@Legatus.3608 said:
@Lexani.6152 said:D/p will beat anything, if player is good. Also don't forget, thief is not 1 vs 1 character, it's +1. His main power capping, decaping and assisting. S/d is only good if another team doesn't have d/p. About other builds...they aren't thieves...they are just mehhh...

First of all even sindrener I am pretty sure will tell you this is flat out false. Anyone in top bracket pvp will tell you its false, DP thief does not 1v1 anything.Second, even the fights thief can win 1v1, many of them are time-sink losses in the end because the thief cannot stand on the point while fighting the opponent.

This is just more obvious thief hate spam from someone who probably tried to run glass ele and got killed by a dp thief.

The true part of this post is that thief is mainly capping, decapping, and assisting. But if thief is so good at everything why is thief relegated to stealing nodes?

TLDR contradicting yourself in your own post to what ends, I have no idea. I'm not even sure what the point is of this post tbh. Are you saying thief is OP? You saying its OK? I can't tell actually, pls clarify what your point is

Dude, you should read before answering. When I say "can beat anything" I am also stating that it's not 1 vs 1 class, thief job is to be +1 and when he is +1 he can do anything. And I am talking about d/p build. I honestly can't understand why you answering if you haven't read my post. I main thief, and it's d/p. I also roam with it in wvw, it's harder ofc, but it's fun. Any class played by a player who knows it will be good class. Thief weak? Depends on you only, good thief avoids battles he can't win and supports his teammates, is mobile. Like I said, read before answering.

No that's fine, your post was a little off from what your intention was I think. Many ppl will read that and think thief is too good like op does.

The problem I have with your post is the "dp will beat anything" comment. There are plenty of team comps and situations where dp CANNOT beat it.

I've seen sindrener do some pretty amazing stuff but tbh I've seen similar stuff from people like vaans on other classes, so overall I don't see thief being great at anything except... well, being a thief. Which doesn't always win games.

And about the +1 and decaps role, I've seen enough games where the other team can afford to park a bunker on their home and not worry about thief because I can't outkill my teams rallybotting in mid either.

babazhook.6805 · March 5, 2018

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

I can get on my Warrior and use a number of skills in quick succession. They may not be the same skill , but there a greater pool of the same. As example (not considering the #1 aattack which is the same across both classes as far as accessibility) , I have 8 skills in total that can be used one right after the other. By the time I cycle through them , the ones first used are generally off Cooldown. A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used. In other words when waiting on INI all he can do is his #1 as far as weapon skills concerned. His attacks stop, his weapon defenses are gone. He does not have 60 ini to keep on using unload.

The INI system is FINE. It balances itself in that a thief expending his INI one one given skill , sacrifices the ability to use other weapon skills. Ifa thief burns off all his ini on unload , he has nothing left for his blind on number 5. He has enhanced his offense while sacrificing defense and in so doing any thief spamming an unload had better be certain he gets a kill via the same or he is going to be countered hard.

When a thief MISSES with an unload and it dodged, his acccess to other weapon skills is diminished. When my Warrior misses with his Cyclone Axe, his other weapon skills are still fully accessible.

Turk.5460 · March 5, 2018

@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Sindrener.1592 · March 5, 2018

Teef is weak wtf need steal to reset with improv

Alatar.7364 · March 5, 2018

@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Wut

Turk.5460 · March 5, 2018

@Alatar.7364 said:
@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Wut

Unload costs 5 Initiative.If all hits connect, 2 initiative are refunded.Under this circumstance, Unload costs a NET of 3 initiative.Thief has (realistically, since trickery is BiS) 15 initiative.15/3 = 5 unloads.Each unload takes 1.5s to cast (maybe less if quickness is a factor).Thief naturally regenerates initiative at 1 per second.5 unloads = 7.5 seconds = 7 initiative available for the 6th' unload.

Hope this helps...

Imperadordf.2687 · March 5, 2018

@bluri.2653 said:Teef is weak kitten need steal to reset with improv

Thats weak pfft we need steal to reset when we steal

Alatar.7364 · March 5, 2018

@Turk.5460 said:
@Alatar.7364 said:
@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Wut

Unload costs 5 Initiative.If all hits connect, 2 initiative are refunded.Under this circumstance, Unload costs a NET of 3 initiative.Thief has (realistically, since trickery is BiS) 15 initiative.15/3 = 5 unloads.Each unload takes 1.5s to cast (maybe less if quickness is a factor).Thief naturally regenerates initiative at 1 per second.5 unloads = 7.5 seconds = 7 initiative available for the 6th' unload.

Hope this helps...

You made it sound like Thief regenerates 7 Ini per 1.5 sec. That's why .=)

FyzE.3472 · March 6, 2018

@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

Equip a pistol, equip another one. Press 3 10 times.

babazhook.6805 · March 6, 2018

@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Predicated of course on all of the unloads hitting with the target not evading or dodging one. If they dodged a single one then they have diminished thief INI pool for no effect. If any thief is abl to hit with 6 consecutive unloads on a single target it a L2p issue on the part of that target. I daresay any class able to get off 6 seperate attacks even if they NOT the same against a single target wherein said target does not dodge evade or mitigate any is going to prevail in the matchup as well.

Quite frankly I think unload is one of the most elegantly balanced of skills when it comes to INI , avoidance and its capabilities. Avoid the shot and the thief suffers what is in essence a double whammy. No damage for the ini burned and more ini burned due to the miss. It is a built in penalty for skill spam WHICH the target is in control of. That 1.5 second channel, while recharging a bit of INI through its duration means in GAME terms there generally a net loss of INI given 2 ini lost if any portion of the unload msses. Ie dodge at the .5 second mark and the full 6 cost paid. Dodge at the 1 second mark and the full 6 ini is paid. Dodging one impacts the availability of the next. It akin to dodging a COR and having all of the other revenants weapon skills gain a higher cooldown.

MithranArkanere.8957 · March 6, 2018

@babazhook.6805 said:
@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.

That would be if they merely got recharges. Revenants can't use the same skill twice. But thieves are meant to be able to use the same skill twice. But then you have traits and skills that let them recover initiative, and that means being able to use a skill not just 2,3 4 for times in rapid succession, but sometimes over 10. And that's a bit too much.

That's why just recharges would not do, but skill ammo does the trick perfectly.

What skill can be used 10 times?

With traits and skills that recover initiative, many skills can. One of the worse offenders is Unload, which can be used over 20 times in succession under the right circumstances.

20 times? Even if every unload hits for the entire channel that is 60 initiative. A Thief can have at most 15. They can get 6 from RFI and 2 from a steal. Thats still a long ways from 60. Can you define the "right circumstances"?.

A thief can perform at most three unloads before he needs another source of INI and while he waits on that INI his other 7 weapon skills can not be used.

Well, 6, as unload refunds 2 if all of them hit. The 6th from the 7 or so initiative you are gaining just from the regen over the 1.5s cast time of each unload.

Predicated of course on all of the unloads hitting with the target not evading or dodging one. If they dodged a single one then they have diminished thief INI pool for no effect. If any thief is abl to hit with 6 consecutive unloads on a single target it a L2p issue on the part of that target. I daresay any class able to get off 6 seperate attacks even if they NOT the same against a single target wherein said target does not dodge evade or mitigate any is going to prevail in the matchup as well.

Quite frankly I think unload is one of the most elegantly balanced of skills when it comes to INI , avoidance and its capabilities. Avoid the shot and the thief suffers what is in essence a double whammy. No damage for the ini burned and more ini burned due to the miss. It is a built in penalty for skill spam WHICH the target is in control of. That 1.5 second channel, while recharging a bit of INI through its duration means in GAME terms there generally a net loss of INI given 2 ini lost if any portion of the unload msses. Ie dodge at the .5 second mark and the full 6 cost paid. Dodge at the 1 second mark and the full 6 ini is paid. Dodging one impacts the availability of the next. It akin to dodging a COR and having all of the other revenants weapon skills gain a higher cooldown.

That would be true if the damage was in line with other similar skills and initiative recovered much slower. You can be a staff/hammer herald with energy sigils, evade a lot, endure with infuse light, block with staff 3 and hammer 4, pop Jalis and use the hammers and the ritual to get more defense, and they can still spam unloads even if none of the previous attacks hit. Guardian with bubbles? Elementalist with focus? Engineer with turrets and shield? All will experience the same thing.

Revenant energy and initiative recharge faster than what people realize. It's just that when you run out of a profession's resource it's something negative, and people notice negative things more often and more intensely than positive things.

Unless the thief is horribly bat and get themselves killed hitting someone reflecting or with Retaliation, or can't properly recover their own initiative, they will still have more than enough initiative to kill anyone when the enemy runs out of defenses after continuous unload spam. At which point you are limited to use the environment for defense, move behind pillars and such. But GW2's maps are horribly lacking in cover, and it's rather unreliable. That leaves only leaving and hoping an ally will come. But if you leave they take the point, and if an ally comes that means they are not somewhere else, and the thief can just run faster than you to that other point and keep on doing its thing.

Turk.5460 · March 6, 2018

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@Turk.5460 said:
@babazhook.6805 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Crab Fear.1624 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:
@Aza.2105 said:
@MithranArkanere.8957 said:I keep saying that thieves need some recharges in their weapon skills so they can't be spammed as much. But giving them recharges would completely break the pace of their attacks and make their initiative mechanic pointless. So it couln't be done.
It would become just like Rev's energy mechanic then.