5 man queue season 11 trial

[Math.5123]

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

[choovanski.5462]

@Sylosi.6503 said

You seem to have quoted me, yet written nothing of relevance to what you quoted, which was entirely about how meaningless that Anet stat was and then proceeded to make some bizarre assumptions based on that, interesting...

i was more referring to the implication of your statement here, which is that in order to have fair games at a high level people are pushed into forming teams.

And that is the problem, that is why LOL brought back solo queue, because at high rank the only possible way to provide a balanced match at that level against a full team, is to have another full team.

i don’t think encouraging teams at a high level is an issue, infact i feel like it has positive effects. but yeah, i didn’t make that logical jump clear, it was a goof on my part.

but as far as the statistics go, without the data we can’t have a good conversation about it.

like, i know we had teams like car crashed that played at off hours with an ex-ESL premade to get ridiculous winrates. this would have had a statistical impact, but since full premades overall hit round 50% there must also be a group of teams who lose disproportionately to balance out teams like car crashed. so i could assume that teams lost even more than the statistics suggest, because of outliers skewing the result.

but like, i don’t know that. i don’t have the data.

as far as fair matches go, i will say this, our current population is causing things like plats & silvers on teams, & some seriously skewed matches. so i don’t think that we have much to lose.

@zinkz.7045 said:

@"choovanski.5462" said:also, ima get hate for this- but buddy wouldn’t you say the social skills & ability to communicate that separate the antisocial solo queuer from the team player is actually a form of skill?

This sort of thing is always amusing, I hate to break it to you, but playing in a team in a video game does not equate to being a social butterfly, in fact it is not exactly unheard of that the opposite true, some of the most anti-social, socially inept people on earth, happily spend 14 hours a day in their mum's basement being "social" in a video game.

Meanwhile one of the reasons a lot of people play solo (for at least significant amounts of the time) is because they have this thing called a life, a job, a wife, kids, other interests, etc, they are basically well rounded human beings with limited time to spend on a video game, so often just want to jump on for a little while play a couple of games then go do something else, such as going out and actually being social.

that’s completely fair dude. i don’t think everyone who is social in game is social in irl.

but like, thats not my point. my point was that in a team game being able & willing to play as a team is a skill.

like in basketball, soccer, being in a band, like anything thats a cooperative group activity the ability & willingness to form a team & the ability to work well together is a skill. so since gw2 is a team game, i can’t see why being a team player shouldnt also be seen as a skill too.

[nia.4725]

@witcher.3197 said:

@"nia.4725" said:I agree that ranked right now absolutely kills teamplay and that it's frustrating not being able to play with your friends. But I don't think ranked 5man q is the solution, unless 5man groups can only be paired with 5man or 3man+2man groups. Anet should find a way to allow 5man premades without kiling solo queuers.

5 man premades could never face solo players except for maybe season 1 to begin with. It's a misconception and nothing but a scapegoat "oh I don't suck at this game I am silver because them evil premades!!!444!!4"

We doN't vote yes because we want to play 500-0 matches but ebcause we'd rather play with friends in GW2 than leave for other games that let us play together. It's embarrassing how anti-social this game has become.

And you're right! But I think it's also obvious that a 5 man group, playing together, probably being in voice chat to communicate and coordinate, is a very unfair opponent to a group of 5 people completely uncomunicated.

I think that the solution is to, simply, not mix all types of groups. Premades should be allowed, yeah! But not against solo queuers. A social game should be encouraged and playing with your friends should ALWAYS be possible. Just don't make it so solo players get crushed.

[FtoPScrub.5476]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

What proof? Anecdotes aren't proof, sorry. I have numbers. You don't. Even imperfect polls are infinitely more trustworthy than personal experiences.

[Math.5123]

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

What proof? Anecdotes aren't proof, sorry. I have numbers. You don't. Even imperfect polls are infinitely more trustworthy than personal experiences.

You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

[FtoPScrub.5476]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

What proof? Anecdotes aren't proof, sorry. I have numbers. You don't. Even imperfect polls are infinitely more trustworthy than personal experiences.

You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

You mean this dropoff? The one that happened 10 months before team queue was removed while the game was coming off it's first xpac hype? In fact it went up and remained slightly higher after the duo Q implementation, lmao. Why are you accusing me of lying then doing what you accuse me of?

[choovanski.5462]

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"choovanski.5462" said:

so you’re just going to ignore the fact that when we had teams in ranked, anet told us that teams actually statistically lost more than they won? so the whole easy wins, easy farm is a fiction for the most part...

Ranked wasn't competitive back then. There wasn't a actual leaderboard and losing really did not matter. There was no reason to tryhard for prestigious titles. Groups weren't there to pubstomp, they were their to play with their friends. Not the same environment today. Like trying to apply logic from the 20th century to the modern day or comparing apples to oranges.

well, as far as i recall there was a leaderboard & titles... so i fail to see how the game wasn’t competitive. i also fail to see how all the people who want to play in teams would transform from people who wanted to play with friends to people who just want to pubstomp for rank.

as far as applying logic from history to the modern day, ah dude this is done all the time. you can predict social trends & revolutions this way. it’s pretty common to study history & historical events in social sciences for this reason. you’d be surprised how many times people & societies repeat historical mistakes.

also, you seem to think that these team queue players are sticking around threatening to quit... nope dude, most of them already have. it’s the main cause of the huge decline in match quality & population. which is why the matchmaking doesn’t work, because the population is too low, & it’s only going to shrink.we discussed it in another thread, & we had examples of multiple pvp guilds quitting in that thread alone. all of them quit due to the removal of teams. in that thread alone we had over 300 people quitting as a result of the change. removing teams killed pvp guilds, & i would guess the total number of players lost would be in the thousands.

You're assuming PvP is dying because people can't play with their friends but nothing indicates that except a vocal minority on the forums. You see far more complaints about balancing issues and wintrading. Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost. Same is true in the user run poll in this thread. You can provide guesses about how many people quit all you want but the polling numbers disagree, sorry.

well, it’s not a simple assumption without any evidence. i had a 40 man pvp guild that i partially ran dissolve after the changes, but im not alone. we talked about it in the following thread: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/36950/is-the-pvp-population-shrinking-and-if-so-why#latest

many people had similar experiences with guilds, and friends lists. someone even had a 200+ member guild quit in reaction to the removal of teams.

to deny the effect of these guilds quitting on the population is pretty insane. furthermore it’s not an assumption that people quit en masse due to teams being removed, it’s a fact.

sure balance is an issue, but it’s not the only anet need focus on.

the game, as it’s not like antisocial solo players who refuse to party w anyone are recommending the game lol. antisocial people do nothing for the growth of the community, often they flame in chat & cause people to quit.Insulting solo Q players doesn't further your point, it just makes you look really petty.

well, i can’t really see how saying that it’s unlikely for people who only play alone to recommend the game is an insult? it seems like simple logic right? people don’t usually suggest to someone else that they should get a multiplayer game so they can both play it alone... usually they want to play it together. so i figure those people who recommend the game are not solo queue purists, usually they will duo queue.

as far as solo queuers flaming in chat... dude you cant have played gw2 pvp & not seen this, it’s pretty common (which is why i said often & not all), & isn’t good for player retention.

[zinkz.7045]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

Erm. most of the competitive players left the game before HoT even existed, you know back when team queue existed ;), Teldo used to get near a 1000 viewers.

What was left by HoT were only sticking around for the money, once that went most of those disappeared, nothing to do with solo queue, team queue was useless for the actual competitive players, which is why they had to do scrims to get decent matches as when they queued as a 5 man in team queue it was often a flip of a coin whether they would get another team or get a worthless blowout. (hint: if you are fine with worthless blowouts then you are not a competitive player)

[Math.5123]

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

What proof? Anecdotes aren't proof, sorry. I have numbers. You don't. Even imperfect polls are infinitely more trustworthy than personal experiences.

You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

You mean this dropoff? The one that happened 10 months before team queue was removed while the game was coming off it's first xpac hype? In fact it went up and remained slightly higher after the duo Q implementation, lmao. Why are you accusing me of lying then doing what you accuse me of?

October 2015 was when people understood no new tournaments were happening. Considering the last tournament were in June.

Edit: soloq was introduced in June 2017. The view count went up to months later. It wasn't due to solo.

[Math.5123]

@zinkz.7045 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

Erm. most of the competitive players left the game before HoT even existed, you know back when team queue existed ;), Teldo used to get near a 1000 viewers.

What was left by HoT were only sticking around for the money, once that went most of those disappeared, nothing to do with solo queue, team queue was useless for the actual competitive players, which is why they had to do scrims to get decent matches as when they queued as a 5 man in team queue it was often a flip of a coin whether they would get another team or get a worthless blowout. (hint: if you are fine with worthless blowouts then you are not a competitive player)

You consider today's matchmaking to be good at avoiding complete blowout games?

[Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2]

@Sylosi.6503 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:I don't get that people still bring the thoroughly debunked pub stomping argument up about 5 man queues even tough A-net offically confirmed that the winrate of 5 mans in ranked was lower cause they actually fight stronger solo players.

Then you do not understand statistics, Anet confirmed that overall it was around 50%, so yes if you take that at face value then is seems fair, however by itself that is meaningless.

For instance to take a simplified version of things, you can get 50% in a situation where at the low end you have a match with better solo/duo players being put up against 5 mans of terrible players (PvE guild playing as a guild event for example) and stomping them, then when you combine that with the other end where you could have 5 man made up of ex-ESL players playing full cheese comp, all on TS/Discord being put up against solo/duo players and stomping them, this gives you a "fair" 50% but neither one of those matches is anything other than a joke.

U still haven't proven how this pug stomping argument is not still nonsense. It's an average. and not everythin is an low or high end they are players inbetween. U are bassically bringing extremes mainly the ESL players who would already have retardly high MMR and likely would already have beaten the vast majority of the playerbase wich are even an smaller percentages of people queing up. So it in no way represents what really happens.

the vast majority of players are solo queers. an smaller part of players are teamquers. and aside that the winrate is actually around 50 percent or lower. there is no fucking way u should even meet teams that often and incase u do the chances of solo queers getting stomped is also practically none.

It's not that people haven't exagarated in the past? Remember Itchiwen? she couldn't stop making threads 24/7 about how team queuers litterally conspiring about killin solo players in ranked queue because of the lulz. there was an dislike to teamque before this shit got removed.

[FtoPScrub.5476]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@FtoPScrub.5476 said:Don't forget that the removal of 5 man queue was offically POLLED with hard numbers and you lost.No, it wasn't officially "POLLED". The poll was that they were to introduce

A TRIAL RUN FOR ONE SEASON

and having another poll after it that would decide wether or not they should restrict to DuoQ. The balance were in shambles and people abused Chrono bunkers + tempests and people thought that trying DuoQ only for a season wouldn't hurt.

HOWEVER

the second poll never came. Neither was there ever a poll about restricting 1600+ to SoloQ.So you're outright lying.

Am I lying about the numbers in the OP as well?

If you carefully read through my post, you can see why the numbers would be skewed. People were up for trying something.

This is like saying that people that try going onto those dating programs are forced to get married without any real say in it.

Edit; the poll were like 70 something % in favor of trying DuoQ only. The keyword is

trying

You didn't answer my question. So far it's a "NO" based on the POLL in THIS thread. This is after you take into account that everyone who wants 5 man is getting their friends to vote "YES".

The reason as to why that's the case is that close to everyone that enjoys playing with friends has already left the game. Hence why the PvP scene is about 1/5th of what it used to be not even a year ago. But the cause of the decline is probably due to some other unknown factors though. Surely.

You have all proof right in front of you. We have tried SoloQ and it failed. Accept your mistake and move on.

What proof? Anecdotes aren't proof, sorry. I have numbers. You don't. Even imperfect polls are infinitely more trustworthy than personal experiences.

You want proof? Go look up the average view-count on gw2 streams on twitch and look at when the massive drop happened. Look at what time 80% of the entire competitive scene stopped playing. Look at when the massive decline in population happened. Look at when the last shred of e-sports died. All of this is evidence that proves that introducing SoloQ only was a massive blunder and back-fired immensely. In order for a PvP centric game-mode to thrive, you need to have competition. Without it, everything falls apart.

You mean this dropoff? The one that happened 10 months before team queue was removed while the game was coming off it's first xpac hype? In fact it went up and remained slightly higher after the duo Q implementation, lmao. Why are you accusing me of lying then doing what you accuse me of?

October 2015 was when people understood no new tournaments were happening. Considering the last tournament were in June.

You're deflecting. This has little to do with tournaments. Everyone wants them back but Anet doesn't have the money and of course removing them killed a lot of the community. This is about the removal of team queue, which, as evidenced by the numbers that you first mentioned, did not have a negative impact on twitch average viewer ship despite your efforts to deceive. In fact if anything, once again using the numbers that you mentioned and under your logic, it did the opposite and slightly boosted viewership.

[Sylosi.6503]

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:

@Sylosi.6503 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:I don't get that people still bring the thoroughly debunked pub stomping argument up about 5 man queues even tough A-net offically confirmed that the winrate of 5 mans in ranked was lower cause they actually fight stronger solo players.

Then you do not understand statistics, Anet confirmed that overall it was around 50%, so yes if you take that at face value then is seems fair, however by itself that is meaningless.

For instance to take a simplified version of things, you can get 50% in a situation where at the low end you have a match with better solo/duo players being put up against 5 mans of terrible players (PvE guild playing as a guild event for example) and stomping them, then when you combine that with the other end where you could have 5 man made up of ex-ESL players playing full cheese comp, all on TS/Discord being put up against solo/duo players and stomping them, this gives you a "fair" 50% but neither one of those matches is anything other than a joke.

U still haven't proven how this pug stomping argument is not still nonsense. It's an average. and not everythin is an low or high end they are players inbetween. U are bassically bringing extremes mainly the ESL players who would already have retardly high MMR and likely would already have beaten the vast majority of the playerbase wich are even an smaller percentages of people queing up. So it in no way represents what really happens.

What I have shown is that the winrate is no indication of matchmaking quality, so as a statistic in regard to claiming 5 man teams vs solo works fine, it is absolutely worthless.

[Zagerus.8675]

In regards to the anti-social comments.. I think a person with even the toughest skin and broadest experiences would have a hard time relating to every person in this game. I don't watch anime, I don't find ERP interesting, I don't particularly enjoy having political agendas that I may or may not disagree with define the undercurrent of a community. Thus, I choose not to associate with a majority of that community. If I could relate to a lot of people who play this game I would be all over 5-man coming back into ranked. The appeal to SoloQ is that I can log in queue up and play against other SoloQers without having to swim through all of that. Maybe the reason I played against 3 man or 5 man premades is because of my MMR but I don't know I don't particularly pay attention to what it's at. I just remember the experience in PvP sucking until they removed 5 man farm teams who ran 2 bunkers and 3 roamers. It was a tragedy trying to play against that as randoms.

[Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2]

@Sylosi.6503 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:

@Sylosi.6503 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:I don't get that people still bring the thoroughly debunked pub stomping argument up about 5 man queues even tough A-net offically confirmed that the winrate of 5 mans in ranked was lower cause they actually fight stronger solo players.

Then you do not understand statistics, Anet confirmed that overall it was around 50%, so yes if you take that at face value then is seems fair, however by itself that is meaningless.

For instance to take a simplified version of things, you can get 50% in a situation where at the low end you have a match with better solo/duo players being put up against 5 mans of terrible players (PvE guild playing as a guild event for example) and stomping them, then when you combine that with the other end where you could have 5 man made up of ex-ESL players playing full cheese comp, all on TS/Discord being put up against solo/duo players and stomping them, this gives you a "fair" 50% but neither one of those matches is anything other than a joke.

U still haven't proven how this pug stomping argument is not still nonsense. It's an average. and not everythin is an low or high end they are players inbetween. U are bassically bringing extremes mainly the ESL players who would already have retardly high MMR and likely would already have beaten the vast majority of the playerbase wich are even an smaller percentages of people queing up. So it in no way represents what really happens.

What I have shown is that the winrate is no indication of matchmaking quality, so as a statistic in regard to claiming 5 man teams vs solo works fine, it is absolutely worthless.

But it will, the pvp playerbase doesn't exist out of only pve guilds and esl playersmatches either for the team or either for the solo players stomping the teams. U still shouldn't be able to meet team players anything close then u meating solo players. there is no way u can be farmed by teams for like 15 losses in a row like some players claim by only lol teams. they are an small group the vast majority are solo players. and in case u do meet em even if u still believe in shitty match quality u should have good odds of actually winning against teams.

in other words u cannot have been farmed by teams 24/7. Not singling out u. but the exagarations we heard on forums.

[Skittledness.5106]

Only if there's a separate leaderboard.Also only allow you to face against other 5 mans and increase rewards to compensate since longer que times

[Nova.3817]

@Skittledness.5106 said:Only if there's a separate leaderboard.Also only allow you to face against other 5 mans and increase rewards to compensate since longer que times

you mean like how they did the leaderboard in the very beginning showing guild teams rather than individual ranking.... lol that tech is already there just needs to be enabled!

[shadowpass.4236]

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:It's not that people haven't exagarated in the past? Remember Itchiwen? she couldn't stop making threads 24/7 about how team queuers litterally conspiring about killin solo players in ranked queue because of the lulz. there was an dislike to teamque before this kitten got removed.

LOL Ithilwen really hates teams.

This reminds me of an old AT back in August. Her team lost every single fight at the start and got pubstumped 504-0, she started raging and crying in chat saying:

• "Fucking cheese strategy."
• "You all have been reported."
• "The only way you can win is cheesing by spawn-camping."
• "Such that we cannot leave."

Then she sent whispers to my friend after the match saying:

• "I hope all of you fucking die."
• "Waste of space on earth."
• "Die."

Before blocking them. LOL

[Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2]

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:It's not that people haven't exagarated in the past? Remember Itchiwen? she couldn't stop making threads 24/7 about how team queuers litterally conspiring about killin solo players in ranked queue because of the lulz. there was an dislike to teamque before this kitten got removed.

LOL Ithilwen really hates teams.

This reminds me of an old AT back in August. Her team lost every single fight at the start and got pubstumped 504-0, she started raging and crying in chat saying:

• "kitten cheese strategy."
• "You all have been reported."
• "The only way you can win is cheesing by spawn-camping."
• "Such that we cannot leave."

Then she sent whispers to my friend after the match saying:

• "I hope all of you kitten die."
• "Waste of space on earth."
• "Die."

Before blocking them. LOL

wow just wow. sorry u had to experience that.

[Nova.3817]

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:It's not that people haven't exagarated in the past? Remember Itchiwen? she couldn't stop making threads 24/7 about how team queuers litterally conspiring about killin solo players in ranked queue because of the lulz. there was an dislike to teamque before this kitten got removed.

LOL Ithilwen really hates teams.

This reminds me of an old AT back in August. Her team lost every single fight at the start and got pubstumped 504-0, she started raging and crying in chat saying:

• "kitten cheese strategy."
• "You all have been reported."
• "The only way you can win is cheesing by spawn-camping."
• "Such that we cannot leave."

Then she sent whispers to my friend after the match saying:

• "I hope all of you kitten die."
• "Waste of space on earth."
• "Die."

Before blocking them. LOL

thats the kind of players anet loves the most lol

[witcher.3197]

@Nova.3817 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:It's not that people haven't exagarated in the past? Remember Itchiwen? she couldn't stop making threads 24/7 about how team queuers litterally conspiring about killin solo players in ranked queue because of the lulz. there was an dislike to teamque before this kitten got removed.

LOL Ithilwen really hates teams.

This reminds me of an old AT back in August. Her team lost every single fight at the start and got pubstumped 504-0, she started raging and crying in chat saying:

• "kitten cheese strategy."
• "You all have been reported."
• "The only way you can win is cheesing by spawn-camping."
• "Such that we cannot leave."

Then she sent whispers to my friend after the match saying:

• "I hope all of you kitten die."
• "Waste of space on earth."
• "Die."

Before blocking them. LOL

thats the kind of players anet loves the most lol

Anet doesn't listen to feedback often, but when they do.. it's people like that.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@starhunter.6015 said:I voted yes, but only if the 5 man ques are only paired against other 5 man ques.

Thisthisthisthisthisthisthisthis. The option should exist, but only where PuGs cannot be farmed. If it's as wanted as its made out to be, it'll stand on its own.

@"witcher.3197" said:At the very least they should remove the idiotic solo restriction in plat and above. It didn't change anything except driving away more people.

Hmm. A well-synced duo that has made it into plat+ are probably subject to the same "premade" vs "pug" effect that plagued the lower divisions. I'd rather plat not be swayed by a voicecomm pair of sidenoders.

[Crab Fear.1624]

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/PvP-Season-5-Ranked-Queue-Poll-Closed/page/1

https://guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/

https://reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/58e36s/solo_and_duo_queue_only_for_season_5/

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/sPvP-Season-5-2016 Not found?

https://mmorpg.com/guild-wars-2/interviews/a-big-shakeup-is-coming-to-pvp-leagues-with-season-5-1000011376

So, about that post season poll? Where was the link?

[zoopop.5630]

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/PvP-Season-5-Ranked-Queue-Poll-Closed/page/1

https://guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/

https://reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/58e36s/solo_and_duo_queue_only_for_season_5/

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/forum/game/pvp/sPvP-Season-5-2016 Not found?

https://mmorpg.com/guild-wars-2/interviews/a-big-shakeup-is-coming-to-pvp-leagues-with-season-5-1000011376

So, about that post season poll? Where was the link?

+1 to this guy for looking up stuff cause, this game should either be FULL SOLO, or JUST allow full teams to play together.

I hate the idea of duo from 0-1600 rating , but you can't que up as a team from 0-1600? what's the difference other then the fact games are STILL the same with a duo / team? People still throw matches around, DUO still carry games harder with a decent team of players. Just bring back the 5 team rank already this game has gotten beyond boring and i JUST started playing this game 4 season ago lol. Already looking into other games because playing solo rank is just frustrating as fuck with 4 players unable to read map pings and chat log on where to go / who to focus.

Unrank becomes 100% steam roll if you are with a team 5 because.... unrank full of noobs and a bunch meme build wannabe legend status players, AT's is OK if your looking to waste 30-40 mins waiting to get into a equal match up with another team, and Monthly just the same crap. Why do we need to wait SO LONG to play as a team to get SOLID match ups and games against other premades? Why drive off the team competitive part into a casual solo quest? The game is getting way to out of control with how it doesn't reward "teams and Guilds" involvement at all. MOST PvP guilds last no more then maybe 6 Months of being "active" till it falls apart because it doesn't do anything for unless playing in-house all day keeps you "happy" but you can just do that with any random browser game in the pvp lobby....

[Arheundel.6451]

Why should you be rewarded with a title for reaching a point while being helped by 4 others who will sync their builds with yours.....when others may reach the same point while being paired with complete randoms and their bad builds?

In an ideal world, the MMR system would pit organized teams against pugs with a higher MMR...in an ideal world the system would take in consideration the fact that you're in a team and "punish" you accordingly.

Unfortunately in the previous reality we seen teams going up while being fed pugs with random MMR or cumulative MMR based on the highest player on their team