The time has come to make Fast Hands and Warrior's Sprint baseline

[Cyninja.2954]

Yes, condi berserker is a situational build. /s

You asked for example, examples were given.

What constitutes a proper example then if not a build which is meta in "some fractals and raids bosses"? Are you noticing how heavily biased you are?

@cryorion.9532 said:The point of that part wasn't about power creep, but about that things can change and are not set in stone.

What?

Then think of a better example since yours backfired and didn't work at all.

You can't pick and chose which part of an example you want to use. The dagger not being available without spellbreaker is exactly why certain skills are locked behind trait lines.

@cryorion.9532 said:Unless you specify an exact traits and build that would outperfom all true top meta warrior builds currently in game (in every game mode) everywhere, there is no solid argument. Do it. I don't mind accepting that I was wrong, that this XY build would be truly broken and increase power creep by game-breaking amount

What? Are you serious? So unless the trait change outperforms all builds, it is neither overpowered nor power creep?

Okay. Thanks. Gl to you.

[Vancho.8750]

Warrior has the least amount of skills from all the professions 17 on core 18 on berserker and spellbreaker -2 for banners in pve not much wigle room for utility so by having access to the weapon skills on demand helps alleviate the shortcommings stemming from that. Imagine every profession had to take their special trait line so their skills are not on double cooldown 60 second steal, 80 second virtues. Imagine that every build on mesmerererer has to have illusions trait line to work in pve and pvp so you are not stuck there just auto attacking.

[Katary.7096]

@"Cyninja.2954" said:Yes, condi berserker is a situational build. /s

Would you care to explain your definition of a situational build?For example, I do not recommend people play that particular build for the Samarog or Keep Construct encounters. At the same time it is preferred for bosses such as Soulless Horror or Matthias. Meaning that the version of the BS Warrior build that is strongest depends on the situation at hand. How does this not qualify for the label of a "situational build"?

[Cyninja.2954]

@Katary.7096 said:

@"Cyninja.2954" said:Yes, condi berserker is a situational build. /s

Would you care to explain your definition of a situational build?For example, I do not recommend people play that particular build for the Samarog or Keep Construct encounters. At the same time it is preferred for bosses such as Soulless Horror or Matthias. Meaning that the version of the BS Warrior build that is strongest depends on the situation at hand. How does this not qualify for the label of a "situational build"?

Yes it is situational. At the same time it is meta tier for those situations. Giving the build Fast Hands makes it even better. That's called power creep.

Using the situational argument as excuse to promote power creep is what I was being sarcastic about.

That said, and since people love to go by forum avatars, I have probabaly more play time on warrior in endgame pve content than most people here demanding baseline Fast Hands (close to 300 LI on warrior alone and often fractal daylies) . Yet I still would not ask for such nonsense.

Why? Because as some one who plays multiple classes extensively, I value balance over "I want my main to be overpowered".

[cryorion.9532]

@"Cyninja.2954" said:

That said, and since people love to go by forum avatars, I have probabaly more play time on warrior in endgame pve content than most people here demanding baseline Fast Hands (close to 300 LI on warrior alone and often fractal daylies) . Yet I still would not ask for such nonsense.

Why? Because as some one who plays multiple classes extensively, I value balance over "I want my main to be overpowered".

Eh... when I asked you for exact examples of overpowered builds with FH baseline, you just came up with vague arguments.And then wished me gl. Isn't it just that you can't come up with anything solid?

Is non-Discipline warrior going to suddenly become top dps, outperforming even Discipline builds? While in reality, FH baseline would improve non-Discipline builds (obviously), making them closer to current top tier meta builds, aka core BS and condi Discipline BS WHILE providing that HUGE "QoL" of having smoother and more fluid rotations. Well, so far I haven't read any solid argument from you how would FH baseline make warrior OP.

As "close to 300 LI on warrior alone and often fractal daylies" warrior, you should be able to give exact example.

About those 2 situational builds you posted (power fractal boonbreaker and condi Tactics BS). You want to perform exact rotations with FH baseline and without Discipline traitline? Are you sure? You realize that you are missing traits that are necessary for proper rotation execution (compared to Discipline variants of those builds). But I already mentioned this (naming specific traits). You really act like you would get whole Discipline traitline together with Fast Hands as baseline.

[Cyninja.2954]

@cryorion.9532 said:You really act like you would get whole Discipline traitline together with Fast Hands as baseline.

No, I act as though this was power creep.

You are the one who keeps wanting to push the narrative that it's equal to an entire discipline line, and since it is not, it would be fine.

That's your and my position in a nutshell.

[Dadnir.5038]

@lodjur.1284 said:

@"Blocki.4931" said:Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement. If you want to change one thing, change that. Everything else is just whining.

Necros don't have one and don't you mention that signet. Discipline is a top tier trait-line (for where warrior's sprint matters). Locust Signet is a mediocre skill. Guardian also doesn't have a trait for this (except in dragonhunter a very specialized traitline).

If you think everyone should get a free 25% movement speed (that doesnt stack) outside of combat I am with you tho

cough cough quickening thirst cough cough

That said:

• The elementalist require to be attuned to air for it's movement speed buff to kick in or use a signet.
• The warrior need to wield melee weapon. (it's not a "melee requirement")
• The ranger either need to equip a signet, not have any imparing condition on him (Druid) or be in beastmode(SB)
• The necromancer need to equip a signet or be above 75% health.
• The guardian (DH) lose it's passive movement speed when one of it's life saving inbuilt skill is on CD.
• The thief need either a signet or to be stealthed.
• The mesmer need chronomancer to have a passive movement boost (swiftness generated by the signet can be corrupted/removed)
• The revenant need to spend ressource for it's "passive" movement boost (herald).

The only ones that don't have a condition hindering their passive movement speed are the engineer and the chronomancer.

[Vancho.8750]

And all of them have good gap closers on them one might say teleport even.

[lodjur.1284]

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@lodjur.1284 said:

@"Blocki.4931" said:Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement. If you want to change one thing, change that. Everything else is just whining.

Necros don't have one and don't you mention that signet. Discipline is a top tier trait-line (for where warrior's sprint matters). Locust Signet is a mediocre skill. Guardian also doesn't have a trait for this (except in dragonhunter a very specialized traitline).

If you think everyone should get a free 25% movement speed (that doesnt stack) outside of combat I am with you tho

cough cough

quickening thirst

cough cough

That said:

• The elementalist require to be attuned to air for it's movement speed buff to kick in or use a signet.
• The warrior need to wield melee weapon. (it's not a "melee requirement")
• The ranger either need to equip a signet, not have any imparing condition on him (Druid) or be in beastmode(SB)
• The necromancer need to equip a signet or be above 75% health.
• The guardian (DH) lose it's passive movement speed when one of it's life saving inbuilt skill is on CD.
• The thief need either a signet or to be stealthed.
• The mesmer need chronomancer to have a passive movement boost (swiftness generated by the signet can be corrupted/removed)
• The revenant need to spend ressource for it's "passive" movement boost (herald).

The only ones that don't have a condition hindering their passive movement speed are the engineer and the chronomancer.

You're not really talking about the opportunity cost of getting 25-33% movement speed here.

Elementalist needs to equip one of its better traitlines for power (air), or Tempest for more or less permanent 25-33% speed

Warrior needs to pick up their second best trait line and any of their like top 5 weapons and gain other relevant bonuses

Ranger can go beastmastery and run the shout heal for permanent swiftness, druid and sacrifice the stealth (bad option) or soulbeast+beastmastery or soulbeast+bird

Necro needs to either pick up a terrible traitline (blood) or a super mediocre skill (locust signet)

Guardian only has it if they go DH and only OOC basically and have to pick up a mediocre trait for it

Thief also gets permanent swiftness from either acrobatics or DD. Also shortbow 5/rifle 4.

Ye, mesmer needs chrono for it, missed that one, mesmer has a lot of mobility skills tho sword 1, staff 2, blink etc

1 point of upkeep is nothing, the only limitation is having to play power pretty much. Condi Rev has no source of movement speed tho outside of blasting the dwarf field.

Engi has either 25% from inventions or very high uptime swiftness from various sources most notably photon accelerator.

De and power Mirage can also both run rune of fireworks without making major concessions for their builds.

[Dadnir.5038]

@lodjur.1284 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@lodjur.1284 said:

@"Blocki.4931" said:Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement. If you want to change one thing, change that. Everything else is just whining.

Necros don't have one and don't you mention that signet. Discipline is a top tier trait-line (for where warrior's sprint matters). Locust Signet is a mediocre skill. Guardian also doesn't have a trait for this (except in dragonhunter a very specialized traitline).

If you think everyone should get a free 25% movement speed (that doesnt stack) outside of combat I am with you tho

cough cough

quickening thirst

cough cough

That said:

• The elementalist require to be attuned to air for it's movement speed buff to kick in or use a signet.
• The warrior need to wield melee weapon. (it's not a "melee requirement")
• The ranger either need to equip a signet, not have any imparing condition on him (Druid) or be in beastmode(SB)
• The necromancer need to equip a signet or be above 75% health.
• The guardian (DH) lose it's passive movement speed when one of it's life saving inbuilt skill is on CD.
• The thief need either a signet or to be stealthed.
• The mesmer need chronomancer to have a passive movement boost (swiftness generated by the signet can be corrupted/removed)
• The revenant need to spend ressource for it's "passive" movement boost (herald).

The only ones that don't have a condition hindering their passive movement speed are the engineer and the chronomancer.

You're not really talking about the opportunity cost of getting 25-33% movement speed here.

Elementalist needs to equip one of its better traitlines for power (air), or Tempest for more or less permanent 25-33% speed

Warrior needs to pick up their second best trait line and any of their like top 5 weapons and gain other relevant bonuses

Ranger can go beastmastery and run the shout heal for permanent swiftness, druid and sacrifice the stealth (bad option) or soulbeast+beastmastery or soulbeast+bird

Necro needs to either pick up a terrible traitline (blood) or a super mediocre skill (locust signet)

Guardian only has it if they go DH and only OOC basically and have to pick up a mediocre trait for it

Thief also gets permanent swiftness from either acrobatics or DD. Also shortbow 5/rifle 4.

Ye, mesmer needs chrono for it, missed that one, mesmer has a lot of mobility skills tho sword 1, staff 2, blink etc

1 point of upkeep is nothing, the only limitation is having to play power pretty much. Condi Rev has no source of movement speed tho outside of blasting the dwarf field.

Engi has either 25% from inventions or very high uptime swiftness from various sources most notably photon accelerator.

De and power Mirage can also both run rune of fireworks without making major concessions for their builds.

I'm just puting things into perspective based on what you comment on:

Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement.

The opportunity cost of all those only depend an the "meta" and the "meta" is something that players create. For example, the scourge make good use of the blood traitline, it's hard to say that the traitline is really "terrible". Swiftness uptime can be really good for most of the professions (if you take the necromancer as an example, it's easy to have 100% swiftness uptime just flashing shroud with speed of shadow, so it's pretty much meaningless to point out that thief can have a lot of swiftness), it's not passive movement speed anyway since you need to trigger it.

[BlackTruth.6813]

There is no more geomancy or hydromancy sigils, why are people still worked up about and are so against baseline fast hands?Is it THAT hard for people to stow weapon full counter or just flat out proc and then dodge it? Is it still hard for people in 2019 to count 2-3 dodges and then bait a Warrior cd, rinse and repeat and then kill the Warrior?

I don't get it. Also, for some reason people don't think "telegraphed skills" is too hard to counter and is having trouble dodging Warriors in 2019.

And yes elementalist needs a buff, that doesn't mean baseline fast hands will put it out of the meta. But obviously it's better that we don't get d/d ele aids back, it's better to make elementalist into something different and balanced if it's going to be buffed.

Seriously, name me a build that is going to be OP with baseline fast hands. Go. What build are you going to say? Gunflame? YOU NEED ARMS TO MAKE GUNFLAME WORK IN PVP LOL. You legit have to sacrifice defense to make Gunflame berserker work. That's how bad that build will be even with baseline fast hands.

Mace + Hammer? Guard and it's elite specs counter that, stability all day = that build is useless.

Name me a build that will be OP with baseline fast hands. I'm sure you won't even know what you're talking about.

[Katary.7096]

@Cyninja.2954 said:

@Katary.7096 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:Yes, condi berserker is a situational build. /s

Would you care to explain your definition of a situational build?For example, I do not recommend people play that particular build for the Samarog or Keep Construct encounters. At the same time it is preferred for bosses such as Soulless Horror or Matthias. Meaning that the version of the BS Warrior build that is strongest depends on the situation at hand. How does this not qualify for the label of a "situational build"?

Yes it is situational. At the same time it is meta tier for those situations. Giving the build Fast Hands makes it even better. That's called power creep.

Using the situational argument as excuse to promote power creep is what I was being sarcastic about.

I see. The post I quoted made it seem as if you were refuting the fact that it is a situational build, which came across as an unreasonable statement.We will likely see more power creep in Guild Wars 2 in the future, as it is well established by now. The specialization patch prior to HoT, first generation elite-specializations, quad-stat gear, second generation elite-specializations, this game has a solid history of power creep. Though I suppose the fact that the Condi Berserker BS offers notably higher DPS than the Power Spellbreaker version could serve as prove that power creep is not happening everywhere or all the time.

[Cyninja.2954]

@Katary.7096 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:

@Katary.7096 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:Yes, condi berserker is a situational build. /s

Would you care to explain your definition of a situational build?For example, I do not recommend people play that particular build for the Samarog or Keep Construct encounters. At the same time it is preferred for bosses such as Soulless Horror or Matthias. Meaning that the version of the BS Warrior build that is strongest depends on the situation at hand. How does this not qualify for the label of a "situational build"?

Yes it is situational. At the same time it is meta tier for those situations. Giving the build Fast Hands makes it even better. That's called power creep.

Using the situational argument as excuse to promote power creep is what I was being sarcastic about.

I see. The post I quoted made it seem as if you were refuting the fact that it is a situational build, which came across as an unreasonable statement.We will likely see more power creep in Guild Wars 2 in the future, as it is well established by now. The specialization patch prior to HoT, first generation elite-specializations, quad-stat gear, second generation elite-specializations, this game has a solid history of power creep. Though I suppose the fact that the Condi Berserker BS offers notably higher DPS than the Power Spellbreaker version could serve as prove that power creep is not happening everywhere or all the time.

I'm not in the camp of people who agree that potential future power creep should be a reason to introduce power creep at every step possible (especially when it affects only 1 class, which a change in Fast Hands would).

Spellbreaker was among the most broken and overpowered specializations ever when introduced (for pvp/WvW) and has seen its fair share of nerfs since then. Berserker was and remains a very strong pve elite specialization. You are comparing apples to oranges.

Let me make this real simple for people:

• the chances of getting baselines Fast Hands are probably around 0%
• the chances of getting the Discipline trait line nerfed by continously comparing it with other trait lines arguing that Fast Hands would be balanced are tremendously high

So keep going on examining how Fast Hands without Discipline is fine (it is not) because Discipline is so important and powerful. The result you get from Arenanet might not be what you expect though.

[lodjur.1284]

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@lodjur.1284 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@lodjur.1284 said:

@"Blocki.4931" said:Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement. If you want to change one thing, change that. Everything else is just whining.

Necros don't have one and don't you mention that signet. Discipline is a top tier trait-line (for where warrior's sprint matters). Locust Signet is a mediocre skill. Guardian also doesn't have a trait for this (except in dragonhunter a very specialized traitline).

If you think everyone should get a free 25% movement speed (that doesnt stack) outside of combat I am with you tho

cough cough

quickening thirst

cough cough

That said:

• The elementalist require to be attuned to air for it's movement speed buff to kick in or use a signet.
• The warrior need to wield melee weapon. (it's not a "melee requirement")
• The ranger either need to equip a signet, not have any imparing condition on him (Druid) or be in beastmode(SB)
• The necromancer need to equip a signet or be above 75% health.
• The guardian (DH) lose it's passive movement speed when one of it's life saving inbuilt skill is on CD.
• The thief need either a signet or to be stealthed.
• The mesmer need chronomancer to have a passive movement boost (swiftness generated by the signet can be corrupted/removed)
• The revenant need to spend ressource for it's "passive" movement boost (herald).

The only ones that don't have a condition hindering their passive movement speed are the engineer and the chronomancer.

You're not really talking about the opportunity cost of getting 25-33% movement speed here.

Elementalist needs to equip one of its better traitlines for power (air), or Tempest for more or less permanent 25-33% speed

Warrior needs to pick up their second best trait line and any of their like top 5 weapons and gain other relevant bonuses

Ranger can go beastmastery and run the shout heal for permanent swiftness, druid and sacrifice the stealth (bad option) or soulbeast+beastmastery or soulbeast+bird

Necro needs to either pick up a terrible traitline (blood) or a super mediocre skill (locust signet)

Guardian only has it if they go DH and only OOC basically and have to pick up a mediocre trait for it

Thief also gets permanent swiftness from either acrobatics or DD. Also shortbow 5/rifle 4.

Ye, mesmer needs chrono for it, missed that one, mesmer has a lot of mobility skills tho sword 1, staff 2, blink etc

1 point of upkeep is nothing, the only limitation is having to play power pretty much. Condi Rev has no source of movement speed tho outside of blasting the dwarf field.

Engi has either 25% from inventions or very high uptime swiftness from various sources most notably photon accelerator.

De and power Mirage can also both run rune of fireworks without making major concessions for their builds.

I'm just puting things into perspective based on what you comment on:

Every class has a trait that increases their movement speed passively, warrior is the only one with a melee only requirement.

The opportunity cost of all those only depend an the "meta" and the "meta" is something that players create. For example, the scourge make good use of the blood traitline, it's hard to say that the traitline is really "terrible". Swiftness uptime can be really good for most of the professions (if you take the necromancer as an example, it's easy to have 100% swiftness uptime just flashing shroud with

speed of shadow

, so it's pretty much meaningless to point out that thief can have a lot of swiftness), it's not passive movement speed anyway since you need to trigger it.

The Meta is definitively created by anet, even if not always fully intentionally. The players did not make defense by far the best warrior traitline and discipline the second best by a large margin. Anet did that.

Blood is an awful traitline overall, it makes you a decent ressbot that's pretty much it. Outside of zerging (and carrying bad raidgroups I guess) it has 0 use.

Flashing shroud doesn't work on scourge cause of massive CD and LF cost. Even on core/reaper it isn't feasible to flash of CD ooc and is clearly not comparable to the cost of having to pick up discipline and the best trait even without the movement speed.

@"BlackTruth.6813" said:There is no more geomancy or hydromancy sigils, why are people still worked up about and are so against baseline fast hands?Is it THAT hard for people to stow weapon full counter or just flat out proc and then dodge it? Is it still hard for people in 2019 to count 2-3 dodges and then bait a Warrior cd, rinse and repeat and then kill the Warrior?

I don't get it. Also, for some reason people don't think "telegraphed skills" is too hard to counter and is having trouble dodging Warriors in 2019.

And yes elementalist needs a buff, that doesn't mean baseline fast hands will put it out of the meta. But obviously it's better that we don't get d/d ele aids back, it's better to make elementalist into something different and balanced if it's going to be buffed.

Seriously, name me a build that is going to be OP with baseline fast hands. Go. What build are you going to say? Gunflame? YOU NEED ARMS TO MAKE GUNFLAME WORK IN PVP LOL. You legit have to sacrifice defense to make Gunflame berserker work. That's how bad that build will be even with baseline fast hands.

Mace + Hammer? Guard and it's elite specs counter that, stability all day = that build is useless.

Name me a build that will be OP with baseline fast hands. I'm sure you won't even know what you're talking about.

Baselining fast hands would prolly change nothing due to how essential discipline is and how strength isn't all that awesome with spellbreaker. The bigger question is what trait would replace it as it would essentially be a "free" trait and also why bother when it won't really change anything.

[BlackTruth.6813]

Yep it changes nothing for sure. It doesn't give Warrior instant cast, it doesn't magically make zerker stance into a Mesmer invuln. I just don't get why people think it's "power creep" when it does nothing. Seriously a non-game changing trait can just replace it if that's what people are worked up about.

[cryorion.9532]

@"lodjur.1284" said:Baselining fast hands would prolly change nothing due to how essential discipline is and how strength isn't all that awesome with spellbreaker. The bigger question is what trait would replace it as it would essentially be a "free" trait and also why bother when it won't really change anything.

It would improve non-discipline builds, providing huge "QoL" for rotations. You know that annoying moment, when you play dagger/axe mace/mace power boonbreaker in fractals, you swap to mace/mace for fast ccs and then are stuck for another 7 seconds on mace/mace? That is annoying af, breaking rotation fluidity.For PvP/WvW, good luck playing non-discipline builds against current meta specs. As you said, Discipline traitline is essential (not only because of Fast Hands, but Fast Hands is the main reason, we take Discipline traitline).

[lodjur.1284]

@cryorion.9532 said:

@"lodjur.1284" said:Baselining fast hands would prolly change nothing due to how essential discipline is and how strength isn't all that awesome with spellbreaker. The bigger question is what trait would replace it as it would essentially be a "free" trait and also why bother when it won't really change anything.

It would improve non-discipline builds, providing huge "QoL" for rotations. You know that annoying moment, when you play dagger/axe mace/mace power boonbreaker in fractals, you swap to mace/mace for fast ccs and then are stuck for another 7 seconds on mace/mace? That is annoying af, breaking rotation fluidity.

Warrior doesn't really need PvE buffs tho, it's basically irreplaceable and this would actually be a meaningful big there. Being stuck on an awkward bar isn't a QoL problem it's a power level problem.

For PvP/WvW, good luck playing non-discipline builds against current meta specs. As you said, Discipline traitline is essential (not only because of Fast Hands, but Fast Hands is the main reason, we take Discipline traitline).

Exactly my point, the immob clear and shorter/cheaper bursts are still essential. Warrior does need some kinda buff, or rather it needs several other builds toned down so it can be competitive again.

[Yerlock.4678]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:

@gmmg.9210 said:Warrior Runes now do the job of arguably what was the most crucial minor trait on the Warrior. This allows other players to open up the weapon swaps, but also makes warriors have a trait that feels redundant. Thus, competitively, with all the warrior telegraphs, Warrior feels weak in some regards. Take the opportunity to make Fast hands baseline and remake it to where it's more damage or versatility on weapon swap through some other means.

I'm not sure I understand. Don't you have the same opportunity cost of running 6 warrior runes and not using the trait line?

While the trait line provides a vastly superior version of the 6 piece rune bonus.

What is the argument here to make this base line?

there is no argument, just another person wanting something for free.

Yes, a QoL update that would allow us to finally use other traits.

[Cyninja.2954]

@gmmg.9210 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:

@gmmg.9210 said:Warrior Runes now do the job of arguably what was the most crucial minor trait on the Warrior. This allows other players to open up the weapon swaps, but also makes warriors have a trait that feels redundant. Thus, competitively, with all the warrior telegraphs, Warrior feels weak in some regards. Take the opportunity to make Fast hands baseline and remake it to where it's more damage or versatility on weapon swap through some other means.

I'm not sure I understand. Don't you have the same opportunity cost of running 6 warrior runes and not using the trait line?

While the trait line provides a vastly superior version of the 6 piece rune bonus.

What is the argument here to make this base line?

there is no argument, just another person wanting something for free.

Yes, a QoL update that would allow us to finally use other traits.

Don't worry, I'm sure the balance team is already looking into how the discipline trait line can be changed as to encourage other trait line use. Not sure you are going to like the result. It definitely won't be baseline Fast Hands.

You are right though, when a trait line sees use in most builds, it might need some "adjusting". Don't come around crying when this happens though, you have been warned.

[BlackTruth.6813]

Actually even just Warrior sprint becoming baseline wouldn't be bad, I think i'll be able to play some Warrior builds without fast hands but without having to sacrifice for rune of the lynx.

It fits with the class too, Warrior's are supposed to be athletic as well. It's kinda brutal to play without Warrior sprint or any movespeed rune too cause people just run in a straight line and dodge everything without having to press endurance dodge.

[Quadox.7834]

No more powercreep please. Better to have muliple options for movement speed so you aren't locked into one build. For example one trait/skill that gives passive movespeed with melee weps, one that gives swiftness, one that gives superspeed. All with different requirements/conditions etc.