Suggestion: Armor sets vs outfits

[Cherdakuru.5841]

As a part of my sudden activity on this forum.Arena.net, players LOVE customization.Fashionwars is blood and sweat of this game.So we would love to get more customization options.If it is so hard to make armor sets, that fit all the races, why don't you just start making them race specific?It actually could add more variety in the game, and if people will ask you to make one particular armor set available on another race or all races you always can do it later!/// mad idea, i'm just brainstorming: you can even add an item, gemstore purchase, that makes items from one race available to another (for new sets) I would buy that if it help get rid of Black lion chests

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

if people will ask you to make one particular armor set available on another race or all races you always can do it later!

People will be asking for each set of race specific armor for all the other races, so they might as well make them race neutral if they’re going to make them available for other races later.

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

Your suggestion was about getting armor out faster. If they’re making armor for all the races then how is it faster? It still takes 9 months for a full set of 3 weights. However in your suggestion they spend 9 months making the armor but then only releasing for one race. On top of that they now start charging for unlocks instead of us getting the armors for free.

So, no time saved and it cost more while ticking off everyone who has to pay to unlock what used to be free.

I’m not seeing any advantages here.

[BunjiKugashira.9754]

I don't think you understand the advantage outfits have over armor from a development perspective.

Outfits have 8 models, so they fit every character. The different models are: Human male, Human female, Sylvari male, Sylvari female, Norn male, Norn female, Asura and Charr. Notice that Asura and Charr only have one model each since both genders use the male version.

Armors have 8 models, so they fit about 1/3rd of all characters. The different models are the same as for outfits, but since each armor is also linked to an armour weight, the amount of characters that can use a skin is limited.Armors have pre-defined cuts that the designer has to consider when making the armor in order to avoid clipping as much as possible. Though in theory it would be possible to place an "outfit" into an armor slot and have it overwrite the other slots (Example).

tldr.:

• any given armor skin can only be worn by 1/3 of all characters
• armor limits the designer's freedom because of predefined cuts and potential clipping issues

Personally I prefer armor and rarely use any outfits. However I can understand why making outfits makes sense for the gemstore.

P.s.: There's a lie/misunderstanding floating around that armor takes 8(or even 24) times longer to create than outfits because you need to create it for every race and gender. Since you also have to create outfits for every race and gender the multiplicator is 8/8=1. The amount of races and genders plays no role in this.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@"BunjiKugashira.9754" said:P.s.: There's a lie/misunderstanding floating around that armor takes 8(or even 24) times longer to create than outfits because you need to create it for every race and gender. Since you also have to create outfits for every race and gender the multiplicator is 8/8=1. The amount of races and genders plays no role in this.

Tell that to Mike OBrien then.

Mike-OBrien-ArenaNetArmor sets are by far the most expensive reward we can make. A full set includes heavy, medium, light, times five races, times two sexes, so it's like developing 30 sets. It takes nine months to develop. (That's for a normal armor set -- legendary is much longer.) It's not something we can do for Living World episodes. Individual pieces are good rewards for Living World episodes; full sets are more something for expansion packs.

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

Your suggestion was about getting armor out faster. If they’re making armor for all the races then how is it faster? It still takes 9 months for a full set of 3 weights. However in your suggestion they spend 9 months making the armor but then only releasing for one race. On top of that they now start charging for unlocks instead of us getting the armors for free.

So, no time saved and it cost more while ticking off everyone who has to pay to unlock what used to be free.

I’m not seeing any advantages here.

9 month? Just wondering, is it an out-of-season April's Fool joke?Nah, they can do armor for one race and if needed redo it for other races

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@"BunjiKugashira.9754" said:I don't think you understand the advantage outfits have over armor from a development perspective.

Outfits have 8 models, so they fit every character. The different models are: Human male, Human female, Sylvari male, Sylvari female, Norn male, Norn female, Asura and Charr. Notice that Asura and Charr only have one model each since both genders use the male version.

Armors have 8 models, so they fit about 1/3rd of all characters. The different models are the same as for outfits, but since each armor is also linked to an armour weight, the amount of characters that can use a skin is limited.Armors have pre-defined cuts that the designer has to consider when making the armor in order to avoid clipping as much as possible. Though in theory it would be possible to place an "outfit" into an armor slot and have it overwrite the other slots (Example).

tldr.:

• any given armor skin can only be worn by 1/3 of all characters
• armor limits the designer's freedom because of predefined cuts and potential clipping issues

Personally I prefer armor and rarely use any outfits. However I can understand why making outfits makes sense for the gemstore.

P.s.: There's a lie/misunderstanding floating around that armor takes 8(or even 24) times longer to create than outfits because you need to create it for every race and gender. Since you also have to create outfits for every race and gender the multiplicator is 8/8=1. The amount of races and genders plays no role in this.

Hmmm i understand, but they make game for players and if players enjoy armor more then outfits, why wouldn't they try to optimize their development of armor models.Right now i understand it as they make outfits for themselves, because it is easier money :/

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

Your suggestion was about getting armor out faster. If they’re making armor for all the races then how is it faster? It still takes 9 months for a full set of 3 weights. However in your suggestion they spend 9 months making the armor but then only releasing for one race. On top of that they now start charging for unlocks instead of us getting the armors for free.

So, no time saved and it cost more while ticking off everyone who has to pay to unlock what used to be free.

I’m not seeing any advantages here.

9 month? Just wondering, is it an out-of-season April's Fool joke?Nah, they can do armor for one race and if needed redo it for other races

Right now they're doing it the fastest and most efficient way. Everyone is in place and creating one line of armor for all in an assembly line fashion. Instead of that you would have them create armor in a start and stop fashion with some working on a new set and some working on the previous set and others working on an older set, and with committee meetings in between to decide which sets have enough demand to do and which do not, plus periodic re-evaluations of old unreleased sets.

It would be the most disjointed, uncoordinated method of armor making one would never want to see and it would increase the time to create armor, not decrease.

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

Your suggestion was about getting armor out faster. If they’re making armor for all the races then how is it faster? It still takes 9 months for a full set of 3 weights. However in your suggestion they spend 9 months making the armor but then only releasing for one race. On top of that they now start charging for unlocks instead of us getting the armors for free.

So, no time saved and it cost more while ticking off everyone who has to pay to unlock what used to be free.

I’m not seeing any advantages here.

9 month? Just wondering, is it an out-of-season April's Fool joke?Nah, they can do armor for one race and if needed redo it for other races

Right now theyre doing it the fastest and most efficient way. Everyone is in place and creating one line of armor for all in an assembly line fashion. Instead of that you would have them create armor in a start and stop fashion with some working on a new set and some working on the previous set and others working on an older set, and with committee meetings in between to decide which sets have enough demand to do and which do not, plus periodic re-evaluations of old unreleased sets.

It would be the most disjointed, uncoordinated method of armor making one would never want to see and it would increase the time to create armor, not decrease.Thank you, my prophet.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:In other words you’re asking for more cultural armor.

One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

Not cultural, just available for one race on the release.But yea, hmmm, interesting idea, it can be cultural!But in the future if players ask they can reshape it and sell it again for other races or sell the device that transform armor to be available for all eligible races.There is a field of opportunities for microtransactions there

In this game armor restricted to one race is known as cultural armor which means your suggestion is for cultural armor regardless of how it looks.

There is not and will not be some “device that transforms armor to be wearable for all races.” The only “device” is hard work by the devs to create armor from start to finish.

You think what, i am stupid? Ofc, there is no such device.Let me explain more detailed:1) They release armor set for humans2) People buy it3) They make models for other races aswell (for all other races or for some)4a) They release "Armor wear pass" making that armor set available for other races4b) "Armor wear pass" can be sold cheaper for only one race (like im Asura and playing only Asura so i dont need it on all races)

Your suggestion was about getting armor out faster. If they’re making armor for all the races then how is it faster? It still takes 9 months for a full set of 3 weights. However in your suggestion they spend 9 months making the armor but then only releasing for one race. On top of that they now start charging for unlocks instead of us getting the armors for free.

So, no time saved and it cost more while ticking off everyone who has to pay to unlock what used to be free.

I’m not seeing any advantages here.

9 month? Just wondering, is it an out-of-season April's Fool joke?Nah, they can do armor for one race and if needed redo it for other races

Right now theyre doing it the fastest and most efficient way. Everyone is in place and creating one line of armor for all in an assembly line fashion. Instead of that you would have them create armor in a start and stop fashion with some working on a new set and some working on the previous set and others working on an older set, and with committee meetings in between to decide which sets have enough demand to do and which do not, plus periodic re-evaluations of old unreleased sets.

It would be the most disjointed, uncoordinated method of armor making one would never want to see and it would increase the time to create armor, not decrease.Thank you, my prophet.

No problem. Thank you for acknowledging your suggestion would increase time, be inefficient, would anger many to be required to pay with a gemstore purchase for what used to be free and that for many people it would mean that their races would never get a particular armor if ANet decides that there isn’t demand enough.

[kharmin.7683]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:I'm not playing GW2 anymore actually.

Why are you posting all of these suggestions then?

[Cherdakuru.5841]

@kharmin.7683 said:

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:I'm not playing GW2 anymore actually.

Why are you posting all of these suggestions then?

I hope that they will eventually remove Black Lion Chests so i can play this game againAnd i'm thinking how could they monetize their game without those damn chests inside

[Leo G.4501]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

That....that's a lie. That's not true at all.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Leo G.4501 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

That....that's a lie. That's not true at all.

Not sure if sarcastic.....

But how is it customization friendly to see armor your race can’t use?

[Dante.1763]

@Leo G.4501 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

That....that's a lie. That's not true at all.

Sorry but..until i can wear asuran armor, i shouldnt be able to try and equip it on my charr. >.<

[Ashen.2907]

I would actually like to see more race specific armor added to the game.

[Liewec.2896]

i regard all of the regular excuses as to why they don't release more armours as just that, excuses.the fact is churning out easy one-piece cashgrab outfits makes more money,and as we've been learning from EA and Activision/Blizzard recently, game companies care only about the bottom line.

[Zaklex.6308]

@Cherdakuru.5841 said:As a part of my sudden activity on this forum.~snip~!/// mad idea, i'm just brainstorming: you can even add an item, gemstore purchase, that makes items from one race available to another (for new sets) I would buy that if it help get rid of Black lion chests

 So if I'm right, based on this last line, all of your suggestions(including the one that specifically addresses Black Lion chests) is about getting rid of Black Lion chests.  Well, the Black Lion chests are optional, no one is forced to use them.  Black Lion chests are not going anywhere, and since you no longer play the game because of an OPTIONAL item that is in the game all you're doing is wasting the Devs time posting these suggestions, and be disingenuous trying to disguise your different suggestions as something other than ways to get rid of Black Lion chests.  Why don't you instead make a post telling us why Black Lion chests keep you from playing this game so that all of us can debunk your reasons.

[Pure Heart.1456]

Armour is better for players, Outfits are better for Anet.The game released with a large number of individual armour pieces, so it's puzzling why Mike Obrien would say that it it takes nine months--the math doesn't add up--unless modelling staff numbers were drastically reduced after the game's initial release.

Mike-OBrien-ArenaNet

Armor sets are by far the most expensive reward we can make.

A full set includes heavy, medium, light, times five races, times two sexes, so it's like developing 30 sets

. It takes nine months to develop. (That's for a normal armor set -- legendary is much longer.) It's not something we can do for Living World episodes. Individual pieces are good rewards for Living World episodes; full sets are more something for expansion packs.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@"Pure Heart.1456" said:Armour is better for players, Outfits are better for Anet.The game released with a large number of individual armour pieces, so it's puzzling why Mike Obrien would say that it it takes nine months--the math doesn't add up--unless modelling staff numbers were drastically reduced after the game's initial release.

Mike-OBrien-ArenaNet

Armor sets are by far the most expensive reward we can make.

A full set includes heavy, medium, light, times five races, times two sexes, so it's like developing 30 sets

. It takes nine months to develop. (That's for a normal armor set -- legendary is much longer.) It's not something we can do for Living World episodes. Individual pieces are good rewards for Living World episodes; full sets are more something for expansion packs.

From my memory of a long ago comment by an ANet staff, there were a number of people who were hired to help create the game and whose contract ended when the game was finished. So staff was reduced at the game’s initial release.

[Leo G.4501]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Leo G.4501 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

That....that's a lie. That's not true at all.

Not sure if sarcastic.....

But how is it customization friendly to see armor your race can’t use?

So let me get this straight, it's not customization friendly to have an outfit among a series of many different outfits just because you can't change parts of the outfit (or use armor) so you'll look different from someone else wearing the same outfit... But it is customization friendly that you can wear all the same armor another race can even if it's uniquely designed for that other specific race?

Or perhaps people's standard for what "customization" is is fluid.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Leo G.4501 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Leo G.4501 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:One disadvantage is that it’s not customization friendly when you see something for one race that would look great on your char of another race but you can’t use it because reasons.

That....that's a lie. That's not true at all.

Not sure if sarcastic.....

But how is it customization friendly to see armor your race can’t use?

So let me get this straight, it's not customization friendly to have an outfit among a series of many different outfits just because you can't change parts of the outfit (or use armor) so you'll look different from someone else wearing the same outfit... But it is customization friendly that you can wear all the same armor another race can even if it's uniquely designed for that other specific race?

Or perhaps people's standard for what "customization" is is fluid.

Regardless of the title, the OP’s post is about armor. My response to the OP is about armor and it not being customization friendly if you can’t use it. Please stick to what is being discussed and don’t drag in irrelevant comments on another subject, namely outfits.

Thanks.