Siege damage should be brought in line

[avey.4201]

@Aeolus.3615 said:I am wondering which siege players say it’s op??

Maybe they want siege that stacks perma on enemy????

By the other hand some conditions need to stop afecting siege like, bleed, poison, torment, ..

arrow carts/ballista/cannon/mortar/golem.

[Blackarps.1974]

I do think its weird they lowered siege damage last year then come around and lower all power damage and healing with this patch. It makes blue/base siege even more useless now. Its also weird they didn't lower the HP of guards but that hasn't really been an issue for me either.

[Shroud.2307]

All I want is for Ballista damage to be heavily reduced against players ( 5k tops ). Arrow Carts, Cannons, etc. doing high damage to players is fine, they're supposed to be for defense and they should be capable of doing so. A zerg with enough support can tank through it anyway and most times AC's are only much of a threat if you're standing in them for an extended period of time.

Ballistas on the other hand should be for destroying siege, not players. Too many people sitting in towers with Ballista's being nothing but a pest.

You can make what ever claim you like about defense and for the most part I agree, but in the case of Ballistas, I'm way beyond tired of seeing people sitting in towers all day just waiting to snipe you with a bali that does 15k in a single hit. It is especially idiotic when people have multiple aimed at Sentry's and just wait there for someone to pass by to multi-hit them for easy kills/participation.

It becomes even more toxic when a fight is happening near an objective and you have people building a bunch of them in towers so they can snipe people from safety. I understand the decision to fight near an offending objective is unwise but this isn't about strategy, it's about toxic mechanics that in this case reward people for being a nuisance.

tldr; Ballista's should be for killing siege not players. All other siege is fine as is.

[Aeolus.3615]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:All I want is for Ballista damage to be heavily reduced against players ( 5k tops ). Arrow Carts, Cannons, etc. doing high damage to players is fine, they're supposed to be for defense and they should be capable of doing so. A zerg with enough support can tank through it anyway and most times AC's are only much of a threat if you're standing in them for an extended period of time.

Ballistas on the other hand should be for destroying siege, not players. Too many people sitting in towers with Ballista's being nothing but a pest.

tldr; Ballista's should be for killing siege not players. All other siege is fine as is.

Balistas should damage in straight line and knock back.

Damage from siege should be reduced from absorption domes.

Altough RoTGD reduces damage on players and siege, in some places by50% damage from treb on walls.

[Dinas Dragonbane.2978]

@"avey.4201" said:Cannon/arrow carts/ballista are doing massive power creep damage, we have so little damage it's impossible to pressure siege campers, and takes a very long time to destroy siege while ballista almost 1 shot's with unblockable cc, arrow carts can down people in 3-4 ticks with big aoe, and cannon does big damage with chilled+cc.Describe the "we" that has so little damage please. Also I want to km now who and what is almost being one shot by ballista and where in which map this is occurring in. Same for the ACs which players can only take ac damage once a second, meaning you cannot take damage from 2 or more at the same time. More acs mean nothing except hitting somewhere the first isn't.

[Biermeister.4678]

They need to increase the damage of siege and the toughness of it also Ranger barrage is enough to take out most siege placed behind walls and gates since it is the only skill that does not need line of sight

[Za Shaloc.3908]

@Biermeister.4678 said:They need to increase the damage of siege and the toughness of it also Ranger barrage is enough to take out most siege placed behind walls and gates since it is the only skill that does not need line of sight

Eh, let Rangers have their niche. They are already shunned enough in zergs.

[Arctisavange.7261]

Are there people really defending siege damage right now. Big yikes on how the people in here are.

Take Stonemist and its sieging for example - theres 2 gates NW and south gate where you can deploy unreachable siege if deployed correctly. You may hit some of the acs with ballista if theyre badly deployed but at the same time your ballista gets pretty easily destroyed by counter siege from upper second level where its practically impossible to reach unless youre fighting only handful of enemies who you outnumber hard.

So pretty much you have a treb on top of the tower covering the gate, you have unreachable ACs + mortar on second floor covering the gate. You have unreachable ACs on the 2 gates mentioned above, you have trebs throwing cow shots on your face. All of that is unreachable if deployed properly and even if by some miracles you do manage to kill any of that before going for the gate ramming, you can be 100% certain new ones will be deployed in an instant.

Same can be said with BL garrison.

There are plenty of places where siege deployment in objectives is unreachable from attackers side and often times youre simply forced to bunker the gate down or go for a long period snoozing of shield gen + catapult war.With the heal nerf, nowadays its pretty hard to bunker even with a blob when attacking a properly sieged up objective.

Lets not forget that weavers got hit with quite a nerf in the patch so they are rare in zergs when you need to kill reachable siege with meteors.

Add in tactivators, siege disablers and enemies clouding you to get couple fast bombs inside.

If youre in denial that no everything is okay, just l2p then im sorry, either youre fighting total trash enemies who dont know what an AC is or youre one of the siege monkeys yourself.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Arctisavange.7261 said:snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

[Arctisavange.7261]

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

[Jobber.6348]

Siege weapons are the last line of defense one can use against outnumbered, and it is also limited by Supply.

Nerfing it would just make objective defense pointless if yu have even 10 less bodies than the attacking force.If yu want Objective defense to only function with a push and pull effect plus a wall in the middle, then go ahead and nerf Siege.

Sure, people can deploy Siege in the field, but remember, that's all that invested Supply not going into something which can be used elsewhere, like a different Siege to take down a wall or to repair a wall.

If someone decides to spend supply making 10 Golems in a camp, they just wasted 10 Golems worth of supply in that camp which can be idk, used to repair 3 walls, forcing the defenders in that objective to drain their own supply to repair walls because a genius wasted all the camp supply.

[Aeolus.3615]

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

The defenders on wall will be killed by fire....:)

Fix burn bursts worry with siege later.

[Arctisavange.7261]

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

The defenders on wall will be killed by fire....:)

Fix burn bursts worry with siege later.

You must be fighting some really big noobs who are defending, Go take on WSR with their SM circus to see proper siege cancer, ganking, clouding and freecasting, even when you have a blob.

[Aeolus.3615]

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

The defenders on wall will be killed by fire....:)

Fix burn bursts worry with siege later.

You must be fighting some really big noobs who are defending, Go take on WSR with their SM circus to see proper siege cancer, ganking, clouding and freecasting, even when you have a blob.

Smc Is for pve players or mega blob :p

I play on a 10ish player team, atm facing a burnguard blob.

If they don’t abuse the fire stacks Bursts we have chance to win.

I don’t mind the siege atm not the most critical issue atm.

The way burns are overperforming in blob gameplay its far worrisome.

[Arctisavange.7261]

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

The defenders on wall will be killed by fire....:)

Fix burn bursts worry with siege later.

You must be fighting some really big noobs who are defending, Go take on WSR with their SM circus to see proper siege cancer, ganking, clouding and freecasting, even when you have a blob.

Smc Is for pve players or mega blob :p

I play on a 10ish player team, atm facing a burnguard blob.

If they don’t abuse the fire stacks Bursts we have chance to win.

I don’t mind the siege atm not the most critical issue atm.

The way burns are overperforming in blob gameplay its far worrisome.

Why are you talking about burn guard in a topic thats about siege?

[aspirine.6852]

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

The defenders on wall will be killed by fire....:)

Fix burn bursts worry with siege later.

You must be fighting some really big noobs who are defending, Go take on WSR with their SM circus to see proper siege cancer, ganking, clouding and freecasting, even when you have a blob.

Lies, we all know WSR doesnt use siege. They tell us themselves.. ;)

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Arctisavange.7261 said:

snip

When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills

from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers

we can talk about the other aspects.

If the back of the wall can be hit by wells, meteors and other AOEs, then someone standing on the back of the wall should be able to hit that attacker with wells, meteors and AOEs.

The first part you have a valid point only if the attackers stack only on 1 spot but youre forgetting that you can cloud up on a wall and no proper defender has no difficulties atleast managing to land 1 skill into the attackers siege. Add defensive siege such as acs and its even far more less difficult cause enemies are busy trying to stay alive rather then focus couple people constantly managing to land DPS inside in an certain time interval.

The second statement you wrote makes me believe you didnt read nothing at all that i typed as i clearly stated there are tons of siege locations in objectives that are UNREACHABLE with meteors, wells and other AOEs.

Please read next time, snip.

Did I mention siege?

I didn’t mention it for a reason. If you had comprehended what I wrote: ‘ When Defenders can hit attackers with the same skills from the spots that the defenders can be hit by attackers we can talk about the other aspects. you would have noted that I said we can discuss other aspects AFTER the disparity on walls is fixed.

If you are dying to siege now... Man., I would say Git Gud, but someone might be offended.

[pninak.1069]

if siege were about to be nerfed players would build more to compensate its loss. and by doing that your goal objective will run out of supplies long before you capture it making a loss of supplies for your team too, because you won't be able to afford as much defense as earlier.

There are also a ton of ways to manage to bypass siege. I kinda like seeing all the aoe rings of them. They do substantially less dmg that you think,. Now if you run around with glasscannon gear I wouldn't be surprised if you get sniped down fast.