The love-hate relationship with SAB: Praise and Pain Points

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Friday.7864 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:I’ve seen some people comment about having to dodge jump. This actually is only required in one specific place at the end of W2Z3 when doing TM. Nowhere else in SAB on any mode is this required.

Yes, but considering all the perversions being thrown at you it can make life a lot easier.

If

you can consistently pull it off but many cannot.

It's actually easier (not easy, just easier) to pull off dodge jumps than some of the

theoretically normal jumps that require perfect precision in order to reach

. At least dodge jump lets you have some leeway there.

I haven't encountered that but then perhaps I'm just used to jumping in this game and don't notice it. The only jumps I dislike are anything with mushroom or trampoline. I spend about 20 seconds last night jumping on a trampoline waiting for it to actually bounce me.

[Blueberry.8095]

@Kulvar.1239 said:

@Taygus.4571 said:

@Kulvar.1239 said:

@Taygus.4571 said:

@Kulvar.1239 said:And then there's me, stuck in world 1 zone 1 because I get bumped into the abyss by jumping rocks in the middle of a jump :(

That sounds like you're playing tribulation. Normal is talking to the npc in the middle, when you enter the house.

tribulation is a nightmare.

Yes, I do play tribulations (with intent). But I can't understand how to handle the jumping rocks. I jump away from a platform, but I still get knockback by the jumping rock and fall to my demise. I watched youtube videos and people seem safe after they jumped out of the platform, but it doesn't work when I do it.

whats your ping? those rocks are almost impossible with high ping, as even if you get past them, game still thinks you're there and knocks you.

I have high ping and so I don't bother with trib.

I have a 30-50ms ping.

And mind is average 260+ before covid, now it's even higher like about 330+

[Friday.7864]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:I find it unlikely that they’ll redo world 2. What will likely happen is that if they were to do future worlds, they’ll take the length criticism into account.

Not that I expect them to. What they can do is nerf the achievement requirements for w2.I can do tribu runs of all zones in w2 but it takes a while and doing the last zones 16 times is a pain to put it mildly.If it stays the same and they add more worlds with the same achievements new players will have to make SAB their full time job if they want to complete it...And yes, I was also jumping on trampolines with a 40ms ping for a while without them doing anything...

[hugo.4705]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"hugo.4705" said:I want the next zones to be more difficult too. Anet again, should simply stop listening too much. (Me included) Because forums doesn't represent the thought of the whole playerbase, it isn't the case for Twitter too. SAB could have been finished right now. So just, stop it, don't make them put SAB in stasis 6 more years AGAIN.You do realize, that w2 being much longer and more annoying than w1

was

one of the reasons why SAB got put in the freezer for so long back then?

I mean, even the original SAB designer admits that w2 was overdone, and that he made a mistake here.

I never said that w2 isn't longer than w1. When speaking about being more difficult, it doesn't necessarily imply longer, as said above, you can make a zone short straight forward but with enemies mechanics that require you more strategy and slowing you down. Also if you pay attention to the environment of my quote, you we'll see that I'm speaking of tribulation. In the others messages in that thread, I clearly said infantile should be easy, normal normal, and tribulation hard. So when I said harder future zones, I speak of new foes and mechanics, and a tribulation that stay at a frustrating level but doable. Also do you think really it is exaggerate to take 7 mins to finish w2-2 compared to 5 min for w1-2? The limit for me is 15 minutes, after 15 minutes you start to be infuriated and want to stop, and that happens only in tribulation w2-2 and w2-3. And I think you missed my last comment some comments above: I'm aware of the length of the zone, I drew a map showing short versions of the zones.

I listened Josh during its stream, he thought bigger is better and of course W2 zones aren't enough cut into checkpoints or simply cut. But this isn't the reason of the freeze of SAB he said: During that time you had the LS1 events, and of course they mobilized everybody due to the huge work it one of the quote was:

! "When asked what the reason for World 3 and World 4 not getting made in the end:"!

! "The reason was simply priority shifting. During season 1 of Living World, everything was unprecedented. It was like, we've made an MMO and we want to keep everyone employed at this point. How do we make enough income from this MMO to keep people employed? Let's explore shall we?! And we all just threw everything at the wall and some of it stuck and some of it didn't. SAB was one of the things that stuck for a little bit then eventually slid down the wall with slime trails behind it and it wasn't enough of an impact to be like, 'Yes, this is a thing that we will always expand on'."

Sure, the first iteration of W2 was long, fastidious, you are killed by one hit, easy smile face paths weren't existing. And Josh was devastated seeing the reaction of players into a thing he spent ton of time in expecting players to be "Wow, amazing!". Does It justify to send him all the hates of the world, insulting Anet and him? Definitely not. It seams that, even after they improved W2 by adding shortcuts, you still hate them 6y after, why do you play that content then?But the scream of everyone on twitter wasn't the origin of the stop of SAB. Josh also worked on several jumping puzzles around Tyria after and even participated in the design of the Marionette fight. I'm happy for him that he has now a job he loves. During that period, players started to be bored, nothing to do anymore, that's why they added ascended stuffs. They needed income, and since SAB can't make any money, of course it was delayed and put into second priority. They tried several thing to make income or attract players, and as he said some simply haven't attracted them. When the first version of W2, I gave feedback, but never insulted him, I thanked him for the settings he made for the zones. And of course I asked for easy path back then.

So of course, you will find players like you saying W2 is longer than W1, don't like it, and so it must be the cause of the stop of SAB. And you will find players like me telling you, it's not because of that, they had to keep the interest of players and income for the company, and so what they did? Ascended; then expansions.We can turn in round like that infinitely, was LS1 really necessary? Could haven't them directly launched ls2 and hot? And finishing as side project SAB?Was it an error to launch SAB at this time? Should have been launched later? Not everyone like SAB, see its stream, one of its chief, raised in communism never know 8bit and hated SAB. There is ton of players here like that "Stop putting those ugly graphics in my face".

It doesn't lead anywhere to continue saying w2 is longer than w1. I ask YOU, what you would do? In all seriousness, tell me. Would you redo W2 again? Would you simply cut a part of the zones into abyss? What I am saying, there is players who already finished all collections and achievs for tribulations, can you imagine reducing the zones? Wouldn't it be unfair that some players experienced long hard path and some others will experience a small path?

---

TLDR: For many longer = boring especially if you have traps. For me it's amusement.SAB was stopped due to priority shifting, ofc LS1 required ton of more work than SAB (Living world story, events, worldbosses.....)W2 is longer than W1, but the only issue for me is eventually the tribulation path. (32 mins long.....)But Normal should stay normal, why not as example, in normal, any arrow trap in w2-2 disable after trigerred? In infantile, all are disabled?But well, I return, to what I said previously, the issues are mechanics: Trampolines need fix, pirahna should stay in hand infinitely. First required jump of the tribulation w2-2 shouldn't be a dodge jump. In W2-2 I lose 80 lives at first jump between the two leaves, and 130 at the end with pillars jumps and trampolines.W2-1 logs on rivers should spawn more frequently.The crying on Twitter when w2 released is only the vocal majority, it doesn't represent the majority of what the playerbase think. It's false to state everyone hate current w2. See did a test asked 12 random players around me: 7 Were for keeping current W2, 5 to nerf it.

[lare.5129]

with slight increased ping on cov19 times the w2z3 comes comes to hard ..aslo w2z3 and tribuliationw2z3 it to hard.

[Friday.7864]

@hugo.4705 said:

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@hugo.4705 said:I want the next zones to be more difficult too. Anet again, should simply stop listening too much. (Me included) Because forums doesn't represent the thought of the whole playerbase, it isn't the case for Twitter too. SAB could have been finished right now. So just, stop it, don't make them put SAB in stasis 6 more years AGAIN.You do realize, that w2 being much longer and more annoying than w1

was

one of the reasons why SAB got put in the freezer for so long back then?

I mean, even the original SAB designer admits that w2 was overdone, and that he made a mistake here.

I never said that w2 isn't longer than w1. When speaking about being more difficult, it doesn't necessarily imply longer, as said above, you can make a zone short straight forward but with enemies mechanics that require you more strategy and slowing you down. Also if you pay attention to the environment of my quote, you we'll see that I'm speaking of tribulation. In the others messages in that thread, I clearly said infantile should be easy, normal normal, and tribulation hard. So when I said harder future zones, I speak of new foes and mechanics, and a tribulation that stay at a frustrating level but doable. Also do you think really it is exaggerate to take 7 mins to finish w2-2 compared to 5 min for w1-2? The limit for me is 15 minutes, after 15 minutes you start to be infuriated and want to stop, and that happens only in tribulation w2-2 and w2-3.

I listened Josh during its stream, he thought bigger is better and of course W2 zones aren't enough cut into checkpoints or simply cut. But this isn't the reason of the freeze of SAB he said: During that time you had the LS1 events, and of course they mobilized everybody due to the huge work it one of the quote was:

! "When asked what the reason for World 3 and World 4 not getting made in the end:"!

! "The reason was simply priority shifting. During season 1 of Living World, everything was unprecedented. It was like, we've made an MMO and we want to keep everyone employed at this point. How do we make enough income from this MMO to keep people employed? Let's explore shall we?! And we all just threw everything at the wall and some of it stuck and some of it didn't. SAB was one of the things that stuck for a little bit then eventually slid down the wall with slime trails behind it and it wasn't enough of an impact to be like, 'Yes, this is a thing that we will always expand on'."

Sure, the first iteration of W2 was long, fastidious, you are killed by one hit, easy smile face paths weren't existing. And Josh was devastated seeing the reaction of players into a thing he spent ton of time in expecting players to be "Wow, amazing!". Does It justify to send him all the hates of the world, insulting Anet and him? Definitely not. It seams that, even after they improved W2 by adding shortcuts, you still hate them 6y after, why do you play that content then?But the scream of everyone on twitter wasn't the origin of the stop of SAB. Josh also worked on several jumping puzzles around Tyria after and even participated in the design of the Marionette fight. I'm happy for him that he has now a job he loves. During that period, players started to be bored, nothing to do anymore, that's why they added ascended stuffs. They needed income, and since SAB can't make any money, of course it was delayed and put into second priority. They tried several thing to make income or attract players, and as he said some simply haven't attracted them. When the first version of W2, I gave feedback, but never insulted him, I thanked him for the settings he made for the zones. And of course I asked for easy path back then.

So of course, you will find players like you saying W2 is longer than W1, don't like it, and so it must be the cause of the stop of SAB. And you will find players like me telling you, it's not because of that, they had to keep the interest of players and income for the company, and so what they did? Ascended; then expansions.We can turn in round like that infinitely, was LS1 really necessary? Could haven't them directly launched ls2 and hot? And finishing as side project SAB?Was it an error to launch SAB at this time? Should have been launched later? Not everyone like SAB, see its stream, one of its chief, raised in communism never know 8bit and hated SAB. There is ton of players here like that "Stop putting those ugly graphics in my face".

It doesn't lead anywhere to continue saying w2 is longer than w1. I ask YOU, what you would do? In all seriousness, tell me. Would you redo W2 again? Would you simply cut a part of the zones into abyss? What I am saying, there is players who already finished all collections and achievs for tribulations, can you imagine reducing the zones? Wouldn't it be unfair that some players experienced long hard path and some others will experience a small path?

SAB is a great event, most unique one of them all if that makes you and Josh feel any better. I'd even praise the last two zones for their uniqueness if it wasn't for the need to run them so many times.He simply shot himself in the foot with time consuming achievements like the 96 (6x16) tribulation runs within a 3-4 week window (among other annoying stuff) > that, my friend, can be changed and fixed, especially when you take into consideration the release of additional worlds aka having even more content to do within the same time limit. Tribu runs are too punishing to make them repetitive as part of achievements. After the first one, additional runs should be optional with nothing but bonus daily rewards imo.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Friday.7864 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:I find it unlikely that they’ll redo world 2. What will likely happen is that if they were to do future worlds, they’ll take the length criticism into account.

Not that I expect them to. What they can do is nerf the achievement requirements for w2.I can do tribu runs of all zones in w2 but it takes a while and doing the last zones 16 times is a pain to put it mildly.If it stays the same and they add more worlds with the same achievements new players will have to make SAB their full time job if they want to complete it...And yes, I was also jumping on trampolines with a 40ms ping for a while without them doing anything...

That’s just as unlikely to happen.

[hugo.4705]

@"Friday.7864" said:SAB is a great event, most unique one of them all if that makes you and Josh feel any better. I'd even praise the last two zones for their uniqueness if it wasn't for the need to run them so many times.He simply shot himself in the foot with time consuming achievements like the 96 (6x16) tribulation runs within a 3-4 week window (among other annoying stuff) > that, my friend, can be changed and fixed, especially when you take into consideration the release of additional worlds aka having even more content to do within the same time limit. Tribu runs are too punishing to make them repetitive as part of achievements. After the first one, additional runs should be optional with nothing but bonus daily rewards imo.

On that I totally agree with you. But don't you think, they made those two achiev (king toad/storm wizard 16xworld1/2 trib) long on purpose? It's to occupy you on several year in a row. There is a simple thing that can be done: See, it takes me 7 mins to do w2-1 trib, 32 mins to do w2-2 trib. Since it takes me 5x more time, make the zone trib reward me 5 w2-2 tokens instead of one? Many react like "since the festival is here, I should finish all those achievs now!" I've finished those achievs after 3y of doing sab: 2020-2019-2018. I am upset about it? No. I think, doing SAB tribs run 16 times to earn 2 ascended orange weapon with unique infusion is GREAT. Also I don't get it, you aren't forced to do your 16x w2-1 / 2-2 / 2-3 in a row. Do one w2 run each day, no more no less.

About the issues that you can't do everything during the festival, that's why some asked SAB to be permanent content, or to have lodge allowing you to go here all year.I didn't have that issue, cause I was here when it launched and so did each achiev when they was added. But I can understand it would be annoying if you start only this year and have to do all the achievements. I can only advise to do the baubles collector first with the help of Dulfy website.And I wanna say, I expected them to readd a 16 times world in tribulation achiev for world 3 and 4, rewarding you with two ascended crimson assassin weapon and two more unique infusions colors. It isn't about "Make me or Josh feel better" there is ton of players that enjoy SAB how it is currently, and when you enjoy a thing, you stay silent and don't post a rant/complain post here. I'm happy that each run of w2-2 I did even If I spam it, reward me each time with a token and don't want it to be daily. Glitches chest should have been available daily and one for each difficulty instead of just daily for all. I would also make trib zones tokens drops in normal mode, with a 1/4 chance, something like that.

---

"Literally everything you do you're gonna have some amount of the population complain about it and say that it's bad and in the wrong direction. And you have the double problem that the loudest people are typically the most upset about it so you have this knock-on/doubling effect that it's magnifies the negativity about a thing. Most people are somewhere in the middle and so don't say anything. And then you have the minority who say they love a thing and it's very hard to know how to balance those things."

The forum is the complaining population. You don't know about the middle group, and you have the minority that say they like it and well the part of it who like it and don't say it too. There is peoples saying 2-2 and 2-3 are too long, and since the start of the post, there are suggestions to improve it. But mind you, w2 zones already been nerfed in the past to add the easy paths. Tribulation path is the normal path that was launched at the start. W2 is a journey, like lord of the ring, if you see the long tribulation zones as just pain, you simply haven't understood tribulations. It gives me a feeling of accomplishment each time I finish a W2 zone and it's a good thing.

They can add new easier achievement, but they can't simply redo an achievement who have been here for a considerable time. Just impossible.And they just need to fix their trampolines, mushrooms and piranhas. That's it.

TLDR: How to expect them to fix issues? Everyone have a different one:-I don't want time consuming achievs.-W2 zones are too long in general.-I want more rewards.-I want to see W3/4, W2 is fine.-Need more time for all the achievs.-Would like to access SAB the whole year.-Less frustration in tribulation.-> And so possibly requiring dev resources and work time, slowing down release of icebrood saga episodes?

[Friday.7864]

The middle group won't complain as they will simply ignore the whole festival. Like many in my guild do.The content is simply too sadistic and messed up for many people to even consider it.I'm doing it and suffering and I hate some parts of SAB so much by now I lack the words to describe it, that's why I care enough to complain.

[Taygus.4571]

@Friday.7864 said:The middle group won't complain as they will simply ignore the whole festival. Like many in my guild do.The content is simply too sadistic and messed up for many people to even consider it.I'm doing it and suffering and I hate some parts of SAB so much by now I lack the words to describe it, that's why I care enough to complain.

why are you playing it, if you hate it?

[nosleepdemon.1368]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Friday.7864 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:I’ve seen some people comment about having to dodge jump. This actually is only required in one specific place at the end of W2Z3 when doing TM. Nowhere else in SAB on any mode is this required.

Yes, but considering all the perversions being thrown at you it can make life a lot easier.

If

you can consistently pull it off but many cannot.

It's actually easier (not easy, just easier) to pull off dodge jumps than some of the

theoretically normal jumps that require perfect precision in order to reach

. At least dodge jump lets you have some leeway there.

I haven't encountered that but then perhaps I'm just used to jumping in this game and don't notice it. The only jumps I dislike are anything with mushroom or trampoline. I spend about 20 seconds last night jumping on a trampoline waiting for it to actually bounce me.

There are some jumps on the faster routes in tribulation mode that require a dodge jump to succeed, because you are flying not only farther but also through danger such as bouncing blocks or hand missiles. A good example is crossing lava after the forest in world 1 zone 1. You will be smashed by a bouncing block midway through your jump.

[myrtthe.3149]

cons: I still hate w2z2 even in infantile. I hate the puzzle part. The piranha's aren't that fun to do, just time consuming. Mushrooms work for me, can adjust mid-air, but the second last trampoline before boss never gets me far enough.And then I had the feared 'client cannot connect to server' message after reaching checkpoint of puzzle room in trib. Then it tossed me into character select. Please with a dc, it would be nice to be able to get back where u were (limit of 5 min max). Could sacrifice some lives. It can be so annoying, especially when you're halfway trib.Shortcut eagle should work in trib.... sacrifice rewards, or take away 5 lives or so. If shortcut wurm works (still have to try that one), then shortcut eagle should work as well.Another con in w1z2: that first darn angry rock in trib. Second one dodging into leaf is somewhat better, but they're so hard compared to the ones in w2.edit: Can't comment on w2z3, because am not able to attempt that one yet.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@nosleepdemon.1368 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Friday.7864 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:I’ve seen some people comment about having to dodge jump. This actually is only required in one specific place at the end of W2Z3 when doing TM. Nowhere else in SAB on any mode is this required.

Yes, but considering all the perversions being thrown at you it can make life a lot easier.

If

you can consistently pull it off but many cannot.

It's actually easier (not easy, just easier) to pull off dodge jumps than some of the

theoretically normal jumps that require perfect precision in order to reach

. At least dodge jump lets you have some leeway there.

I haven't encountered that but then perhaps I'm just used to jumping in this game and don't notice it. The only jumps I dislike are anything with mushroom or trampoline. I spend about 20 seconds last night jumping on a trampoline waiting for it to actually bounce me.

There are some jumps on the faster routes in tribulation mode that require a dodge jump to succeed, because you are flying not only farther but also through danger such as bouncing blocks or hand missiles. A good example is crossing lava after the forest in world 1 zone 1. You will be smashed by a bouncing block midway through your jump.

Those required for shortcuts don't count. Also, you don't need dodge jump for that rock.

[Solvar.7953]

The simplest way to improve bauble collection would be to first split the achievements into checkpoints (all baubles at w1z1c1, w1z2c2, etc), and for those achievements, have a list of individual baubles like they do for scavenger hunts. Thus one can work on that achievement piecemeal instead of sitting down for a long marathon session, not have to worry about back tracking (just re-play the zone again). It might even inspire more people to do it, as you would do a play through and see that you have gotten 50% on some number of the zones, and maybe on some zones even higher, and decide 'let me figure out where those missing baubles are and go get them'.This would make the achievement easier to some degree, but not sure if that is really that big an issue.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@"myrtthe.3149" said:Shortcut eagle should work in trib.... sacrifice rewards, or take away 5 lives or so. If shortcut wurm works (still have to try that one), then shortcut eagle should work as well.

I couldn't find one for the eagle shortcut although I found a video of someone doing the map in less than 6 min.

[Friday.7864]

@Taygus.4571 said:

@Friday.7864 said:The middle group won't complain as they will simply ignore the whole festival. Like many in my guild do.The content is simply too sadistic and messed up for many people to even consider it.I'm doing it and suffering and I hate some parts of SAB so much by now I lack the words to describe it, that's why I care enough to complain.

why are you playing it, if you hate it?

I want to complete it, aka get all the achievements like I did for all the other (humane) festivals so far.I don't even care about the infusion anymore. The moment I'm done and get the 40AP for wep collections I'm not stepping foot into tribu anymore or doing anything else for that matter except dailies for achieves afterwards.

[Wiishu.1852]

@"hugo.4705" said:

I will add what I really find an issue with w2-2:? "All-bauble collecting SHOULDN'T require a specific mode or BACKTRACKING"

Does nobody have fun? Enjoy normal and infantile, why seeking for pain? To find something bad to say?I agree with some points, but everyone would have different dots colors Imho.

I personally love W2Z2 and have none of the issues mentioned. The trampolines do work fairly reliably if you jump on them. Enough for regular mode. Haven't done trib mode, however. Not sure if they're different. Bauble collection does not require backtrack or baby-mode. If you go all the way to the hand temple but don't trigger the check point, then die and go back and take the shortcut, you can jump from the seven bauble pillars, across the check point (don't trigger it) to get the assassins in the clouds, then jump to doom. That will take you back to the checkpoint right before the ports to all the ninja stops. From there you can get all the way back to the assassin temple. The ONLY problem I have with doing that and the assassin cleanout is the stupid assassin on top of that one pillar right at the beginning. (before the first octopus) I can't find any way to get him other than from the baby rainbow. I think I've tried to slingshot him from every possible platform, but nothing reaches him. Unless someone knows how to get him, that is the ONE thing I wish Anet would absolutely fix, because that does require the baby mode, which I also find really annoying.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Wiishu.1852 said:

@"hugo.4705" said:

I will add what I really find an issue with w2-2:

?

"All-bauble collecting SHOULDN'T require a specific mode or BACKTRACKING"

Does nobody have fun? Enjoy normal and infantile, why seeking for pain? To find something bad to say?I agree with some points, but everyone would have different dots colors Imho.

The ONLY problem I have with doing that and the assassin cleanout is the stupid assassin on top of that one pillar right at the beginning. (before the first octopus) I can't find any way to get him other than from the baby rainbow. I think I've tried to slingshot him from every possible platform, but nothing reaches him. Unless someone knows how to get him, that is the ONE thing I wish Anet would absolutely fix, because that does require the baby mode, which I also find really annoying.

If it's the one between the building with the red roof and the checkpoint (before the first octopus) then you get it with a bomb while you're still on the red roof.

[Safandula.8723]

Doing w2z2 achivments for 2h only to find out i cant back track after some point made me stop playing sab

[Wiishu.1852]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Wiishu.1852 said:

@"hugo.4705" said:

I will add what I really find an issue with w2-2:

?

"All-bauble collecting SHOULDN'T require a specific mode or BACKTRACKING"

Does nobody have fun? Enjoy normal and infantile, why seeking for pain? To find something bad to say?I agree with some points, but everyone would have different dots colors Imho.

The ONLY problem I have with doing that and the assassin cleanout is the stupid assassin on top of that one pillar right at the beginning. (before the first octopus) I can't find any way to get him other than from the baby rainbow. I think I've tried to slingshot him from every possible platform, but nothing reaches him. Unless someone knows how to get him, that is the ONE thing I wish Anet would absolutely fix, because that does require the baby mode, which I also find really annoying.

If it's the one between the building with the red roof and the checkpoint (before the first octopus) then you get it with a bomb while you're still on the red roof.

Wow...I tried that from all along the edge but couldn't touch him. Will try again! Woohoo! I hadn't actually tried from there. Since it appeared too far from the ledge below, I guess I just assumed! Yippee! Can now get achievement(s) without baby mode. Thank you!!!!

[Luthan.5236]

I recentle played W2Z2 in tribulation mode ... and realized that it was much easier than back then in 2013. I guess it was because back then I did it only once for a full run where I needed the shops and stuff as well. Took me still some time. Might try W2Z3 as well to have finished 1 full run of W2 in tribulation mode. Being able to just skip the gong pagoda (didn't know before it was optional and could be ignored) makes the zone much easier ha ha. :D

Though I'm a bit exhausted from getting the full skin set from tribulation W1 and doing the daily glitched chests. I guess it is okay - I can do the W2 tribulatoin skins (yellow) in the next year.

Main part that makes it annoying (I already mentioned it): You only have 4 weeks (usually only 3 I think) and some sets need to to the zones repeatedly in tribulation. That is getting boring and exhausting. You could take your time ... but then it would take years. I did only one run every 1-2 days. Which was okay but still exhausting. (Considering there is lots of other stuff there and you can only do it now when the festival is running.)

For W2Z2 and W2Z3 it has already been mentioned that the zones are long. Might be hard for peoply just starting to learn them. (Or for people that can't get better and still take long to finish 1 run.) Maybe they could split them (has already been suggested) and I'd say something lik W2Z2a and W2Z2b token - then using both + 2 bauble (2x 1 bauble) in the mystic forge to create the W2Z2 token that us used for the skins tribulatoin. Difficulty would not get changed. But people could log off and take a break. (And won't have to fear connection problems that much.)

[Deihnyx.6318]

Trials and Trib rewards give you 2 infusions I believe. It's pretty valuable, so of course you gotta "work" for it.You can definitely do it in one year as there's no daily timegate afaik. It gets easier every time you do it. Yes W2Z2 and W2Z3 are long, but not necessarily hard once you've done it a couple times.And really, you don't have to do it all at once, SAB has been around for years. You don't lose progress every year.

[Luthan.5236]

I agree on the amount of "work" to do for the infusions. That's why I said difficulty should not be reduced. But we had several people that mentioned their limited time. And splitting the W2Z2 and W2Z3 would just make it possible to log out in between while not losing progress. (Finishing first half. Then log out and doing the other half later.) Also a disconnect near the end might only make half of the time go wasted.

Difficulty and amount of work that you'd need to spend would not be reduced at all.

Just to make the box feel less "grindy" and more fun. I'm comparing it to the other festivals though. If it were permanently in the game it would be different. You could do it at your own pace. Like ... 1 tribulation run now. Then if you feel in the mood again a few weeks later another one. Here with the festival it forces us to get the most out of it in the short festival time. (I mean I don't know how much time I'll have next time during the festival so I need to play a lot now.)

Consortium guy that tries to get Moto to sell the SAB. I hope some time in the future he suceeds and we get SAB "in every corner of Tyria" or something like that. (= maybe possible to buy one for home instance or so. :D )

For most other festivals you can't do all the stuff at once in one year. Because it is only daily. You can just do your daily and are finishd to do it in like <30 mins each day. That feels less like forcing the player. Here we have the crimson assassins tokens as similar mechanis. The tribulation mode is some additonal grind the other festivals don't have. (I would be okay with permanent SAB where only tribulation tokens were obtainable during the year - for example. Baubles and other rewards only during the festival. That way it might be possible to balance it somehow and keep the festival interesting still.)

[Clyan.1593]

Went for the green and yellow weapons last year, which as a challenge was totally fine to me. I - in all honesty - didn't mind farming 96 tribulation maps.However, I really don't enjoy the dailies. 202 and 203 have some parts in it, which I personally find endlessly tedious.Beside that I think SAB is great!