Runecrafter's Salvage-o-Matic concerns [Merged] — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Runecrafter's Salvage-o-Matic concerns [Merged]

ROMANG.1903ROMANG.1903 Member ✭✭✭
edited January 4, 2019 in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

I have a few interrogations with the new salvage thing in the gemstore. It gives more upgrades than the Silver-fed Salvage-o-Matic, while only giving 5% less rare materials. But it only costs 30 copper on use, half the price of the Silver-fed kit.

The difference in on use-cost between the Silver-fed kit and the Copper-fed kit was understandable, as the later has mutch lower salvage rates (likely its purpose is to be used on lower-rarity items while the Silver-fed was dedicated to yellow+ items). But here the difference between the Silver-fed kit and that new Runecrafter's kit is so low, I find it hard to justify it being half as expensive.

So, let's say I only salvage rare items with the Silver-fed kit, is there any reason I shouldn't use the Runecrafter kit instead? If no, why even create a gemstore item that renders another gemstore item obsolete?


[Edit]: Copied some answers that better clarify my interrogation:

@ROMANG.1903 said:
If the Runecrafter's kit only has 5% less chances of rare materials, while being half as expensive and recovering 20% more rune dust, is it still worth using the Silver fed kit if you just want to sell everything and get the most value out of it?

Is 5% chances of rare materials, worth paying twice as mutch on use and losing 20% of rune dust?

@Vyral.9846 said:
What is the advantage of the Silver-Fed? It gives an extra 5% chance of salvaging "rarer materials", a 20% less chance of salvaging upgrades, and costs twice as much per use. What are these "rarer materials" it speaks of? T6 materials instead of T5? Does the extra 5% bonus in gaining them outweigh the 2x cost per use and the loss of 20% salvaged runes/sigils over large numbers of salvages?


[Edit]: A lot of people seem to have misunderstood the tooltip of the Runecrafter's Salvage-o-Matic and to regret their purchase. I personally advise really considering every parameter (salvage rates, costs, and how you plan on using each kit) before doing so, but you can get a full gem refund by contacting the support.

<13

Comments

  • Kal Spiro.9745Kal Spiro.9745 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    It doesn't. The Silver-Fed salvage-o-matic is still better than the Runecrafter's unless you specifically want to recover the upgrade. Because in order to do the same thing you would have to salvage the item, then salvage the rune/sigil too. You're probably not doing it with the copper fed, because you want a chance at something other than the base ingredient. So you still spent 60cp and lost out on 5% chance, twice.

    Tarnished Coast Kal Spiro - Ranger (80), LB/S-D, Eagle/Wolf, Signet, M/S/NM |Daredevil|Ranger
    |Guardian|Scrapper|Necromancer|Berserker|Dragonhunter|Mesmer|Elementalist|Deadeye|Warrior
    |Herald|Daredevil|Reaper|Spellbreaker|Weaver|Chronomancer|Soulbeast|Holosmith|Revenant

  • @Lamont.5973 said:

    @totaloverride.3240 said:
    Runecrafter's kit should give rune not salvage the rune!!!!!!!!!!
    This is one more scam. I bought this and now i regret that.
    i want my 200g back!

    It salvages the rune? What is the point of buying this thing then? The silver has an 80% chance of salvaging the rune anyway which, in my experience, means 100%. Why would I buy this thing? Thank you for your post, though, you saved me 600 gems I would have spent because I misread the description. I have to agree this is sort of a scam that relies on people either not reading or not understanding the description before buying.

    scam!

  • totaloverride.3240totaloverride.3240 Member ✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @GWMO.4785 said:
    Correct me if im wrong.. but i feel like im missing something here. The description on the Rune kit says "100% chance of salvaging upgrades". As where silver kit has 80% of RECOVERING upgrade. Copper kit has 20% chance of salvaging upgrades (it always did. i never got an actual rune or sigil from it ever since the change). Same for Mystic kit but 80%. And finally the black lion kit has 100% chance of recovering upgrade, excl. infusions.

    So...
    Why do some of these kits say salvage and others recover? shouldnt these be the same with the cost being higher or lower depending on the kit?
    Why does non of them actually recover the upgrade other then the black lion kit? i know its a chance. but very oddly it never happend...

    all silver/copper/runecraft are salvaging all runes/sigils
    so it's a scam

    i want tool not to salvage runes/sigils. only if i click on rune/sigil, then they should be salvaged.
    argument that "it is faster this way", is so stupid that i don't want to comment on it

    once we empty TP for low tier runes/sigil, new rune/sigil system will blowup, bcs 99% of salvage you get dust
    you think runes/ sigils are now costly? wait few months it will be pain in the * to craft or buy them

  • LucianDK.8615LucianDK.8615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    Yeah, definitely some cryptic wording for sure.

    But yes, anything with an extra upgrade in, you only have a chance to recover the mats from when salvaging normally. With runecrafter you always get the upgrade materials when salvaging. Its no scam.

    Black Lion kits however extracts an undamaged upgrade item.

  • LucianDK.8615LucianDK.8615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well its a great benefit for those wishing to craft runes and sigils, giving you more reliable access to materials. That is why I bought it.

  • I misunderstood the description too. I unconsciously interpreted the "100% chance of salvaging upgrades" as 'recovering upgrades'.

    Doh. Well, now I have all 3 of these items. :/

  • Urud.4925Urud.4925 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @GWMO.4785 said:
    Correct me if im wrong.. but i feel like im missing something here. The description on the Rune kit says "100% chance of salvaging upgrades". As where silver kit has 80% of RECOVERING upgrade. Copper kit has 20% chance of salvaging upgrades (it always did. i never got an actual rune or sigil from it ever since the change). Same for Mystic kit but 80%. And finally the black lion kit has 100% chance of recovering upgrade, excl. infusions.

    So...
    Why do some of these kits say salvage and others recover? shouldnt these be the same with the cost being higher or lower depending on the kit?
    Why does non of them actually recover the upgrade other then the black lion kit? i know its a chance. but very oddly it never happend...

    all silver/copper/runecraft are salvaging all runes/sigils
    so it's a scam

    i want tool not to salvage runes/sigils. only if i click on rune/sigil, then they should be salvaged.
    argument that "it is faster this way", is so stupid that i don't want to comment on it

    once we empty TP for low tier runes/sigil, new rune/sigil system will blowup, bcs 99% of salvage you get dust
    you think runes/ sigils are now costly? wait few months it will be pain in the * to craft or buy them

    Well, idk if it's a scam or not, but during these holidays, inebriated by the alcohol, weighed down by sweets, I also misread. Although the price was too low to be good (that's why I looked on the forum) Thanks a lot for your first post, it helped.
    I agree with @GWMO.4785, it would be better to use similar descriptions.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    It's not a scam. It upfront tells us what it does.
    You might not like that, you might prefer a different item on the TP, but that's a design concern, not one about whether we're being deliberately misled.

    No i wouldnt call it a scam. not in a direct sense at least. Like i can understand that on the kits where you have the salvage chance, it gets salvaged. and otherwise just wasted. However on the kits that have recover chance.... they dont recover. like guaranteed. Exception being the bl kit. So... flawed? idk

  • LucianDK.8615LucianDK.8615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    I feel like the Runecrafter's kit should at least be 25%, if not 30% chance of rarer materials (or cost only 15c per salvage), in order to compete better with Mystic Salvage kits, considering it costs 3 times as much per salvage as those.

    Silver-Fed has always been awful value, costing 6 times as much per salvage as the Mystic while doing the same thing, so there was never a reason to buy or use that one anway.

    "As you know, those who you once called friends have become enemies." ~Glint

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    Itd be nice if what i paid for was still what i paid for, and hadnt been changed to be utterly useless.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Haleydawn.3764Haleydawn.3764 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    The above was written as part of an attempt to waste time.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"

    It didnt used to, and it was changed very recently as it still said

    "Double-click to salvage crafting materials from an item in your inventory. 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of recovering upgrades from items."

    less than a week ago, which is what it should still do.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Haleydawn.3764Haleydawn.3764 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"

    It didnt used to, and it was changed very recently as it still said

    "Double-click to salvage crafting materials from an item in your inventory. 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of recovering upgrades from items."

    less than a week ago, which is what it should still do.

    I can't remember the last time I specifically needed to extract a rune/sigil from an item, because it was too valuable to scrap. There's Black Lion Kits for this. Even before these changes, if you needed to recover a rune/sigil, you'd use a Black Lion kit because of the 20% chance that you'd lose the upgrade, no?
    Seems like it was redundant enough to remove the function from Salvage-o-Matics for QoL in inventory management.

    The above was written as part of an attempt to waste time.

  • @TheAgedGnome.7520 said:
    I misunderstood the description too. I unconsciously interpreted the "100% chance of salvaging upgrades" as 'recovering upgrades'.

    Doh. Well, now I have all 3 of these items. :/

    Me 2. Wish i could throw all 3 in the toilet with a mystic forge stone to get 1 that salvages ascended gear as well. That would make me feel less kitten.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"

    It didnt used to, and it was changed very recently as it still said

    "Double-click to salvage crafting materials from an item in your inventory. 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of recovering upgrades from items."

    less than a week ago, which is what it should still do.

    I can't remember the last time I specifically needed to extract a rune from an item, because it was too valuable to scrap. There's Black Lion Kits for this.
    Seems like it was redundant enough to remove the function from Salvage-o-Matics for QoL in inventory management.

    Not everyone has black lion kits, you know that right? i used the silver cause it had an 80% chance to do it, and regardless, what i paid for should still do what i paid for it to do.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • @totaloverride.3240 said:

    @Lamont.5973 said:

    @totaloverride.3240 said:
    Runecrafter's kit should give rune not salvage the rune!!!!!!!!!!
    This is one more scam. I bought this and now i regret that.
    i want my 200g back!

    It salvages the rune? What is the point of buying this thing then? The silver has an 80% chance of salvaging the rune anyway which, in my experience, means 100%. Why would I buy this thing? Thank you for your post, though, you saved me 600 gems I would have spent because I misread the description. I have to agree this is sort of a scam that relies on people either not reading or not understanding the description before buying.

    scam!

    If it removed the rune aswell then it would make upgrade extractors and permanent upgrade extractors redundant

  • @Dante.1763 said:
    what i paid for should still do what i paid for it to do.

    It's not the first time ANet's changed the utility of a convenience item after a major feature update. I do think that ANet should offer to refund the cost of the kit to anyone who asks, since the functionality changed. There's almost no chance that they can allow a silver-fed to continue to extract runes, since the economic changes require that sigils & runes be produced via crafting, not 'recovery'.

    If I was really unhappy with the change, I'd submit a support ticket and keep appealing until a very senior GM responded. I think there's a very good chance that they'll realize that they should honor such requests for a month or so.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Haleydawn.3764Haleydawn.3764 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"

    It didnt used to, and it was changed very recently as it still said

    "Double-click to salvage crafting materials from an item in your inventory. 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of recovering upgrades from items."

    less than a week ago, which is what it should still do.

    I can't remember the last time I specifically needed to extract a rune from an item, because it was too valuable to scrap. There's Black Lion Kits for this.
    Seems like it was redundant enough to remove the function from Salvage-o-Matics for QoL in inventory management.

    Not everyone has black lion kits, you know that right? i used the silver cause it had an 80% chance to do it, and regardless, what i paid for should still do what i paid for it to do.

    Section 3: 4d- vi in the User Agreement:
    "You acknowledge that Gems are digital material with no cash value, that no interest is paid or earned with respect to Gems, that Gems are not personal property, that the quantity of Gems in Your Account may be increased or decreased by ArenaNet in its reasonable discretion, that You have no right to a refund related to Gems,."

    Anet also covers themselves in making any changes to the game 'at their discretion'. No exceptions.

    You can request a refund of your Salvage-o-matic, However, if you 'got your fair use out of the item', you wont get one.

    Things change.

    The above was written as part of an attempt to waste time.

  • @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

  • Haleydawn.3764Haleydawn.3764 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    The wiki is player made and needs updating, so I updated it with the correct terms the kit now displays.
    I'll also add, the description changed with the Nov 13th patch to change how runes/sigils are obtained/work. ("Salvage Kits: The chance to extract a rune or sigil from equipment is now a chance to salvage the upgrades directly into their crafting materials. This does not affect Black Lion Salvage Kits, which will continue to always extract upgrades intact." - Here)
    I own the Silver-fed, have done for years, it says salvage.

    The above was written as part of an attempt to waste time.

  • Urud.4925Urud.4925 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"

    It didnt used to, and it was changed very recently as it still said

    "Double-click to salvage crafting materials from an item in your inventory. 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of recovering upgrades from items."

    less than a week ago, which is what it should still do.

    I can't remember the last time I specifically needed to extract a rune from an item, because it was too valuable to scrap. There's Black Lion Kits for this.
    Seems like it was redundant enough to remove the function from Salvage-o-Matics for QoL in inventory management.

    Not everyone has black lion kits, you know that right? i used the silver cause it had an 80% chance to do it, and regardless, what i paid for should still do what i paid for it to do.

    Section 3: 4d- vi in the User Agreement:
    "You acknowledge that Gems are digital material with no cash value, that no interest is paid or earned with respect to Gems, that Gems are not personal property, that the quantity of Gems in Your Account may be increased or decreased by ArenaNet in its reasonable discretion, that You have no right to a refund related to Gems,."

    Anet also covers themselves in making any changes to the game 'at their discretion'. No exceptions.

    You can request a refund of your Salvage-o-matic, However, if you 'got your fair use out of the item', you wont get one.

    Things change.

    Oh believe me, i know they do and im familiar enough with the user agreement. However, it still has left a very bad taste in my mouth, and to me IMO marks a turn in the company.

    This change was strike three for me, it wasnt the first one they made that made me leery, but its the "straw that broke the camels back" so to say.

    Forcing players into the gemstore to get upgrades on items they earned in game, changing items purchased with real money so they arent at all what was paid for is shaddy as hell, and something that i never wanted to see in this game. Now that it is here though, its not going to get better.

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:
    what i paid for should still do what i paid for it to do.

    It's not the first time ANet's changed the utility of a convenience item after a major feature update. I do think that ANet should offer to refund the cost of the kit to anyone who asks, since the functionality changed. There's almost no chance that they can allow a silver-fed to continue to extract runes, since the economic changes require that sigils & runes be produced via crafting, not 'recovery'.

    If I was really unhappy with the change, I'd submit a support ticket and keep appealing until a very senior GM responded. I think there's a very good chance that they'll realize that they should honor such requests for a month or so.

    As unhappy as i am about the change i have very little faith over getting a refund on the silver fed salvage kit. i purchased it when it first came out, so theres no way in hell even though its not what i bought that id get a refund.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • ROMANG.1903ROMANG.1903 Member ✭✭✭

    @totaloverride.3240 said:
    Runecrafter's kit should give rune not salvage the rune!!!!!!!!!!
    This is one more scam. I bought this and now i regret that.
    i want my 200g back!

    You can't get your gold back but you can get a gem refund. You need to contact the support while explaining the confusion and why you didn't get what you expected to get. They will ask you to manually destroy the item (just to be sure, don't do it before they actually tell you to do it). Then they should refund your gems.

  • @Urud.4925 said:

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

    Lol literally 2 minutes after I made the comment.

  • Cragga the Eighty Third.6015Cragga the Eighty Third.6015 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    A couple of questions:
    1: (answered)
    2: When 'salvaging' runes, what are the chances of getting charms and symbols? Is it 100%? Or do you just get a lot of junk lucent motes with rare drops of useful stuff?

  • Vrath.1754Vrath.1754 Member ✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Cragga the Eighty Third.6015 said:
    A couple of questions:
    1: Where are people getting this for 200 gems?? I see it listed as 600.
    2: When 'salvaging' runes, what are the chances of getting charms and symbols? Is it 100%? Or do you just get a lot of junk lucent motes with rare drops of useful stuff?

    1. They are saying 200g, gold, that they converted to gems to purchase the item.
  • ROMANG.1903ROMANG.1903 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Tanner Blackfeather.6509 said:

    @Urud.4925 said:

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

    While I see the confusion, the name is perfectly appropriate as it is the best tool for runecrafters. It will generate the highest amount of materials for crafting runes and sigils of all the tools.

    My personnal interrogation is, if the Runecrafter's only has 5% less chances of rare materials, while being half as expensive as the Silver-fed, is it still worth it to use the Silver fed if you just want to sell everything and get the most value out of it? Is 5% chances of rare materials, worth paying twice as mutch on use and losing 20% of rune dust?

  • @Dante.1763 said:
    Oh believe me, i know they do and im familiar enough with the user agreement. However, it still has left a very bad taste in my mouth, and to me IMO marks a turn in the company.

    Again, this isn't the first time they've done this.
    To me, this isn't even close to egregious: the former functionality of the silver-fed didn't fit with the complete overhaul of the rune|sigil system. In contrast, they have nerfed the value of the candy corn gobbler a couple of times, reducing the number of available buffs and the duration.

    @Dante.1763 said:

    If I was really unhappy with the change, I'd submit a support ticket and keep appealing until a very senior GM responded. I think there's a very good chance that they'll realize that they should honor such requests for a month or so.

    As unhappy as i am about the change i have very little faith over getting a refund on the silver fed salvage kit. i purchased it when it first came out, so theres no way in hell even though its not what i bought that id get a refund.

    I can guarantee you won't get a refund without asking.
    But in this case, it's clear that they changed the functionality; normally they deny refunds because people had the opportunity to use the item for a while, whereas in this case, we haven't, not really. We had the old functionality. Mind you, they might still say no because of that, but...

    Anyhow, it costs you about the same time to create a support ticket as it would to cogently reply to this message.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • @ROMANG.1903 said:

    @Tanner Blackfeather.6509 said:

    @Urud.4925 said:

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

    While I see the confusion, the name is perfectly appropriate as it is the best tool for runecrafters. It will generate the highest amount of materials for crafting runes and sigils of all the tools.

    My personnal interrogation is, if the Runecrafter's only has 5% less chances of rare materials, while being half as expensive as the Silver-fed, is it still worth it to use the Silver fed if you just want to sell everything and get the most value out of it? Is 5% chances of rare materials, worth paying twice as mutch on use and losing 20% of rune dust?

    The big thing is that we don't know what rate it'll produce ecto from rares. Remember, that "rarer materials" chance is not the ecto chance.

  • Vyral.9846Vyral.9846 Member
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    Recommend uses:

    • Fine or less: copper-fed/basic
    • Masterwork: runecrafter's or silver-fed if you don't have rc
    • Rares: silver-fed, mystic, or masterwork

    What is the advantage of the Silver-Fed? It gives an extra 5% chance of salvaging "rarer materials", a 20% less chance of salvaging upgrades, and costs twice as much per use. What are these "rarer materials" it speaks of? Ectos? T6 materials instead of T5? Does the extra 5% bonus in gaining them outweigh the 2x cost per use and the loss of 20% salvaged runes/sigils over large numbers of salvages?

    Now I am kind of bummed that I bought the Silver-Fed when the rune/sigil changes went into effect.

  • Haleydawn.3764Haleydawn.3764 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tanner Blackfeather.6509 said:

    @ROMANG.1903 said:

    @Tanner Blackfeather.6509 said:

    @Urud.4925 said:

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

    While I see the confusion, the name is perfectly appropriate as it is the best tool for runecrafters. It will generate the highest amount of materials for crafting runes and sigils of all the tools.

    My personnal interrogation is, if the Runecrafter's only has 5% less chances of rare materials, while being half as expensive as the Silver-fed, is it still worth it to use the Silver fed if you just want to sell everything and get the most value out of it? Is 5% chances of rare materials, worth paying twice as mutch on use and losing 20% of rune dust?

    The big thing is that we don't know what rate it'll produce ecto from rares. Remember, that "rarer materials" chance is not the ecto chance.

    Exactly. It covers your chance of getting the next tier up material on salvage. Like when you get Orichalcum instead of Mithril when you salvage.

    The above was written as part of an attempt to waste time.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:
    Oh believe me, i know they do and im familiar enough with the user agreement. However, it still has left a very bad taste in my mouth, and to me IMO marks a turn in the company.

    Again, this isn't the first time they've done this.
    To me, this isn't even close to egregious: the former functionality of the silver-fed didn't fit with the complete overhaul of the rune|sigil system. In contrast, they have nerfed the value of the candy corn gobbler a couple of times, reducing the number of available buffs and the duration.

    Oh i know that, i even say that this isnt the first time they have, rather its the latest change in a string of changes, and this is the one that finally made up my mind.

    @Dante.1763 said:

    If I was really unhappy with the change, I'd submit a support ticket and keep appealing until a very senior GM responded. I think there's a very good chance that they'll realize that they should honor such requests for a month or so.

    As unhappy as i am about the change i have very little faith over getting a refund on the silver fed salvage kit. i purchased it when it first came out, so theres no way in hell even though its not what i bought that id get a refund.

    I can guarantee you won't get a refund without asking.
    But in this case, it's clear that they changed the functionality; normally they deny refunds because people had the opportunity to use the item for a while, whereas in this case, we haven't, not really. We had the old functionality. Mind you, they might still say no because of that, but...

    Anyhow, it costs you about the same time to create a support ticket as it would to cogently reply to this message.

    Perhaps that is the case, but would it be worth it to even try? if they readjusted the cost of the silver fed, so that it didnt cost double what the new one does(which has no downsides to using it) it probably wouldnt be to bad. Id still be annoyed at the change, but far less, because it would still be worthwhile to use. As it is now, the new one blows the silver fed ones usage out of the water due to it being half the price with only a 5% loss at a chance of rare materials.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

  • Cronos.6532Cronos.6532 Member ✭✭✭

    Reduce the cost per use of Silver-Fed to 25c

    signature

  • @Vyral.9846 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    Recommend uses:

    • Fine or less: copper-fed/basic
    • Masterwork: runecrafter's or silver-fed if you don't have rc
    • Rares: silver-fed, mystic, or masterwork

    What is the advantage of the Silver-Fed?

    It has a significantly better chance of producing ecto from rares compared to copper-fed/basic kits. ~0.875 for silver-fed, under 0.7 (and probably closer to 0.55) for copper-fed (I haven't seen a lot of verifiable data for basic salvage of rares, which is why the range is so wide; there is a lot of data on silver-fed/mystic kits).

    Now I am kind of bummed that I bought the Silver-Fed when the rune/sigil changes went into effect.

    If you own it already, I'd say use it instead of getting runecrafters. The difference between 80% chance and 100% isn't going to turn out to be worth 600 gems for most people.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭

    @ROMANG.1903 said:

    @Tanner Blackfeather.6509 said:

    @Urud.4925 said:

    @Flying.6509 said:

    @Haleydawn.3764 said:

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    @LucianDK.8615 said:
    Think you guys are looking for the endless upgrade extractor contractor. about 3000g.

    No.. im looking for a perma salvage kit that ACTUALLY has a chance to recover upgrades. And no silver kit does not do that, despite the description saying 80%

    The description on the Silver-fed CLEARLY states "80% chance of salvaging upgrades"
    What needs to be introduced is a Permanent Black Lion Salvage Kit, which given the latest changes, wont be too long to see come out I think. Until then, your option for a permanent way of recovering upgrades is already in game, via the Endless Upgrade Extractor.

    You sure about that? Says "recovering" here. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver-Fed_Salvage-o-Matic
    Only it doesn't recover anything, it salvages. Outdated description? False advertising? Something doesn't add up.

    Not anymore: This page was last edited on 1 January 2019, at 18:02.
    Ninja edited!
    Anyway, it's a too cheap way to scam people, so it's not ANet's style (I mean, I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose). But I wouldn't have called it "Runecrafter" kit, since you end up with no rune. Maybe "The Crumbler, "The Destroyer", "The Annihilator" or "Mote Maker" were better names.

    While I see the confusion, the name is perfectly appropriate as it is the best tool for runecrafters. It will generate the highest amount of materials for crafting runes and sigils of all the tools.

    My personnal interrogation is, if the Runecrafter's only has 5% less chances of rare materials, while being half as expensive as the Silver-fed, is it still worth it to use the Silver fed if you just want to sell everything and get the most value out of it? Is 5% chances of rare materials, worth paying twice as mutch on use and losing 20% of rune dust?

    Silver-Fed was never worth it.

    Either use the Mystic Salvage Kit, which does exactly the same as Silved Fed for 1/6th of the cost per salvage, or the new Runecrafter's.

    "As you know, those who you once called friends have become enemies." ~Glint

  • ROMANG.1903ROMANG.1903 Member ✭✭✭

    @Asum.4960 said:
    Silver-Fed was never worth it.

    That was the case at the begining when it cost 1 silver on use. It has since been reduced to 60 copper on use, which makes it just slightly less expensive than the Master's salvage kit for the same rates.

  • @Dante.1763 said:
    Perhaps that is the case, but would it be worth it to even try?

    Stop replying to me and find out? You've filed support tix before; it won't take you that much of your time.
    (I'm really not trying to 'win' an argument -- I honestly think you'd be happier trying and failing than to have not tried at all, at least in the long run.)

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Sera.2146Sera.2146 Member ✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    I bought the Runecrafter Salvage-o-matic for science. Already owned the Copper and Silver.
    I then bought a total of 40 of the same green glove with runes in them.

    Copper Description - 10% chance of rarer materials. 20% chance of salvaging upgrades.
    Silver Description - 25% chance of rarer materials. 80% chance of salvaging upgrades.
    Runecrafter Description - 20% chance of rarer materials. 100% chance of salvaging upgrades.

    I manually clicked on each of the glove with each salvage-o-matic, 20 for the Copper, 10 for the Silver, 10 for the Runecrafter's.

    Copper - salvaged all 20 gloves and got 3 lucent motes.
    Silver - salvaged all 10 gloves and got 8 lucent motes.
    Runecrafter's - salvaged all 10 gloves and got 10 lucent motes.

    Anet has completely done away with the recovering of upgrades with salvage-o-matics. They are now either destroyed completely or you get motes and/or symbols from them. The Silver is pretty much pointless now with it's cost despite it having that extra 5% of getting rarer mats. The only way you will recover upgrades now are with the black lion salvage kits or the upgrade extractors. So, gonna have to start coughing up the gems or get lucky with the chest of black lion goods if you want to recover upgrades now.

    Hopefully this will help some people figure out what they have changed.

  • Illconceived Was Na.9781Illconceived Was Na.9781 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2019

    @Dante.1763 said:
    As it is now, the new one blows the silver fed ones usage out of the water due to it being half the price with only a 5% loss at a chance of rare materials.

    Until someone publishes ecto salvage rates for it, I can't agree. If runecrafter has a 5% smaller rate of 82% instead of of 87%, then it looks like silver-fed is slightly better.

    Which is more valuable in 6 months is going to depend a lot on the markets for ecto, symbols, and charms.

    My recommendation is that if you own silver-fed already, don't buy runecrafter. And vice-versa: don't by runecrafter if you own silver-fed. Use either on masterwork & rares.
    If you do own both, use RC on masterwork, SF for rares

    (however: keep an eye out for more data; these recs will change if it turns out that runecrafter's gives more than ~80 ecto per 100 salvages, if it gives somewhat less, and will vary with the average value of charms & symbols.


    Some back of the envelope numbers for 100 rares, 80 of which include an upgrade (rough guess of rares found in the wild). Assume half armor, half weapons. For Runecrafter, we can expect 3.9*0.5 of symbols, and the same number of charms. For silver-fed, it's 80% of that.

    Silver-fed: 19.6 gold

    • 87 ecto @19s = 16.6 gold
    • 3.9 * 0.8 * 0.5 symbols * 1.17g average value = 1.8g
    • 3.9 * 0.8 * 0.5 charms * 1.13g average value = 1.77 g
    • Cost = 60c * 100 = 0.6g

    Runecrafter: 19.8 gold

    • 82 ecto @19s (reasonable guess) = 15.6
    • 3.9 *1 * 0.5 symbols * 1.17 =2.3
    • 3.9 * 1 * 0.5 charms * 1.13 = 2.2

    That's a difference of 20 silver-fed in salvaging 100 rares, which is negligible especially considering the number of assumptions made. The more rares you get without an upgrade, the better silver-fed becomes. We also don't know the actual ecto drop rate from runecrafter, which could be much less than 82, and that would make it a lot less worthwhile.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Dante.1763 said:
    As it is now, the new one blows the silver fed ones usage out of the water due to it being half the price with only a 5% loss at a chance of rare materials.

    Until someone publishes ecto salvage rates for it, I can't agree. If runecrafter has a 5% smaller rate of 82% instead of of 87%, then it looks like silver-fed is slightly better.

    Which is more valuable in 6 months is going to depend a lot on the markets for ecto, symbols, and charms.

    My recommendation is that if you own silver-fed already, don't buy runecrafter. And vice-versa: don't by runecrafter if you own silver-fed. Use either on masterwork & rares.
    If you do own both, use RC on masterwork, SF on


    Some back of the envelope numbers for 100 rares, 80 of which include an upgrade (rough guess of rares found in the wild). Assume half armor, half weapons. For Runecrafter, we can expect 3.9*0.5 of symbols, and the same number of charms. For silver-fed, it's 80% of that.

    Silver-fed: 19.6 gold

    • 87 ecto @19s = 16.6 gold
    • 3.9 * 0.8 * 0.5 symbols * 1.17g average value = 1.8g
    • 3.9 * 0.8 * 0.5 charms * 1.13g average value = 1.77 g
    • Cost = 60c * 100 = 0.6g

    Runecrafter: 19.8 gold

    • 82 ecto @19s (reasonable guess) = 15.6
    • 3.9 *1 * 0.5 symbols * 1.17 =2.3
    • 3.9 * 1 * 0.5 charms * 1.13 = 2.2

    That's a difference of 20 silver-fed in salvaging 100 rares, which is negligible especially considering the number of assumptions made. The more rares you get without an upgrade, the better silver-fed becomes. We also don't know the actual ecto drop rate from runecrafter, which could be much less than 82, and that would make it a lot less worthwhile.

    So, i just salvaged 325 rares using the runecrafters and got 345 ecto from it. However, i did notice that i didnt get any essence of luck from those rares. I did get 487 motes, but only 5 symbols.

    Ember Wandertooth(SB), Lucina Fallenflame(Weaver), Kianda Redpaw(Guardian), Kingslayer, Light in the Dark.
    Why Guild Wars is called Guild Wars

<13
©2010–2018 ArenaNet, LLC. All rights reserved. Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, Heart of Thorns, Guild Wars 2: Path of Fire, ArenaNet, NCSOFT, the Interlocking NC Logo, and all associated logos and designs are trademarks or registered trademarks of NCSOFT Corporation. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.