Social wvw-connections are broken. Feeling lost. Looking for Piken Square.

[Hyperionkhv.1978]

For me it looks like Anet killed existed social wvw-connections.

I played for Piken Square few years already. Each WWW-server is not just few hardcore wvw-guilds. It was a complex social net of different players.

I knew main guilds, constant roamers and now it all gone somewhere (according to few topics even players from one guild can be scattered around different alliances now).

I was thrown to some First Haven or Reaper's Corridor (depends what WVW tab you are looking at).

WVW is like a big guild vs guild PVP now: you go in wvw-match with unknown people around and...

I dont know, I just stand in Eternal Battleground start blue corner and do not want fight for this 'First Haven'.

My spirit is down. I want to play with my Piken Square bros and sis 😢

[Anteia.4062]

I could not agree more with this. I feel very lost now. I've played with and for my server (Piken) for many years and now that I'm no longer able to fit in a hardcore WvW guild, I've always been glad to still be able and play with and for my fellow server mates when I could. This change will ruin WvW for me and I will miss my server a lot. I hope it never happens.

Edited December 4, 2021 by Anteia.4062

[Galmac.4680]

Yep, it is not anymore a home server feeling. 

[Luthan.5236]

I have a similar feeling. I have Underworld as my main server/world since release. Didn't play from end 2013 until mid 2019 (and returning to WvW only in 2020 I think). And the linking made it feel a bit weird - regarding "server identity." Still ... I got used to the server linking  - still liked to regularly see some well known names of players/guilds in the map and chat.

This will be lost for casual players that do not join a guild. And those guilds probably will limit themselves to  hardcore players first - if slots for guilds/alliancees are limited (limited amount of players).

I would prefer (probably not possible technically - if the guilds alread reach limit with players for one of the new "alliances") if there was a guild for each server/world - where casual players would be grouped with if not chosing a guild/alliance. So all players  from the same previous world/server would be groupd with similar other players - and then matched into other alliances. Still won't change the problem that previous big guilds might be "lost" - unless you decide to join them (which might require more serious play and not only casual WvW - if those guilds require it).

So ... for casuals this is a step even more into the "just joining for the rewards" direction.

Edit: I'd suggest:  1 previous server gets the guilds/players not alligning with any alliance into a "server alliance" that is used as fallback measure. (Players assigned per home world if not in a "WvW" guild. Guilds getting the option to still join that alliance of their previous server Other guilds that didn't care ... can get mached randomly later or form other aliances.)

Then generating the new worlds or "shards" or whatever they call it by using those server alliances and filling them up with the other unaligned guilds/players that want to we mached and mixed freely with all the others (not bound to stay with the home server).

A mixed system ... something between previous server thingy and a totally freely matching. There are some guilds on Underworld tha have "Underworld" in their name. And others that adervise as pretty old guild (players playing since GW1) with main server on Underworld.

Edited December 4, 2021 by Luthan.5236

[Dawdler.8521]

1 hour ago, Luthan.5236 said:

A mixed system ... something between previous server thingy and a totally freely matching. There are some guilds on Underworld tha have "Underworld" in their name. And others that adervise as pretty old guild (players playing since GW1) with main server on Underworld.

I got whiplash from all the facepalming I just did because you are LITERALLY describing the alliance system with the actual alliances, which this beta havent implemented yet.

[FunesMori.3947]

I mean seriously what where people thinking would happen when they dont select a guild for this test?
Ofc you get randomly matched into some random alliance.

You wanna play with your old server mates? Then join their alliance guild or create your own with those guys.

But all those people are like, well i didn't join any guild or created my own or selected any guild, but i still expect that it works as before. That's not going to happen you have to organise yourself.

You can't blame the system for not using it.

[Anteia.4062]

19 minutes ago, FunesMori.3947 said:

 

You wanna play with your old server mates? Then join their alliance guild or create your own with those guys.

Actually, selecting a server WvW community guild is exactly what I did, but due to most of those players also having a hardcore WvW guild they have to represent, the people who can't meet those hardcore requirements are still not matched up with them. I haven't found even one other guildy in the same matchup. So it's not that simple and the casual players are left out of this matchup completely.

[Rose Solane.1027]

20 minutes ago, FunesMori.3947 said:

I mean seriously what where people thinking would happen when they dont select a guild for this test?
Ofc you get randomly matched into some random alliance.

You wanna play with your old server mates? Then join their alliance guild or create your own with those guys.

But all those people are like, well i didn't join any guild or created my own or selected any guild, but i still expect that it works as before. That's not going to happen you have to organise yourself.

You can't blame the system for not using it.

You miss the point. Many players (like me) play on the same world (Piken Square for example) for a very long time but are not hardcore WvW players. So we are not a member of a hardcore WvW guild because guilds have a member limit. This beta doesn't have alliances active so there is no way to join the players we normally play with unless we would have joined the hardcore WvW guild. Most hardcore WvW guilds wouldn't have a place for us due to member limit.

 

Now this is all a temporary problem for one week, the duration of this beta. Hopefully the next beta does have alliances active so we can test how that would work (for casual WvW players). Can we somehow join our hardcore brothers from our world in an alliance and play on the same WvW server as they do? I can see some issues for us (casual WvW players). Without having a WvW guild how are we going to form an alliance with the hardcore WvW guilds from our home server? For me it could be easy, at least for a one week beta. I am one of 4 guild leaders of a PvX guild, and all guild leaders are playing on Piken Square. So I can probably try to form an alliance between my PvX guild and a hardcore WvW guild on Piken Square. But most casual WvW players don't have the option to form an alliance between a guild they are a member of and a hardcore WvW guild. A possible solution is given in this thread. If ArenaNet creates one WvW guild per world all the WvW casuals for that world could join that guild and alliances can be created. If that is a feasible option is another question.

 

So far this beta seems to work as intended for me. This morning I missed the players I normally see when playing WvW but the players on my new world were nice. Although there were many French and German players (and guilds) active in this new world, communication did seem to happen (in English). I hope that will be the same for the rest of the week. But I have to agree with the title of this thread: Social wvw-connections are broken. Feeling lost. Looking for Piken Square. Especially looking for Piken Square.

[FunesMori.3947]

1 hour ago, Anteia.4062 said:

Actually, selecting a server WvW community guild is exactly what I did, but due to most of those players also having a hardcore WvW guild they have to represent, the people who can't meet those hardcore requirements are still not matched up with them. I haven't found even one other guildy in the same matchup. So it's not that simple and the casual players are left out of this matchup completely.

Well then your community guild wasnt supposed to be a alliance guild. If the "hardcore WvW guild" decided the represent them self and go solo as guild then there is nothing you can do about that. And if they went in another alliance guild then you only could have asked to join that alliance aswell.

 

1 hour ago, Rose Solane.1027 said:

You miss the point. Many players (like me) play on the same world (Piken Square for example) for a very long time but are not hardcore WvW players. So we are not a member of a hardcore WvW guild because guilds have a member limit. This beta doesn't have alliances active so there is no way to join the players we normally play with unless we would have joined the hardcore WvW guild. Most hardcore WvW guilds wouldn't have a place for us due to member limit.

 

Now this is all a temporary problem for one week, the duration of this beta. Hopefully the next beta does have alliances active so we can test how that would work (for casual WvW players). Can we somehow join our hardcore brothers from our world in an alliance and play on the same WvW server as they do? I can see some issues for us (casual WvW players). Without having a WvW guild how are we going to form an alliance with the hardcore WvW guilds from our home server? For me it could be easy, at least for a one week beta. I am one of 4 guild leaders of a PvX guild, and all guild leaders are playing on Piken Square. So I can probably try to form an alliance between my PvX guild and a hardcore WvW guild on Piken Square. But most casual WvW players don't have the option to form an alliance between a guild they are a member of and a hardcore WvW guild. A possible solution is given in this thread. If ArenaNet creates one WvW guild per world all the WvW casuals for that world could join that guild and alliances can be created. If that is a feasible option is another question.

You have that many hardcore players in one alliance guild that the member cap of 500 is reached?

And why does Anet have to provide that guild for the casuals? Like i said they can make their own guild, invite all the casuals of their server that have no alliance guild. That's what i meant with organise yourself.

[Cuks.8241]

This is just beta, after the beta I think we will still have old servers for some time. Join Piken discord after the beta and join one of the guilds or whisper commanders you like. Various guilds and commanders have been advertising in discord but also in game for this moment so there is hardly an excuse.

The community might not be exactly the same after the alliances so talk to your favorite commanders. We have guilds that take non hardcore players. 

[Xenesis.6389]

Prepare for a week of casuals flooding in here complaining about a one week alliance test we've been talking about in the wvw forums for the past 6 months, the alliance system we've been talking about for the past 4 years, links we've talked about the past 5 years, guild/server loyalty/community that's already been in the tumble cycle for the past 7 years, being matched with strangers even though that's already been happening for the past 5 years through links, and talking about loving and missing a wvw community they refuse to dedicate even one guild slot to stay together with.

 

Maybe this will be the shock factor to make people plan for the changes. This isn't the first and only test of the alliance system, there will be more, every part needs to be tested in steps, if you can't handle it then take the week off wvw. Your servers will be back next week, what you do with your communities after that, is still up to you.

[TaliesinRevel.5971]

10 hours ago, Hyperionkhv.1978 said:

For me it looks like Anet killed existed social wvw-connections.

I played for Piken Square few years already. Each WWW-server is not just few hardcore wvw-guilds. It was a complex social net of different players.

I knew main guilds, constant roamers and now it all gone somewhere (according to few topics even players from one guild can be scattered around different alliances now).

I was thrown to some First Haven or Reaper's Corridor (depends what WVW tab you are looking at).

WVW is like a big guild vs guild PVP now: you go in wvw-match with unknown people around and...

I dont know, I just stand in Eternal Battleground start blue corner and do not want fight for this 'First Haven'.

My spirit is down. I want to play with my Piken Square bros and sis 😢

I agree wholeheartedly.  I only had one regular guild player of WvW (my husband). He is now on another map and we cannot play together for the week. We both had our guild chosen before restructuring. When my guildy was not on, I could generally run with other guilds that I have known for years that are now not recruiting anymore. No more can I run with them. I am basically a one person guild with no choice of who I play with, that knows nobody on the map, fighting my old friends with my old enemies. In fact if you defend your land, castle or tower you actually lose. It is all about pips now not about guilds at all. I wanted to play in WvW to help the guilds I knew. The very reason I played has been taken away. Why would I play now? Are we just Anet's game pieces?

[Setay.2135]

As my wife and I are on different alliances this is a locked out game mode for the both of us.  At least this is only a week long but we should not be expected to read the message boards to get our WVW information. There should be a pop up in game that says you need to select a guild to represent for WVW. It should happen every day UNTIL you select it. 

 

Or if you havent selected a server it should ask you the first time you try to join WVW for the first time after implementation. The random assignment is not a smart way to implement this.

[Greens Daily Ritual.9025]

14 hours ago, Setay.2135 said:

As my wife and I are on different alliances this is a locked out game mode for the both of us.  At least this is only a week long but we should not be expected to read the message boards to get our WVW information. There should be a pop up in game that says you need to select a guild to represent for WVW. It should happen every day UNTIL you select it. 

 

Or if you havent selected a server it should ask you the first time you try to join WVW for the first time after implementation. The random assignment is not a smart way to implement this.

I wasn't aware they were implementing an Alliance BETA until I logged in for Friday reset like I always do. I had talked to one of our original server leaders and asked to be invited to their guild in anticipation of the "Alliances" weeks ago. I didn't see any announcements when logging into the game and I didn't see anything on Wiki explaining this. I was banned from the forums for years, until recently. The only reason I am here now is to find info I can't find anywhere else.

 

I couldn't find one single person from the guild OR server I was on. The friendships and allegiance I have forged with fellow server mates is primarily what keeps me playing. If this is the future of WvW, it's probably the end of me playing it. There are many other games I could play if I wanted to play alone.

 

 

[Greens Daily Ritual.9025]

On 12/4/2021 at 2:17 PM, Xenesis.6389 said:

Prepare for a week of casuals flooding in here complaining about a one week alliance test we've been talking about in the wvw forums for the past 6 months, the alliance system we've been talking about for the past 4 years, links we've talked about the past 5 years, guild/server loyalty/community that's already been in the tumble cycle for the past 7 years, being matched with strangers even though that's already been happening for the past 5 years through links, and talking about loving and missing a wvw community they refuse to dedicate even one guild slot to stay together with.

 

Maybe this will be the shock factor to make people plan for the changes. This isn't the first and only test of the alliance system, there will be more, every part needs to be tested in steps, if you can't handle it then take the week off wvw. Your servers will be back next week, what you do with your communities after that, is still up to you.

Casuals? I play EVERY SINGLE DAY and they did next to nothing to let people know they needed to make a choice. I've been discussing this with people on our server for as long as anyone else has, so please spare me the "casuals" horse feces and other disparaging remarks. They make more effort to let you know there's new items in the Gem Store and virtually everything else except this Beta. Not even a blanket in-game email alerting people they need to take action. This is not the player's fault, so stop trying to blame them for something that has basically been kept a secret.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Greens Daily Ritual.9025

[Xenesis.6389]

5 minutes ago, Greens Daily Ritual.9025 said:

Casuals? I play EVERY SINGLE DAY

Ok I said casuals, if you're not a casual why are you offended?

 

Quote

 

and they did next to nothing to let people know they needed to make a choice.

I've been discussing this with people on our server for as long as anyone else has

 

So did you know or did you not know?

 

Quote

, so please spare me the "casuals" horse and other disparaging remarks. They make more effort to let you know there's new items in the Gem Store and virtually everything else except this Beta. Even a blanket in-game email alerting people they need to take action. This is not the player's fault, so stop trying to blame them for something that has basically been kept a secret.

 

I mean I don't disagree they're terribad at communication, they always have been and always will be. But this isn't the permanent change, it's a test, treat it as a test, and by the way there's going to be more tests so you're forewarned now months ahead. Treat it as a test, report what's broken and go back to the usual on friday. We've also already heard the discussions around alliance links and communities for years now, coming in here this week complaining about it again ain't going to make a difference. It's already going forward, accept it, adapt, organize, and move forward with it.

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

the casual player would have surely needed more informations about that they gotta choose their guild, however, in most cases it did work. apparently randomly not for a certain % of players but idk.

 

think we got most of our alliance into the right matchup at last, only names are a bit messed up.

 

people outside of that just gotta learn to organize or adapt. it's a pvp mode after all, but it is that heavily messed up since many years, that people are not even aware of this fact.

[Danikat.8537]

I've been on the same server since the headstart weekend, but the way I've come to look at it that means who I play WvW with is effectively random anyway, because guilds and communities move around and I haven't.

I chose Desolation before the game even launched, because a fan site said it was an unofficial UK server, and then I just never had a reason to leave. I didn't even play WvW until a year later (the first WvW Season) and I've never played seriously enough to join a WvW guild or community or worry about server rankings. I join an open tag if there is one or roam around solo or with whoever I bump into. I'll talk in map, squad and team chat, but I haven't been part of any group more permanent than a squad and I don't pay any attention to when or if guilds, commanders and other individuals move on or off the server. So I've never really chosen who I'm playing with anyway.

My first reaction to the alliance system was definitely that I'm losing 'my community' and I don't want to do that, but I also realised the obvious solution posted in this thread: join a guild that's part of that community, one which will join an alliance with other Deso players so we get to stay together. But I don't know where to start; I don't know if there is one, and if there is I don't know what their requirements are and I don't know who to ask to find out. I know there's a Discord channel, so I suppose I'd start by joining that...but all the steps I'd have to go through is making me realise I'm not really part of that community now, so I'd be joining one rather than staying with one I'm already in.

In that case, if the name is the only thing I really have an association with and that's going either way, maybe I should open myself up to other options: wait until the alliance system is in and alliances are settling down then choose one, instead of trying to stick with a random one.

The one part I wasn't sure about was if I'd have the same experience anywhere else. I've heard so many "horror" stories about WvW; dead maps, private guild groups agressively keeping away anyone else, constant abuse in team chat, especially if anyone dares to be so stupid as to ask a question, an absolute split between groups who will only cap empty objectives and actively avoid other players and groups meeting for pre-scheduled fights and avoiding all objectives (I want to fight other players to claim or defend objectives, not one or the other) and so on.

My experience with WvW is so different from the way I've heard it described I thought I must have gotten lucky with my random server. But so far this week hasn't been much different, so now I'm thinking I don't need to worry about that as much. I might be ok with whatever alliance I randomly end up in, or I might choose one to join, but it might not be one linked to my current server.

[Dayra.7405]

I very positive thing about this beta: People getting aware that doing nothing (social connection wise) is only a bad option anymore. so:

 

If you want social wvw-connections, build them. alliances will offer you that.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Dayra.7405

[Zok.4956]

On 12/4/2021 at 5:47 PM, Rose Solane.1027 said:

You miss the point. Many players (like me) play on the same world (Piken Square for example) for a very long time but are not hardcore WvW players. So we are not a member of a hardcore WvW guild because guilds have a member limit. This beta doesn't have alliances active so there is no way to join the players we normally play with unless we would have joined the hardcore WvW guild. Most hardcore WvW guilds wouldn't have a place for us due to member limit.

Isn't there a community guild on Piken Square?

On my server it was announced for quite some time before the first WvW beta to join a community guild if you want to continue to play in the WvW beta with the same players you usually play with. No need to join a "hardcore guild".

[Samis.1750]

I agree with the OP.  With the current server system, you have many players who aren't in a fight guild and like to defend/upgrade objectives for their "server".  Servers added an additional level of meaning to go along with fun fights. My guess is that many of alliances will care even less about objectives or the score, both of which add extra meaning to the WvW experience. Many people on a given server know players/commanders who are not in their guild - and who they will no longer be able to fight alongside.

 

This expansion will also make it harder for newer players to get into WvW.

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

this here is anyways just the freaking first beta test try. the 2nd try is probably forming alliances then out of the wvw signed guilds more precisely

 

@Samis.1750 disagree, only people make it harder for themselves to "get into" Wvw. realistically, u can play in in different ways, and to get into the casual way of semi-roleplaying "defender of objectives", you don't require anything at all. literally, nothing. outside of a character, a single one, with the required level to enter wvw, right? so what are people up about there?

 

there is not gatekeeping, guilds train u up to usefulness anyways if they see a willing newbie.

 

this "toxic elitism" is merely a big meme, taken serious by way too many people fooling themselves. the forum here showcases that pretty well