Why does Mesmer Greatsword trait suck

[Sleepwalker.1398]

• Mesmer:  Bountiful Blades (Domination) — Improves greatsword skills. Mirror Blade bounces additional times, and Phantasmal Berserker summons an additional berserker and deals less damage.

 

 

• Guard:  Zealous Blade (Zeal) — Your power is increased. Gain additional power while wielding a greatsword. Your greatsword skills have reduced recharge.
• Warrior: Forceful Greatsword (Strength) — Gain power and a chance to gain might on critical strike. Double these bonuses while wielding a greatsword or spear. Greatsword and spear skills recharge faster.
• Ranger:  Two-Handed Training (Beastmastery) — Greatsword and spear skills deal more damage and recharge faster. Gain fury when you disable a foe.

 

The other classes get faster recharge with  2 getting might and 1 gets fury on disable and more damage.

For Mes...its like "here this is best we could come up with for you."

I spend most of my time is WvW so not sure how this works for you guys in PVE.

Edited February 2, 2022 by Sleepwalker.1398
Formatting copy/paste stuffed up

[Woltarion.6829]

Ranger has a better block with his greatsword than mesmer does with his shield

[mungozen.2379]

1 hour ago, Sleepwalker.1398 said:

The other classes get faster recharge with  2 getting might and 1 gets fury on disable and more damage.

Apples and Oranges right?

Each profession has different weapon skills on the Greatsword.  Each profession has traits that impact those weapon skills differently.

What you are observing is a small slice of the total picture, definitely not enough to draw any serious conclusion from.

[Alcatraznc.3869]

Well make Mesmer greatsword a melee weapon just like the other 2 and afterward maybe we can start comparing . 

[Salt Mode.3780]

There is alot of things horrible about Mesmer GS but its still one of our best weapons, bountiful blades on the other hand is a straight up nerf by adding one more bounce to it.

Edited February 3, 2022 by Salt Mode.3780

[Justine.6351]

Idk I like it. An extra clone, more cripple, more might and more vulnerability. With certain other traits you can even double up on boons from the phantasms.

 

I guess I would probably change the extra bounce to immobilized on gs 3 so the berserkers could hit more reliably.

[Yoci.2481]

Where do you get more cripple from?

[viquing.8254]

 GS really need more sustain option to be on par with other meta weapon (looking at all class).

And fixing this crappy illusionary wave on sloppy ground...

1 hour ago, Yoci.2481 said:

Where do you get more cripple from?

The past version of the trait ?

 

10 hours ago, Mungo Zen.9364 said:

Apples and Oranges right?

When  apple does more damage + mobility + CC + sustain while orange just have 1 skill who need a 3+ skill combo to be on par, I fail to see the "global picture".

But it's more about the base weapon than the trait.

 

Edited February 3, 2022 by viquing.8254

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

It's not a GS only problem it's a mesmer thing.

The sword trait is just pathetic if you compare it with other sword traits. 

Even mirage mantle is trash comparing to other core dodge traits. 

[Justine.6351]

1 hour ago, Yoci.2481 said:

Where do you get more cripple from?

double berserkers.

9 minutes ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

It's not a GS only problem it's a mesmer thing.

The sword trait is just pathetic if you compare it with other sword traits. 

Even mirage mantle is trash comparing to other core dodge traits. 

 

I actually like the sword AND spear trait. The lower cooldowns on some of mesmer's best skills is quite nice. The extra damage buff is just there. I wouldn't mind seeing something to do with evades instead of ferocity buff as sword mainhand, offhand and spear have evade but idk since the competing trait already gives reflect on evading. Perhaps replace Evasive Mirror and have Fencer's Finesse grant sw 2 & 4 and spear 3 mirror for 1 second in place of the ferocity bonus.

[Justine.6351]

43 minutes ago, viquing.8254 said:

 GS really need more sustain option to be on par with other meta weapon (looking at all class).

I've been using leeching food, sigil of blood and sigil of draining. Laserbeam gives easy leech procs and draining on any interrupt, but in the context of gs, illusionary wave.

[viquing.8254]

7 minutes ago, Justine.6351 said:

I've been using leeching food, sigil of blood and sigil of draining. Laserbeam gives easy leech procs and draining on any interrupt, but in the context of gs, illusionary wave.

Sorry I should precise I always talk in a PvP context and for example I compare to other similar ranged meta weapon like ranger bow.

[Justine.6351]

Just now, viquing.8254 said:

Sorry I should precise I always talk in a PvP context and for example I compare to other similar ranged meta weapon like ranger bow.

oops ok. A valid point.

Yeah I am not sure what power focused weapon really has sustain on it? Do you mean defense?

[Puck.3697]

Mesmer greatsword as a whole is pretty bad. 

It's such a unique weapon that I think Anet rly waste alot of potiental when they allow weapons like this to just become so outdated. 

I remember rhe first time I tried this game seeing a mesmer with a greatsword was one of the biggest pulling points of the game, the proffession is so unique compared to any class other games have. It amazes me they waste it. 

My assumption to why would be after core Anet decided to go very anti-ranged and nuke ranged weapons and favour melee. 

Mesmer Greatsword was just another victim to their change of direction on this. 

[Sebrent.3625]

Not leaning one way or the other on this, but one thing to note when comparing the Mesmer Greatsword to other ranged weapons like the Ranger Longbow is that one is a projectile and the other is not. There is less counterplay vs the Mesmer Greatsword than there is vs the Ranger Longbow since the Mesmer Greatsword is unaffected by anti-projectile mechanics.

 

Does that warrant the other differences? ./shrug

[viquing.8254]

18 minutes ago, Sebrent.3625 said:

Not leaning one way or the other on this, but one thing to note when comparing the Mesmer Greatsword to other ranged weapons like the Ranger Longbow is that one is a projectile and the other is not. There is less counterplay vs the Mesmer Greatsword than there is vs the Ranger Longbow since the Mesmer Greatsword is unaffected by anti-projectile mechanics.

 

Does that warrant the other differences? ./shrug

Good point but currently, the damage came vastly from F1 burst combo than from GS skills on theireself.

There isn't much reflect in PvP. Moreover only GS2 mater, you will barely GS1 pewpew. While bow 5 does massive aoe damage and bow 2 can triger one bloc/aegis then does more damage.

So I'm not convinced that it warrant the differences in this context. It's probably different in WvW.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

11 hours ago, Justine.6351 said:

double berserkers.

 

I actually like the sword AND spear trait. The lower cooldowns on some of mesmer's best skills is quite nice. The extra damage buff is just there. I wouldn't mind seeing something to do with evades instead of ferocity buff as sword mainhand, offhand and spear have evade but idk since the competing trait already gives reflect on evading. Perhaps replace Evasive Mirror and have Fencer's Finesse grant sw 2 & 4 and spear 3 mirror for 1 second in place of the ferocity bonus.

FF has conditional stats whereas every other similar weapon trait has stats granted just by speccing + if you have the weapon. 

 

[Yoci.2481]

12 hours ago, Justine.6351 said:

double berserkers.

 

I actually like the sword AND spear trait. The lower cooldowns on some of mesmer's best skills is quite nice. The extra damage buff is just there. I wouldn't mind seeing something to do with evades instead of ferocity buff as sword mainhand, offhand and spear have evade but idk since the competing trait already gives reflect on evading. Perhaps replace Evasive Mirror and have Fencer's Finesse grant sw 2 & 4 and spear 3 mirror for 1 second in place of the ferocity bonus.

Perhaps you haven't played Mesmer in the past few years but berserker doesn't have cripple.

[Obliviscaris.6937]

23 hours ago, Mungo Zen.9364 said:

Apples and Oranges right?

Each profession has different weapon skills on the Greatsword.  Each profession has traits that impact those weapon skills differently.

What you are observing is a small slice of the total picture, definitely not enough to draw any serious conclusion from.

 

This is giving off really that huge 'Stockholm syndrome' energy that I've come to expect from Mesmer mains in denial.

[mungozen.2379]

9 minutes ago, Obliviscaris.6937 said:

 

This is giving off really that huge 'Stockholm syndrome' energy that I've come to expect from Mesmer mains in denial.

What are you talking about? 

I would say the same thing if people were comparing Traits specific to Mace or Hammer skills across different professions.

What you are observing is a small slice of the total picture, definitely not enough to draw any serious conclusion from.

[Salt Mode.3780]

The comparison isn't a direct comparison it is the fact that Mesmer GS trait is essentially a NERF to the weapon itself.

First off having 2 berserker spawn is roughly the same if not less then having 1 berserker spawn, the extra bounce may seem like more dps but anyone who plays Mesmer at a higher lvl knows this is a nerf.

The only thing that trait is giving for GS is an extra clone that is going to take a few sec before it can even be used to shatter.

[Justine.6351]

1 hour ago, Yoci.2481 said:

Perhaps you haven't played Mesmer in the past few years but berserker doesn't have cripple.

Idk I remember them causing cripple. Checked in game and they don't. Probably changed it when they added cripple to gs 3 because I do recall them switching the boon removal between the 2 skills.

[Salt Mode.3780]

 

Berserker 

February 25, 2020

Competitive content update: Cooldown reduced from 15 seconds to 12 seconds. This skill no longer cripples foes. Instead, the projectile now removes 2 boons. The projectile no longer boomerangs. Competitive splits: Reduced phantasm power coefficient per strike from 0.23 to 0.15.

 

Mind Stab

February 25, 2020

Competitive content update: Cooldown reduced from 12 seconds to 10 seconds. This skill no longer removes boons, but instead inflicts cripple for 5 seconds. Competitive splits: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.7.

 

They just swapped effects.

Tho I will say the boon rip is a straight nerf because the projectile is easily dodged/blocked and often times will not hit ur target.

Edited February 4, 2022 by Salt Mode.3780

[Puck.3697]

1 hour ago, Obliviscaris.6937 said:

This is giving off really that huge 'Stockholm syndrome' energy that I've come to expect from Mesmer mains in denial.

tbh... his statement is Accurate to a Extent, every proffession has Terrible Weapons and Weapons other proffessions have that are just directly better

Mesmer Sword vs Warrior Sword as a example.

I dont think there is any "Stockholm Syndrome" i think theres some that excessively over exaggerate problems with their proffessions and More neutral opinons across all 9 proffession sub forums.

Mesmer has issues, but it isnt alone in that boat.

[FarmBotXD.1430]

10 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

tbh... his statement is Accurate to a Extent, every proffession has Terrible Weapons and Weapons other proffessions have that are just directly better

Mesmer Sword vs Warrior Sword as a example.

I dont think there is any "Stockholm Syndrome" i think theres some that excessively over exaggerate problems with their proffessions and More neutral opinons across all 9 proffession sub forums.

Mesmer has issues, but it isnt alone in that boat.

I think the issue is that GS is the best power mesmer weapon and its still worse in every way then other classes weapons