What if GW2 were to shut down?

[almostdaft.4319]

Honestly? I'd probably just fall back to GW1, maybe some WoW on the side.

[Labjax.2465]

39 minutes ago, Smoky.5348 said:

This was the first thing I thought of. City of Heroes just suddenly died because NCSoft said so. All the cool characters you have here mean nothing once the plug is pulled. And that stinks something fierce because GW2 is currently the only MMO l can play comfortably. I don't like playing MMOs, l don't like playing PvP pubs, and l don't like playing PvE pubs. I only play online games with my friends these days, but GW2 has just the right combination of stuff that the online gameplay doesn't bother me.

But, considering ANET doesn't play their own game enough to know what needs fixing, that plug might be pulled sooner than it we think.

On the flip side, I believe Aion is still going (another NCSoft property) and so is GW1 (granted GW1 is far less of an online game than this). Personally, I'm doubtful they'd pull the plug on GW2 unless: 1) NCSoft itself went kaput and Anet with it or 2) A GW3 was made and they wanted to drive players to it.

Cause GW1 seems to be very easy to maintain, which is free advertising for GW2 and the IP as a whole. And it's a fairly significant IP. So considering it from the standpoint of profit and self-interest (the way these corps behave) it seems to me that it'd be pretty irrational to shut down GW2 without something to replace it.

What I think is far more likely to happen if the GW2 team screws things up is the game will be put on maintenance mode and that's it. Right now tho, they are still clearly reinvesting into the game, albeit less, and their aiming at a steam release shows a concerted interest in growing the game's playerbase.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Labjax.2465

[Ashen.2907]

On 7/15/2022 at 2:54 PM, Danikat.8537 said:

The EU is not even considering banning microtransactions, only loot boxes. In GW2 that would only affect Black Lion Chests, not the vast majority of things they sell.

Depending on the specifics of the legislation it may not even affect Black Lion Chests, or it may mean a relatively minor change like restricting them to people who are over 18, considering literal gambling is legal in a lot of EU countries.

That is more understandable. I may not agree with governments telling adults that they are not allowed to gamble but I can understand attempts to limit it to adults and to regulate it as the gamblimg that it is in video games. The mention of in game cosmetics as being considered for banning would essentially be government declaring that artists are not allowed to sell their art, which would another level of authoritarianism entirely. I am very happy for Europeans that such is not being considered.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Ashen.2907

[Ragebru.1397]

1 hour ago, Ashen.2907 said:

government declaring that artists are not allowed to sell their art

Both the EU and the interview with Texas Sen Ted Cruz, both stated that the development company owns those skins and just lease them to you. Which I believe is kind of the focal point for these arguments, is that cosmetics really aren't "yours". I won't pretend like I know the EU's law-making side, but I can assure you that at least the US has raised this alarm quite a lot recently- both on dem and rep side. 

[Smoky.5348]

4 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

...it seems to me that it'd be pretty irrational to shut down GW2 without something to replace it.

Humor me for a bit more, what was NCSoft's replacement for City of Heroes? It wasn't Guild Wars, was it?

[Labjax.2465]

56 minutes ago, Smoky.5348 said:

Humor me for a bit more, what was NCSoft's replacement for City of Heroes? It wasn't Guild Wars, was it?

I think I see what you're saying like what would the one game have to do with the other, tho it is interesting... I'm looking at the dates and it may be GW2 was NCSoft's replacement for City of Heroes. O.o If I'm not misreading this from tiredness, GW2 is released August 25, 2012 and City of Heroes (along with Paragon Studios) is terminated on August 31, 2012, with the last day of services on November 30, 2012.

Maybe just a coincidence in timing, but regardless, I don't think City of Heroes ever had the kind of popularity/profit GW2 has had (correct me if anyone has sources to the contrary) and I imagine that makes a difference.

[Arnox.5128]

1 hour ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Maybe just a coincidence in timing, but regardless, I don't think City of Heroes ever had the kind of popularity/profit GW2 has had (correct me if anyone has sources to the contrary) and I imagine that makes a difference.

GW2 was never a SUPER popular MMO, but the playerbase it does have is very dedicated. Very loyal. It's a steady income stream, even if it's definitely not the biggest one in NCSoft's lineup.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Arnox.5128

[Aodlop.1907]

On 7/8/2022 at 11:23 AM, Astralporing.1957 said:

WoW is a much more mainstream MMORPG (primarily because for years it has been the example on which mainstream was based on) than GW2 is, which means Blizzard players have more options for something that can satisfy them well enough.

As a WoW refugee, I disagree. Ever since they've ruined WoW, I've been trying to find a satisfying new home, to no avail. 

[Arnox.5128]

50 minutes ago, Aodlop.1907 said:

As a WoW refugee, I disagree. Ever since they've ruined WoW, I've been trying to find a satisfying new home, to no avail. 

FF14 didn't work for you?

[Astralporing.1957]

52 minutes ago, Aodlop.1907 said:

As a WoW refugee, I disagree. Ever since they've ruined WoW, I've been trying to find a satisfying new home, to no avail. 

Obviously, no two games are the same, and there will always be some elements lacking if you look for a full replacement. Especially if you look to replace all the good elements you remember, without getting the bad ones as well. Still, if you lok around, MMORPG games will generally tend to have much more in common with WoW than with GW2. That's because everyone, when making their own game, looked up to WoW and its success, but hardly anyone looked up to GW2. At best they might try to "borrow" some individual elements that they've found interesting, but the general game design and ideology behind is pretty much unique to GW2 and noone else ever tried to make a game with similar approach since.

[Gehenna.3625]

13 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said:

The EU is not even considering banning microtransactions, only loot boxes. In GW2 that would only affect Black Lion Chests, not the vast majority of things they sell.

Depending on the specifics of the legislation it may not even affect Black Lion Chests, or it may mean a relatively minor change like restricting them to people who are over 18, considering literal gambling is legal in a lot of EU countries.

Yep, only loot boxes are in danger (which I think is a good thing), meaning black lion chests and possibly random mount packs. Everything else is direct sales which they aren't going to be shutting down. 

The reason why Belgium shut down gems entirely, I believe, is because Anet wasn't able or willing to take out black lion chest keys from the gem store for Belgium. It might be a bit more complex than that but you have to think in that direction. It's not that Belgian legislation forbids direct sales afaik. 

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

Yep, only loot boxes are in danger (which I think is a good thing), meaning black lion chests and possibly random mount packs. Everything else is direct sales which they aren't going to be shutting down. 

The reason why Belgium shut down gems entirely, I believe, is because Anet wasn't able or willing to take out black lion chest keys from the gem store for Belgium. It might be a bit more complex than that but you have to think in that direction. It's not that Belgian legislation forbids direct sales afaik. 

Belgium didn't shut down anything. Anet on their own decided to remove several elements from gemshop because they were unwilling to adjust to Belgium's laws (which would require admitting that lootboxes are gambling).

[Ashen.2907]

12 hours ago, Ragebru.1397 said:

Both the EU and the interview with Texas Sen Ted Cruz, both stated that the development company owns those skins and just lease them to you. Which I believe is kind of the focal point for these arguments, is that cosmetics really aren't "yours". I won't pretend like I know the EU's law-making side, but I can assure you that at least the US has raised this alarm quite a lot recently- both on dem and rep side. 

OK, lease their art. A governmemt acting to deprive an artist of the right to lease their art, to deprive them of control of their property, is no less authoritarian than depriving them of the right to sell it.

[Aodlop.1907]

6 hours ago, Arnox.5128 said:

FF14 didn't work for you?

All I play in WoW is 3v3 arena, duels and random BGs.

As a result, I didn't even bother to give FFXIV a try.

[Jianyu.7065]

I would feel sad that I was never able to share my passion for this world with someone I loved.

[Ashen.2907]

9 minutes ago, Jianyu.7065 said:

I would feel sad that I was never able to share my passion for this world with someone I loved.

As cynical as I can be this was touching. Best post in the thread.

[Minjin.8259]

On 7/8/2022 at 5:16 AM, SinisterSlay.6973 said:

Sometimes it's tough to think about the years spent and literally wasted.

I look upon it like entertainment the same as if I watch a movie or read a book.  Just because the movie ends or the book is finished doesn't mean the time (and money) goes poof.  I still enjoyed it while participating in it.  Same with a game.  

[Smoky.5348]

On 7/19/2022 at 4:24 PM, Minjin.8259 said:

I look upon it like entertainment the same as if I watch a movie or read a book.  Just because the movie ends or the book is finished doesn't mean the time (and money) goes poof.  I still enjoyed it while participating in it.  Same with a game.  

I'm a little late, but a service-based game isn't the same movies and other games. If a movie goes out of production, you can still watch it if you can find it. If a game's service goes down, it cannot be experienced anymore. It's not something that can be easily archived like other games. Watching a walkthrough on YouTube can't match the experience of actually playing it. This used to be an MMO-only problem, too, but now service-type games are spreading to many other multiplayer genres that have previously been proven to support local play.

Your core beliefs are correct; no one can take away your own experiences with the game and they are real. But when a game's services end, you cannot create any more experiences, nor can anyone else start new experiences. That, l feel, is a real problem.

[Danikat.8537]

9 minutes ago, Smoky.5348 said:

I'm a little late, but a service-based game isn't the same movies and other games. If a movie goes out of production, you can still watch it if you can find it. If a game's service goes down, it cannot be experienced anymore. It's not something that can be easily archived like other games. Watching a walkthrough on YouTube can't match the experience of actually playing it. This used to be an MMO-only problem, too, but now service-type games are spreading to many other multiplayer genres that have previously been proven to support local play.

Your core beliefs are correct; no one can take away your own experiences with the game and they are real. But when a game's services end, you cannot create any more experiences, nor can anyone else start new experiences. That, l feel, is a real problem.

I think the point was that the time spent playing the game wouldn't have been wasted just because it's not online any more. When you've finished reading a book you don't have anything to show for it except your memories of having read it. Yes owning the book means you can read it again, but that's not what gives meaning to the time spent reading it. (Otherwise you could achieve the same thing by buying books and never reading them.)

It's the same with a game, whether it can be easily archived or not. You don't play a game so that you'll have the ability to play it again later and you won't get anything from playing it except the memories of having done so. The point of playing it is to enjoy that time, and that can be done whether or not it's available to play again later on.

[Smoky.5348]

1 minute ago, Danikat.8537 said:

It's the same with a game, whether it can be easily archived or not. You don't play a game so that you'll have the ability to play it again later and you won't get anything from playing it except the memories of having done so. The point of playing it is to enjoy that time, and that can be done whether or not it's available to play again later on.

I suppose l have a very different outlook on video game enjoyment, then. I try not to play anything that l won't want to come back to. Only exceptions are visual novels and old games that l want to experience for myself. And even then, l might enjoy an old game so much l wind up wanting to go back and play it again. The original Final Fantasy VII was like this for me; l played it to see what it was all about, and now it's one of my favorites that l like to return to from time to time.

And even that lends support to my concern. I can easily go play Gimmick for the NES despite it being decades past its prime, but trying to play a dead service game is highly difficult, if not impossible, even if it's only five years old.

[IsabelDawn.8950]

I wouldn't worry about that.

Even some of the most ancient, archaic MMO's of the first generation are still running (and, shockingly, still have players!). It is vanishingly rare for an MMO to be shut down, shelved, and never accessible again. It does happen, of course, but it isn't the norm for established titles.

 

More often then not an MMO gets put into maintainance mode, meaning the game still runs, and can be bought, but the developers no longer actively update it. Guild Wars 1 is a good example.

 

Even that I dont see happening anytime soon, this is a great time for Guild Wars 2!

[Danikat.8537]

13 hours ago, Smoky.5348 said:

I suppose l have a very different outlook on video game enjoyment, then. I try not to play anything that l won't want to come back to. Only exceptions are visual novels and old games that l want to experience for myself. And even then, l might enjoy an old game so much l wind up wanting to go back and play it again. The original Final Fantasy VII was like this for me; l played it to see what it was all about, and now it's one of my favorites that l like to return to from time to time.

And even that lends support to my concern. I can easily go play Gimmick for the NES despite it being decades past its prime, but trying to play a dead service game is highly difficult, if not impossible, even if it's only five years old.

I understand that, I do the same thing. I have a Gameboy Advance in my bag right now with A Link to the Past because I play it on the bus.

But I still think it's two different things, or different aspects of the same thing. I'm just not sure how to describe it. Owning a copy of a game does enable you to play it whenever you want, even years later, but that's the reason to own a copy (when that's possible) not the reason to play it. The point of playing a game is to have fun playing it, and that will be true even if you don't get to go back to it later for whatever reason.

Maybe watching a movie in the cinema is a better analogy? If you enjoy a movie then the time spent watching it was well spent, even if you don't buy the same movie to watch at home later on. The fact that you can't watch it again whenever you like won't change the fact that you enjoyed watching it the first time. It's the same with games. It is nice to be able to go back to them whenever you want, but not doing that won't change the fact that it was fun when you did play it.

[MSevenR.4081]

Could release it as a single player or co-op game as one final push!  I think it would work well for this game, imo.  Same with Final Fantasy XIV.  Although a lot of stuff is server based, so probably quite a large project...

 

Assuming like minimal code changes, just tone down difficulty a bit is mostly all you would need to do.  could go the extra mile and add things like NPC helpers/party members and stuff, but that would probably be too much work for a shutting down MMO.

 

Sell it for like $60 and call it a day!  Preserve the story and the world so it isn't lost to time at least.  Like so many "live service" games will be in the coming years.

[eyelogix.1654]

GW2 is probably the last MMO. I still love it, but whenever they decide to pull the plug then I'm out.
Played GW1 since the Factions release and bought Prophecies a month after.

The games lore got me hooked, and it had an interesting concept at that time.

[vandrefalk.6823]

I'd be done with MMOs for now and not try another until Ashes of Creation comes out. Not that I'm believing it will be any kind of saviour either but things are looking better recently.

 

I'd be gaming a lot less anyway if GW2 shut down, probably try some games from my Steam library but it would be time to try that Outside MMO everyone keeps talking about.