Doubleteaming : how to fix it

[manu.7539]

Dblteaming can be very annoying and can decide which team win or not. The best team not always win at the end of the week because of it. I think there is some solutions to fix that problem:

 

1- If in a skirmish 2 teams get a clear majority* of their kills against the same team then the focused team should get a warscore bonus strong enough to compensate the unfair situation.

 

2- If in a skirmish 2 teams get a clear majority of their taken objectives against the same team then the focused team should get a warscore bonus strong enough to compensate the unfair situation.

 

*A clear majority could be like 62-65% and higher. Then the higher is that pourcentage the higher should be the warscore bonus for the focused team.

 

 

Another way could be to penalize any team focusing another,. This could force everyone to fight each other fairly but doesnt directly fix the doubleteaming matter, still it could be better than nothing.

 

 

PS: I said the word in W. Please dont bring me again in that discussion about that winning isnt important, this is not the point of this topic.

[Bizgurk.5639]

Alright, so let's assume I'm having fun double-teaming you and your team would get a warscore bonus because of this, then what? I'd still be double-teaming you!

So what's the meaning of the warscore bonus?

[Strider Pj.2193]

The ONLY way to remove double teaming is to have just two sides.  And that is a whole different game mode.  It no longer is WvW.

 

Wvwvw was designed to encourage double teaming.  The BIGGEST issue isn’t that double teaming happens, it’s WHO is double teamed.

 

There needs to be incentives to double team the leader.  Reward structure, etc.  

 

 

[manu.7539]

16 minutes ago, Bizgurk.5639 said:

Alright, so let's assume I'm having fun double-teaming you and your team would get a warscore bonus because of this, then what? I'd still be double-teaming you!

So what's the meaning of the warscore bonus?

Yeah its probably impossible to completely stop the dblteaming but the idea is to counterbalance the effect of it so the best team get a better chance to win at the end of the week even if they were dblteamed.

[manu.7539]

14 minutes ago, Strider Pj.2193 said:

The ONLY way to remove double teaming is to have just two sides.  And that is a whole different game mode.  It no longer is WvW.

 

Wvwvw was designed to encourage double teaming.  The BIGGEST issue isn’t that double teaming happens, it’s WHO is double teamed.

 

There needs to be incentives to double team the leader.  Reward structure, etc.  

 

 

I'm not against the idea of having only 2 teams but it would change alot the dynamic of the game. My proposition is for the actual 3 team mode.

[Mabi black.1824]

the matches on three sides are a feature of this mode, personally I really like it so that the games change continuously as you least expect. if you have two teams on you you can have more fun because everything becomes more hectic and you never get bored. if it is you who apply it you will have fun because in fact you can put an enemy team in difficulty. when you have matured the awareness that in this mode you can suffer everything and even more or when you won't get angry anymore when they rip off a garry t3 from under your nose, then you'll start to really enjoy this game mode.

just my opinion 😉

[Gorani.7205]

The double-teaming isn't the problem. The problem is that the two stronger servers (1st & 2nd) can feed on the weakest as a double team, without any downside for both of them, because there is no incentive for the second in line server to team up with the weakest server (2nd + 3rd vs 1st) to go against the strong and leading server.

[Some Call Me Tim.2319]

On 9/6/2022 at 7:41 AM, manu.7539 said:

Yeah its probably impossible to completely stop the dblteaming but the idea is to counterbalance the effect of it so the best team get a better chance to win at the end of the week even if they were dblteamed.

 

“Winning” really means nothing in the current  wvw.   For the fight groups it’s about finding fights.  For the roamers and havoc groups it’s about messing with the enemies stuff.  

 

Double teaming may happen here and there but it’s not as terrible as some would have us believe and frankly it’s really a non-issue after all is said and done.  

Edited September 9, 2022 by Some Call Me Tim.2319

[manu.7539]

2 minutes ago, Gorani.7205 said:

The double-teaming isn't the problem. The problem is that the two stronger servers (1st & 2nd) can feed on the weakest as a double team, without any downside for both of them, because there is no incentive for the second in line server to team up with the weakest server (2nd + 3rd vs 1st) to go against the strong and leading server.

It doesnt always happen this way, sometimes the worst team focus one of the other teams just to bully them, or to show that they still have some power over you or whatever the reason. Sometimes its good enough to ruin the chances to win for the best team.  Its unfair and for those enjoying a fair competition it is a demotivating situation to play that game when it happen too often.

[manu.7539]

19 minutes ago, Some Call Me Tim.2319 said:

 

“Winning” really means nothing in the current  wvw.   For the fight groups it’s about finding fights.  For the roamers and havoc groups it’s about messing with the enemies stuff.  

 

Double taming may happen here and there but it’s not as terrible as some would have us believe and frankly it’s really a non-issue after all is said and done.  

I always get about same reactions when I talk about winning and I always have about the same answer to it: not everyone think as u do, its a competitive game, it is normal to enjoy winning and dislike losing. But losing just because u were dblteamed is just hateful for those like me looking for a fair competition.

Edited September 6, 2022 by manu.7539

[Some Call Me Tim.2319]

1 minute ago, manu.7539 said:

I always get the about same reactions when I talk about winning and I always have about the same answer to it: not everyone think as u do, its a competitive game, it is normal to enjoy winning and dislike losing. But losing just because u were dblteamed is just hateful for those like me looking for a fair competition.

 

If you actually want to “win” a match then get a big group and run around taking all the structures you can and work at keeping them.  That’s where most of the points come from.  

 

The people out there fighting don’t  care about winning the matches as much as they care about winning the fight that’s right in front of them.  

 

Winning matches means nothing worth stressing about in the current wvw.  Maybe alliances will be different?  Time will tell. 

[Bizgurk.5639]

36 minutes ago, manu.7539 said:

Yeah its probably impossible to completely stop the dblteaming but the idea is to counterbalance the effect of it so the best team get a better chance to win at the end of the week even if they were dblteamed.

I mean I do understand your frustration, but I doubt that your suggestions would change anything. I'm looking at my server and the guilds there, who are only looking for other fighting guilds to do GvG. If such servers like mine are stuck in a tier with enemies that don't have any fighting guilds, then they either want to go one tier up or one tier down. Going up needs coverage and my server doesn't have that because it's boring. Going down is the only solution and if those guilds could force a weaker world to go up due to those extra warscore they'd get, then they'd beat the hell out of that world, just to get them a higher warscore.
Those ideas you have might make it even worse.

[manu.7539]

5 minutes ago, Bizgurk.5639 said:

I mean I do understand your frustration, but I doubt that your suggestions would change anything. I'm looking at my server and the guilds there, who are only looking for other fighting guilds to do GvG. If such servers like mine are stuck in a tier with enemies that don't have any fighting guilds, then they either want to go one tier up or one tier down. Going up needs coverage and my server doesn't have that because it's boring. Going down is the only solution and if those guilds could force a weaker world to go up due to those extra warscore they'd get, then they'd beat the hell out of that world, just to get them a higher warscore.
Those ideas you have might make it even worse.

Its called WvW, not GvG but I agree that fighting is fun, just do it in EoTM if u absolutely are a fan of GvG's. Having a map Q of gvg'ers can be frustrating for those wanting to play WvW and not GvG.

Edited September 6, 2022 by manu.7539

[Xenesis.6389]

It's been said many times already, the double team is usually focused on the wrong team, the weakest one in the match. In a three way match it's expected a double team will happen pretty much all the time, that is the point of having three teams instead of two. Except the way it should work is the middle team should be keeping the winning side in check not helping them.

The motivation to do so is what needs to change, to get the two weakest to fight the strongest at all times. There are many ways they could approach this to change, but I don't think anet is interested in changing wvw, they love having snowball effects, even from day one with orbs then bloodlust ruins, to outnumbered buff not actually helping you when outnumbered, now to boon blobbing.

The only big positive they did was put in skirmish mode to basically stop a couple servers from running up overnight scores. There is no real map politics anymore other than lets hit greens side while they're hitting blue cause easy cap they won't respond to in time! You don't need penalties, you don't need handicaps, you don't need inflated scores, you just need to change motivations and the biggest one in wvw apparently is "rewards".

[Bizgurk.5639]

2 minutes ago, manu.7539 said:

Its called WvW, not GvG but I agree that fighting is fun, just do it in EoTM if u absolutely are a fan of GvG's

If those guilds could read they'd we very upset!

[Hackuuna.4085]

If a server with a strong timezone goes in and dominates both servers, capturing their BLs, your solution will grant the dominating server a bonus when those servers "double team" by flipping their own BLs back. Further, the dominating server will be granted a bonus when the weaker servers are both getting most of their kills against the dominating server while trying to recapture their sides.

[manu.7539]

4 minutes ago, Hackuuna.4085 said:

If a server with a strong timezone goes in and dominates both servers, capturing their BLs, your solution will grant the dominating server a bonus when those servers "double team" by flipping their own BLs back. Further, the dominating server will be granted a bonus when the weaker servers are both getting most of their kills against the dominating server while trying to recapture their sides.

you are right but lets agree that in this situation the dominating server is going to win the skirmish anyway, bonus or not.

[AlCapwnd.7834]

The Double Teaming will stop when MAG stops being MAG.

 

Its your fault MAG. You created the issue you are complaining about.

 

As always, put your confused emojis over there --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->

[Ashen.2907]

4 hours ago, Strider Pj.2193 said:

The ONLY way to remove double teaming is to have just two sides.  And that is a whole different game mode.  It no longer is WvW.

 

Wvwvw was designed to encourage double teaming.  The BIGGEST issue isn’t that double teaming happens, it’s WHO is double teamed.

 

There needs to be incentives to double team the leader.  Reward structure, etc.  

 

 

This.

[displayname.8315]

If it's not double-team focusing for structure capping, it's night capping for structure capping.  Fights don't even factor in.

 

If this was about fights you would see respect for guilds an no a$$jamming.

 

Guilds never did get any real support other than a little arena for their self made mode.  No reason to really join the leftover guilds their not serious 

[Strider Pj.2193]

4 hours ago, manu.7539 said:

I'm not against the idea of having only 2 teams but it would change alot the dynamic of the game. My proposition is for the actual 3 team mode.

And yet, you didn’t address the rest of the post.  WvWvW was DESIGNED to have double teaming.  Get used to it, or play sPvP.  
 

It has been built in.  If double teaming bothers you so much, this isn’t your mode.

[Strider Pj.2193]

3 hours ago, manu.7539 said:

It doesnt always happen this way, sometimes the worst team focus one of the other teams just to bully them, or to show that they still have some power over you or whatever the reason. Sometimes its good enough to ruin the chances to win for the best team.  Its unfair and for those enjoying a fair competition it is a demotivating situation to play that game when it happen too often.

How can the (your words not mine) worst team ‘bully’ a better team?  Please help me understand how that can happen unless the ‘best’ team allows it..?

Edited September 6, 2022 by Strider Pj.2193

[ArchonWing.9480]

That's the whole point of WvW. It's the only way to take out a t3 SMC or a T3 keep that's being held very strongly by the invading team.

There's some aspects to diplomacy too. If your side is super pushy when they're strong and doesn't give the other sides space, then it's only natural to be focused once the other people get on.

Also if your server or if the guilds on it are known for obnoxious behavior, then people are just going to double team that to get rid of it.

Edited September 6, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[kash.9213]

All the lazy and afk players could flood one or two servers to farm that Warscore Bonus.

I don't see double teaming enough, either in immediate fights or as map influence, to want to do anything about. 

At this points since WvW is just a larger arena match like SPvP and doesn't have anything else going for it, I don't mind if some servers or guilds decide to influence the rest of the match to hopefully get a better bracket for everyone on the next match. 

Edited September 6, 2022 by kash.9213

[LetoII.3782]

2 hours ago, AlCapwnd.7834 said:

The Double Teaming will stop when MAG stops being MAG.

 

Its your fault MAG. You created the issue you are complaining about.

 

As always, put your confused emojis over there --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->

Mag isn't 2v1'd

Mag 1v2's