June 27 Balance Update Preview

[xXxNikiGoesWildxXx.3678]

Willbender needs more work especially for its utilities. 

"Reversal of Fortune" compared to healing signet is very terrible and punishing to use. Having it twice sounds good but realistically you get 2k heals 2 times in pvp. Even 4k heal is low. There are core traits which triggers when using healing skill so try to buff those traits in order to make this healing skill better without buffing it. 

"Flash combo" instead of making its second cast return back to its starting position, allow second shadowstep on target if all hits land. It cannot be anything similar like thiefs/mirages utility for "going in-out" as range and requirements are super high and unfun. Fix this please.

"Rolling light" same problem as "Flashing combo".... just remove backward movements and add moving forward twice. Roll forward then leap forward(current). 

"Heaven's palm" cast time is super long and range is super short. So my advice is to either buff range to 900 from 600 OR reduce cast time from 1,25 sec to 0,75 sec please. 

These 4 changes are something which needs to be considered and applied, at least anything similar to these examples. 

[vinz.8475]

I play Mirage and Reaper the most.

Mesmer:

Mirage evasion has been a major pain point in competitive modes for a long time, and it was something we wanted to address in this update. Mirage will now have 100 endurance in PvP and WvW but will no longer be able to dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.

This seems it is only ment for pvp/wvw? but there is no only pvp/wvw.

• Mirage can no longer dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.

This ist for everything? but

Mirage Cloak Trait says: Gain Mirage Cloak instead of dodge rolling. Ambush skills become available for a short time whenever you gain Mirage Cloak. Gain access to Deception skills. So Mirage never had a dodge?

• Mirage can no longer dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.

Is this only hard cc or hard and sorft cc? (You need some evasion fore raid bosses etc.)

 

Chronomancer has exess to quickness or alacrity so why not give the ambush skil on greatsword quickness for 5 people (same duration as with staff alac). Mirage would not be able to do both because greatsword needs direct damage stats and staff needs dot stats to be relevant.

Needing clones for the alacraty duration is horrible by the way when the group is fighting against multiple oponents, while moving or the main oponent swiches phases.

 

Necromancer:

The following changes on Necro mess with the class identity too much. The Necromancer is all about raising dead (reviving downed players) and spreading corruption.

• Ritual of Life: Reduced revive percentage from 7% to 2% in PvE only.
• Life from Death: This trait no longer revives allies and now increases outgoing healing.
• Transfusion: This trait now only teleports downed allies when initially activated. Reduced the revival pulse from 2% to 1% when used with the scourge elite specialization in PvE only.
• Unholy Feast: This skill now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
• Spiteful Spirit: This trait now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
• Enfeebling Blood: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.
• Lesser Enfeeble: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.

 

And pls do not change Signets of suffering . If you do pls move the existing effect to the signets (the staying active in shroud part). It is quite fun as is and i play with it in the open world with my Reaper using every signet i can (pls add an elite signet somehow^^).

• Signets of Suffering: This trait has been reworked and causes signet skills to remove boons from affected foes. No one will use this, Necromancer has already enough boon remofal.

 

Scrapper:

Pls do not change Kinetic Accelerators this is the best thing about scrapper. Why would you make it more complex to play the game this is not fun.

• Kinetic Accelerators: This trait has been reworked. Apply boons to nearby allies when you successfully combo with a blast or leap finisher. Your function gyro is now a blast finisher.

[WaterMud.8106]

ANet please don't get rid of the few remaining unique traits in service of giving things like Scourge or Bladesworn alacrity.

Res scourge is fun. Noone wants to sacrifice the 1 existing res bit in the game that's used to teach new players fights in service of alacrity in a sh*itty healer.

Daring Dragon is a cool trait. Idk who thinks it isn't. Immortal Dragon is a functionally useless trait. If you have to put alac there. I have literally gotten people to buy your game just on both of these unique Necro & War playstyles.

Also what's with the Dramitc discrepancies between the level of ranger buffs / reworks and something like Warrior or Guardians this patch? Kinda seems like most of their useless weapons are still useless...

 

Cal said fun is the priority. Not feeling that with this patch honestly. You can do better.

[CornFarm.9260]

I'm sorry I just got home. Does literally anyone at your studio play Warrior anymore??

Like arc divider back down to 1 weaker hit? Quickness-on-hit with burst skill?? (aka. The only thing that you know how to give warrior?) ELIMINATING Daring Dragon which is the ONLY unique variation Bladesworn has??? These were the only remaining  F U N  things my boy had. ANET ARE YOU DRUNK!?

Meanwhile War had nothing added to the cdr traits where it lost cdr, while ranger, guard and ele all got buffs to some of their traits?? & Not to mention every other class (for better or worse) gets a class REWORK.

  DO YOU JUST WANT ALL THE WARRIOR PLAYERS TO QUIT OR WHAT!?

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Please @net
Nice patch, thanks for sharing it with us but...

Revert the changes on Burning Speed + Earthen Rush on Elementalist; no one asked for it, and no one is happy with it.
Just because one of you couldn't evaluate the range at Sabetha doesn't mean you need to nerf the 2 most important placement skills of Dagger mainhand.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Zhaid Zhem.6508

[CornFarm.9260]

1 hour ago, LazloW.8194 said:

Just get rid of alacrity and quickness if keeping those boons means losing class flavor. We don't need more and more sources of this, different classes shouldn't feel the same.

 

This ^. Or find places to put them that don't dumpster unique builds. Every core class has easily 10-20 garbage tier traits. Even some of these being grandmaster. You could easily just make one the gives-boon-on-x trait and have that boon varry between whatever 3rd core or elite specialization you have equipped.

This hamstringing of elite spec MECHANICS and play styles in service of having everything be technically "viable" in a raid (where everyone is just going to take what is the best/optimal anyway) is idiotic. I'm done buying gems or and future Xpacs until you course-correct back to unique fun option for everyone. Both are possible, you just refuse to do it.

Edited June 10, 2023 by CornFarm.9260
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[Gotejjeken.1267]

23 hours ago, NuggetScout.3782 said:

So let me get this right, you guys are REMOVING traits that reduce COOLDOWNS, but ONLY applying the cooldowns to PVE skills for traps on ranger....what?? wondering if yall know what youre actually doing.

Wish it was even that sensical..they are seemingly just reducing the CD of Spike Trap only in PvE and Healing Spring in all mods (thank god). 

THE PvE trap in Frost Trap isn't getting touched in any mode, apparently neither are the others (i.e. Flame or Viper).  

Edited June 10, 2023 by Gotejjeken.1267

[CalamityCoyote.5413]

Okay So you give scourge  Alac which as stated many times NOBODY ASKED FOR!!!! Also Also we already Have Five Different class builds that can GIVE and Keep way better Alac uptime to the point scourges will never be accepted You cut the sand shade width and uptime so it can give alac which into making it the worse class to give alac these are the stupidest changes you can give a class you are completely changing the identity of Necro.

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Scourge has always been intended to be a viable support option, but the lack of quickness or alacrity has held it back in endgame content outside of specific cases.

 

This is something YOU want not the players but YOU the Devs which means stop don't do it  Scourge job is to help new players play content they never played before with minimum penalty

[SkyRight.2370]

1 hour ago, CornFarm.9260 said:

This ^. Or find places to put them that don't dumpster unique builds. Every core class has easily 10-20 garbage tier traits. Even some of these being grandmaster. You could easily just make one the gives-boon-on-x trait and have that boon varry between whatever 3rd core or elite specialization you have equipped.

This hamstringing of elite spec MECHANICS and play styles in service of having everything be technically "viable" in a raid (where everyone is just going to take what is the best/optimal anyway) is idiotic. I'm done buying gems or and future Xpacs until you course-correct back to unique fun option for everyone. Both are possible, you just refuse to do it.

 

I couldn't agree with this more. Idk y I never thought of a core "do x on class mechanic boon" that just varries by specialization... ANet have you?

| OR Failing that ^ |

Things that have no reason to go away:

Res scourge -- >> Just make the on-alacrity trait reduce outgoing res power.

Warrior -- >> For the love of God don't get rid of Daring Dragon & just put the alac literally anywhere else if you have to. Maybe just on Immortal Dragon?

Mirage Dodge -- >> Maybe give them a Grandmaster trait that lets them stunbreak but not condi-cleanse on dodge? (You know, like they originally had in PoF.) -- That way imo could still counter them & their damage would be lower cause it would compete with Infinite Horizon.

Ele Churning Earth -->> This combo + Lightning flash is COOL. Making this skill do less damage while eliminating the cool combo people were doing REMOVES FUN INTERACTIONS, it doesn't ADD it.

Ranger -->> Jfc can you tell the new balance due plays ranger!? Like I'm not opposed to other classes getting this level of attention. But MY GOD this is the level of understanding that should be applied to ALL the classes to preserve their play styles (see those above ^) not just one...

>>> Options Are Nice <<<

Edited June 10, 2023 by SkyRight.2370
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[Zok.4956]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

but the lack of quickness or alacrity has held it back in endgame content outside of specific cases

Only because you wanted a different playstyle and added  quickness and alacrity as kind of "must have 100%"  permanent power creep boons more and more to the game.

Simple solution: Remove quickness and alacrity as boons from the game and increase the baseline  as if both boons would have 100% uptime. And as soon as you don't have to "balance" both anymore, you could maybe focus better on class identities.

[Splork.9327]

Since boon rip necromancer got nuked in WvW, can you have another look at increasing the target cap of Sand Savant back to 5 in WVW. It's currently a dead trait. And you're removing Feed from Corruption, so the only choices for grandmaster is a dead trait, a support trait, and a condition trait. Your also nerfing Nefarious Favor when we take Path of Corruption, which I think it was the reason you nerf sand savant in the first place. Please I've been suffering for 3 years since you nerfed it.

[Batalix.2873]

7 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said:

Only because you wanted a different playstyle and added  quickness and alacrity as kind of "must have 100%"  permanent power creep boons more and more to the game.

Simple solution: Remove quickness and alacrity as boons from the game and increase the baseline  as if both boons would have 100% uptime. And as soon as you don't have to "balance" both anymore, you could maybe focus better on class identities.

This seems like a simple solution, but really most of the classes don't have much to do outside of DPS as it is. The EoD specs especially which are just...awful, DPS-first, everything else afterthought design. You could argue HAM, Specter, and Heal Vindi all have some support built into their design, but really all three have a history of being overbalanced for DPS, where HAM does too much passive AA DPS, Specter was Scourge 2.0 and did too much of everything well on top of DPS, and Vindi just ignored healspeccing for one-trick pogo sticking.

So while short-term thinking suggests that removing these two oppressive boons would result in more diversity, in reality it would just converge and homogenize the classes even more.

The problem is deeper than alac/quick. It's that ever since FB/Scourge/Ren overcompensating away from Chrono/Druid, ANet has only been designing especs with two metrics in mind: direct DPS, and DPS-boons. And they didn't bother to add some much needed new dimensions to combat to accommodate new especs, which is why we see so much retrodding and repetition in EoD specs: Specter just being Scourge 2.0, Catalyst being Scrapper/Tempest/Weaver 2.0, Willbender being DD 2.0, Untamed being SB/Zerker 2.0, etc. etc. You can only do so much with 10-ish boons and 10-ish conditions plus barrier, the system is spreading itself too thin.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Endaris.1452]

11 hours ago, Furball.1236 said:

But how is this a problem to the gameplay experience of the party?

Sanctuary is already the single best skill for breaking defiant foes, making any guardian a much preferable option over other classes when it comes to instanced content requiring to break huge breakbars such as Sunqua Peak CM. Sanctuary already deals more breakbar damage than Mesmer's Signet of Humility (an elite skill) while on a lower cooldown. Certainly a skill that already dominates the meta to the degree of strongly favoring certain class choices for some content does not need its baseline power increased by improving its untraited availability. It only makes it likely that even groups for other content with big breakbars will start favoring guardian over other classes.

That being said, I would not mind a cooldown split between gamemodes with sanctuary getting the lowered CD in competitive game modes but not in PvE as Sanctuary obviously has an entirely different niche in those game modes.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Endaris.1452

[Polantaris.9513]

On 6/9/2023 at 3:59 PM, CasualWanderer.5824 said:

• Bladeturn Requiem: This skill no longer blocks incoming attacks.

So if it doesnt block attacks now, could someone please explain what's the point of this skill anymore? It's garbage for pve dps since it takes cast time and is only marginally better than auto attacking (for condi), for power it's only used defensively. So what's the plan for this? Why remove block? You could have removed it in pvp only, but now it's not going to be used anywhere at all.

Seriously, this skill is basically worthless now and honestly a huge nerf to Virtuoso.

Why would I ever spend my blades on this if it's not for defensive purposes? That's the whole tradeoff, you lose your blades for defense instead of offense. At this point, the only reason you'd ever use this skill is.....never. Virtuoso is a ranged class, so having a close range self-focused AoE (that also does no damage nor side effects) is pointless.

Not sure why they even did this, the general class notes don't mention it at all.

Edit: I love how I've never posted on these forums since release, apparently, since it says this is a new account, but I've been playing on this account since before release...The only time I've ever posted on the forums in ten years is to complain about a nonsensical change. Honestly pretty funny.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Polantaris.9513

[Lily.1935]

So I decided to take a day to just look over this rather than give my opinion right away on this since there's a lot here and I wanted to keep it constructive. I'm a necromancer main for context and my main elite specialization I use the most and love the most is scourge. I was extremely excited for it when it was revealed, more so than anything else GW2 had shown off since launch to give you context. I LOVE scourge, it is my jam as an elite spec. It checks so many boxes for me.

On 6/8/2023 at 5:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Necromancer

Scourge has always been intended to be a viable support option, but the lack of quickness or alacrity has held it back in endgame content outside of specific cases. That won't be an issue anymore, as we've adjusted Desert Empowerment to be that source of alacrity. With scourge support likely becoming more viable in general use, we felt that its reviving power was just a bit too high and have made some adjustments to bring it more in line. We'll be keeping a very close eye on alacrity scourge's performance and will follow up as needed.

I am happy to see that we're looking at bringing up its support. Over the past few years rather than scourge gaining more boons they actually lost boons previously and with the changes you've made you have returned some of that and added more than they've ever had. This does increase their utility by quite a bit and I'm happy to see that. I'm also happy to see that you're going to keep a close eye on it, this is good. I suspect the changes you've made here wont work out as well as you might think but we'll get into that. There are changes mentioned in the live stream I'll mention but aren't listed here. Part of my critique will mention those changes along with some blind spots that y'all have missed.

I'm optimistic but this post will be far more critical moving forward.

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 Core

• Well of Blood: This skill now applies regeneration with every pulse.
• Ritual of Life: Reduced revive percentage from 7% to 2% in PvE only.
• Life from Death: This trait no longer revives allies and now increases outgoing healing.

• Banshee's Wail: This trait no longer increases outgoing healing.

• Transfusion: This trait now only teleports downed allies when initially activated. Reduced the revival pulse from 2% to 1% when used with the scourge elite specialization in PvE only.

I'm reordering these in my response to make it easier to respond to them because these changes are more related to each other rather than repeating myself over and over again. Necromancer doesn't have great healing output. As much as people like to say its good, its just not. Its revive output was great, but that's a bit different. Cutting this you may find that the scourge can't keep up with the demands when it comes to group healing. Which may hinder it significantly. With the nerfs to barrier we'll see later this could become an issue and I'd suggest keeping a close eye on this. This might not be too much of an issue because barrier is spread out a bit more, but I'd look into increasing their healing output in other ways.

Some Specific stuff, Is well of blood still going to pulse its healing along with regeneration? That would be quite potent, and I'd like to see that in action. I'm curious to see how that'll play out. Sand Flare might be needed for the alacrity healer but we can't know for sure until we have the numbers for alacrity.

There is also Life from death. This trait wasn't taken before because Vampiric presence was just a better option to take even if the damage it gave was extremely minor. it just didn't do enough before and perhaps you want us to rely on it a bit more for healing but outgoing healing power doesn't effect barrier application and combine that with the fact that necromancer doesn't have great outgoing healing this trait just doesn't look enticing.

Banshee's wail was also one that wasn't taken and I don't see this change helping it any. It might be prudent to try something new in blood magic to diversify its utility for builds.

Transfusion and Ritual of life change I'm fine with, given the direction we're going. Although I'd like to see Transfusion's base healing increased for allies that are not downed.

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• Quickening Thirst: This trait has been reworked. Gain life force when you strike an enemy with a dagger skill.
• Life Siphon: This skill is no longer channeled and will instead perform a single attack. Enemies struck by the initial attack will be dealt damage over time, and the user will be healed when damage is dealt.

I kinda get what you're trying to do with Quickening thirst but the issue is blood doesn't really work all that well with daggers. Even though its built into the specialization daggers themselves don't really care about this trait and MH dagger already has a lot of life force. Off Hand dagger is used by Harbinger and Condi Reaper which neither of them can afford to run blood as a secondary because the DPS hit is much too high. So it really comes down to this being a core necromancer change because none of the elite specs really care about this. I think this is the issue with blood though. Its so focused on healing that it really doesn't do anything else well and its not great and providing healing outside of reviving either. So you'd need to do a lot in order to make this an enticing option.

When talking about Life Siphon this seems like a pure numbers change and not a change made for fun. Channeling skills can be a lot of fun to use. Dagger is a pretty fun weapon to use even if its not good. This change doesn't help dagger in it being used and its technically Better but it just seems like it'll be less fun. Now that's a subjective opinion, but I'm not a fan of this change.

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•    Unholy Feast: This skill now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
•    Spiteful Spirit: This trait now removes boons instead of converting them into conditions.
•    Devouring Darkness: Increased cooldown from 10 seconds to 18 seconds in WvW only.
•    Enfeebling Blood: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.
•    Lesser Enfeeble: This skill no longer converts boons into conditions.
•    Path of Corruption: This trait now increases the cooldown of Nefarious Favor by 50% in WvW only.

Changing some of these into just boon strip is fine, but boons are too oppressive in WvW and we need more boon rip and not less. I understand its a long internal debate, and I'll state my opinion on it since y'all insist on having me play WvW to get legendary weapons.

The Devouring darkness change is extremely rough. I wouldn't change that personally unless I was going to increase the number of boons converted from 1 to 2.

The path of corruption change I'm putting here because its more of the same. I don't like or agree with these changes.

Spiteful Spirit is a trait You honestly should just replace. Its not interesting to use and it doesn't fit the flavor of it.

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• Signets of Suffering: This trait has been reworked and causes signet skills to remove boons from affected foes.
• Signet of Vampirism: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds.
• Plague Signet: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE and from 45 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the number of conditions transferred from 5 to 4 in PvP and WvW.
• Signet of Spite: Reduced cooldown from 60 seconds to 40 seconds in PvE and from 40 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the duration of cripple, blind, and weakness to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW. Adjusted the duration of bleeding, poison, and torment to 8 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Signet of the Locust: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvE only.

Returning the trait to remove boons is interesting but the issue we run into is its competing with Chill of Death which is odd. You have two traits which do similar things and while chill of death is passive with its proc I'm not a fan of them competing like this. The other signet changes are fine except for Signet of spite. its cooldown was much too long in PvE and 40 seconds is still much too long.

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Scourge

• Desert Empowerment: This trait has been moved to the grandmaster tier, replacing Feed from Corruption. The barrier from this trait will now only apply around the shade and will affect 5 targets. This trait now also grants alacrity to allies when you grant them barrier.
• Sandstorm Shroud: This skill now pulses barrier to allies near the scourge before it detonates.
• Abrasive Grit: This trait no longer causes Sand Flare to grant barrier to allies. In addition to its previous effects, this trait now grants might when you apply barrier.
• Sand Flare: This skill now grants a reduced amount of barrier to nearby allies.
• Sadistic Searing: This trait no longer reduces the cooldown of punishment skills. Increased burning duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Trail of Anguish: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvE and from 50 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Ghastly Breach: Reduced cooldown from 75Trail of Anguish seconds to 60 seconds in PvE and from 90 seconds to 72 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced duration from 4 to 3 seconds in WvW only.
• Desiccate: This skill now also grants fury to nearby allies. Increased might from 5 stacks for 8 seconds to 8 stacks for 9 seconds. Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
• Serpent Siphon: This skill has been reworked. It will now send a serpent to a target area that will detonate upon arrival. Allies in the area will gain barrier, regeneration, and aegis. Enemies will be poisoned and one of their boons will be converted into torment. Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds.

 

There's a lot to unpack here so I'll go through each of them.

• Desert Empowerment: This is a pretty big change and it really changes what skills will be taken. The problem is with the unlisted change which was mentioned in the patch notes. Currently it seams that arena net has no way to make it so Scourge can only give barrier to 5 targets so shade duration being dropped to 8 seconds is to try and clumsily balance this. The problem is it doesn't solve that issue for try hard groups. Scourge might be able to maintain 2 shades at a time, although its safer to maintain 1 which would put them at 9 targets. This means scourge can overlap with your other alacrity still to some extend. Even without that its 6 targets with sand cascade. This is all hypothetical though and we wont know for sure if its possible to maintain 2 shades after the patch. We also wont have the Barrier duration needed to maintain it on 9 targets even if we can hypothetically give it out to 9 through sand cascade. IF you're that worried about the target cap limit I'd suggest postponing this change until you can keep it at 5 targets and keeping shade duration at 20 seconds because that really hurts the scourge far more than you think.
• Sandstorm Shroud: This is an interesting change. I'd like to see it in game. I'm a bit more optimistic about this change since it seems balanced around 5 targets and not the shades. The problem is I'd like it to pulse around the shades too but until you can figure out how to make it so its target cap is at 5 no matter how many shades are active this will have to be the band-aid solution.
• Abrasive Grit: Its good to see this return to form. The removal of might was pretty sad previously and didn't make much sense so i'm happy to see it back.
• Sand Flare: Reducing the barrier it gives rather than removing it was a better idea for sure. I'd like to see its base barrier for the scourge increased back to what it was previously though because the skill was nerfed way too hard.
• Sadistic Searing: This trait just isn't good enough. It doesn't do enough for the scourge especially when punishment skills aren't really taken on DPS. And considering that you wont take this on alacrity builds because you want Sandstorm shroud, this had no home. If the speculation about Feed from corruption is correct and its a master trait now then its a choice between two do nothing traits and that's not great. There's also the issue with the scourge not wanting to use shades as often because of the 8 second duration really hurts them which means we get even less value from this trait. There's just no real reason to take this trait but there's nothing better. This needs to be more enticing to take. Maybe Torment and burning duration increase or a condition damage buff. It needs something to make us want to use it. Because right now its a feel bad trait.
• Trail of Anguish: Cooldown reduction is nice to see. This skill is solid. I don't have much to say on it.
• Ghastly Breach: 60 seconds in PvE is still too long for this skill. its competing with Plaguelands and losing even when its traited for currently. The might it gives isn't good enough so this needs either to have a lower cooldown, more boons it gives or higher damage. or all three. My preference would be a shorter cooldown. Around 30-40 seconds and maybe an extra boon like resistance.
• Desiccate: I really like this change, but I'd like to have seen a bit more. Like perhaps a stack of burning along with it. Something to push me to use this because taking time to cast this spell during combat is time I'm not using my other more powerful weapon skills which can be a problem for DPS builds. I think its okay for Support though, I just think it does need a little more to it.
• Serpent Siphon: Fantastic change. This gives us more defensive utility and its great support on any scourge build be it DPS, Alacrity DPS or healer. It wont be taken all the time but when it is taken it'll be fantastic.

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• Manifest Sand Shade: Reduced shade duration from 20 to 8 in PvE only.

This right here is devastating to the scourge. This is where all the issues people are having are coming from right now. For a quick fix to this, tie it to Desert empowerment and not have this function like this for scourge normally. In the future I'd say fix the target cap but this reduces scourge from being a 35k DPS to a sub 33k DPS possibly lower than that which throws them out of viability. Scourge should be a 37k DPS spec which means its too low in the damage department now and this pushes them even lower. Scourge isn't Guardian, even with the extra boons they don't have nearly as flexible utility slots to really take as big of advantage of this. So I'd ask that you please don't make this baseline for the scourge.

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Harbinger

•     Vile Vials: This trait no longer reduces the cooldown of elixir skills. Increased vulnerability stacks from 5 to 7.
•     Elixir of Promise: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW.
•     Elixir of Anguish: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW.
•     Elixir of Bliss: Reduced cooldown from 40 seconds to 32 seconds in PvP and WvW.
•     Elixir of Ignorance: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds.
•     Elixir of Risk: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW.
•     Elixir of Ambition: Reduced cooldown from 90 seconds to 72 seconds in PvP and WvW.

Last we have the harbinger on the list. There's an unlisted change here though which I'll go over in a minute. Overall these changes are just fine since its removing the cooldown stuff. But that doesn't make Vile Vials viable... Its still not going to be taken.

It was mentioned on the stream that septic corruption's damage was going from 1/2% damage increase per stack to 1/4% which is absolutely a terrible idea. Harbinger's damage isn't out of line even with the buff it got last time and its condition build is fairly close to condi reaper. Condi reaper isn't harder to use either, I'd say its easier to use and you're not as squishy so I can't agree with this change.

There's also the issue that these damage boosting traits on harbinger should just be a part of a minor trait and not a part of the adept traits. This along with the fact that blight needs to be generated through elixirs creates the exact same problem that y'all are trying to fix with boon supports but its worse because you aren't a support and you still have to spam elixirs off cooldown. The Adept traits really should be focused around how you generate blight so we can make the choice of if we want to take the elixirs or not.

Last thing I'll mention is Sinister shroud and Death magic. Sinister shroud needs to have its cooldown made baseline for the necromancer. It really holds the necromancer back from being able to choose different specializations because its so important. Soul reaping would still be extremely good without it, probably still required in most cased but it really needs to go. The other element to this is death magic. Death should be necromancer's second support specialization. And currently it has no means of support. But it would be nice to be able to run Death+blood+scourge as a full support rather than having to take Soul reaping on every build. Which will be the case with this patch.

 

overall the patch look okay. its just that 8 second shade duration that's really killing it for most people. Tie that to Desert Empowerment for the time being and we should be at least okay for the time being.

[Rafocale.5270]

Really should reconsider the scourge changes, especially the reduction in shade duration, managing your shades was always the most annoying and unfun part of scourge and now it's going to be even worse..The signets of suffering change is also bad IMO necro has boonstrip out the wazoo and removing a unique and fun signet trait for more boonstrip is just boring and bad. You guys also went a bit too hard on the reductions to scourges rezzing power, even if scourge actually gives some boons it still won't be competitive with the other alac supports without it's ability to mass rez. Unstable Bladestorm is fine as it is, ground targeted skills are annoying and I really enjoy that virt doesn't have many (Except greatsword 3 which shouldn't be ground targeted either). The loss of a block on bladeturn requiem seems unnecessary unless you're planning on speeding up the cast time of the skill so it's actually useful for dps otherwise it's just a dead skill. Staff mirage is already not played often and nerfing it more isn't going to help that. The weighty terms nerf will kill celebrand. At some point you guys are going to have to go back and rework all the traits that used to reduce cooldowns cuz the majority of them are borderline useless now that they've lost their cd reductions. Also maybe go through and round most/all cooldowns to a multiple of 5 or 2 for the sake of having nice clean numbers.

[BumboJumbo.1308]

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Edited June 16, 2023 by BumboJumbo.1308

[Bunny.9834]

RIP Scourge. 

 

[Bluberi Len.8342]

On 6/9/2023 at 4:12 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

not be required to activate a particular utility type on cooldown to provide quickness or alacrity.

On 6/9/2023 at 4:12 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Removing additional skill-type-specific recharge-reduction traits and rolling the reduction into baseline skills where it makes sense to do so. The goal of these changes is to give players more flexibility in trait selection

I don't play any other professions, so I can't speak much outside of ranger. Anyway, here we go.

Despite the quote above, interestingly there's no mention of "We Heal as One" or "Strength of the Pack" (both are reduced cooldown by a trait in Beastmastery as of now). Not sure I'm a fan of the spirit changes, but idk the duration of the boon or how the new spirits work, same with Celestial Avatar. I'd rather the spirits not fully disappear and work like Revenant's tablet instead, or completely attached to the ranger. There's much that hinges on the cooldown and the boon duration, so I won't be thinking too much about it (for now)

Also, can "Perilous Gift" stop having a cooldown the size of a small moon for what it's doing? It's ok for the damage reduction, but I'm not sure I'm ok with the actual healing. I've been using "Fervent Force" mainly for this. And yes I only play open world/fractal, don't care for much else.

[AlPower.2476]

WTF this is even worst than I thougtht at the start; Anet is really nerfing Toolkit in PvP and WvW??? Seriously? Why? ._. I thought that CD change in trait and skills was a global change, but im reading that's PVE ONLY???

CmC, why? what is ur logic behind this change?? ._. you're now killing toolkit in PvP, with any kitten sense....

 

For the love of god, stop with ur "I throw a bad balance and senseless patch and then I keep quiet the next 6 months and I don't care what players have to say" please, this is being so kitten sad.

Edited June 10, 2023 by AlPower.2476

[miles.5961]

Perhaps consider adding whirl (as well as projectile so rifle gets to join in on the fun too) in addition to leap and blast to proc boons as Scrapper? That way I'm not forced to use hammer 3 just to upkeep my boons and I get to mostly keep my original qdps scrapper rotation and shredder gyro. Fudge with the boon duration if you have to.

[Mukluk.9082]

I'll stick to commenting on the classes I'm most proficient with.

The 20% cd trait removals.  So far I keep seeing these traits getting removed, but NOT getting entirely baked into their classes.
Examples: When the ranger 20% reduced cd on survival skills trait was removed you did not reduce the cd on sharpening stone.
In regards to the upcoming removal of the 20% reduced cd to traps trait, you said you would be changing the cd's of healing spring and spike trap, but NOT the other THREE TRAPS? (flame, snake, frost)

Engineer:
Mechanical Genius:  I fear this new limitation on the mechanist where they have to stand ultra close to their mech or the mech will get very long cd's on their skills is going to be implemented the same way ranger signet of renewal is. That signet punishes you HEAVILY if you are not in range of the pet when you use it, BUT it has NO INDICATOR when you are not in range of the pet. So you use it and it fails and goes on cooldown and nothing happens.  Mechanists should not feel like they are in a 3 legged race with their mech. They should be allowed to step away from time to time.  

Druid:
You said you wanted to not make us spam spirits to provide alacrity (awesome!) however, with these changes we will have to spam astral form skills to provide alacrity (and other boons), meaning we will not be able to save astral form for clutch revives (glyph of the stars) or huge healing on demand. "Sorry I couldn't save you, I gave you alac recently".
Sad to see ancient seeds go, I feel like that was a class defining feature, but I understand it may have been not fun to play against.  Natural stride being replaced with a 10% buff for 5 seconds is extremely underwhelming, and would rather not lose stride in trade for that.
Without full information on how the new spirits slam/shake interactions work I'm not sure what is going on there, but with the possible removal of the way stone spirit worked before you may unintentionally remove druids ability to provide protection to their party. If you don't intend to do that, please keep this in mind.

Necro:
I have pulled over countless players from other MMO's to play GW2 by simply describing support scourge. It is a playstyle that simply does NOT EXIST in most mmo's and is one of the many things that makes gw2 unique.  If you feel you have to destroy that playstyle in order to give the necros alacrity, then please just dont give them alacrity.  

I really like the way you implemented quickness on berserker (attached to the burst skill they spam anyway) and alacrity on bladesworn (attached to the dragonslash they spam anyway). This isn't much more difficult than mechanist or harbinger boon uptime which is extremely simple. 
By contrast the necro having to give up SO MUCH to get alacrity, and druid having to burn their big heal form to give it is starkly different.  

Similarly, boon corruption on necros was a class defining feature, you don't need to take so much of that away. It was fine.
 

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

On 6/8/2023 at 5:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Confusion damage has been adjusted as follows in PvE only:

• Damage over time: Increased the base damage from 11 to 18.25. Increased condition damage scaling from 0.03 to 0.05.
• Damage on skill activation: Reduced base damage from 49.5 to 16.34. Reduced condition damage scaling from 0.0975 to 0.0325.

... Why? Do we really want every single condi to function exactly the same way?

[clockworkcuttlefish.3254]

I've mained Herald since I started playing this game, just started playing it in actual raids, and now you're going to kill it again. Are you for real???????????? These changes are super trash. I'm so tired of every profession I play and enjoy getting trashed by garbage changes.

Honestly just get rid of every profession except Mechanist, because that seems like what you want. Do the people who decide on these changes even play the classes they're "adjusting?" I'd rather you go back to pretending that Revenant doesn't exist.

[Zephire.8049]

I won't speak about classes I don't know as much detail about but the scrapper changes do nothing but make it more painful to play (literally in some cases). This is not introducing an alternative play style (which could have been achieved by adding leap and blast finishers as a source for quickness on top of from gyros), this is taking one play style out back and replacing it with a drastically different one and then saying it's the same thing.

If people enjoy gyro scrapper, they may not enjoy turret/grenade spam/hammer scrapper, especially if they have to use Function Gyro off cooldown to cover quickness. Function Gyro should be for revives/stomps and as an emergency measure, not something you put in your rotation.

The elixir cooldown reductions are nice! But quick scrapper being killed off means it's rather moot, especially as players will still have to fill their bar with other skills and can't bring elixirs even if they wanted to. Not if they want to provide quickness, anyway.

This doesn't even get into how scrapper leap animations lock you in and you can end up flinging yourself into death because there's no way to cancel it and sometimes the game decides to send you through your target rather than stop you at their hitbox. It also completely changes up how many buttons you need to press as you'll need to place your own fields and then use a finisher, likely swapping between kits and your weapon. I can't speak for others but I enjoy a LI version of heal quick scrapper because it's less button presses and I can focus on healing and people's health. This guts that playstyle, forces scrappers to ignore their profession mechanic (gyros), and kills heal quick scrapper.

Adding quickness to finishers on top of gyros could have opened up non-gyro builds, instead you killed off gyros to force people into a different style completely. Nothing changes except different skills are brought and more buttons mashed. Oh and heal quick scrapper will be DoA.