Why Ranger and Warrior are jokes

[Eddie.9143]

The only people who think this build is okay are the ones currently being carried by it. Have you noticed Poe hasn't been playing since cata got nerfed? Wonder why 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

32 minutes ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

so when rangers not in the cross hairs what class all u whiny babies gonna chose next as the now magically super overpowered class/build? Lmao

It'll definitely be warriors.

[Eddie.9143]

6 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

It'll definitely be warriors.

Condi zerker and bladesworn are 10000% next on the chopping block after birds ranger 

[aymnad.9023]

1 hour ago, Eddie.9143 said:

The only people who think this build is okay are the ones currently being carried by it. Have you noticed Poe hasn't been playing since cata got nerfed? Wonder why 

I already talked about what I think should be nerfed for slb (edit : pig maul dmg + prelude lash animation) but I could add a change sword 3 which I think should have less dmg (at least 33%) but a shorter cd as it is meant to be utility instead of dmg. Now for this video if you are full glass and turn your back (no vision) to a full glass (sicem) without any defensive cd left (block or stunbreak) you will die to any combo and in a shorter time(even those with less than 1min cd).

Edit : for the bladesworn there were multiple dodges for nothing. The perma reflect should not be a thing. I think the playstyle with multiple heals combined with cc + dmg + unblockable all in one is also not fun but I am not sure how to change that without reworking it

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023

[bethekey.8314]

9 hours ago, Downstate.4697 said:

To be fair, wtf is your build?

Did you ever feel the burst of Rocket Turret The Slow? I thought not. It’s not a story the Meta would tell you. It’s an Engi legend.

9 hours ago, Zizekent.2398 said:

For warrior: Unlike most of projectiles hate in this game, just do a melee or AoE hit "to counter" warrior's Aegis.

Willingly going into melee, where Warrior almost always wins, to clear a 3 sec (?) fairly common boon of theirs, is NOT how you win lol.

9 hours ago, XxsdgxX.8109 said:

Right, I forgot you receive a passive 20% damage reduction and an additional dodge when you don't run the same setup as the OP.

People will always find ways to distract themselves from the point, lol.

5 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

WHY did you randomly dodge twice in a row as if you're a silver 1 player... and you did that WHILE blind-siding yourself with your own camera. That's how you royally ate that BS's Dragon Slash.

There's ways to counter BS War but you did everything incorrectly.... that's why everyone's confused with your video.

Not claiming to do everything well all the time, and neither should you expect it lol. Definitely could have dodged better. Most players are bad, and builds that only consistently killed bad players have been nerfed hard in the past (for Engi, FT scrapper and Rifle Mech).

So, regardless of my actions: Soulbeast has 1 attack that does 20k+ damage and is fairly unavoidable / Bladesworn has very little vulnerable openings and very high damage for its tankiness/sustain. And I've seen both builds farm top players.

[Eddie.9143]

4 minutes ago, aymnad.9023 said:

I already talked about what I think should be nerfed for slb but I could add a change sword 3 which I think should have less dmg but a shorter cd (as it is meant to be utility instead of dmg). Now for this video if you are full glass and turn your back (no vision) to a full glass (sicem) without any defensive cd left (block or stunbreak) you will die to any combo and in a shorter time(even those with less than 1min cd).

there's not enough defensives on most classes, the smoke assault forces you to dodge twice, especially if the birds are hitting at the same time, and the immobs and cc force you to use stun breaks, then they stealth or run/reset and you have nothing for the next round of bursts. especially if they're abusing terrain.

[aymnad.9023]

3 minutes ago, Eddie.9143 said:

there's not enough defensives on most classes, the smoke assault forces you to dodge twice, especially if the birds are hitting at the same time, and the immobs and cc force you to use stun breaks, then they stealth or run/reset and you have nothing for the next round of bursts. especially if they're abusing terrain.

which professions or builds are you thinking about? The meta build all have decent defense and a lot of good builds (like vindi / spellbreaker) have multiple ways to negate it.

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023

[Stand The Wall.6987]

3 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

You're talking oooold boonbeast stuff.

Fresh reinforcements hasn't been practical to use for a long time now.

None of this might stacking stuff was good until they did these recent changes which made it worth it. Trying to might stack on it in say the past 2 years with the way traits/skills used to be, was too much of a sacrifice from certain abilities you 100% needed mandatory for survival, and it wasn't strong enough might stacking to make up for the sacrifice in survival utilities.

even without fresh reinforcement its fairly easy to stack might since multiple weapons and trait lines have might gain. if we're talking about ranked then meta builds are far from mandatory for ppl with experience playing the game. as for ppl who don't care about using a glassier build, do you really think cheap one shot combos are good for the game if the player doesn't have to sacrifice too much?

[Kuma.1503]

13 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Pig ranger and Berserker as honorable mentions of course.

Hunter's call + One Wolf Pack + Sic Em dealing 20k+ fairly unavoidable damage.

Bladesworn with high health, high mobility, highest sustain, near projectile immunity, cc immunity, 20+ might, 8k+ ranged AoE stuns etc.

Why are these classes baby mode?

 

Y'know... I was gonna come in like "This ranger build stacks a lot of might and vuln. You can expect a lot of damage-- yada yada"

But I've watched that about 10 times and the only vuln you had came from the skill that one shot you. The ranger one shot you with 0 stacks of might and a portin of a skill (it was partially mitigated with a dodge + healing). You either need 2 dodges saved up, or a block/invuln to survive this on any glass build because of how long the birds linger for. And this ranger build certainly has the tools to bait these cooldowns out of you. 

Going off of their previous balancing standards (rifle mech for example) this is definitely on the chopping block. Any build that nets kills this easily doesn't stick around for long. Whether they only work in low ranks or not.

I bring up rifle mech because it had at the at least 5 major weaknesses (CC, condis, being focused, LoS, reflects) and that didn't stop the gutting from happening. This has fewer weaknesses (birds ignore reflects and latch on after you leave LoS) and aparently DOES work at higher ranks.

 

- - - - - - - - -

As for the Warrior build. I don't know enough about it to judge, but Warriors have always countered any engi not abusing blinds and 180 casted nades because we simply do not win in melee range. Period. We don't have the stab, stunbreaks, sustain, or tankiness to survive against them. Even Scrapper, what should be our bruiser spec, gets memed in melee range.  Now if they un-gutted kinetic accelerators and impact savant, that might be a different story. 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

5 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Those Soulbeast builds don't use unblockables my dude.

Rangers don't have unblockable attacks unless they bring Sig Of Hunt which isn't worth using for several reasons.

Cata on the other hand actually does have unblockable attacks like Gale, that are naturally unblockable without needing traits or utility skills tied in.

 

Bladesworn has the dumb unblockables

[aymnad.9023]

18 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Any build that nets kills this easily doesn't stick around for long. . 

Kind of ironic when you look at the setup he is running which is clearly meant to os 🙂 

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023

[Kuma.1503]

8 minutes ago, aymnad.9023 said:

Kind of ironic when you look at the setup he is running which is clearly meant to os 🙂 

He's playing what I like to call "We have thief at home".

I played something similar on core prior to the rifle nerfs. 9 times out of 10. Your "one shots" come from targeting someone who's burned through all of their stab/stunbreaks and comboing them with rifle, rocket turret stuns, and pry bar. 1 time out of 10 you get runny rocket crits for 10k. The projectile takes 3 centuries to land, but it's funny when it does. 

It worked better before rifle nerfs because that gave you some pressure inbetween your bursts to soften up your target or bait out some cooldowns. The rifle autoattack now is laughably weak. 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[bethekey.8314]

11 minutes ago, aymnad.9023 said:

Kind of ironic when you look at the setup he is running which is clearly meant to os 🙂 

My "one shot" hits for 8-10k (not 20k), is aimed, and would take 5 seconds to hit (well, miss) at the range the ranger did 😞 I'd relate it more to the "highly telegraphed, melee only, requires a stun to land" burst that Warriors have justified since the dawn of time.

4 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

He's playing what I like to call "We have thief at home". 

Or unsuspecting "Ele-be-gone". Only Engi build I felt joy playing during the dark times.

[Mini Crinny.6190]

Once ranger gets nerfed, it will be good for the game and bring a lot more players back to the PvP scene

[Kuma.1503]

Just now, Mini Crinny.6190 said:

Once ranger gets nerfed, it will be good for the game and bring a lot more players back to the PvP scene

I wish my friend. I wish. 

People say this every time an OP build becomes FoTM. They were saying it just last week with Catalyst. I reckon they'll say the same thing about Warrior once ranger gets nerfed. After that, it's a toss up on whether people realize how good Specter is right now, or if they start saying it about Deadeye / One shot Chrono w/ stealth and double Moa. 

This roller coaster never ends I'm afraid. 

[aymnad.9023]

1 hour ago, bethekey.8314 said:

My "one shot" hits for 8-10k (not 20k), is aimed, and would take 5 seconds to hit (well, miss) at the range the ranger did 😞 I'd relate it more to the "highly telegraphed, melee only, requires a stun to land" burst that Warriors have justified since the dawn of time.

Or unsuspecting "Ele-be-gone". Only Engi build I felt joy playing during the dark times.

What I meant to say is is that there are things to nerf on the side of slb but they are not the os highlighted in your video despite what @Kuma.1503 said.

On one side (slb) you have a combo giving 4s to react (based on 2 utilities) every 60s or one with 50% less damage (giving more time to react) every 30s .

On the other (your build) we have a os combo giving less than 1s to react every 75s or giving 1.5-5s to react every 25s or less. 

Both can work in the game. In fact wh has existed for a long time and was so gimmicky that you would not use it unless you were facing a full anti projectile team and wanted to play sicem. 

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023
edited to add explanation

[Flowki.7194]

We starting to feel the game wide consequences of nerfing an entire class that had a high skill floor and effectiveness I see?... reap what you sow.

Edited July 29, 2023 by Flowki.7194

[Kuma.1503]

30 minutes ago, aymnad.9023 said:

What I meant to say is is that there are things to nerf for slb but they are not highlighted in your video despite what @Kuma.1503 said.

On one side you have a combo giving 4s to react and is based on 2 utilities every 60s cd or does maybe 50% less damage every 30s.

On the other whe have a os combo giving less than 1s to react every 75s or giving 2s to react every 25s or less. 

I think the key difference is that one build relies on that one combo to get their kills and hits like a wet noodle any time it's on CD. Has very little in the way of might stacking. 

The other build has 3 other backup combos to fall back on and sword skills that crit for 5-7k each. Is able to  might stack like crazy so miscellaneous skills will still hit hard outside of their bursts. 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[ArthurDent.9538]

11 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

We starting to feel the game wide consequences of nerfing an entire class that had a high skill floor and effectiveness I see?... reap what you sow.

Nah, these builds are far less kittenous than cata was and you will find few people who disagree.

[aymnad.9023]

11 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

I think the key difference is that one build relies on that one combo to get their kills and hits like a wet noodle any time it's on CD. Has very little in the way of might stacking. 

The other build has 3 other backup combos to fall back on and sword skills that crit for 5-7k each. Is able to  might stack like crazy so miscellaneous skills will still hit hard outside of their bursts. 

 

 

I can understand that and would not have a problem if might generation, sword and another combo are getting hit.  I only wanted to point out the 1 burst shown in the video because it is super specific.

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023

[Sandzibar.5134]

11 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

We starting to feel the game wide consequences of nerfing an entire class that had a high skill floor and effectiveness I see?... reap what you sow.

I guess r55 and the frenchies were STILL using cata and tempest after your WORLD ENDING NERFS in their MAT comps by accident.... maybe they randomly picked out of a hat or something..

 

[bethekey.8314]

38 minutes ago, aymnad.9023 said:

On one side (slb) you have a combo giving 4s to react (based on 2 utilities) every 60s or one with 50% less damage (giving more time to react) every 30s .

On the other (your build) we have a os combo giving less than 1s to react every 75s or giving 5s to react every 25s or less. 

This is a losing comparison lol. In damage alone, they are not at all equivalent.

Single attacks, let alone auto-aimed, ranged ones that persist through LoS, should not do 20k+ damage. Under any circumstances. That's a line crossed. Hard nerfs.

Edit: Note the Ranger hitting a 9.5k maul after the burst too. That's more equivalent to Rocket burst, and the Ranger has both lol.

Edited July 29, 2023 by bethekey.8314

[aymnad.9023]

53 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

This is a losing comparison lol. In damage alone, they are not at all equivalent. Using the utilities to artificially increase the time you have to react? Cmon man 😛

Single attacks, let alone auto-aimed, ranged ones that persist through LoS, should not do 20k+ damage. Under any circumstances. That's a line crossed. Hard nerfs.

Edit: Note the Ranger hitting a 9.5k maul after the burst too. That's more equivalent to Rocket burst, and the Ranger has both lol.

We probably both played enought pvp to know this is true 🙂. For slb with / without owp / sicem there is more / less dps meaning the time to adapt to wh changes a lot. For your build with / without stealth means more or less time to react to rocket (which does more dmg than maul). 

Edited July 29, 2023 by aymnad.9023

[Myror.7521]

@Waffles.5632 Mine was also a old meme that you See often in warr Forum xD

[Flowki.7194]

1 hour ago, ArthurDent.9538 said:

Nah, these builds are far less kittenous than cata was and you will find few people who disagree.

You need to re-read what I said, as I didn't mention anything about that statement.

 

1 hour ago, Sandzibar.5134 said:

I guess r55 and the frenchies were STILL using cata and tempest after your WORLD ENDING NERFS in their MAT comps by accident.... maybe they randomly picked out of a hat or something..

 

 

And? I play ranked, and never see any power catas at all, and only a condi cata every 10 games if that. The avg level playerase is full of warriors, necros and now soulbeasts, and there are more core gaurds than tempests. Its not just becuase of the current 3v3 shoe box maps either, they are all over unranked aswell. You don't even know how bad the scepter nerf was to many ele specs that were not even meta.. but made RNG matchmaking ranked tolerable to play. Staff tempest as a solo que, no thanks.