More “paths” to legendary gear...

[Ohoni.6057]

@Sarrs.4831 said:Different skins? Fine. Good, even.Same skins? No. Envoy armor is for HoT raids.

But how would you make happy a player that liked the look of Envoy armor and wanted some for himself, but did not enjoy raiding? I'll speed up the process by eliminating the obvious wrong answers,

NO, you could not make him happy by "having him raid anyway," since he does not enjoy raiding, and therefore would not enjoy that experience.NO, you could not make him happy by "he never gets the armor," because in that case, he would never get the armor.

So how would you go about making that player happy, if not by having an alternate method of acquiring the Envoy skin?

Speaking purely for myself, I couldn't care less about having Legendary armor, but I do want a few Envoy skins.

[Seera.5916]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Sarrs.4831 said:Different skins? Fine. Good, even.Same skins? No. Envoy armor is for HoT raids.

But how would you make happy a player that liked the look of Envoy armor and wanted some for himself, but did not enjoy raiding? I'll speed up the process by eliminating the obvious wrong answers,

NO, you could not make him happy by "having him raid anyway," since he does not enjoy raiding, and therefore would not enjoy that experience.NO, you could not make him happy by "he never gets the armor," because in that case, he would never get the armor.

So how would you go about making that player happy, if not by having an alternate method of acquiring the Envoy skin?

Speaking purely for myself, I couldn't care less about having Legendary armor, but I do want a few Envoy skins.

But how do you make the player who wants something easily visible to tell players that he's experienced raids and put equity into it ("sweat" equity or gold equity) and got through it happy?

You can't make everyone happy 100% of the time. Your option will not make everyone happy.

I think more are happy with the current situation than would be happy with your solution. Most people have a desire to show off their accomplishments.

[STIHL.2489]

@Seera.5916 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Seera.5916 said:

@Rysdude.3824 said:

@Seera.5916 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:Open world PvE as it stands right now is not set up to make legendary armor even possible to obtain. There's nothing about open world PvE that shows skill or dedication.

Who cares? I've been playing GW2 since launch, if that's not "dedication" then I don't know what is.

So if they give open world it's own legendary armor, it should be like the same as ascended: no special effects or aura's. Plain Jane, you wouldn't know it was legendary just by looking at it unless you knew what the skin looked like. IE: you get just the functionality of legendary armor.

Why? Why are people not allowed to have nice things unless they also enjoy raiding?

But each mode should have it's own unique skin and the WvW ones should be given their own skins and not just C&P from the ascended version.

What is the point of that? What if the mode you enjoy playing does not offer the skin that you think looks best, and what if the skin you like best doesn't come from a mode you want to play? That seems like a set-up for plenty of lose/lose propositions. What we want are win/win propositions, where you can always get the skin you want by playing in a mode you enjoy.

There should be rewards in games that showcase skill and dedication towards different aspects of the game. That are unique to that game mode. So that when you see them with it you know they are good at that game mode. Not have to ask them or wonder what part of the game they played to get that.

You can't give every skin and every reward out to every aspect in the game that people like to do. Otherwise, every drop will be so low in chances of dropping that they might as well have the current drop rate of precursors for the gen 1 legendaries. You can't have anything be map specific because someone may not like to play in that map. But if things aren't map specific then people will go to the easiest maps to do it in, which are the starter maps. Which means new players will find it even harder to get experience because the experienced players are all there trying to get the drop they want. Because people have to farm for hours and hours and hours and hours even on the starter maps to get the skin they want, they end up selling everything they don't want or get duplicates of, taking down the GW2 economy with it because supply skyrocketed but demand remained the same.

Because under your thought, where would it stop? Put it only on world bosses and people say "I don't like to do world bosses." So they put it in level 80 maps. People then say "I don't like to play those maps." So they put them in all maps on champions. Players go "I don't like fighting champions, it's either zerg fest and too easy or too hard because I can't solo and I'm never on when others are there."

If you read what I said, there's nothing that shows dedication or skill in open world PvE. You can't use account creation date, because players can take breaks. You can't use age of characters because people can stand around and chat in LA all day and from what I've read, we both think those players who just stand around in LA and chat all day should not get handed legendary weapons or armor.

Which is why any legendary set for open world PvE as it is today should be just the functionality and not the cool special skin. Legendary weapons do require you to venture out into the areas of the game that have measurable ways to show dedication and skill.

And I'm one of those who believes the generation 1 legendary weapons should not have been sellable on the TP. Precursors, yes. Legendary weapons, no.

While I admire the logic, selling raids takes away from it unfortunately (IMO). So you can have Raid legendary armor by wallet and completely taking away the skill and dedication awe.

It does take away the prestige. But until such time as ANet makes generation 1 legendary weapons untradeable, there should be a legendary armor that can bought.

And if they add new legendary armors in addition to the current set, I hope they can put in some system that makes it prohibitively hard to buy raid runs for those new armors - if they even require raids.

Meh by that logic, there is no reason to put the armor behind the raid to start with.

Yes there is. Raids given their difficulty, deserve a fitting reward. An exclusive skin is quite fitting for raids. And highest difficulty content should give the highest rarity items as rewards. Hence the rarity level of Legendary.

And you can get legendary armor without raiding, it just won't have the same skin.

And no, I'm not saying that legendary armor shouldn't be added to other aspects of the game. Just that it's quite deserving to have a set that is designed to be earned by those who raid.

Skins.. Titles... sure..

This whole legendary thing is trash, and just leads people to buy raids, which is no different then buying them off the TP, which means, it's not good for the game or the game mode.

[Tenrai Senshi.2017]

@Sarrs.4831 said:Different skins? Fine. Good, even.Same skins? No. Envoy armor is for HoT raids.

In all honesty, I wouldn't mind this at all, because I really don't like the design of the legendary Envoy armor. XD

[Seera.5916]

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Seera.5916 said:

@STIHL.2489 said:

@Seera.5916 said:

@Rysdude.3824 said:

@Seera.5916 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:Open world PvE as it stands right now is not set up to make legendary armor even possible to obtain. There's nothing about open world PvE that shows skill or dedication.

Who cares? I've been playing GW2 since launch, if that's not "dedication" then I don't know what is.

So if they give open world it's own legendary armor, it should be like the same as ascended: no special effects or aura's. Plain Jane, you wouldn't know it was legendary just by looking at it unless you knew what the skin looked like. IE: you get just the functionality of legendary armor.

Why? Why are people not allowed to have nice things unless they also enjoy raiding?

But each mode should have it's own unique skin and the WvW ones should be given their own skins and not just C&P from the ascended version.

What is the point of that? What if the mode you enjoy playing does not offer the skin that you think looks best, and what if the skin you like best doesn't come from a mode you want to play? That seems like a set-up for plenty of lose/lose propositions. What we want are win/win propositions, where you can always get the skin you want by playing in a mode you enjoy.

There should be rewards in games that showcase skill and dedication towards different aspects of the game. That are unique to that game mode. So that when you see them with it you know they are good at that game mode. Not have to ask them or wonder what part of the game they played to get that.

You can't give every skin and every reward out to every aspect in the game that people like to do. Otherwise, every drop will be so low in chances of dropping that they might as well have the current drop rate of precursors for the gen 1 legendaries. You can't have anything be map specific because someone may not like to play in that map. But if things aren't map specific then people will go to the easiest maps to do it in, which are the starter maps. Which means new players will find it even harder to get experience because the experienced players are all there trying to get the drop they want. Because people have to farm for hours and hours and hours and hours even on the starter maps to get the skin they want, they end up selling everything they don't want or get duplicates of, taking down the GW2 economy with it because supply skyrocketed but demand remained the same.

Because under your thought, where would it stop? Put it only on world bosses and people say "I don't like to do world bosses." So they put it in level 80 maps. People then say "I don't like to play those maps." So they put them in all maps on champions. Players go "I don't like fighting champions, it's either zerg fest and too easy or too hard because I can't solo and I'm never on when others are there."

If you read what I said, there's nothing that shows dedication or skill in open world PvE. You can't use account creation date, because players can take breaks. You can't use age of characters because people can stand around and chat in LA all day and from what I've read, we both think those players who just stand around in LA and chat all day should not get handed legendary weapons or armor.

Which is why any legendary set for open world PvE as it is today should be just the functionality and not the cool special skin. Legendary weapons do require you to venture out into the areas of the game that have measurable ways to show dedication and skill.

And I'm one of those who believes the generation 1 legendary weapons should not have been sellable on the TP. Precursors, yes. Legendary weapons, no.

While I admire the logic, selling raids takes away from it unfortunately (IMO). So you can have Raid legendary armor by wallet and completely taking away the skill and dedication awe.

It does take away the prestige. But until such time as ANet makes generation 1 legendary weapons untradeable, there should be a legendary armor that can bought.

And if they add new legendary armors in addition to the current set, I hope they can put in some system that makes it prohibitively hard to buy raid runs for those new armors - if they even require raids.

Meh by that logic, there is no reason to put the armor behind the raid to start with.

Yes there is. Raids given their difficulty, deserve a fitting reward. An exclusive skin is quite fitting for raids. And highest difficulty content should give the highest rarity items as rewards. Hence the rarity level of Legendary.

And you can get legendary armor without raiding, it just won't have the same skin.

And no, I'm not saying that legendary armor shouldn't be added to other aspects of the game. Just that it's quite deserving to have a set that is designed to be earned by those who raid.

Skins.. Titles... sure..

This whole legendary thing is trash, and just leads people to buy raids, which is no different then buying them off the TP, which means, it's not good for the game or the game mode.

I've got no problem with them adding more ways to get legendary armor. The effort just has to match the rarity. And I'm talking relative to the gen 2 legendary weapons, the ones you can't buy.

I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Seera.5916 said:But how do you make the player who wants something easily visible to tell players that he's experienced raids and put equity into it ("sweat" equity or gold equity) and got through it happy?

I've offered several suggestions. They could have little trophies that float over your shoulders if one at a time isn't enough, that should be plenty for people showing off in Lion's Arch or wherever it is people go to pretend that other people are impressed with them.

You can't make everyone happy 100% of the time. Your option will not make everyone happy.

That may be true, but considering how relatively few people raid, and how at least some of those people are unlikely to care as much as you seem to about gauging virtual cod-pieces, "if you can't please everyone," then it stands to reason that those raiders are the one that you'd have to end up not pleasing. I'd like to find a compromise in which everyone gets at least something close to what they're looking for.

I think more are happy with the current situation than would be happy with your solution. Most people have a desire to show off their accomplishments.

I don't believe that's true, but even if it were true, most people do not have envoy armor, or a feasible path to earn it in the future, so even if most people did have a desire to show off, they would not be served by the status quo. I think it's fairly difficult to argue that there are more people who have or will have envoy armor than those that don't but would want it, so you might not want to be making some egalitarian "the interest of the many over the few" argument here.

@Tenrai Senshi.2017 said:

@Sarrs.4831 said:Different skins? Fine. Good, even.Same skins? No. Envoy armor is for HoT raids.

In all honesty, I wouldn't mind this at all, because I really don't like the design of the legendary Envoy armor. XD

And that's the problem with the system, skins are not fungible, some care about them very little, some care about them very much, and those who do and don't in no way correlate to the current means of acquiring them. The goal should be a system in which at least most of those who would like the armor have a fun and engaging way of doing so. Those who don't care, can continue not caring.

I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

[Tenrai Senshi.2017]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

Yeah, to be honest, as Miellyn said, there are already a lot of skins in the game separated by game mode. Fractal weapons and legendary back item in fractals, unique legendary backs in PvP and WvW. Unique Raid skins. Unique Dungeon skins. Skins from PoF or HoTS maps or achievements, and even skins that are acquired in the open world or on new Living Story maps.

And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good. But to make every skin available everywhere would eliminate the reward-based satisfaction of completing some types of content. I personally like that certain types of rewards are themed around the content from which they are attained, but in the same breath, I'd also say specific tiers of gear should not be locked away only behind selective types of content. So adding legendary armor to Fractals that have a unique fractal themed appearance in my opinion would be awesome, but then I'd just as happily say that adding a new Raid unique legendary back item for Raiders would also be cool.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just require two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just

require

two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

This is a perfectly acceptable solution for the majority of the players. You are not the majority. You should have noticed it by now after this thread and the easy mode raiding discussions.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just

require

two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

This is a perfectly acceptable solution for the majority of the players. You are not the majority. You should have noticed it by now after this thread and the easy mode raiding discussions.

My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

[Shining One.1635]

I miss the old Guild Wars 1 approach to gear. Best-in-slot gear was very easy to attain from multiple sources. Of course, you still had the prestige items that required some effort. The only differences were the skins.

I think there should be more paths to legendary functionality, but the various modes should have their own skins/effects.

[Loosmaster.8263]

@Shining One.1635 said:I miss the old Guild Wars 1 approach to gear. Best-in-slot gear was very easy to attain from multiple sources. Of course, you still had the prestige items that required some effort. The only differences were the skins.

I think there should be more paths to legendary functionality, but the various modes should have their own skins/effects.

That's the problem. Functionality is not what this is about. They want the skins that are locked behind certain content.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just

require

two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

This is a perfectly acceptable solution for the majority of the players. You are not the majority. You should have noticed it by now after this thread and the easy mode raiding discussions.

My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has zero correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just

require

two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

This is a perfectly acceptable solution for the majority of the players. You are not the majority. You should have noticed it by now after this thread and the easy mode raiding discussions.

My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

This may be caused by the fact that this forum doesn't have a downvote function at all.You got downvoted into oblivion when you stated that opinion on reddit.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is opposed to their own self-interest in this matter.

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

You could actually bring some proof that you are arguing for the marjority. You never brought it in any discussion you participated. You just threw those things around while the discussions and reddit actually indicate that you are the minority.The point people disagree with you is actually not legendary armor in open world but envoy skins in open world. Those are raid only and will stay raid only. The implementation of PvP and WvW armor just cemented this.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

It’s on you to present actual evidence rather than comment about the lack of downvotes on your posts when those were disabled months ago.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

You could actually bring some proof that you are arguing for the marjority. You never brought it in any discussion you participated. You just threw those things around while the discussions and reddit actually indicate that you are the minority.The point people disagree with you is actually not legendary armor in open world but envoy skins in open world. Those are raid only and will stay raid only. The implementation of PvP and WvW armor just cemented this.

And you've never brought any proof that you represent the majority. Since my proposal would benefit the majority, the burden of proof would be on you to establish that they would choose to work against their own self-interests.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

You could actually bring some proof that you are arguing for the marjority. You never brought it in any discussion you participated. You just threw those things around while the discussions and reddit actually indicate that you are the minority.The point people disagree with you is actually not legendary armor in open world but envoy skins in open world. Those are raid only and will stay raid only. The implementation of PvP and WvW armor just cemented this.

And you've never brought any proof that you represent the majority. Since my proposal would

benefit

the majority, the burden of proof would be on you to establish that they would choose to work against their own self-interests.

Burden of proof is on you since you’re the one making the claim.

[STIHL.2489]

I fine with the raid having special skins, that is a hallmark of GW2, to have modes with their own special unique skin.

Equally so, WvW legendary armor should also have it's own unique skin, just like sPvP should, and if they put it in, Openworld should also have it's own skin.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

You could actually bring some proof that you are arguing for the marjority. You never brought it in any discussion you participated. You just threw those things around while the discussions and reddit actually indicate that you are the minority.The point people disagree with you is actually not legendary armor in open world but envoy skins in open world. Those are raid only and will stay raid only. The implementation of PvP and WvW armor just cemented this.

And you've never brought any proof that you represent the majority. Since my proposal would

benefit

the majority, the burden of proof would be on you to establish that they would choose to work against their own self-interests.

Burden of proof is on you since you’re the one making the claim.

I only claim to be representing the interests of the majority, which I am. I don't claim that they necessarily agree with me, but again, to claim otherwise would be an extraordinary claim, and therefore require extraordinary proof.

Why do you believe that the majority would act against their own interest in this?

@STIHL.2489 said:I fine with the raid having special skins, that is a hallmark of GW2, to have modes with their own special unique skin.

Equally so, WvW legendary armor should also have it's own unique skin, just like sPvP should, and if they put it in, Openworld should also have it's own skin.

I'm not satisfied with that, because one skin is not "just as good as another." If you don't have the skin that you want, then it doesn't matter whether you have access to a completely different skin. I think that "each mode gets a skin" is fine so long as it's something that can be acquired relatively quickly and easily, so that if you aren't enjoying yourself then you at least don't have to put up with it for long, but anything that takes many hours of dedicated activity should be more flexible than that.

[Lunateric.3708]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Seera.5916 said:I just don't want the skins to be the same between all modes.

But you still haven';t explained how people would be able to get the skins they want without having to spend significant time doing activities that they don't enjoy.

That part is really easy. They don't.

Then you haven't come up with an acceptable solution to the problem.

How does a PvP or WvW or instanced PvE player get a second generation legendary weapon?

A good question and one worthy of developer attention. It's important to keep in mind though, two wrongs don't make a right, they just

require

two rights to resolve.

@"Tenrai Senshi.2017" said:And honestly, that's fine. Not everything needs to be available in every mode. As long as there is enough variety so that people can get things they like, then it's all good.

That doesn't work though, since one skin cannot "make up for" another, each person values each skin differently, so if a certain skin is locked away from a player, no volume of other skins could make up for that.

This is a perfectly acceptable solution for the majority of the players. You are not the majority. You should have noticed it by now after this thread and the easy mode raiding discussions.

My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

You can't downvote posts here so that's a pretty invalid thing to say. I invite you to try and make a post in Reddit where people can and will show disagreement more transparently.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:My posts have more upvotes than downvotes. I'm not sure how you're getting the impression that I don't represent a majority position.

Well since downvotes were removed months ago...

I could create a post that GW2 should be cancelled, have five upvotes, and the claim that I have more upvotes than downvotes. While that may be true, it has

zero

correlation with how the population sides with that statement.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Point being, there's no reason to believe that better access to Legendary armors would not be supported by the majority of players, since the majority of players do not participate in the things that currently award them. To make that case, you would need some actual evidence that the majority is

opposed

to their own self-interest in this matter.

You could actually bring some proof that you are arguing for the marjority. You never brought it in any discussion you participated. You just threw those things around while the discussions and reddit actually indicate that you are the minority.The point people disagree with you is actually not legendary armor in open world but envoy skins in open world. Those are raid only and will stay raid only. The implementation of PvP and WvW armor just cemented this.

And you've never brought any proof that you represent the majority. Since my proposal would

benefit

the majority, the burden of proof would be on you to establish that they would choose to work against their own self-interests.

Burden of proof is on you since you’re the one making the claim.

I only claim to be representing the interests of the majority, which I am. I don't claim that they

necessarily agree

with me, but again, to claim otherwise would be an extraordinary claim, and therefore require extraordinary proof.

Why do you believe that the majority would act against their own interest in this?

@STIHL.2489 said:I fine with the raid having special skins, that is a hallmark of GW2, to have modes with their own special unique skin.

Equally so, WvW legendary armor should also have it's own unique skin, just like sPvP should, and if they put it in, Openworld should also have it's own skin.

I'm not satisfied with that, because one skin is not "just as good as another." If you don't have the skin that

you

want, then it doesn't matter whether you have access to a completely different skin. I think that "each mode gets a skin" is fine so long as it's something that can be acquired relatively quickly and easily, so that if you aren't enjoying yourself then you at least don't have to put up with it for long, but anything that takes many hours of dedicated activity should be more flexible than that.

You claim to be representing the interests of the majority with no evidence. You get disputed on that and then tell those that disagree to provide evidence.

Now ignoring all that, I do believe that players would approve of anything that benefits them.

If Anet were to make all fractal awards available in open world PvE, there would be a lot of players who approved. If Anet were to increase the gold from the dailies to 10G, a lot of players would approve.

I could go on but I don’t see a need. Anet can add a lot of things and many, if not all, could be desired by the majority of players. That doesn’t mean it’s the best thing for the game.

A lot of players collectively have no idea what they want and a lot of players don’t realize the consequences of having what they want implemented.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Lunateric.3708 said:You can't downvote posts here so that's a pretty invalid thing to say. I invite you to try and make a post in Reddit where people can and will show disagreement more transparently.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. The fact is, way more upvotes than down.