ArenaNet's Approach: Analyzing GW2's Feature Lifecycle - What Lies Ahead????

[Panda.1967]

5 hours ago, starlinvf.1358 said:

I get expansions for the Especs and new build potential.  Historically, content burns out in 3-8 weeks, regardless of how much of it there is.  There is objectively more value  in new ways to play, which compounds over time, compared to story arcs and events most people only do ONCE, and then complain about lack of content after.  

 

Even in that regard we got less out of SotO than we would have from an actual expansion…

Relics don’t add new ways to play… in-fact in their current state we actually LOST options.

Weaponmastery Training adds new options to every espec, but its not much and a new weapon doesn’t change up builds that much… most meta builds still play the same way they did before.

The new weapons we’re getting later won’t add much either…

 

we got no new Espec… no new traits… no new utility skill… nothing that actually changes playstyles.

[kharmin.7683]

SotO hasn't been completely released yet.  Of course there's less ... right now.

[Panda.1967]

2 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

SotO hasn't been completely released yet.  Of course there's less ... right now.

All that we’re getting in the content update is 1 new map, a new weapon for each profession, and an undefined number of relics that may or may not be based on missing rune effects.

[Sobx.1758]

8 minutes ago, Panda.1967 said:

Relics don’t add new ways to play… in-fact in their current state we actually LOST options.

We already know more relics will be added, so the choice will increase either way.

[Panda.1967]

21 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

We already know more relics will be added, so the choice will increase either way.

That ultimately depends on how many more relics they add and if the second batch of relics includes the missing rune effects or not… if they don’t include the missing rune effects or adequate substitutes then we will still have lost options. ANet has been very vague about the second batch of relics, for all we know we may only get 2 new relics that are more or less the same as the ones we already have.

[Sobx.1758]

12 minutes ago, Panda.1967 said:

That ultimately depends on how many more relics they add and if the second batch of relics includes the missing rune effects or not… if they don’t include the missing rune effects or adequate substitutes then we will still have lost options. ANet has been very vague about the second batch of relics, for all we know we may only get 2 new relics that are more or less the same as the ones we already have.

They'll probably keep adding relics with next expansions. And we don't the same -or even similar- options to have more options.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Astralporing.1957]

41 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

And we don't the same -or even similar- options to have more options.

At the same time ending up with more options (which i doubt we will, tbh, but let's indulge in that unlikely fantasy) does not mean we haven't lost options. A multitude of trash options will never equal even just a few of good ones.

[Lucius.2140]

7 hours ago, Doam.8305 said:

Gw2 took everything great about Gw1 and burned it then spent the next decade rehashing the same old zones up till SoTo. Which while wasn't a return to a gw1 map is an homage to gw1 maps with what if scenarios and museums.

Thus we have a precedent and Anet would raise a big middle finger as they did we gw1 and once again retread the path through Core, Cantha, Elona, and the North then pop a Gw4. 

Edit: The point was be careful what you wish for however I just learned if a person alters their post then the quotes are changed as well. I got a notification that his post was altered. Currently my statement doesnt make sense with the new quoted remark but not going change it.

Haven't eddited my post. My statement doesn't have anything to do with what i wish, it doesn't have any sentimental kind of word, etc. 

Anet's been working on an unnanunced project in Unreal Engine (4-5) since 2022. The job posts have added things like online worlds, redefining combat and innovation, project for an established IP.

Is either an IP from Anet or one from NSOFT, is online, in a brand new engine that most of the big MMO in developement right now are using.

That alone concludes is either Anet's IP or the heavy hitter from NSOFT, namely: Linage. However they created a new "Linage game", announced it and are about to launch it; not unanounced. Plus makes more sense for them to move Anet works in its own IP.

GW2 can have 1,2,3 expansions before the game is released or perhaps even announced. Another point: theres not even one SoTo review in metacritic, the game itself has switched model and standars and seems logical that the future will be "3". 

Edit: Also IPs get refreshed sales with new games. They probably will sell more copies with one new game than with a new GW2 expansion.

 

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Lucius.2140

[Lucius.2140]

On 10/6/2023 at 1:56 PM, Assolador.3598 said:

With each new expansion, ArenaNet seems to halt support or place yet another feature into maintenance mode. Dungeons, PvP, raids, underwater combat, guild halls, and guilds themselves—none have been spared. Even Living Worlds and POSSIBLY elite specs. fractals and WvW see minimal updates. Remember Silent Surf? What about the long-awaited Alliances, announced half a decade ago? Strikes, Dagda – a disaster, IBS levels of bad. Cerus is decent, the only saving grace amidst the mess that is SoTO, With the exception of its exceptional storytelling.

Rifts were announced as the main feature of the expansion, promising thrilling rift hunts, but they devolved into an unbearable grind. All this while, ArenaNet seems engrossed in their new Unreal Engine project, leaving GW2 in a sorry state. Why rework runes? And that FOMO machine called dailies? Sure, some improvements were made, but was it necessary? Many neglected aspects of the game cry out for attention. What exactly is ArenaNet doing? Updating the engine? Still laboring on SoTO? Perhaps preparing for the next expansion? Is this Unreal Engine project even related to GW2?

When they say "support core features," does it mean needlessly reworking a system that wasn't broken but merely inconvenient? Although I know a dev might read this, the silence from their end is deafening. Yet, amidst the chaos, ArenaNet is busy crafting new MTX with shiny effects, supported eagerly on forums, alongside almost useless bug fixes.

I genuinely want to remain positive about the game's development, but the rampant neglect of crucial issues is driving me away. Despite my initial excitement for SoTO, I'll hold off on the next expansion until I see what it truly offers. If you have any positive experiences with GW2, please share. All I can see now is the disheartening descent into "surprise CM maintenance mode." Good luck out there, and thanks for enduring this poorly articulated post.🙂

To add up to the main topic, would be interesting to see if theres more on the run about reconnecting systems and old content, they did mention they have ideas about it and 2022 was the year of Scarlet.

About the SoTo frustration, I'm waiting for it to get bigger, namely the new weapons or the next expansion.

As a positive note: the "Return" achievements nailed the reward rate for the LS maps for me and i enjoyed a lot my favorites ones like Istan and Siren's Landing.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Lucius.2140

[Vayne.8563]

On 10/7/2023 at 9:32 AM, kharmin.7683 said:

Be very careful what you wish for.  This could happen where it gets sold off to another company who decides to try to make more profits by forcing a subscription and heavy P2W model, completely abandoning horizontal progression which would force players to continue to pay and/or grind to keep up.

Be very careful.

Worked out great for Everquest Next, Landmark and Rift, no?

[Panda.1967]

40 minutes ago, Vayne.8563 said:

Worked out great for Everquest Next, Landmark and Rift, no?

*pays respects at the graveyard, looks over at the NCSoft section of the graveyard* I’m starting to think the Necromancer I called on 11 years ago may have died…

[Vayne.8563]

9 minutes ago, Panda.1967 said:

*pays respects at the graveyard, looks over at the NCSoft section of the graveyard* I’m starting to think the Necromancer I called on 11 years ago may have died…

The doom and gloom is strong in this one. Sadly I've been hearing this kind of nonsense since ascended gear was released, a few months after launch. It wasn't true then and it's not true now. I won't judge something before I've seen it, and I know that some people, with their crystal balls, know everything that's going to happen before it does, like all the people who said that there would never be open world legendary armor, or the people that said before that there would never be another expansion, or the people who before HOT said there would never been an expansion in the first place. We were never getting mounts, the release of game X was going to doom Guild Wars 2, and a host of other doomer predictions that never came true.

You might be right. It's absolutely possible. But I think that there's plenty of people playing this game that are still happy and satisfied with it, more than enough to support it moving forward. And if it doesn't work for you, it doesn't matter if there are enough people it does work for. That's always been the case.

[Cronospere.8143]

I want to add to the list of abandoned features: 

- home instance cat/dog scavenger hunt. 

- home instance nodes

Small addons like these are more important than they know.. 

EDIT: its about the little details that are quickly forgotten. See my reply below. 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Cronospere.8143

[Vayne.8563]

1 hour ago, Cronospere.8143 said:

I want to add to the list of abandoned features: 

- home instance cat/dog scavenger hunt. 

- home instance nodes

Small addons like these are more important than they know.. 

The fact the people think the dog scavenger hunt was ever a thing, or that the cat home instance thing is supposed to have gone on forever and in fact wasn't one time content that was finished is silly. It's done. The fact that people are complaining about it is ludicrous. Find a cat, look up what to feed it and it appears in your home instance? This is important? Maybe to you. Maybe to a handful of other people. In my opinion most people don't even farm a home instance every day or even know this exists.

[Balsa.3951]

5 hours ago, Cronospere.8143 said:

I want to add to the list of abandoned features: 

- home instance cat/dog scavenger hunt. 

- home instance nodes

Small addons like these are more important than they know.. 

thats a odd one to complain about. but i probably don't know how important cats are 

[Panda.1967]

17 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

The doom and gloom is strong in this one. Sadly I've been hearing this kind of nonsense since ascended gear was released, a few months after launch. It wasn't true then and it's not true now.

What? I was referring to the fact that the games you listed in the post I quoted are all dead… and the Necromancer 11 years ago for the NCSoft section was because of City of Heroes a game NCSoft shutdown prematurely just weeks before GW2 launched… I’m not a doomsayer calling for GW2s imminent death… no I believe this game still has plenty of life left… I don’t like how SotO has been turning out but thats not going to make me say the game is dead or dying.

Everquest Next & Landmark are dead games… and Rift is a zombie…

Edited October 9, 2023 by Panda.1967

[Sobx.1758]

18 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

At the same time ending up with more options (which i doubt we will, tbh, but let's indulge in that unlikely fantasy) does not mean we haven't lost options. A multitude of trash options will never equal even just a few of good ones.

"losing options" (in terms of "exact effects") is a common thing during balance changes and easly not just in this game. This is not anything new, this is happening and always has been happening. Not sure why this is somehow thought of as some meaningful distinction here when changing or removing effects -or their parts- isn't a new concept. There will be more options than we have now and the effects aren't bound to the stat part of the runes, which is a win in itself.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

There will be more options than we have now

There will be  more options that we have now. There will however still be less option than we've had before the Relic change.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Astralporing.1957

[Cronospere.8143]

9 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

thats a odd one to complain about. but i probably don't know how important cats are 

 

13 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

The fact the people think the dog scavenger hunt was ever a thing, or that the cat home instance thing is supposed to have gone on forever and in fact wasn't one time content that was finished is silly. It's done. The fact that people are complaining about it is ludicrous. Find a cat, look up what to feed it and it appears in your home instance? This is important? Maybe to you. Maybe to a handful of other people. In my opinion most people don't even farm a home instance every day or even know this exists.

 Its more about the little things that are also quickly forgotten. The stupid and small things. Like guild decorations, activities, races, world meta events (which are finaly back). Updates to festivals. Side stories. and yes. 

Yes ofc i care more about big things. They were already mentioned in previous posts. Like guild content and whatever OP said also. We want big bigger biggest. But dont forget the details. 

I dont think it is odd to complain about the fact that up until EoD every expansion and living story had home instance nodes. EoD was awesome, yet was also delivered poorly, with a lot of details missing, like guild hall decorations, a guildhall full of invisible walls, almost no races or activities (which were added later, great job on that!). Do we even need to start about what SotO is missing so far?  

[Sobx.1758]

33 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

There will be  more options that we have now. There will however still be less option than we've had before the Relic change.

Yes, there will be more options than we have now. There can be more options than we had. There already is the benefit of bonus effects not being tied to stats in the runes.

[Panda.1967]

4 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

"losing options" (in terms of "exact effects") is a common thing during balance changes and easly not just in this game. This is not anything new, this is happening and always has been happening. Not sure why this is somehow thought of as some meaningful distinction here when changing or removing effects -or their parts- isn't a new concept. There will be more options than we have now and the effects aren't bound to the stat part of the runes, which is a win in itself.

The difference is that when Relics were announced we were all lead to believe that ALL existing runes 6 piece effect would become Relics… what we received was a small selection of them and most of that small selection got nerfed… we have had absolutely no word one way or another from ANet in regards to the fate of the remaining rune effects. When things are removed in balance passes we are actually TOLD it is being removed…

 

TL;DR the difference is being actually told something is being removed vrs it being removed without a word.

[Linken.6345]

4 hours ago, Panda.1967 said:

The difference is that when Relics were announced we were all lead to believe that ALL existing runes 6 piece effect would become Relics… what we received was a small selection of them and most of that small selection got nerfed… we have had absolutely no word one way or another from ANet in regards to the fate of the remaining rune effects. When things are removed in balance passes we are actually TOLD it is being removed…

 

TL;DR the difference is being actually told something is being removed vrs it being removed without a word.

We were told we would get 40 core relics with more added later.

If you thought 40 effects was all we had before thats on you.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/relics-bring-new-equipment-to-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

Guild Wars 2: Secrets of the Obscure will release with forty core relics and twelve expansion relics. Core relics, which have effects inspired by many of the current rune sets, will be available to all players regardless of expansion ownership. Additional core relics will be added over time as part of our ongoing commitment to improving our core game features; our overarching goal is to offer more viable choices despite fewer overall options.

 

What seem to have changed is the more core relics coming later since all the updates only talk about expansion relics. in a later blogpost

Relics

at relesase 40 Core Relics,12 Secrets of the Obscure-Exclusive Relics

Update 1 Additional Expansion Relics

Update 2 Legendary Relic

Update 3 Additional Expansion Relics

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure-launches-today/

Edit

alto we did not get 12 soto exlusive relics either so this might be the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing.

Edited October 10, 2023 by Linken.6345

[Panda.1967]

34 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

What seem to have changed is the more core relics coming later since all the updates only talk about expansion relics. in a later blogpost

That’s exactly the issue… the initial announcement made it sound like all of them will be available, starting with 40 and more added over the course of the expansion… but ever since SotO launched all we’ve heard from them is more expansion relics are comming… no word on what is happening with the missing core relics.

[Linken.6345]

3 minutes ago, Panda.1967 said:

That’s exactly the issue… the initial announcement made it sound like all of them will be available, starting with 40 and more added over the course of the expansion… but ever since SotO launched all we’ve heard from them is more expansion relics are comming… no word on what is happening with the missing core relics.

Thats you reading in more into the announcement then what the said tho.

They could give us 2 more core relics over the mini expansion year and both of them still just inspired by the old rune effects just like 39 out of the 40 we got already.

The only unchanged rune bonus I think is relic of the trooper.

And as I said in my other post we did not get 12 SotO exlusive relics either so the information in that blogpost can be wrong on more counts.

[Panda.1967]

2 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Thats you reading in more into the announcement then what the said tho.

They could give us 2 more core relics over the mini expansion year and both of them still just inspired by the old rune effects just like 39 out of the 40 we got already.

The only unchanged rune bonus I think is relic of the trooper.

And as I said in my other post we did not get 12 SotO exlusive relics either so the information in that blogpost can be wrong on more counts.

It doesn’t invalidate my earlier point any. The difference between this situation and a balance pass removing things still is communication. In this situation we were mislead and made to guess about things, in a balance pass we are told directly what is being removed or changed and sometimes why.

with this we were we’d get 40 to start and more later. We weren’t told which 40, we weren’t told if any would be removed permanently, we weren’t even told that effects would be changed either. We were blindsided by the things we didn’t know were happening. We want to know what is going to happen going forwards so we are not blindsided again.

if this were a balance pas we would have been told directly that these runes are losing their effects, these runes are having their effects altered when converted to relics, and these ones are just becoming relics. Instead all we were told is a non-descript 40 to start with more over time.