November 28 Skills and Balance Update Preview

[Tails.9372]

The ini change to Unload is good as it lessens the burden it puts on the other weapons skills (and vice versa) which has always been a big problem for the weapon set as the high ini cost created situations where it was often times more beneficial to prioritize the ability to use Unload over the usage of your other skills. This issue should be resolved now.

But there are still some problems with the weapon set: the damage is rather lackluster, weapon skill 2 is rather useless (as 3 does damage better and 4 does CC beter) and the set lacks utility namely mobility. I'd say adding a disengage to Bola Shot (e.g. an on use 400-600 range shadowstep backwards) would solve the last two issues.

 

On 10/27/2023 at 11:00 PM, AquaBR.9250 said:

the stealth pistol attack needs and improvement i think it deals the same damage as unload, and theres no bonus for power builds by spending more Malice

One thing they could do here is replacing sneak attack (and its malicious version) with a stealth attack version of Unload if you have a pistol in your main and off hand. Make it do considerably more damage than Unload, piercing by default and make it apply 3 stacks of vulnerability per hit. This way people would still have a good reason to use the stealth attack (especially on DE).

Edited November 2, 2023 by Tails.9372

[Jski.6180]

A bit of an random question but some what related to coming updates previews where is anet saying that there are going to be new relic coming out on the 7th? I seen an list but its missing an link to where they got that info. The new relic are very important to the coming patch on the 28 and its odd there no post about them on these forms.

[LichOverlord.6329]

Overall, im actually quite happy with this balance patch so far - a far cry from how I felt about the last big balance update

I would like to see more of a heavy-handed approach to severely overpreforming specs, though, and a lot more love for underpreforming specs - mirage, for example, has been a spec I've seen barely touched in my raid groups compared to chrono and virtuoso, and with the healing buffs its pretty apparent that chrono is going to be the main support/boon mesmer, and virt is going to be the main dps mesmer, with very little room for mirage

Rather than trying to shoehorn mirage into a support dps role with alacrity, why not just revert some of your heavy-handed mirage nerfs - like the inability to dodge while immobilized - and buff their ability to provide torment and confusion, as mirage had a firm place in the meta as the main condi mesmer dps until condi virt came into the scene and took that away from them

[LichOverlord.6329]

On 10/28/2023 at 12:48 PM, Voyant.1327 said:

The only thing that isn't a nerf is the weapon skill changes.

Its a DPS & HPS loss in Chaos & Inspiration with these changes, and we lose more class identity. 

Those who think this benefit Mesmer haven't looked close enough at what is happening. 

The only people excited about it are people who don't use them currently. Those who do realize how awful these changes are. 

Was planning on buying the expansion today, but looks like another long break when this patch launches so I'm holding off. Maybe they'll get it right in another year lol. 

They've made a number of changes in the past 2 years that have dealt large hits to mesmer's class identity

This isn't one of them 

In fact, these are some of the best and most thoughtful mesmer changes I've seen in a long while

Not only can mesmer now provide much-needed boons like protection and regeneration, but they can do so in a meaningful and unique way that fits in with the class fantasy - providing chaos aura, for example, as part of it's main support rotation is wonderful, as it's one of mesmers unique aspects that help solidify their identity as masters of chaos magic

So actually, I think these changes benefit class identity for mesmer, as now mesmer can provide needed boons in a more unique way, rather than just tacking prot and regen onto like shatter 1 or something boring and homogenous 

[Roadkizzle.2157]

5 hours ago, LichOverlord.6329 said:

They've made a number of changes in the past 2 years that have dealt large hits to mesmer's class identity

This isn't one of them 

In fact, these are some of the best and most thoughtful mesmer changes I've seen in a long while

Not only can mesmer now provide much-needed boons like protection and regeneration, but they can do so in a meaningful and unique way that fits in with the class fantasy - providing chaos aura, for example, as part of it's main support rotation is wonderful, as it's one of mesmers unique aspects that help solidify their identity as masters of chaos magic

So actually, I think these changes benefit class identity for mesmer, as now mesmer can provide needed boons in a more unique way, rather than just tacking prot and regen onto like shatter 1 or something boring and homogenous 

I just really wish they would have increased access to Chaos Aura for Mesmers.

We have Staff 4 with a 25 second cooldown and Shatter 2 also with a 25-30 second cooldown.

But the aura only lasts for 5 seconds or so.

There are 3 Leap Finisher weapon skills if there's a Ethereal field but Staff 2 moves you backwards off of platforms or away from your group you need to support.

Sword 3 is only on the 2nd part of the attack and the clone is very buggy so you may not be able to get it.

2/3 of the Axe skills are forced movement so it's not ideal for group content.

[Rap Tiger.1257]

11 hours ago, MagicBot.1570 said:

Oh, I absolutely want to see a Soulbeast nerf. This spec has been going under the radar for too long, and it happens to get free buffs here and there every time there's a patch. It is dominating in fractals, with nothing coming close to its burst, and sustained damage, and CC, on top of an already absurd self-boon uptime. I actually think fractal balance is a pretty big problem right now, which is completely disregarded.

Here are a few examples of the direct or indirect buffs Soulbeast got this year, off the top of my head:

- introduction of hammer

- sword rework

- damage coefficient increases across the board

- an insane amount of free power on the sword trait, too

- awesome synergy with both Firework and Dragonhunter Relic

- and now a full pet rework, which not only buffs Soulbeast indirectly from the double pet bug abuse, but they went out of their way and hard buffed Devourer as well (perfect for precasting!)

You can call this however you want, but nothing comes even close to the absurdity that is power Soulbeast right now. And let's not mention condi Soulbeast, which will also be overperforming after this update as well (it already is insanely good)

 

Are you kidding me? Are we just going to have buffs on pets and do you want more nerfs on the soulbeast class? Isn't one wolf of the pack enough? We don't even know if our pets will be more useful with this update that buffs some and nerfs other pets

The one who needs nerf, I repeat here, is BLADESWORN, I don't complain about any class even with mesmer having 20s of invulnerability, revenant with almost infinite dodge, etc., but these still receive damage, bladesworn does high damage and doesn't receive damage unless it has 3 people on top of it or 2.

[Falseprophet.1502]

On 10/31/2023 at 3:32 PM, Loke.1429 said:

Preview is somehow (how??) missing a nerf to willbender in wvw. E.g.

There is a lot of feedback on this in that thread.

 Who on the balance team plays wvw?

If you two honestly believe this, it may actually be the most astonishing thing I've read on these forums. Judge's Intervention is a core skill. Nature's Traversal is not. Concurrently, Nature's Traversal is MUCH better and than Judge's Intervention.

 

Your "balance" suggestions are nonsensical. They won't fix your inability to dodge one of the most telegraphed professions in the game. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Falseprophet.1502

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

it is not (just) their burst damage. A lot of classes can burst hard. But ever tried to catch a running willbender? 

Too much mobility, too much sustain, too many boons, too high burst damage in one package.

I am convinced, the only reason not everyone beside thieves is playing willbender at this point is rooted in nostalgia for the other classes.

[KawsMeCal.5923]

Relic of the Monk no more cooldown

Mechanist now share Monk Relic cooldown with mech

What?

[FreshF.5793]

Regarding Heal-Scrapper:

Can we have a Trait, that has Interaction with Barrier?

E.g. 

- Barrier increases your healing to other allies by X

- a portion of your barrier is converted to healing, when you or your allies are not at full health

-granting barrier grants also boons to allies (Might, Protection, Resolution, Resistance, Regeneration, or whatever) 

Or another one regarding the trait-rework for protection:

Instead of protection let the toolbelt-healing-skill grant Aegis for allies. That way it is on demand and you dont have to use it on a spamming mechanic.

Just change the Boon 🙂

[Master Ketsu.4569]

Contained temper change sounds like a bad idea. Not just because it's removing a good source of fury, but because tying an energy management trait to something that depends on your opponent just sounds really clunky.

Edited November 3, 2023 by Master Ketsu.4569

[Roadkizzle.2157]

I really do like the changes to Mesmer. I've been wanting to play a support Chrono since starting GW2 last year.

But please keep the Chaos traitline Condi damage increase and Concentration and Expertise tied to Regeneration and not having the Chaos Aura.

 

Auras can be overwritten so Characters using the Chaos traitline can't rely on keeping an aura they would need while playing in groups.

Keep the application of Regen on Chaos Aura to encourage using them but a player shouldn't be punished because someone else uses a Blast Finisher on a combo field.

[Loke.1429]

On 11/3/2023 at 12:18 AM, Falseprophet.1502 said:

If you two honestly believe this, it may actually be the most astonishing thing I've read on these forums. Judge's Intervention is a core skill. Nature's Traversal is not. Concurrently, Nature's Traversal is MUCH better and than Judge's Intervention.

 

Your "balance" suggestions are nonsensical. They won't fix your inability to dodge one of the most telegraphed professions in the game. 

Although you seem clueless, and stuck on the details I will reply. I wrote "e.g." because the exact suggestion will probably never be used, its just an example. I dodge just fine thank you.

Seriously though. Compare Advancing Strike with Lighting Flash for example. Giving advancing strike the "ele treatment" would literally mean a damage reduction of 89% from the current. Both movement skills both deal damage. Yeah lightning flash is placed freely and has slightly longer range, but advancing strike has aoe immob, aoe slow, combo finisher and a much lower cooldown (and is a weapon skill so you still can have a utility).

Advancing Strike (20s cd)
Quickly dash toward your foe and then shadowstep to deliver a debilitating attack that first slows and then immobilizes your enemies.

  Damage (2x): 366
  Slow (3s): Skills and actions are slower.
  Immobilize (2s): Unable to move.
  Number of Targets: 3
  Combo Finisher: Whirl
  Range: 750

Lightning Flash (35s cd)
Cantrip. Teleport to target area.

  Damage: 80
  Radius: 120
  Range: 900

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by Loke.1429

[Angesombre.4630]

Please don't change Contained Temper: This trait has been reworked. Gain energy when you break out of stun. I don't want to camp a single legend with a useless or underperforming trait.

I want to be able to use an elite specialization without having to use an elite legend.

Edited November 4, 2023 by Angesombre.4630

[Rap Tiger.1257]

Another thing, arenanet, you could remove the nerfs on some pets from what I saw in the preview, like the nerf on the jaguar and some others like the phoenix's wing buffet, wyverns that previously did damage in PvP as well as the electric wyvern's f2 attack, it could give a decent dash when teaming up with phoenix using soulbeast, also remove the nerfs on bristleback who will come now... and smokescale on take down.... since the only update we will have will be on the pets that were already supposed to have been fixed since the beginning of the game.....or half of it at least. all other classes are getting buffs, our side of rangers just repairs their pets...

[Falseprophet.1502]

4 hours ago, Loke.1429 said:

Although you seem clueless, 

Seriously though. Compare Advancing Strike with Lighting Flash for example. 

 

LOL. Calls me clueless and then compares a weapon skill to a utility skill.

[Loke.1429]

8 hours ago, Falseprophet.1502 said:

LOL. Calls me clueless and then compares a weapon skill to a utility skill.

I'm trying to call them out on their thus far limited but very biased departure from the principle of having low damage on skills that also give cc, movement, etc. As established feb 2020. Yeah weapon and utility is not equal and not a direct comparison, but give me a break. I hope you still see how incredibly overloaded / overpowered Advancing Strikes is...

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by Loke.1429

[Falseprophet.1502]

48 minutes ago, Loke.1429 said:

I'm trying to call them out on their thus far limited but very biased departure from the principle of having low damage on skills that also give cc, movement, etc. As established feb 2020. Yeah weapon and utility is not equal and not a direct comparison, but give me a break. I hope you still see how incredibly overloaded / overpowered Advancing Strikes is...

 

Immobilize is not a control effect. It is a condition. It's not a bias departure like this very unsound point you're trying to make. In fact,  it's a consistency because it is a condition. If Advancing Strike did a knockdown, then yes, it should do damage like other control skills in the game and should be nerfed based off that balance philosophy almost four years ago. But alas, it does NOT and here is another poorly articulated atypical "I hate blue class" post. Onto the next! 

Edited November 4, 2023 by Falseprophet.1502

[Falseprophet.1502]

1 hour ago, Loke.1429 said:

I'm trying to call them out on their thus far limited but very biased departure from the principle of having low damage on skills that also give cc, movement, etc. As established feb 2020. Yeah weapon and utility is not equal and not a direct comparison, but give me a break. I hope you still see how incredibly overloaded / overpowered Advancing Strikes is...

 

Oh, since you're obviously an Ele "main," here's a cool screenshot in a WvW environment (Armistice Bastion) testing out a pure power dagger/dagger build for roaming.

 

If you don't bother opening up the link because it doesn't fit your narrative -- I'll put the highlight here. Burning Speed, a movement skill, doing 17K crits WITH AN UNBLOCKABLE utility (Augment Fire)!!!!!! This screenshot doesn't even show the other big hits, like Fire Grab hitting for 10k+ (it just had a normal hit in that screenshot for almost 6k LOL), Convergence hitting for 7K+. We can go on. But let's just start with facts instead of inaccuracies to fit your bias. 

Your unfound hatred still doesn't change the fact that the lead balance dev mains your class.

Edited November 4, 2023 by Falseprophet.1502

[Loke.1429]

6 hours ago, Falseprophet.1502 said:

Immobilize is not a control effect.

You need to wiki "Control effect" because you dont know what you are talking about. Attacking my articulation is ad hominem, so I will gladly ignore that part.

6 hours ago, Falseprophet.1502 said:

But let's just start with facts instead of inaccuracies to fit your bias. 

Your point and my point may both be true, because there are many things that are broken. I said nothing about what is under and overpowered about ele except lightning flash being really weak.

You need to stop desperately gaslighting an obviously fair arugment, wth  🤦‍♂️. To borrow your logic, nice "blue class" main posting bro.

For wvw, willbenders are OP for zerg diving, OP for roaming and OP for 1v1. I will also play willbender all the time if they dont touch it, further degenerating the gameplay for others. I'm posting here (stupidly?) hoping they listen to valid feedback, and actually fix the outliers.

[Hins.2489]

20 minutes ago, Loke.1429 said:

You need to wiki "Control effect" because you dont know what you are talking about. Attacking my articulation is ad hominem, so I will gladly ignore that part.

Your point and my point may both be true, because there are many things that are broken. I said nothing about what is under and overpowered about ele except lightning flash being really weak.

You need to stop desperately gaslighting an obviously fair arugment, wth  🤦‍♂️. To borrow your logic, nice "blue class" main posting bro.

For wvw, willbenders are OP for zerg diving, OP for roaming and OP for 1v1. I will also play willbender all the time if they dont touch it, further degenerating the gameplay for others. I'm posting here (stupidly?) hoping they listen to valid feedback, and actually fix the outliers.

wait wait wait op for 1v1?hmmmmmm think you just too bad :3 stop playing forum and spend more time on the game bruh

tbh dont need to say that much just say im noob im bad i cant kill a willbender even there is so many class can beat them.pls nerf it for me so i can finally kill them with my forum player experience

Edited November 4, 2023 by Hins.2489

[Loke.1429]

3 minutes ago, Hins.2489 said:

kitten

stop trolling

[Falseprophet.1502]

34 minutes ago, Loke.1429 said:

You need to wiki "Control effect" because you dont know what you are talking about. Attacking my articulation is ad hominem, so I will gladly ignore that part.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Control_effect

Control effects

• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/7/79/Daze.png/20px-Daze.png Daze — Disables all skills for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/9/97/Stun.png/20px-Stun.png Stun — Prevents movement and actions for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/3/36/Knockdown.png/20px-Knockdown.png Knockdown — Knocks the target on ground, preventing movement and actions for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/3/31/Pull.png/20px-Pull.png Pull¹ — Pulls the caster to the target or the target to a specific location and disables them for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/c/ca/Knockback.png/20px-Knockback.png Knockback¹ — Knocks back the target away and on the ground, preventing movement and actions for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/6/68/Launch.png/20px-Launch.png Launch¹ — Throws the target in the air over a short distance, preventing movement and actions for a short duration. Can move Downed targets.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/c/c8/Float.png/20px-Float.png Float — Causes the target to float in the air, preventing movement and actions for a short duration. Causes underwater targets to move up.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/6/66/Sink.png/20px-Sink.png Sink — Causes the underwater target to move downwards.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/e/e6/Fear.png/20px-Fear.png Fear^{1 2} — Disables all skills and causes the target to flee directly away from the caster for a short duration.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/c/cc/Taunt.png/20px-Taunt.png Taunt^{1 2} — Forces the affected target to run towards the source of taunt with all skills except stun breakers disabled while using their auto-attack skill.

 

 

[psizone.8437]

3 hours ago, Falseprophet.1502 said:

Control effects

You gotta scroll down. Immobilize is there under non-disabling control effects.

Immob being a condition doesn't matter for arguments sake either since you also listed fear and taunt as definite control effects and they're both conditions.

[Falseprophet.1502]

55 minutes ago, psizone.8437 said:

You gotta scroll down. Immobilize is there under non-disabling control effects.

Immob being a condition doesn't matter for arguments sake either since you also listed fear and taunt as definite control effects and they're both conditions.

Nah, it's under "similar." And it literally states it is a condition that has some control. 

 

"Some conditions will deal damage to enemy Defiance bar without being considered a disabling mechanic (particularly for purposes of various traits, as well as Stability as their counter). These conditions are often referred to "soft CC"."

 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Immobile

Immobile is a condition that prevents movement, turning, and dodging. 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Falseprophet.1502