Where does Elementalist shine?

[Helgaley.3619]

Title. In other words, what does ele do that other classes can't do better? Feel free to share your thoughts on general strengths and weaknesses as well. 

My thought is that ele shines most in pvp or WvW roaming. Skilled eles are hard to take down in both modes, but cele stats obviously have an impact in WvW. I don't think it does anything particularly well enough in PvE that would justify the average player bringing it over most other professions. 

[Downstate.4697]

It doesn’t do anything better, but can do a bit of everything.  It shines especially on celestial stats

[Doctor Hide.6345]

Does everything need to be justified though? I don't think it does in the slightest. Let people bring what they want. I couldn't care less what someone brings as long as they are enjoying themselves with it. So, my take is that Ele is just fine as is with how it is set up for just damage mainly. It doesn't need anything special with it. And if a group for some reason has a problem with it, I just tell them to kitten off a cliff, and I find a non elitist group who doesn't care.

Edited November 21, 2023 by Doctor Hide.6345

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

In raid speedrun tournament, for ~2weeks after balance updates and before nerfs, every 6 months.

About celestial ; i don't really agree on this statement.
Every celestial builds are full kitten to fight ; mesmer, berserker, rev, harbinger etc but you can get find builds that offer faster kills with a tool kit to flee, survive condition spam... Ccelestial is just trolling with those classes. What you don't easily have with Elem (Fresh air is almost dead with all the stab spam classes and scepter nerf ?) and so in proportion you see a lot more "effective" Celestial Elem/Catalyst.

Edited November 21, 2023 by Zhaid Zhem.6508

[nuggetjr.6571]

Elementalist shines in the fun department imo... At least fresh air weaver. Fun is the most important aspect because if the spec you are playing isn't fun what are we doing here?

 

I do think it'd be really cool to make unravel a baseline skill f5 rather than a utility. 

Edited November 23, 2023 by nuggetjr.6571

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Golem benchmarks

[Natedog.7549]

1 hour ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

Golem benchmarks

Maximum hitbox size golem benchmarks to be precise. 

[zeyeti.8347]

11 hours ago, nuggetjr.6571 said:

I do think it'd be really cool to make unravel a baseline skill f5 rather than a utility. 

Give this person "balance team access" plz, that's one great idea and could be really usefull in any gamemode (maybe a bit overpowered in pvp)

On 11/21/2023 at 10:42 PM, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

Let people bring what they want

Ofc , let the troll departement be feeded plz , i'll come carry you with my healing alacrity soulbeast condi dps quickness ... Asking for a specific role then having a troll coming with the complete opposite you are asking for and expulse him is elitist ? then i am an elitist when i ask for a meat burger and is given a vegan one and start complaining about my wrong delivery.

Sorry for the sarcasm , i know the game was selled as "come like you are" but that doesnt work in endgame content , nor in wvw and pvp organized, ofc pve open world doesnt need to be organized so come like you are there , but don't be  a burden to your squad in organized content.

This is why ele is not appreciated in pve endgame , it doesnt shine in anything , complicated and very punishing rotation for damage and a very scuffed "meh" healer , it does the work as healer indeed , but it doesnt bring anything to the table for your squad, at at time where firebrand , hscg etc bring up some hard carry tools for your group , also i bet warrior is gonna be a better healer than tempest after the weapon patch , and look forward for herald shield rework and access to scepter , ele will be completely overshadowed (even more than actually) and it's not the weird pistol mechanic who's gonna save it ...

[soulknight.9620]

Nowhere. Anything ele can do every other class can do better. And since anet rebalanced every single class to have "everything" ele lost its main purpose of being jack of all trades. Atm ele is a mediocre class that has low survivability and somewhat from average to decent dps depending on the build/game mode/spec. Weaver for example has no role at all cause its dps is average, no utility and no access to selfsustain/selfboons. 

[zeyeti.8347]

There is one thing they can do before changing traits etc , it's making every weapon have a specific role (i know this will hurt pvp as ele being jack of all trades shine there), the only weapon who is designed so is hammer.

That's for me the more raging part of it , ele has to have lower hp and the lowest armor cause he can attune to water to heal , he can attune to earth to protect himself , in group instanced content you don't want that , you have support who as their name implys support you , it's frustrating to not use more than half of your skills in a rotation , and if you do you will be severly impacted in your role.

As healer , more than 50% of your skills are just gap fillers who have no purpose at all , the cc are horrible and are mostly locked behind attunements who will mostly not be available while the cc is needed ...

No, actually the ele is a class to be played if you want more challenge on your challenge, numbers and % proves it , only very dedicated players mastering it can make it work , but you can count those players ingame with your two hands...

it's ok in open world pve with celestial stats for some solo content , but you barely see one in instanced content... and there is a good reason for it.

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

Yyy.. this... I mean... Ele's would probably get #1 place in being the most in downed state out of all classes I think.
Also we shine in our rotations that include being in downed state most of the time.
That's about it.

[Doctor Hide.6345]

11 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Ofc , let the troll departement be feeded plz , i'll come carry you with my healing alacrity soulbeast condi dps quickness ... Asking for a specific role then having a troll coming with the complete opposite you are asking for and expulse him is elitist ? then i am an elitist when i ask for a meat burger and is given a vegan one and start complaining about my wrong delivery.

Sorry for the sarcasm , i know the game was selled as "come like you are" but that doesnt work in endgame content , nor in wvw and pvp organized, ofc pve open world doesnt need to be organized so come like you are there , but don't be  a burden to your squad in organized content.

This is why ele is not appreciated in pve endgame , it doesnt shine in anything , complicated and very punishing rotation for damage and a very scuffed "meh" healer , it does the work as healer indeed , but it doesnt bring anything to the table for your squad, at at time where firebrand , hscg etc bring up some hard carry tools for your group , also i bet warrior is gonna be a better healer than tempest after the weapon patch , and look forward for herald shield rework and access to scepter , ele will be completely overshadowed (even more than actually) and it's not the weird pistol mechanic who's gonna save it ...

You know what I meant. If you are asking for a specific role, and someone brings something else then of course you can kick them for that. I was not referring to that, and you knew it. There is more scenarios than that when it comes to elistism. If it is an open group and all they ask for is just dps, a person is more than freely allowed to join as an ele because Ele is good at dps despite some of your nay saying. It does the job quite well in capable hands. I also couldn't care less for the support side argument you presented because I don't care to play support. I only play pure dps professions here. 

And most people don't give two kittens if an Ele is brought when they are asking for just dps classes. The someone brought any other class than I requested applies to most all the other professions in the game. It is not just an Ele specific thing.

Edit:  A lot of you nay sayers are just making mountains out of mole hills. It is not that bad of a state for its intended purpose on the dps side. You can claim all you want with your "not" elitism that it needs to change and re define itself to fit the groups will, but it doesn't need to that as well since it is not that big of a problem. Most people don't care that much and will take an Ele because they know it can get the job done. A dps is still a dps at the end of the day.

Edited November 24, 2023 by Doctor Hide.6345

[Helgaley.3619]

1 hour ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

You know what I meant. If you are asking for a specific role, and someone brings something else then of course you can kick them for that. I was not referring to that, and you knew it. There is more scenarios than that when it comes to elistism. If it is an open group and all they ask for is just dps, a person is more than freely allowed to join as an ele because Ele is good at dps despite some of your nay saying. It does the job quite well in capable hands. I also couldn't care less for the support side argument you presented because I don't care to play support. I only play pure dps professions here. 

And most people don't give two kittens if an Ele is brought when they are asking for just dps classes. The someone brought any other class than I requested applies to most all the other professions in the game. It is not just an Ele specific thing.

Edit:  A lot of you nay sayers are just making mountains out of mole hills. It is not that bad of a state for its intended purpose on the dps side. You can claim all you want with your "not" elitism that it needs to change and re define itself to fit the groups will, but it doesn't need to that as well since it is not that big of a problem. Most people don't care that much and will take an Ele because they know it can get the job done. A dps is still a dps at the end of the day.

You kind of said what others are getting at - it does the job well in capable hands, and the average player doesn't always have the most capable hands. Lol. It's problematic when you build a profession as a selfish glass cannon with a high learning curve that other professions with higher survivability can outDPS while still bringing utility to a group. 

If Anet wants the professions to be balanced in terms of numbers and roles they can fulfill but not balanced in terms of design and complexity, then that is inherently going to lead to the current situation where certain professions are left behind because there is no reward for mastering them. The average player is always going to lean towards bringing professions that offer the highest output for the lowest effort, and I just want to be clear that I think that's perfectly fine. It's fun, you know you're contributing, and unlike complex professions like Elementalist, you aren't going to feel like a burden to the group by either being in downstate all the time or making mistakes in your rotation that ruin your output. 

Your position is that it doesn't need to be changed because other people will still bring it and you don't care about support roles, and that's fine. You know what would happen if Anet made some changes to either reward the complexity of Elementalist or made it easier for the average player to master? 

People would still bring it to your groups, and you still wouldn't care about support, so it wouldn't matter to you anyway. 

The point I think others are getting at, myself included, is that if complexity and effort is not rewarded, then people aren't going to want to play it. It's that simple. If the profession cannot do anything that other professions can't do better for less effort, then that is fundamentally bad game design that, as you've said yourself, doesn't discourage people from bringing that profession in their groups because it discourages the average player from wanting to play that profession in the first place. 

Edited November 24, 2023 by Helgaley.3619

[asket.5674]

On 11/23/2023 at 7:51 PM, nuggetjr.6571 said:

Elementalist shines in the fun department imo... At least fresh air weaver. Fun is the most important aspect because if the spec you are playing isn't fun what are we doing here?

 

I do think it'd be really cool to make unravel a baseline skill f5 rather than a utility. 

Yes, unravel is dearly needed as f5 class utility, not the buffs just the effect of fully attuning would be enough!

[Doctor Hide.6345]

7 minutes ago, Helgaley.3619 said:

You kind of said what others are getting at - it does the job well in capable hands, and the average player doesn't always have the most capable hands. Lol. It's problematic when you build a profession as a selfish glass cannon with a high learning curve that other professions with higher survivability can outDPS while still bringing utility to a group. 

If Anet wants the professions to be balanced in terms of numbers and roles they can fulfill but not balanced in terms of design and complexity, then that is inherently going to lead to the current situation where certain professions are left behind because there is no reward for mastering them. The average player is always going to lean towards bringing professions that offer the highest output for the lowest effort, and I just want to be clear that I think that's perfectly fine. It's fun, you know you're contributing, and unlike complex professions like Elementalist, you aren't going to feel like a burden to the group by either being in downstate all the time or making mistakes in your rotation that ruin your output. 

Your position is that it doesn't need to be changed because other people will still bring it and you don't care about support roles, and that's fine. You know what would happen if Anet made some changes to either reward the complexity of Elementalist or made it easier for the average player to master? 

People would still bring it to your groups, and you still wouldn't care about support, so it wouldn't matter to you anyway. 

The point I think others are getting at, myself included, is that if complexity and effort is not rewarded, then people aren't going to want to play it. It's that simple. If the profession cannot do anything that other professions can't do better for less effort, then that is fundamentally bad game design that, as you've said yourself, doesn't discourage people from bringing that profession in their groups because it discourages the average player from wanting to play that profession in the first place. 

The thing is people will still play it the way it is. Not everything has to be for everyone or even the average player is my take. I hate that design philosophy because it takes way the more complex ones in some manner. It's ok to have low represented classes that take a long time to master like the Ele. If that means the average player can't get it within a week or two, I say so be it. It is not for them which is an ok thing. Not every profession is for everyone. I appreciate that the Ele takes some challenge to master, and the reward is the fact that the person mastered it. It doesn't need to be translated into utility or something else. Not every thing is fair and equal in this world when it comes to effort and pay out. Sometimes the challenge alone is good enough to keep the profession as is without any extra bells and whistles to encourage more to play it.

It has been this way for years now with the Ele design. I don't see it changing any time soon either. I see it being reinforced more now actually with how the balance patches are taking the pure dps side at least with buffing sword and such.

[Knuckle Joe.7408]

At doing comparable damage to other classes with 5x the effort.

[Joxer.6024]

in the sun........

[zeyeti.8347]

14 hours ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

You know what I meant. If you are asking for a specific role, and someone brings something else then of course you can kick them for that. I was not referring to that, and you knew it. There is more scenarios than that when it comes to elistism. If it is an open group and all they ask for is just dps, a person is more than freely allowed to join as an ele because Ele is good at dps despite some of your nay saying. It does the job quite well in capable hands. I also couldn't care less for the support side argument you presented because I don't care to play support. I only play pure dps professions here. 

And most people don't give two kittens if an Ele is brought when they are asking for just dps classes. The someone brought any other class than I requested applies to most all the other professions in the game. It is not just an Ele specific thing.

Edit:  A lot of you nay sayers are just making mountains out of mole hills. It is not that bad of a state for its intended purpose on the dps side. You can claim all you want with your "not" elitism that it needs to change and re define itself to fit the groups will, but it doesn't need to that as well since it is not that big of a problem. Most people don't care that much and will take an Ele because they know it can get the job done. A dps is still a dps at the end of the day.

Thta's true to a certain extend , as you said in capable hands only , out of that context ele is a burden , it lacks a lot of cc , is mostly downed , needing ppl to rez him and at at time where many pure dps classes bring something + to the table than only pure dps ele is overshadowed , i agree it is partially some classes are busted and have huge dps with a simple rotation , the only one who can bring something is catalyst , but the complecated rotation , the scuffed energy mechanic make him a "wish" version of the herald.

https://gw2wingman.nevermindcreations.de/popularity just explain to me why is ele the least played class for almost 4 years ? there is something fishy with it , and many ppl can point out what .

Lowest hp and armor combo of the whole game (for no reason today , there was a reason when the game launched , ele and guard where the only class with strong healing option beside the healing skill, completely not necessary today...)

Too hybrid to overly shine in a specific role (the only one being pure dps in very capable hands : and as said you can count with your two hands ppl able of it)

Complicated to play for no specific reason , just compare the dps/quickness catalyst vs herald ... 

Scuffed in many situation , like needing a cc force you to go in an attunement you don't want , while most classes have cc available in their two weapon switch or having your key cc attunement locked cause you just changed.

Except for tempest : worst utility skills ever made , arcane skills (who cares about a skill landing a crit. with 100% chance when you are already at 100% crit. chance ...), invocation who goes down when you mount up , conjured weapon ....

You are just being vague and don't give any example where it shines , ele is okay-ish.... , yes the whole 3 e-specs are least played than 2% but that's ok .... 

I played every class in the game and have +5000 hours on ele , so i can pratically say that playing ele atm is shooting in your own feet, especially new players whoi like the mage staff archetype the other game have (those ppl are gonna have a hard time and will think to some extend the game is open world hardcore , and once they go necro or any other huge hp class : easy mode unlocked !) , many class can play full zerk in open world try that with your ele with 11600 hp ...

It's normal to me to have some unrepresentative class in the game , like 1-2 e-spec , but 3 of them ??? no there is something wrong with ele , if literally nobody plays it that means the class is done wrong. But anet is going to an interesting direction the change to hammer and EE for catalyst maybe an end to the black tunnel , till it got nerfed cause 1 guy hit 50K on the golem or 10 catalyst beated up mursaat overseer in 20 secs.... that lone sentence depict the ele state for almost 5 years : 1 guy representing 0,0000001% of gw  2 community hit 60k hopla nerf ele for everyone ....

And about your take about elitism , it's 50/50 , some ppl are born elitist (make them feel special) and some are made elitist cause of lyers , my guild com was open to everyone with low kp or none for strike cm's to come and try , while insuring him they know how the boss works , guess what ? now he kicks everyone who don't have the kp ... can you blame him ?. some ppl are lyers and lazy and want the good stuff immediately without any effort like leeches even if they waste the time of 9 other ppl... there is born elitist and made elitist by the people complaining about elitism , i can safely say i am from the second part , if it's training we can fail all night it's ok , if it's fullclear , have exp. , 250kp/li blablabla , not knowing a mechanic isn't allowed to me and deserve an immediate kick , cause you wasted 9 ppl time  , lyed and are an egoist who don't care about the 9 other ppl in your squad ,ofc you can make an error , everyone make mistakes but there is a difference between making an error and not knowing a mechanic.

Being an egoist lyer leeching on those who have master the fight , took time to comprehend the fight and train many roles is for me by far worst than born elitism. Those people made their own demon ... a big part of elitsim community is born cause many people cannot be trusted , why do you think everyone ask for kp/li ? Trust is good , control is better !

 

Edited November 25, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[zeyeti.8347]

15 hours ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

I also couldn't care less for the support side argument you presented because I don't care to play support. I only play pure dps professions here. 

I lost that part , without playing any support , could it be dps/boon , healer/boon .... you think your opinion is valid without knowing how 40% of a classic squad for instanced content works ? My persoanl answer is no , how can you talk about balance when you don't know what 18 of the 27 e-spec can bring to the table , i don't want to be mean here , everybody can express his opinion .... but for ele you have tempest/alac dps and heal and catalyst/quickness , that makes 3 role and playstyle you don't know about and you talk about ele being fine while you know only 50% of it ... express your opinion but don't be surprised or offended people rise an eyebrown when they read that , it's like a fat guy grasping his breath while climbing 5 stairs telling you how to run and manage your stamina ... Sorry again , i really don't mean to be silly here , but with a sentence like that i can't take you seriously , when you talk about something and emit what you think is valid and solid statement you have to know the subject.

Edited November 25, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[Doctor Hide.6345]

10 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Thta's true to a certain extend , as you said in capable hands only , out of that context ele is a burden , it lacks a lot of cc , is mostly downed , needing ppl to rez him and at at time where many pure dps classes bring something + to the table than only pure dps ele is overshadowed , i agree it is partially some classes are busted and have huge dps with a simple rotation , the only one who can bring something is catalyst , but the complecated rotation , the scuffed energy mechanic make him a "wish" version of the herald.

https://gw2wingman.nevermindcreations.de/popularity just explain to me why is ele the least played class for almost 4 years ? there is something fishy with it , and many ppl can point out what .

Lowest hp and armor combo of the whole game (for no reason today , there was a reason when the game launched , ele and guard where the only class with strong healing option beside the healing skill, completely not necessary today...)

Too hybrid to overly shine in a specific role (the only one being pure dps in very capable hands : and as said you can count with your two hands ppl able of it)

Complicated to play for no specific reason , just compare the dps/quickness catalyst vs herald ... 

Scuffed in many situation , like needing a cc force you to go in an attunement you don't want , while most classes have cc available in their two weapon switch or having your key cc attunement locked cause you just changed.

Except for tempest : worst utility skills ever made , arcane skills (who cares about a skill landing a crit. with 100% chance when you are already at 100% crit. chance ...), invocation who goes down when you mount up , conjured weapon ....

You are just being vague and don't give any example where it shines , ele is okay-ish.... , yes the whole 3 e-specs are least played than 2% but that's ok .... 

I played every class in the game and have +5000 hours on ele , so i can pratically say that playing ele atm is shooting in your own feet, especially new players whoi like the mage staff archetype the other game have (those ppl are gonna have a hard time and will think to some extend the game is open world hardcore , and once they go necro or any other huge hp class : easy mode unlocked !) , many class can play full zerk in open world try that with your ele with 11600 hp ...

It's normal to me to have some unrepresentative class in the game , like 1-2 e-spec , but 3 of them ??? no there is something wrong with ele , if literally nobody plays it that means the class is done wrong. But anet is going to an interesting direction the change to hammer and EE for catalyst maybe an end to the black tunnel , till it got nerfed cause 1 guy hit 50K on the golem or 10 catalyst beated up mursaat overseer in 20 secs.... that lone sentence depict the ele state for almost 5 years : 1 guy representing 0,0000001% of gw  2 community hit 60k hopla nerf ele for everyone ....

And about your take about elitism , it's 50/50 , some ppl are born elitist (make them feel special) and some are made elitist cause of lyers , my guild com was open to everyone with low kp or none for strike cm's to come and try , while insuring him they know how the boss works , guess what ? now he kicks everyone who don't have the kp ... can you blame him ?. some ppl are lyers and lazy and want the good stuff immediately without any effort like leeches even if they waste the time of 9 other ppl... there is born elitist and made elitist by the people complaining about elitism , i can safely say i am from the second part , if it's training we can fail all night it's ok , if it's fullclear , have exp. , 250kp/li blablabla , not knowing a mechanic isn't allowed to me and deserve an immediate kick , cause you wasted 9 ppl time  , lyed and are an egoist who don't care about the 9 other ppl in your squad ,ofc you can make an error , everyone make mistakes but there is a difference between making an error and not knowing a mechanic.

Being an egoist lyer leeching on those who have master the fight , took time to comprehend the fight and train many roles is for me by far worst than born elitism. Those people made their own demon ... a big part of elitsim community is born cause many people cannot be trusted , why do you think everyone ask for kp/li ? Trust is good , control is better !

 

I don't see that low representative numbers as a problem still with the class still. It can do the numbers which is all I care about on the pure dps side. That is good enough for me. I am not saying it has some issues and is 100% perfect all the time, but what some of these people want change wise is absolute foolishness. I will fight tooth and nail against those that want to add more HP and make it less complex just because they are lazy kitttens who don't want to put forth the work to properly master it. I can't stand that middle school level of people demanding such things trying to take the easy way out. I say middle school because I work at one, and some of the people here with what they wanted sound just like middle schoolers being lazy and not wanting to put forth effort to learn the class. 

About your Elitist take, my take was more on people kicking people just because they brought a dps they didn't like, but they never once mentioned in description saying no of this class. To me that is Elitism, but like I said that one is more rare. As for your why part, I get that because people do lie and cheat their way to the top. I am always the one to watch guides and read builds and such, so I am not a burden to groups to the best of my abilities minus learning the fight still. I have no problem with those groups demanding kpi because training runs exists, but I do suppose have a problem demaning kpi and experience when joining a group when it wasn't even mentioned it was needed in the description. Those who demand after the fact just want a free ride imo.

[Doctor Hide.6345]

13 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

I lost that part , without playing any support , could it be dps/boon , healer/boon .... you think your opinion is valid without knowing how 40% of a classic squad for instanced content works ? My persoanl answer is no , how can you talk about balance when you don't know what 18 of the 27 e-spec can bring to the table , i don't want to be mean here , everybody can express his opinion .... but for ele you have tempest/alac dps and heal and catalyst/quickness , that makes 3 role and playstyle you don't know about and you talk about ele being fine while you know only 50% of it ... express your opinion but don't be surprised or offended people rise an eyebrown when they read that , it's like a fat guy grasping his breath while climbing 5 stairs telling you how to run and manage your stamina ... Sorry again , i really don't mean to be silly here , but with a sentence like that i can't take you seriously , when you talk about something and emit what you think is valid and solid statement you have to know the subject.

I say it is valid because not everyone has to enjoy and play everything to have knowledge about a class. It is ok for people like me to just focus on the pure dps side and be masters of the pure dps side. We don't have to know the boon/support side. You may say we have too, but I can hold your opinion just as foolish as you hold mine on the matter if that is your take. So, I can't take yours seriously either than if that is your stance on it. I can see yours as just another kitten person trying to change the class to fit their lazy middle school means if that is the road you want to travel down going forward. 

Or, we can accept we each have a different view on what mastering the class means, so I can respect yours and you can respect I know the pure dps side well and leave it at that. Because I don't like how support plays on GW2. I just don't. I think it is kitten foolish, so I never bothered with it. I prefer support play more on the traditional role side like in FF14 playing healers there.

Edit: I am just tacking this on here because I don't want to post three in a row if I can help it. This is from another thread that was brought up. I am not against QOL changes like bug fixes or buffing numbers. I am ok with that. What I am more against is changing it to be easier to play by buffing HP and making rotations less complex for the sake of those kittens without brains. I am also against added support for pure dps specs, but I am fine with more selfish utility(mainly more self cleansing, self healing, self boons , and more CC. none of it is sharable) on a pure dps build for purity of purpose and personal beliefs. I am god kitten sick and tired of people thinking everything has to be support in some manner for the game, so I will fight my hardest to keep things pure dps because that is what I enjoy about the professions here that I play. I like being a selfish dps. Not everyone enjoys being a slave to the group giving out boons and heals here. But you want to add more dps, I am for that because it doesn't change the core of the specs I play.

Edited November 25, 2023 by Doctor Hide.6345

[zeyeti.8347]

11 hours ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

Edit: I am just tacking this on here because I don't want to post three in a row if I can help it. This is from another thread that was brought up. I am not against QOL changes like bug fixes or buffing numbers. I am ok with that. What I am more against is changing it to be easier to play by buffing HP and making rotations less complex for the sake of those kittens without brains. I am also against added support for pure dps specs, but I am fine with more selfish utility(mainly more self cleansing, self healing, self boons , and more CC. none of it is sharable) on a pure dps build for purity of purpose and personal beliefs. I am god kitten sick and tired of people thinking everything has to be support in some manner for the game, so I will fight my hardest to keep things pure dps because that is what I enjoy about the professions here that I play. I like being a selfish dps. Not everyone enjoys being a slave to the group giving out boons and heals here. But you want to add more dps, I am for that because it doesn't change the core of the specs I play.

Then we are in for a draw , ele has many way to be played and your take is foolish too , you know the dps side well ? then some insights about the advantages of playing dps as ele should be told by you , i prove points about with data and some really known issues with it , while you just say i like it that way , fact is when someone isn't played at all , there is a problem and being told by someone who only play dps and for such has to do 0 mechanic on pratically 75% of the "hard" content is way too funny to read , you know you play mostly like you are against the raid training golem when you have good support with you , matter of taste and chocie but we leave in a democracy and many ppl are in for a big change to ele as it is not played at all , again there is a way to make it more efficient without putting higher numbers , the change to EE next patch will not increase catalyst dps , but will ensure beginners with this class will get more from EE last trait.

And yes your opinion isn't valid , cause you surely don't know tempest is considered for many as a lackluster healer (one of the worst healer who is "meta"), but how could i explain it ? you don't know how it plays , you play only selfish dps classes , would be also great to have some insights for what you have achieved with this class.... Personnaly i can't do it , cause i play a variety of classes depending  of nerfs and buffs , cause being inefficient for me isn't fun at all.

And as suppport i don't feel like a slave , it's more ppl who are slave to you cause they need you more than you need them , loosing one healer is more gonna result in a wipe than loosing a dps.

Also when you don't know how 50% of tools of a class work , you can't have an objective view of how it should be balanced , thats just facts , if this skill or thats skill is changed or this trait and blblabla , how is it gonna affect the support part of the classes , many of us know , you not !

I reject your reality and place it with my own , thats says long about your mentality ... narrow view of the game and rejecting reality to meld it in your own , you make me think about toxic feminism who get humbled but retract in their own biased reality to confort their galactic size ego.

Edited November 26, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[Doctor Hide.6345]

6 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Then we are in for a draw , ele has many way to be played and your take is foolish too , you know the dps side well ? then some insights about the advantages of playing dps as ele should be told by you , i prove points about with data and some really known issues with it , while you just say i like it that way , fact is when someone isn't played at all , there is a problem and being told by someone who only play dps and for such has to do 0 mechanic on pratically 75% of the "hard" content is way too funny to read , you know you play mostly like you are against the raid training golem when you have good support with you , matter of taste and chocie but we leave in a democracy and many ppl are in for a big change to ele as it is not played at all , again there is a way to make it more efficient without putting higher numbers , the change to EE next patch will not increase catalyst dps , but will ensure beginners with this class will get more from EE last trait.

And yes your opinion isn't valid , cause you surely don't know tempest is considered for many as a lackluster healer (one of the worst healer who is "meta"), but how could i explain it ? you don't know how it plays , you play only selfish dps classes , would be also great to have some insights for what you have achieved with this class.... Personnaly i can't do it , cause i play a variety of classes depending  of nerfs and buffs , cause being inefficient for me isn't fun at all.

And as suppport i don't feel like a slave , it's more ppl who are slave to you cause they need you more than you need them , loosing one healer is more gonna result in a wipe than loosing a dps.

Also when you don't know how 50% of tools of a class work , you can't have an objective view of how it should be balanced , thats just facts , if this skill or thats skill is changed or this trait and blblabla , how is it gonna affect the support part of the classes , many of us know , you not !

I reject your reality and place it with my own , thats says long about your mentality ... narrow view of the game and rejecting reality to meld it in your own , you make me think about toxic feminism who get humbled but retract in their own biased reality to confort their galactic size ego.

If that is the way you want to play it, then I say it is draw because your take is now that of a child and irrelevant in my eyes. There is no more that can be said between us because we will not agree. Good Bye. 🙂

[zeyeti.8347]

Just now, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

If that is the way you want to play it, then I say it is draw because your take is now that of a child and irrelevant in my eyes. There is no more that can be said between us because we will not agree. Good Bye. 🙂

cya, rather be a child than a reality melding shapeshifter.

Edited November 26, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[Doctor Hide.6345]

     With that small discussion out of the way, I can post this. This is what I came to decision wise if Ele needs to shine in my opinion. I will retract some of what I said about no changes after thinking about it some. I would be fine if Ele got more self boons, self cleansing, self healing, and more CC built into skills mainly on Weaver and Catalyst. I am fine still with the low health and complex nature of the rotations, but if they built more into the self support(not sharing side), I think it would shine as the pure dps class that can stand on its own while not being brain dead easy to play. Plus, I would love it if group support was no longer needed it for it function well, but I know that won't happen. That curse of boonball will always be there for most encounters, but if they could lesson it when it doesn't have to be in the boonball, I say it would help it at least for the pure dps side being more self sufficient. That is my compromise at least in my opinion if I wanted it to get an identity.