January 30 Balance Update Preview

[Antioche.7034]

Despite the being the highest bench, mirage was still one of the least played specs. Now it's being toned down, and way too much. Couldn't you just nerf it by 1/2k ? This spec is one of the hardest in the game, nobody plays it, and it still gets yeeted to lower damage than way more easy to play specs ... 

[Kauna Arget.7052]

Mixed feeling on this patch. Some of the relic changes are really nice. I like we're nerfing instead of straight buffing everyone up to the top level currently seen. I dislike some of the nerf decisions' impacts on other builds. For context I'm a PvE main (mesmer - heal and boon chronos, chaos cvirt, pvirt and hqh) who mostly does raids/strikes/fractals (training, normal clears and CM clears).

Playing hchrono in fractals has made me try to find ways to fit resistance into my build without sacrificing too much utility (taking glamours - could the uptime of resistance on glamours be increased as it's basically only feedback you can fit into your skill bar?) or healing (taking the GM trait with resistance on distort instead of the heal/cleanse on shatter trait) to try and keep up with people's expectations from the firebrand meta. The new resistance relic will really help with that as hchrono tends to run heal mantra anyway. If Flock relic turns all excess healing, not just that from the relic, into barrier then I think it might be a little overpowered on certain specs depending on the level of barrier it gets turned into.

I don't suppose standardising the range of a relic's effect would be a thing on the list anywhere? Knowing my boons are 360 but my relic is 300 (also why is chrono aegis on distort 300 not 360?) means I have to keep track of several different ranges at once. But then some relics are 360. The 600 range for mesmer f2 chaos aura regen is weird but nice and I don't have to worry about that.

I'm not a fan of the nerf to the heal herald might ramp up (which is slow compared to a lot of other healers). Yes herald will still have great boons, but if its alacrity support doesn't do much might, it will take much longer now to get to 25 stacks.

My main concern is the chaos nerfs. I've played chaos virtuoso since nearly EoD release. I won't lie, it has been my favourite build in the game for a long time because I can do a lot with it (comes from being a mesmer main for 80% of my over 10k hours playtime). It doesn't do as much damage as dueling condition virtuoso, but has more utility (some small boons, access to aegis, some other niche use cases) and is more low intensity/safer for those who need something that can do ok dps in instanced endgame PvE content. It's being hit harshly by these "mirage nerfs" and will no longer be anywhere near close to its dueling counterpart (needing a gear change and also having a nerf to its damage traits), which is compounding the "needs other people to help with chaos aura to do its best damage" thing from the last patch.

The mesmer mantra change is nice. I really like the mantra of pain change and restorative mantras change, which has been needed since mantras got "reverted" to their worse state of having to charge them. I'm concerned about the change to mantra of distraction and it no longer ccing if you accidentally untarget before you press it but wasting the charge. Or is it now going to be an aoe around you for ccing? With Mantra of Resolve being changed to 360, is the trait (Mender's Purity) also going to be changed to 360 to bring Lesser Power Cleanse in line with its skill counterpart? Power Cleanse is already 360.

Might as well also mention that the balance design where some classes can do "roaming boons" like herald, firebrand and renegade and don't need a target, compared to some like berserker and chrono who need a target to do their boons (by boons I mean quickness and alacrity) along with the various ranges makes some of them not so appealing in the vast majority of groups. Any group can take a herald (as long as they have a heal alac), but you have to build around taking a berserker or a catalyst say and they aren't great if the fight moves or there is a long "waiting" phase.
Any chance we can have more Slow sources in the game so I can take Danger Time again instead of Improved Alacrity constantly? All PvE chronos are basically stuck with IA right now as even trying super hard to do slow themselves, they won't do a decent amount of it 😞

[FreshF.5793]

On 1/12/2024 at 12:26 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Adaptive Armor: This trait has been reworked. Your function gyro has two ammunition and grants barrier to allies when cast. Function Gyro no longer has an increased recharge when creating additional gyros but has a higher base recharge.

This means PvE-Heal-Quickness Scrapper won't be profiting from this Trait?

That sucks 😞

[FrozenFlame.5163]

On 1/12/2024 at 12:26 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Mesmer

• Restorative Mantras: This trait now triggers when using a mantra ammunition skill instead of when charging a mantra. Reduced the base healing from 1,640 to 820. Reduced the healing coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5.

You talk about WvW Support Mesmer overperforming and then you nerf a huge part of support chrono build for PVE... 
Why is this change not WvW only?!
Aegis Boon Support Chrono will be gutted with this change.

[Zenith.7301]

Power mesmer builds in the PvE gutter outside golem benchmarks, and they decide to nuke out of orbit the one competitive but high ramp up and poor target swap condi build that doesn't have the luxury of staying in range.

 

Chronomancer in PvE is just a worse support and DPS option given its skill floor, ceiling, and DPS relative to the alternatives.

[Mevelios.4809]

On 1/12/2024 at 12:26 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

• Relic of the Flock: This relic now heals instead of granting barrier. Excess healing is converted to barrier.

That one I disapprove wholeheartedly. For the sake of balance, it's true you don't exactly want to ease barrier access on ordinary healer profiles, if they can resort frequently enough to their healing skill. But there are so many synergies allowing regen or smaller heals to kick in while the barrier covers the next hit, so you can actually have a pick worth considering other than the relic of the monk... A shame!

[Makc.7302]

This is my 1st reply ever I guess but all I want to say is: if you want to balance SPvP deadeye MAKE the only dmging options DE has while wielding rifle is when it kneels! Playstyle revolving around spaming 2 is extremly onbonious for players to face and cheesy cause of several reasons:
1) rifle 2 is the highest costeffective damaging skill. It does respectable amount of dmg, has good range, projectyle speed and for SOME reasons slows the target down while giving DE swiftness which leads to simple kiting and zooming around the target (some specs can't do anything against this alone).
2) kneeling is useless for anything but stealth + mobility. With easy acess to stealth and shadows traitline rifle DE can blink around the map and rotate. Spotter's shot does no damage (which is somewhat fine) but three round burst is weaker then 2 skirmisher's shots, puts DE in disadvantegous position and way more punishing is it does not hit. Change that.
3) Shadows traitline is busted: gives survivability, decent damage, a lot of condition cleansing (wchich IMO it should not do) and two most important things: insane initiative gain and combat in and out of combat movility (cause of ini reneneration).
4) DE has 5 additional ways to enter stealth: steal skills, elite, 1 rly good utility (shadow gust) and simple dodge rolling. That skyrockets safety and initiative gain of DE which leads to mobility and very high and spamable damage.
5) Thief having initiative is an issue. It allows profession to disangage and re-engage under extremly benefitial circumstances. Initiative should in theory balance it but not when build regeins it SO FAST.
All this insane mobility, stealth acess, high burst damage and very high survivability (cause of stealth and mobility) leads to kinda toxic playstyle (which is extremly fun, I'll admit). DE can easely reset fights and re-engage while other professions will have their CD's and will have no ability to fight back (or it will be pointless to cause thief ca simple blink away and distance itself from the threat).

So what would I suggest:
1) Nefr skirmishers shot by either increasing it's ini cost to 4 or lower it's damage by 35%.
2) Buff double tap by reducing it's ini cost to 4 and lower it's damage by 10%
3) Increase Three Round Burst Damage by 10% or give it PVE might generation (3 per hit instead of 1 per hit) and lower it's ini cost to 4.
4) Reduce Shadow's Rejuvenation initiative gain to 1 on enter and 1 on exit
5) Increase silent scope's stealth duration to 2 seconds but give it 10 second CD.
6) Mercy should completly remove Deaeye's Mark leading to One in the Chamber trait not giving stolen skill.
7) Free Action (Standing up From Kneel) should not be acesable imideatly after kneeling. Give this skill 2.5 second of Cooldown.

Everything that I wrote is aimed at sPvP and Rifle, I believe Thief in general has some issues which I haven't covered.

Edited January 13 by Makc.7302

[xXxOrcaxXx.9328]

CMC, hear my prayer!
Bring back the real Crippling Throw as long as GS4 hasn't blocked anything yet. I want to be able to assert my dominance over an enemy by forgoing puny blocks in favor of throwing my GS right in their face!

Edited January 13 by xXxOrcaxXx.9328

[AlexndrTheGreat.8310]

For Ranger since that’s what I play:

Glad to see greatsword being buffed again. It’s been left in the dust for a while now so good to see that it may be usable again

Let Loose giving might was definitely what it needed. Quickness dps Untamed brought nothing outside of damage, so at least they’ll have some other boon support now. Heal Untamed as well, probably don’t need to bring Flame Trap anymore to blast might for the group. Still would like to see other support abilities be added to Untamed to fill in the gaps, notably stability in some way?

No comment on Carrion Devourer nerf. Didn’t swap over to it so I don’t know how good/bad it is now. Is nice though to see really niche pets come up in some builds instead of the staple stable we’ve had for years.

Another charge on Barrage sounds fun. If only for the meme Arrowcart Ranger build, having a 2nd charge of LB5 to initiate combat can help get you into combat and activate QuickDraw.

[RasSativa.5109]

Still not a single nerf on harbinger in wvw. Seems like anet likes an overpowerd build that is unkillable. Take a close look ar some specs in certain asoects of the game. They outperform and mak the game unfun for players of lower level

[Yorna.7150]

I like the mesmer changes. As mesmer is my most played class for the past ~7 years we mesmer mains shouldn't dream of being good at anything other than jump puzzles portal specialist.

 

yes that's sarcasm

 

 

Edited January 13 by Yorna.7150

[RasSativa.5109]

For heal mesmer we will need to see what the changes bring. I dont like using mantras much but seems like they will get a nerf. 
 

is it possible to fix illusion off life to actually revive in pve. 
 

the mirage nerfs are harsh and will tank alacmirage once more. Seems like the purple class gets the big axe today

[Geronmy.3298]

38 minutes ago, RasSativa.5109 said:

Seems like the purple class gets the big axe today

Which is ironic. We got the big axe by getting a smaller axe.

[Luki Hofi.9058]

no not condi hammer
condi cata was a nice thing for OW and dps if you want to not play condi tempest

back to the hole of suffering

[Jski.6180]

The relic update is better for the ele class then the ele update lol.

[Shagie.7612]

you recognize that firebrand is bad in pvp, so you buff it for the class that already has the best support build in the game by a considerable margin

but renegade, the other equally as bad elite, just nah?
with this, it's unarguably the worst elite in the game in pvp and it's approaching nearly 4 years of it.

c'mon lol

[Myror.7521]

@Goosekilla.2796 i gues they do not touch the condi zerker build cause of:

1: it is only slightly in the meta rn (with slightly i mean that it might got punished away by other meta Builds souch as Druid)

 

2: there is actually no real other build for warr that is even nearly meta lvl ...... cause the meta is heavy ranged spamy and for some weird reason every class get good ranged weapon .... besides Warrior..... wich got also punished by get its dmg Ressources halfed cause of a "CC shouldnt do any DMG" Nerf 

[ShadowKatt.6740]

55 minutes ago, Yorna.7150 said:

I like the mesmer changes. As mesmer is my most played class for the past ~7 years we mesmer mains shouldn't dream of being good at anything other than jump puzzles portal specialist.

 

yes that's sarcasm.

Your sarcasm has been heard and summarily ignored.

NOW GET BACK TO YOUR JUMPING PUZZLE AND I BETTER NOT HEAR THAT TV!

[scerevisiae.1972]

How the frick are you not nerfing Vindicator sustain?

 

Currently 1 remotely competent vindi can tank up to 5 player's damage indefinitely by chaining constant dodges & OP alliance evades plus insane barrier from salvation, insane boons from alliance, insane mobility from shiro + greatsword, solid (but not amazing) damage from shortbow, plus vigour relic + energy sigils... it's ridiculous.

 

Pretty much the most OP thing in the game rn in WVW.

 

[Skyroar.2974]

On 1/11/2024 at 11:26 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Revenant

In addition to toning down the damage of power vindicator in PvE, we've made some minor adjustments to axe to improve its usability for condition builds.

• Frigid Blitz: This skill no longer inflicts slow. This skill now also inflicts torment.

I think this change is a bit misguided.

Revenant, as an energy-driven, low-cooldown class, doesn't needs a full, 5-weapon skill DPS rotation. The entire point of the class's main mechanic, similar to Thief's initiative, is about rewarding decision making, not about spamming everything you have. Otherwise, what's the point of energy? Why not just remove it entirely, or at least why not just remove energy costs from weapon skills, if you want every single skill to be used in rotations?

I do think the slow effect didn't have much purpose in it neither (it's a mobility skill, not a defensive skill), and maybe torment will be slightly better, but Anet should actually worry about improving this skills' primary purpose first, before turning it into generic DPS skill number 5.

As it is now, Frigid Blitz is kind of clumsy as a mobility skill. It's slow, it puts the player in a weird position (behind the target' back) and has some additional animation after the shadowstep is over. It feels bad to use it. Make it faster; improve its range slightly too; and it'll feel much better to use. Perhaps give it an additional effect, like a leap finisher, to give us an aura. Something that stands out, that leads to decision-making. "Should I spend energy for this skill, or for another one?" is the essence of Revenant's gameplay.

Even with additional damage, I don't think the clumsiness of the skill will make it enjoyable to use in instance PvE, as it forces players to teleport behind target's backs.

Edited January 13 by Skyroar.2974

[LENDECHY.8014]

Why does the chaos traitline has to suffer to nerf a build nobody uses, like didnt u hitted enought with the chaos aura thing?? Is this a declaration that chaos will not ever be a viable dps spec??

Idk, to be honest Im more concerned about chaos virt because i like that build a lot, i mean, i do everything with it and it got buff nerfed at the same time las time while the dueling version got straight buffed, and now, even if condi mirage uses both dueling and chaos you decide to hit chaos again??? And me hoping u could buff it or at least revert the chaos aura thing but hey, rn i just hope u revert this...

[HotDelirium.7984]

Balance Team, I don't want to assume where you are getting your benchmarks from so I will say IF you are not using meta and non meta builds in regular PVE encounters, every strike and every raid then you are doing US, the customer, a disservice. Those nerfs to mirage, a class that is barely played at all is distressing. This affects alacmirage also. I thought damage potential wasn't going to be much of a factor going forward?

[the krytan assassin.9235]

This has got to be one of the worst balance changes Ive seen in my 11 years of playing this game. 

This preview proves again that the devs have absolutely no clue whats going on in terms of instanced PvE and only take a look at the snowcrows benchmark lists for their balance changes. 

How can you be so completely detached from your own game that you think that builds such as Mirage, condi holo, condi Weaver/Tempest and quick untamed  are overperforming while simultaneously making absolutely no remark about the absolutely broken state that for example cvirt, pslb and Reaper are currently in. 

The nerfs to karakosa relic also seems really weird. NOBODY wants to go back to the Monk relic meta. Karakosa is currently not overperforming and theres actually a nice spread across the relics for support. On top of that the relic actually facilitated unique healing builds that will now become absolutely useless again. 

If you actually want to start nerfing some of the overperforming builds, id probably recommend starting to take a look at https://gw2wingman.nevermindcreations.de/popularity 

Edited January 13 by the krytan assassin.9235

[HotDelirium.7984]

2 hours ago, RasSativa.5109 said:

For heal mesmer we will need to see what the changes bring. I dont like using mantras much but seems like they will get a nerf. 
 

is it possible to fix illusion off life to actually revive in pve. 
 

the mirage nerfs are harsh and will tank alacmirage once more. Seems like the purple class gets the big axe today

mantras only heal after the prep and not on the charge AND you can't do anything else besides shatter while preparing. Quickness helps but activating all 4 mantras will take 5 to 8 seconds of not using other skills. whew

[XenesisII.1540]

I mean.. same dev that nuked mirage dodge for 3 years, what did you all expect.....

😒