Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trise.2865 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological manipulation and trickery. It's called induced compulsion; commonly known as the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airdive.2613 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.It's not exciting, it's inflation. In a bigger picture, it's fairly pointless to play these games except during the holidays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Sure it is different ... by your OWN admission that GW2 doesn't give out rewards like you are describing in this other game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Yah but since these games exist, gw2 should update and adapt, why would you be against more exciting rewards anyways or free stuff? Am I missing something here lol? It's 2019 not 2012, games give out exciting loot, gw2 should follow suite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trise.2865 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. I've already gotten in trouble for trying to help other gambling addicts on these forums, so I'll just echo "there's more to gaming than the loot tables" and leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Sure it is different ... by your OWN admission that GW2 doesn't give out rewards like you are describing in this other game. You could play gw2 and lose self control and drop $10k on gems, there is no difference. Especially when gatcha games straight up give you an option to select a unit. Its the same as going on the gw2 TP and buying what you want with your gems converted to gold or just buying something from the gem store with gems. The gatcha is the same as the black lion chest which they keep making more enticing, I dont see the difference or get your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Yah but since these games exist, gw2 should update and adapt, why would you be against more exciting rewards anyways or free stuff? Am I missing something here lol? It's 2019 not 2012, games give out exciting loot, gw2 should follow suite.The existence of these other games is not a reason for Gw2 to update and adapt. GW2 has a business model that works because its market supports it well enough to stay in business. Clearly, if the market wasn't satisfied with the game, the game would fade away and not be supported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Yah but since these games exist, gw2 should update and adapt, why would you be against more exciting rewards anyways or free stuff? Am I missing something here lol? It's 2019 not 2012, games give out exciting loot, gw2 should follow suite.The existence of these other games is not a reason for Gw2 to update and adapt. GW2 has a business model that works because its market supports it well enough to stay in business. Clearly, if the market wasn't satisfied with the game, the game would fade away and not be supported. I'm noticing a lot less players, my friends list is always empty, wvw and pvp, nobody is around... Making loot more exciting or impactful could only help, especially since gamers in 2019 have come to expect this and are used to it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Sure it is different ... by your OWN admission that GW2 doesn't give out rewards like you are describing in this other game. You could play gw2 and lose self control and drop $10k on gems, there is no difference. Especially when gatcha games straight up give you an option to select a unit. Its the same as going on the gw2 TP and buying what you want with your gems converted to gold or just buying something from the gem store with gems. The gatcha is the same as the black lion chest which they keep making more enticing, I dont see the difference or get your point.No, there is a HUGE difference ... the example you provided of the other game is giving you some rewards for free ... what you are describing here is something players have to pay for or earn in GW2 ... you aren't making relevant comparisons here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Yah but since these games exist, gw2 should update and adapt, why would you be against more exciting rewards anyways or free stuff? Am I missing something here lol? It's 2019 not 2012, games give out exciting loot, gw2 should follow suite.The existence of these other games is not a reason for Gw2 to update and adapt. GW2 has a business model that works because its market supports it well enough to stay in business. Clearly, if the market wasn't satisfied with the game, the game would fade away and not be supported. I'm noticing a lot less players, my friends list is always empty, wvw and pvp, nobody is around...I don't see the relevance ... if the business model wasn't working, GW2 wouldn't be here. It needs people buying gems to sustain ... clearly people are doing so, regardless of your friends list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Sure it is different ... by your OWN admission that GW2 doesn't give out rewards like you are describing in this other game. You could play gw2 and lose self control and drop $10k on gems, there is no difference. Especially when gatcha games straight up give you an option to select a unit. Its the same as going on the gw2 TP and buying what you want with your gems converted to gold or just buying something from the gem store with gems. The gatcha is the same as the black lion chest which they keep making more enticing, I dont see the difference or get your point.No, there is a HUGE difference ... the other game is giving you these rewards for free ... what you are describing is something players have to pay for or earn in GW2 ... you aren't making relevant comparisons here. Europe already determined the black lion chest is the same as a loot box which is the same as a gatcha roll. Playing the game itself is one large gatcha roll, there are legendary precursors hidden amongst the mobs. It's all the same addictive chance based model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.So, this gives you enough rewards then? You’ve found a way to play this game for 6 years. GW1 for multiple as well. You have evidently been entertained enough to keep playing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Of course it is. Because they've assigned such a ridiculous cash/effort value to those pulls, literally rolling on a slot machine for something that MIGHT be rewarding, that you feel like you've been rewarded when all they've done is waste your time and blinked lights in your face... like every slot machine. Yes, it feels good, it feels like you've won! It feels like you want to keep playing, keep going, maybe drop some money in to feel that rush again... and, think about getting that it when you're not playing... It's all calculated psychological trickery, it's called induced compulsion, or the "Skinner box" technique. Casinos have been doing this for nearly a century. And it is very, VERY dangerous.It's no different then playing gw2? And I'm mostly f2p on gatcha games so I dont see where the danger is. People should have more self control. Sure it is different ... by your OWN admission that GW2 doesn't give out rewards like you are describing in this other game. You could play gw2 and lose self control and drop $10k on gems, there is no difference. Especially when gatcha games straight up give you an option to select a unit. Its the same as going on the gw2 TP and buying what you want with your gems converted to gold or just buying something from the gem store with gems. The gatcha is the same as the black lion chest which they keep making more enticing, I dont see the difference or get your point.No, there is a HUGE difference ... the other game is giving you these rewards for free ... what you are describing is something players have to pay for or earn in GW2 ... you aren't making relevant comparisons here. Europe already determined the black lion chest is the same as a loot box which is the same as a gatcha roll. I don't see the relevance. You were providing an example of a game that was great because it was giving players free rewards ... GW2 doesn't give free rewards, yet you say the games are the same in this regard. That's a contradiction that makes your comparison meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Strider Pj.2193 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.So, this gives you enough rewards then? You’ve found a way to play this game for 6 years. GW1 for multiple as well. You have evidently been entertained enough to keep playing?Hi strider lol, gatchas spoil players and make gw2 feel lackluster, we need more rewards the game feels unrewarding and stale in my opinion. The reward model hasent changed in years, I think that's a problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Strider Pj.2193 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.So, this gives you enough rewards then? You’ve found a way to play this game for 6 years. GW1 for multiple as well. You have evidently been entertained enough to keep playing?Hi strider lol, gatchas spoil players and make gw2 feel lackluster, we need more rewards the game feels unrewarding and stale in my opinion. The rewards havent changed in years, I think that's a problemBut in other games, you claim those gatchas are awesome ... so really you are saying GW2 shouldn't have them and other games are awesome because they do? I mean, do you have congruent point here or not? Why would you even reference other games that contradict your point?The matter here is pretty simple; I see no business case for Anet to change their rewards system; there isn't any information we have to suggest it would make it a better business for them or it's players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Strider Pj.2193 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.So, this gives you enough rewards then? You’ve found a way to play this game for 6 years. GW1 for multiple as well. You have evidently been entertained enough to keep playing?Hi strider lol, gatchas spoil players and make gw2 feel lackluster, we need more rewards the game feels unrewarding and stale in my opinion. The rewards havent changed in years, I think that's a problemBut in other games, you claim those gatchas are awesome ... so really you are saying GW2 shouldn't have them and other games are awesome because they do? I mean, do you have congruent point here or not? Why would you even reference other games that contradict your point?Well once you get used to that kind of loot and it becomes the norm, there is no going back. They opened pandora box, that's why gatcha games are exploding in popularity, the loot is exciting and impactful. Gw2 should be looking at this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Zohane.7208 said:@"Arsenic Touch.7960" said:More meaningful rewards, yes. The amount of rewards is fine, if not too much at times, the problem is that most of the time it's kitten.I'd be intereested in examples of what you'd consider "more meaningful" rewads. It would make it easier for me (and possibly others) to have an opinion about this.It would also be interesting to see how you envision these rewards to keep feeling meaningful, without entering an ever increasing spiral of better and better rewards (to counter the devaluation when rewards become too commonplace).I'm not him but since I agree with him perhaps it's worth adding a couple of thoughts on the topic. So let's look at the current loot experience in GW2. When I go into the world and do a variety of open world activities my inventory fills up quickly, especially with a meta event. Take Auric Basin for example. You go in, do the meta and go below the city to loot. Lots of rooms with lots of chests in a variety of sizes. It takes almost as much time to loot them as it takes to do the meta itself. At least it feels that way. Point is, it feels like you're getting a lot of loot. And indeed my 200 slots of inventory space are pretty much filled. But what did I get? Well first things first. Salvage everything that is masterwork (green) or less. deposit everything. Then open up the 10 varieties of bags/containers that contain loot within loot. So exotic looking bags that give you some basic salvage stuff again or some random materials directly. Some loot bags also give more loot bags. So the chore continues. Then when all masterwork stuff and lower has been revealed and salvaged and deposited without really checking what that got me, I got to the rares (yellow) and do the same things, just with a better salvage option. I get a bunch of materials, some rare. The I have one or two exotics than come out of that and salvage them too. So I have at least some ecto's to show for it. Handy but just another material like the others.Now what's exciting about that? The problem is that GW2 has layers upon layers in crafting and in loot but rarely do you get something that is really exciting. And I can go all evening just doing things like that and kill legendary bounties and still get no legendary loot. Because at the end of the day, the chance of winning something really cool is extremely low and we get tons of loot that's just more of the same. In GW1 when you got an ecto that was something. It was a direct link to an armor set you were collecting like obsidian and it was a currency of its own. It cost 10 gold each and though the currencies are not the same 18 silver and needing hundreds of them for various items that you need to create other items to make other items that will make you the final item, just takes the excitement out of it.So the problem in GW2 is that I do want loot to be more meaningful, but I'm not sure how they would do that without revamping the game in a big way because crafting, TP trading, gems, real money and cash shop items are all linked to each other and to loot in game as well. But I think part of the problem is that exotic gear is so easy to get that it's problematic as well. Getting green or gold weapons in GW1 was more of a chase and felt more rewarding than going to the TP or a karma vendor a buying it straight up after leveling up casually because you have way more gold than you need to get full exotic gear the moment you hit 80. So I guess I wish that exotic gear had more meaning because there is a big difference in the value of exotic items and actually crafting exotic gear...crafting it is a lot more expensive but that makes no sense compared to the prices of exotic loot on the TP and such. So any meaning in loot is pretty much non-existent because of the way things are set up in my view.And the harder to get skins that are cool usually are from BL currency. That's how that ties into it. I've got a really cool staff. I bought it for a few hundred gold. That's the sort of thing that used to drop from bosses in games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Strider Pj.2193 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.So, this gives you enough rewards then? You’ve found a way to play this game for 6 years. GW1 for multiple as well. You have evidently been entertained enough to keep playing?Hi strider lol, gatchas spoil players and make gw2 feel lackluster, we need more rewards the game feels unrewarding and stale in my opinion. The rewards havent changed in years, I think that's a problemBut in other games, you claim those gatchas are awesome ... so really you are saying GW2 shouldn't have them and other games are awesome because they do? I mean, do you have congruent point here or not? Why would you even reference other games that contradict your point?Well once you get used to that kind of loot and it becomes the norm, there is no going back. They opened pandora box, that's why gatcha games are exploding in popularity, the loot is exciting and impactful. Gw2 should be looking at this.I think you provided the exact reason in this post why Anet shouldn't provide that kind of loot. Maybe free stuff is the norm for that game ... but it's not the norm (and I don't see why it should be) in GW2 ... ESPECIALLY if it cuts into potential revenues. Sounds to me like Anet is doing the smart thing and keeping the lid on that Pandora's Box for their customers. Anet should be running as far away from this free loot model as they can, because the incentive to play this game should be content and fun, not some Pandora's Box of Free Loot. I think at this time, they have done that pretty well just simply based on the fact that the game is still developed and in existence. I can't say I would expect the same for the game that's giving away the farm.I can't support the idea of 'free' loot or 'more'. There is potential for 'different' though, as many of the rewards you get are directly linked to crafting things you want. It's a hard choice because the TP is driven by people contributing to it; any reduction there would be bad. Likewise, It's hard to imagine how Anet would just suddenly have epic loot drops for players. I hardly get exotics; how could they justify anything more rare drop and maintain a reasonable level of the lower tier loot dropping? I mean, I know where your thread is going because you tried to make 2 others with the same flavour; you just want exclusive rewards for high performance. "MORE LOOT" doesn't address that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaklex.6308 Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 @Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:@Trise.2865 said:@Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:I feel this game doesn't reward its players enough. When you play cell phone games, specifically gatcha games the amount of rewards they give out is insane Gonna stop you right there. Gatcha games don't give out "rewards". They drip-feed the barest minimum currencies necessary to counterbalance the slot-machine core they built the veneer of gaming around. They allow their slot machines to continue being nominally "playable". It only feels like a big reward because the bars they set are so kitten high.They give out quite a bit going onto a gatcha game for the first time it's pretty staggering the amount of rewards. It itches the treasure itch far more then gw2. When you log back into gw2, it feels lackluster and then it feels like the loot is boring and repetitive, and not exciting at all.Dragalia lost which just came out in Sept, for Christmas and new years gave out enough free currency for 15 ten pulls and then straight up gave out 8 ten pulls ontop of that, it's fairly exciting.Final fantasy brave exvius gave out an insane amount of currency and summons for free for the holidays.Meanwhile gw2, achievement points and a mini pet. And blues and greens...If a game has to entice players to play it by giving out something for free, you know there is a problem there. Yah well its enticing and then when you play it it's also fun, so I dunno man lol.Again, that's subjective assessment. Sounds to me you aren't playing the right game if you aren't getting the rewards you want from it. I've played mmos since 2001, I think I know what type of game this is and what it has to offer. I've also played since gw1 launch.Clearly you don't, since the rewards you seek were never anything this game gave out. If you did know, you wouldn't be asking for them to be added and know why you wouldn't be asking that as well. Yah but since these games exist, gw2 should update and adapt, why would you be against more exciting rewards anyways or free stuff? Am I missing something here lol? It's 2019 not 2012, games give out exciting loot, gw2 should follow suite.The existence of these other games is not a reason for Gw2 to update and adapt. GW2 has a business model that works because its market supports it well enough to stay in business. Clearly, if the market wasn't satisfied with the game, the game would fade away and not be supported. I'm noticing a lot less players, my friends list is always empty, wvw and pvp, nobody is around... Making loot more exciting or impactful could only help, especially since gamers in 2019 have come to expect this and are used to it now.Let me correct this for you: Making loot more exciting or impactful could only help, especially since mobile gamers in 2019 have come to expect this and are used to it now. PC Gamers do not expect this and are not used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mauried.5608 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 Maybe the problem is the definition of what makes a reward exciting.If everyone in the game had a legendary weapon do you think they would have much value , or be classed as exciting?For most players, the concept of an exciting piece of loot is something thats rare , and most other players dont have it , but that doesnt work if the game is handing outexciting loot to everyone.Also the more rewards that are simply handed out , the more the game economy suffers, as most stuff then becomes worthless because everyone has it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etria.3642 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 He also wants legendaries handed out for solo content that is SO challenging that most people can't do it. Wonder what the next free thing he wants will be that most folks won't ever get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted January 8, 2019 Author Share Posted January 8, 2019 @Etria.3642 said:He also wants legendaries handed out for solo content that is SO challenging that most people can't do it. Wonder what the next free thing he wants will be that most folks won't ever get.I'd like some loot to be exciting and rare and exclusive and to mean something. Instead of greens and blues in copious amounts and everyone has the same legendaries because they open their wallets.That being said, we really could use more exciting loot as well, that is impactful to our accounts overall. A holiday reward or a thank you to vet players that gets us excited and want to log into gw2 as opposed to other options, which there are so many of now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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