condi dmg question

[weaponwh.9810]

does power and precision benefit condi build at all? or its waste and better to put in vit etc?

[Ashantara.8731]

The direct damage you deal is still based on power, so yes, power is more beneficial than vitality (at least outside of WvW, and even there it depends). Precision increases your chance for additional damage dealt, so again, yes, very beneficial in pretty much all cases except pure healing/support builds.

[Fueki.4753]

There are traits that cause critical strikes to apply conditions, so (depending on your class and build) precision can/will be profitable.But Power increases direct damage only, not condition damage.

[Tommo Chocolate.5870]

@Fueki.4753 said:There are traits that cause critical strikes to apply conditions, so (depending on your class and build) precision can/will be profitable.

This is true, although many (maybe even all) of those traits have internal cooldowns, some of which are quite long (10 seconds for Incendiary Powder!), so I'm not sure how worthwhile it is to invest in precision just for those traits.

[Fueki.4753]

I'd rather use Trailblazers for pure condi builds to have some sustain, but if you go along with the META, Viper is the optimal choice for many condi builds.

Also, Burning Precision on Elementalist has 5 seconds cooldown.

[Danikat.8537]

Almost all attacks which cause conditions will do some direct damage, making power useful and as other people have said critical hits could be useful depending on your traits (and the sigils you choose). The extra damage on critical hits can be useful too, but you need both precision and ferocity to make the most of it, and since there isn't a set with condition damage, expertise, precision and ferocity that's when you start getting into trade-offs.

As for whether it's better than defensive stats (vitality and toughness) or something else that really depends on you, your build, what you're playing and how you like to play. For some things (WvW for example) extra defense is more important, for others pure-damage builds will work but require you to be willing and able to rely entirely on active defenses like dodging and CC to keep yourself alive, and not everyone wants to do that.

For example my ranger has a full set of ascended viper's equipment (power, condition damage, precision, expertise) but I only use it in raids when I can count on other people providing healing and support. (And frankly even then I'm not very good and die a lot, but I found a nice guild who are willing to put up with that while they teach me.) For anything else I swap the trinkets and back item for rabid (condition damage, precision, toughness), it's not a big difference if you look at the numbers (about 400 extra toughness), but it's enough that if I mis-time a dodge I'll survive and that makes a big difference when I'm playing solo.

Basically whilst there absolutely are bad combinations in this game it's not as simple as X is good, Y is bad. There's a lot of variations and a lot of builds that will work.

@Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:

@Fueki.4753 said:There are traits that cause critical strikes to apply conditions, so (depending on your class and build) precision can/will be profitable.

This is true, although many (maybe even all) of those traits have internal cooldowns, some of which are quite long (10 seconds for Incendiary Powder!), so I'm not sure how worthwhile it is to invest in precision just for those traits.

It's probably not worth going out of your way to get your critical chance as high as possible. But level 80 equipment always has 3 or 4 stats, conditions only need 2 and expertise is only in 4-stat sets (and bringers, which has precision) so you're going to have 1 or 2 other stats anyway, and if you're already boosting condition damage the extra conditions on critical hits could be useful.

[Sugar Min.5834]

OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

[Dante.1508]

@Ashantara.8731 said:The direct damage you deal is still based on power, so yes, power is more beneficial than vitality (at least outside of WvW, and even there it depends). Precision increases your chance for additional damage dealt, so again, yes, very beneficial in pretty much all cases except pure healing/support builds.

Disagree Vitality is just as important as power.. Power is useless while you are laying on the ground dead.

[Metasynaptic.1093]

@Mil.3562 said:OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

Wait until you see 20k+ burning ticks from a firebrand, or similar confusion ticks from a mirage.

[Ashantara.8731]

@Dante.1508 said:

@Ashantara.8731 said:The direct damage you deal is still based on power, so yes, power is more beneficial than vitality (at least outside of WvW, and even there it depends). Precision increases your chance for additional damage dealt, so again, yes, very beneficial in pretty much all cases except pure healing/support builds.

Disagree Vitality is just as important as power.. Power is useless while you are laying on the ground dead.

You're not laying on the ground dead in open world PvE (including story missions), unless you are a newbie or have not managed to master the game's combat mechanics. There is another thread about Marauder's gear in which I agreed that some professions benefit from a couple of Marauder trinkets. But other than that, as I wrote here, Vitality is of little importance in PvE compared to Power and Precision. With Power and Precision (and decent movement) your enemy lies dead before you before they even get to the point of killing you.

[Fueki.4753]

@Ashantara.8731 said:Vitality is of little importance in PvE compared to Power and Precision.That depends on your build.Traits like Force of Will (Guardian) or Taste for Danger (Ranger) give you other stats based on your Vitality.

[RaidsAreEasyAF.8652]

@Fueki.4753 said:That depends on your build.Traits like Force of Will (Guardian) or Taste for Danger (Ranger) give you other stats based on your Vitality.

If you want the extra stats from these traits, its almost always better to just not take them and get the stats from your gear instead. A Full set of Zintl Armor gives you 439 Vitality. Vitality is the main stat on that set. You get another 120 from the trait taste of danger and you have 1000 base vitality. So you are sitting on 1559 Vitality. That means you get 109 Expertise.Well, thats obviously something you can do. You could however take yassiths breastplate and legs and you get 111 expertise. Seriously, these traits are pure garbage. If you want stats take proper armor.

[Juan.6124]

@Mil.3562 said:OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

Not sure why you run dire over viper or trailblazer but try this build: [&DQgnNjI1IioSAAAAgAAAAHcBAAC9AQAAkgAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA=]

Copy this, go ingame, open hero pannel, go to the build tap. On the top row you will see numbers 1, 2, 3 for build templates. Right click on your current one and select Paste Build Template.

In shroud your 1 will apply burning and vuln, your 4 poison and your 5 applies chill which turns into bleed. Open with 5+4 to create whirl combo in an ice field for more bleeding. Blood is Power before going into shroud which makes the condition be transfered, spectral grasp to pull enemies from 1200 range so you can cleave them down. Read what your traits and skills do.

Condi scourge or power reaper are better than condi reaper though.

[weaponwh.9810]

I saw some video, ppl use condi build to solo champ bounty, which got me curious how well is condi build for PvE champion. all you need to do is get condi tick then rest of time just evade/tank/heal. I can't do that with power build because I need constantly attacking in order to get my dps up, also power require precision/power/ferocity while condi, can replace those with vit/toughness. I think any class/build can solo trash mob or vetern, but when it come to champion bounty or higher, see like condi is the only one can solo it, it doesn't have burst dmg but the sustain one and the tankyness help alot

[ugrakarma.9416]

@weaponwh.9810 said:does power and precision benefit condi build at all? or its waste and better to put in vit etc?

Depends of traits, some classe had condi proc traits on critical hits, then should had some critical chance to get full use.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@Mil.3562 said:OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

Must check the date of video, early HoT reaper did lots of bleed, but it was nerfed long time ago. anyway the scepter #2 with full Viper gear+nightmare runes can apply near 30s of bleed.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@weaponwh.9810 said:I saw some video, ppl use condi build to solo champ bounty, which got me curious how well is condi build for PvE champion. all you need to do is get condi tick then rest of time just evade/tank/heal. I can't do that with power build because I need constantly attacking in order to get my dps up, also power require precision/power/ferocity while condi, can replace those with vit/toughness. I think any class/build can solo trash mob or vetern, but when it come to champion bounty or higher, see like condi is the only one can solo it, it doesn't have burst dmg but the sustain one and the tankyness help alot

Also most necro weapons can apply condi while just moving around the boss at safe distance. But inst so safe against bosses with ranged atacks.

[Cyninja.2954]

@"weaponwh.9810" said:does power and precision benefit condi build at all? or its waste and better to put in vit etc?

To be exact, the damage formula for condition damage is:(Base Damage + Condition Damage Scaling Factor) Duration * (1 + Bonus Duration + (Expertise / 1500))

• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage

Condition damage and Expertise are the only factors you can affect in the damage formula when it comes to pure condition damage.

Now, very often classes have traits which apply additional conditions on critical hits (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Critical_hit), this is where Precision comes in and further increases damage output for your conditions (by applying more, tehcnically it does not increase the damage output per condition).

Finally, attacks also have a Power damage component which will benefit from any additional damage stats provided from gear. Overall this will often net the least increase, but will outperform itemization lacking these stats. Still a common approach is to stack condition damage and expertise first, then go for more defensive stats on open world sets since the survival increase often makes gameplay easier for poor players and requires less attention for good players.

TL;DR:Precision will benefit condition builds potentially more than power, power benefits condition builds too but might be worth replacing for defensive stats depending on skill level and content aimed at.

[Sugar Min.5834]

@DirtyDan.4759 said:

@Mil.3562 said:OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

Not sure why you run dire over viper or trailblazer but try this build: [&DQgnNjI1IioSAAAAgAAAAHcBAAC9AQAAkgAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA=]

Copy this, go ingame, open hero pannel, go to the build tap. On the top row you will see numbers 1, 2, 3 for build templates. Right click on your current one and select Paste Build Template.

In shroud your 1 will apply burning and vuln, your 4 poison and your 5 applies chill which turns into bleed. Open with 5+4 to create whirl combo in an ice field for more bleeding. Blood is Power before going into shroud which makes the condition be transfered, spectral grasp to pull enemies from 1200 range so you can cleave them down. Read what your traits and skills do.

Condi scourge or power reaper are better than condi reaper though.

I went for dire because i want to be tankier while depending on my minions to fight mobs and champions. Just trying to play a different style : D Thank you.

@ugrakarma.9416 said:

@Mil.3562 said:OP don't mind me riding on this topic I have a question on condi damage too.

I have watched a few videos on condi damage ticking from an average of 900+ to 2k+.

My full acended dire condi reaper mm never tick more than 250 :anguished: Did i go wrong somewhere? Or did ANet make some changes recently?

Must check the date of video, early HoT reaper did lots of bleed, but it was nerfed long time ago. anyway the scepter #2 with full Viper gear+nightmare runes can apply near 30s of bleed.

Guess i'll switch to Viper then. Gonna spend lots of gold again :( Thank you.