VB meta needs revamp

[Westenev.5289]

@Linken.6345 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:Weird, I always see people afking until nightfall to kill matriach/patriach. Only revamp this map needs is killfloors until the boss spawns, to spite the leechers.

Well people will just go afk on a vine or use skyscale to avoid kllfloors.

Then add veteran vinetooths instead. They can kill afk skyscales surprisingly well.

[SkyCake.4216]

I'm not saying Anet should add this or that I even want it myself. And, I know I'm setting myself up to be used as a stepping stone for someone to quote partially and say "no". BUT!

VB is actually the reason I kind of wish we could like queue up for maps. It would require a lot more than just adding a queue system since you'd have to have much stricter "anti-leech" rules/mechanics in place due to the size and participation meter. That would be new ground on its own for Anet. It would be fun to play a VB meta where everyone joined is there for the same reason. They could even increase base difficulty or something since it would be an instanced map after the queue pops to match the reward of having a guaranteed stat selectable.

I'm not sure I directly agree with the OP. VB can't be a meta map compared to maps like Dragon's Stand or Drizzlewood Coast. But, there is still part of me that wishes _something _could happen since I do enjoy getting to T4. It still happens even if it can sometimes be difficult to find a group for it. I think it's pretty fun! Making it "quicker" may not be the best option though since it's already pretty rewarding for time commitment/effort.

[Khisanth.2948]

@Westenev.5289 said:

@Linken.6345 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:Weird, I always see people afking until nightfall to kill matriach/patriach. Only revamp this map needs is killfloors until the boss spawns, to spite the leechers.

Well people will just go afk on a vine or use skyscale to avoid kllfloors.

Then add veteran vinetooths instead. They can kill afk skyscales surprisingly well.

This just shows how unfamiliar you are about VB's canopy ...

[Slowpokeking.8720]

@"SkyCakeLight.3750" said:I'm not saying Anet should add this or that I even want it myself. And, I know I'm setting myself up to be used as a stepping stone for someone to quote partially and say "no". BUT!

VB is actually the reason I kind of wish we could like queue up for maps. It would require a lot more than just adding a queue system since you'd have to have much stricter "anti-leech" rules/mechanics in place due to the size and participation meter. That would be new ground on its own for Anet. It would be fun to play a VB meta where everyone joined is there for the same reason. They could even increase base difficulty or something since it would be an instanced map after the queue pops to match the reward of having a guaranteed stat selectable.

I'm not sure I directly agree with the OP. VB can't be a meta map compared to maps like Dragon's Stand or Drizzlewood Coast. But, there is still part of me that wishes _something _could happen since I do enjoy getting to T4. It still happens even if it can sometimes be difficult to find a group for it. I think it's pretty fun! Making it "quicker" may not be the best option though since it's already pretty rewarding for time commitment/effort.

And 99% of the time it's not gonna happen, i couldn't even kill the boss because nobody defends the rally points and ppl just log in and kill off it quick.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Slowpokeking.8720 said:

@"SkyCakeLight.3750" said:I'm not saying Anet should add this or that I even want it myself. And, I know I'm setting myself up to be used as a stepping stone for someone to quote partially and say "no". BUT!

VB is actually the reason I kind of wish we could like queue up for maps. It would require a lot more than just adding a queue system since you'd have to have much stricter "anti-leech" rules/mechanics in place due to the size and participation meter. That would be new ground on its own for Anet. It would be fun to play a VB meta where everyone joined is there for the same reason. They could even increase base difficulty or something since it would be an instanced map after the queue pops to match the reward of having a guaranteed stat selectable.

I'm not sure I directly agree with the OP. VB can't be a meta map compared to maps like Dragon's Stand or Drizzlewood Coast. But, there is still part of me that wishes _something _could happen since I do enjoy getting to T4. It still happens even if it can sometimes be difficult to find a group for it. I think it's pretty fun! Making it "quicker" may not be the best option though since it's already pretty rewarding for time commitment/effort.

And 99% of the time it's not gonna happen, i couldn't even kill the boss because nobody defends the rally points and ppl just log in and kill off it quick.

Why didn't you defend one of them so that you could get to the boss?

[Westenev.5289]

@Khisanth.2948 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:

@Linken.6345 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:Weird, I always see people afking until nightfall to kill matriach/patriach. Only revamp this map needs is killfloors until the boss spawns, to spite the leechers.

Well people will just go afk on a vine or use skyscale to avoid kllfloors.

Then add veteran vinetooths instead. They can kill afk skyscales surprisingly well.

This just shows how unfamiliar you are about VB's canopy ...

Shows how little you know about the dreaded flying vinetoots, but I digress. Nobody defends the rally points or bothers with map readyness outside of organised maps and the occasional tree hating murder hobo, and why should they when they can just wait for the vined chicken(s) to perch in the canopy regardless.

[Ayrilana.1396]

@Westenev.5289 said:

@Khisanth.2948 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:

@Linken.6345 said:

@Westenev.5289 said:Weird, I always see people afking until nightfall to kill matriach/patriach. Only revamp this map needs is killfloors until the boss spawns, to spite the leechers.

Well people will just go afk on a vine or use skyscale to avoid kllfloors.

Then add veteran vinetooths instead. They can kill afk skyscales surprisingly well.

This just shows how unfamiliar you are about VB's canopy ...

Shows how little you know about the dreaded flying vinetoots, but I digress. Nobody defends the rally points or bothers with map readyness outside of organised maps and the occasional tree hating murder hobo, and why should they when they can just wait for the vined chicken(s) to perch in the canopy regardless.

Those don’t attacks you in midair.

[Khisanth.2948]

@"SkyCakeLight.3750" said:I'm not sure I directly agree with the OP. VB can't be a meta map compared to maps like Dragon's Stand or Drizzlewood Coast. But, there is still part of me that wishes _something _could happen since I do enjoy getting to T4. It still happens even if it can sometimes be difficult to find a group for it. I think it's pretty fun! Making it "quicker" may not be the best option though since it's already pretty rewarding for time commitment/effort.

So how often do you spend organizing for t4 VB runs?

[Cuks.8241]

The only change the map would really welcome is adding a few minutes between the choppers appearing and matriarch spawn. This way everyone gets a chance to get to the canopy in time.T4 system is fine. It's true that it is seldom done and requires coordination but in my opinion, some events like that are welcome. I don't see the bladed chest as a problem. I haven't done t4 many times and I still unlocked all the chest skins and have some spare boxes in my bank from boss drops.

[Rinagal.9235]

First part of VB meta is probably the best meta-event in terms of gameplay design in gw2 (well i haven't seen Drizzlewood Coast yet, but i doubt it will change my opinion drastically), it's just that for most of players fun = reward / (time spent * required effort) and in such a model VB meta in it's current state is doomed to be unpopular. It's actually 95% of other meta-events that should be revamped, but it is unrealistic scenario.

[Khisanth.2948]

@"Cuks.8241" said:The only change the map would really welcome is adding a few minutes between the choppers appearing and matriarch spawn.

On the one hand, "I can't get to matriarch"On the other hand, "Nobody is killing the other bosses!"

Hmm...

There is also nothing stopping anyone from getting to the platform on time but people insist on not doing that and just complaining instead.There are multiple ways to get to the platform1) be there already2) use the chopper3) use the HoT masteries4) use mounts

Option 3 takes about 2.5 minutes with a 25% movement speed buff and 3 minutes without any movement speed buffs. The defense event to spawn the chopper is 4 minutes long. Do I need to point out the obvious here?

This way everyone gets a chance to get to the canopy in time.

Everyone already as a chance to get to the canopy on time. Some people just choose not to and then complain about it instead.

T4 system is fine. It's true that it is seldom done and requires coordination but in my opinion, some events like that are welcome. I don't see the bladed chest as a problem. I haven't done t4 many times and I still unlocked all the chest skins and have some spare boxes in my bank from boss drops.

There are also one or two achievements that requires t4 VB.

@Rinagal.9235 said:First part of VB meta is probably the best meta-event in terms of gameplay design in gw2 (well i haven't seen Drizzlewood Coast yet, but i doubt it will change my opinion drastically), it's just that for most of players fun = reward / (time spent * required effort) and in such a model VB meta in it's current state is doomed to be unpopular. It's actually 95% of other meta-events that should be revamped, but it is unrealistic scenario.

The first part of the VB meta is hanging around in one area for around 20 minutes.For most players fun probably equals doing a bit more than role playing as a bot.

[Rinagal.9235]

@Khisanth.2948 said:

The first part of the VB meta is hanging around in one area for around 20 minutes.For most players fun probably equals doing a bit more than role playing as a bot.

Oh, i see, defend rally points, search for supplies and doing events all on your own or with 1-2 other players means roleplaying a bot, but follow commander or zerg stuff with a huge raid does not.

[Cuks.8241]

@Khisanth.2948 said:

@"Cuks.8241" said:The only change the map would really welcome is adding a few minutes between the choppers appearing and matriarch spawn.

On the one hand, "I can't get to matriarch"On the other hand, "Nobody is killing the other bosses!"

Matriarch can be killed sooo fast if there are not many people there to scale it up. Break the first bar and burst before it is scaled up by people using choppers and it will go down in seconds. Someone actually doing the events to progress the map can easily miss it. It's not a big issue, you have more bosses but the design is flawed.

[casualkenny.9817]

Having 20 simultaneous defense points is silly.

What's the odds enough get defended by 2ish players? (I know u dun need to def all 20 for t4) and not all players can duo-def a point. Ppl will tend to agglomerate esp those who are new

It might be alot better to randomly trigger defense event in 1 of the 4 camps in each cluster, with chopper/mushroom/whatever to help groups traverse within each cluster quickly. Then introduce personal contribution tier rewards (either a new counter, or the current one but with modified purpose and contribution), that are built heavily by the defense/campbuilding events. Then even when say only 5 ppl are interested in the meta events, they can easily party/10squad up and go tackle 1 of the clusters together. AND get personal rewards for it (tokens, those bladed parts chests, better chance for ASC chest/whatever). Ensure that multitagging is disabled. Make the pact supplies individual-based so ppl dun have to race for them as competitors. If map attains t4, ppl with personal defense-phase contribution tiers get additional bonus rewards. That way, players can get rewards for those events, get to play/coordinate with others, maplvl organisation and pop critical mass requirements averted. If enough small groups can coalesce, u get t3/4 more often. And even if just 5 ppl in map wanna do those Def events, they still get decent bonus rewards.

P.s. when ppl say meta, they don't mean killing 1 boss for Amal = meta - thats a boss fight. And I do think anet shld retain the current matriarch=Amal.

P.p.s Mmo players who like metas like doing things with ppl, not defending some place alone. For rewards. Although u can have fun content that gives crappy rewards, and ppl may do them at the start for the experience, it is gonna be much less fun on the 20th run with no rewards to look forward to, esp if theres other hopefully fun content elsewhere that gives better rewards. Of cos, if there is no fun content anywhere in the game, game dies.

P.p.p.s. most pof 'metas' are just 1 zerg running around and beating up something that is camouflaged by pewpew graphics and requires almost no coordination between groups. Even Dragonfall devolved into some weird 2-3hr slog of ppl zerging 1 lane at a time for max rewards, which was disappointing and weird. (And then crawling over some dragon body like sparkly ants popping pimples)