Virtuoso Looks Awesome

[Loboling.5293]

While I'm sad it looks like we're only getting to see one of the elite specs. The new mesmer elite spec looks super cool. 

I love the dagger theme, and it looks like it doesn't do anything overly destructive to the gameplay of cooperative modes, like PvP. It seems focused on giving mesmers a direct damage build that centers on AOE burst. I bet it'll be a ton of fun for open world, hopefully they can balance is nicely for pvp. 

What did everyone think?

[Roda.7468]

I have been sniped.♥

[XenesisII.1540]

1200 range dagger

actual damage aoes to use

no clones but charges that turn into projectiles (wow frost mage to a tee btw)

store up to 5 charges

it's own unique shatters

 

Not bad.

Edited July 27, 2021 by XenesisII.1540

[zealex.9410]

I dont dig ranged weapons, but the mechanics and the utils sold it to me so far, ill w8 for a couple weeks till we get the first beta test.

[Salt Mode.3780]

12 hours ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

1200 range dagger

actual damage aoes to use

no clones but charges that turn into projectiles (wow frost mage to a tee btw)

store up to 5 charges

it's own unique shatters

 

Not bad.

Its not unique shatters its literally the same thing just ranged due to not having clones. Its still extremely telegraphed but I guess its better then dodging dmg then clones dying before reaching to target.

The only spec that has unique shatters is chrono.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Salt Mode.3780

[RabbitUp.8294]

1 hour ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Its not unique shatters its literally the same thing just ranged due to not having clones. Its still extremely telegraphed but I guess its better then dodging dmg then clones dying before reaching to target.

The only spec that has unique shatters is chrono.

Only F4 is truly unique for chrono, and the same is true for virtuoso.

F1-F3 is the same thing with some minor secondary effects (F1 strikes twice, F2 refunds cooldown, F3 slows).

[Salt Mode.3780]

2 hours ago, RabbitUp.8294 said:

Only F4 is truly unique for chrono, and the same is true for virtuoso.

F1-F3 is the same thing with some minor secondary effects (F1 strikes twice, F2 refunds cooldown, F3 slows).

At least there is 2ndary effects rather then being the same like mirage and core....I dont understand why you said they are minor 2ndary effects considering the bonus it adds on for chrono.

Having extra dmg on F1 isn't small considering it scales off clones, F2 refunds cooldown which is a nightmare when chrono condi was a thing, and F3 slow mechanic was insanely strong paired with Danger Time before it got nerfed. 

Only reason why anyone would think those are minor is because of the consistent nerfs it has gotten over the years.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Salt Mode.3780

[Trejgon.9367]

question to local mesmer experts, from someone who didn't do mesmer since LWS1:

it was my understanding that clones was a big survivability tool for mesmers (akin to thief's stealth), while it hardly matters for pve, it tends to get important for sPvP and wvw (notably roaming part of wvw).

 

So the thing that get's me confused about this new espec, can it be workable for sPvP/WvW roaming? is what they shown sufficient to provide proper sustain, or will it need some more sustain-y traits to be workable within those areas?

[Salt Mode.3780]

13 minutes ago, Lord Trejgon.2809 said:

question to local mesmer experts, from someone who didn't do mesmer since LWS1:

it was my understanding that clones was a big survivability tool for mesmers (akin to thief's stealth), while it hardly matters for pve, it tends to get important for sPvP and wvw (notably roaming part of wvw).

 

So the thing that get's me confused about this new espec, can it be workable for sPvP/WvW roaming? is what they shown sufficient to provide proper sustain, or will it need some more sustain-y traits to be workable within those areas?

Honestly no aside from the 30 sec F4 block and the 60 sec CD distortion which is just our original distortion moved into utility its all dps no sustain. This spec will most likely have to go back using core utilities like blink, signet of midnight, decoy, mirror img, etc in order to sustain.

Also like to point out that the shatters are no longer instant which means you can get interrupted easily and considering none of the utilities in the new espec provides stunbreak you are left with extremely limited options.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Salt Mode.3780

[Jables.4659]

The elite specialization looks like a straight downgrade to Core Mesmer in a lot of ways.  The "shatters" are not instant cast,  the f4 is not invulnerability, and you can't dry-shatter.  Its also worth noting that unless I missed something, there is no mobility attached to the elite spec.  Mobility creep has resulted in Core Mesmer being an extremely slow class.  With Mirage being more or less unplayable in spvp/wvw, that needs to be addressed. 

[RabbitUp.8294]

1 hour ago, Lord Trejgon.2809 said:

question to local mesmer experts, from someone who didn't do mesmer since LWS1:

it was my understanding that clones was a big survivability tool for mesmers (akin to thief's stealth), while it hardly matters for pve, it tends to get important for sPvP and wvw (notably roaming part of wvw).

 

So the thing that get's me confused about this new espec, can it be workable for sPvP/WvW roaming? is what they shown sufficient to provide proper sustain, or will it need some more sustain-y traits to be workable within those areas?

Clones were more of a survivability tool in pve than pvp/wvw. Any half-decent player wasn't fooled by clones and they were cleaved down pretty quickly either way.

 

In solo pve, clones can tank for you if you stay ranged and take close to no damage.

[phokus.8934]

2 hours ago, Lord Trejgon.2809 said:

question to local mesmer experts, from someone who didn't do mesmer since LWS1:

it was my understanding that clones was a big survivability tool for mesmers (akin to thief's stealth), while it hardly matters for pve, it tends to get important for sPvP and wvw (notably roaming part of wvw).

 

So the thing that get's me confused about this new espec, can it be workable for sPvP/WvW roaming? is what they shown sufficient to provide proper sustain, or will it need some more sustain-y traits to be workable within those areas?

It has good sustain from the utilities but we know next to nothing about the traits nor the other elite specs.  No one has played it or theorycrafted so we just don’t know.

[Bast.7253]

Not seeing the appeal.

Now we're just a weaker ranged burst spec with easily telegraphed abilities that will probably still have to resort to stealth and burst power damage in pvp but be subpar to core as usual.

Hurray, we can 111111 mobs down in open world faster now and cast ground targeted aoe. This looks like it might be decent in pve and raiding but even then, probably won't be as good as existing specs or other elite specs.

Shatters are the same only with f1 being rapid attacks. Same offhands we've been stuck with for years meaning the only time the spec will feel different is when we're struggling for our lives without clones or specifically using dagger. Event hat just feels like a slightly longer range version of ele dagger.

Boring, honestly. And not sure what the point of an aoe knockback is when it looks like it knocks people back like 400 and mesmer is so glass it would die by the end of the knockback anyway, especially without channeling our ONE distortion with a utility skill.

The visuals all look the same to me and behave pretty similar. Honestly seems like a lot of borrowed abilities from other classes with slightly flashier effects. Might be cool in pve though. 

[GutterRat.1269]

22 hours ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Honestly no aside from the 30 sec F4 block and the 60 sec CD distortion which is just our original distortion moved into utility its all dps no sustain. This spec will most likely have to go back using core utilities like blink, signet of midnight, decoy, mirror img, etc in order to sustain.

In other words it's one-shot or go home. Which means that if it manages to actually reliably one-shot, it'll be nerfed to oblivion.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

11 minutes ago, msalakka.4653 said:

In other words it's one-shot or go home. Which means that if it manages to actually reliably one-shot, it'll be nerfed to oblivion.

I don't see how you can instagib since f skills have like 1 sec cast time. 

[Hirosama Nadasaki.6792]

2 minutes ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

I don't see how you can instagib since f skills have like 1 sec cast time. 

 

You could try something cheesy with stealth. Kinda works for trapper dragonhunter with longbow 2.

[Salt Mode.3780]

17 hours ago, Hirosama Nadasaki.6792 said:

 

You could try something cheesy with stealth. Kinda works for trapper dragonhunter with longbow 2.

Again its goes back to stealth nuke which again most of our complains are one shot in stealth. I don't agree in this kinda mind numbing tactic, we ain't DE or thieves. I would like our class to be more challenging then to go stealth one shot like d/p thieves or DE.

[Hirosama Nadasaki.6792]

2 hours ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Again its goes back to stealth nuke which again most of our complains are one shot in stealth. I don't agree in this kinda mind numbing tactic, we ain't DE or thieves. I would like our class to be more challenging then to go stealth one shot like d/p thieves or DE.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'd definitely like that more. I was more saying it in terms of what you can do with what we were shown.