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It is much better than Sky Hammer as it currently stands.

@Flandre.2870 said:Obviously needs a lot more effort put into it. It's atrocious.

+100 to this. Abysmal map, should be buried and never see the light of day again.

This. I dunno if I'll play ranked with this map in rotation.

Sidenote: If even one person votes for this map in unranked, it always seems to be chosen. Fishy :expressionless:

Utter garbage map. To small and messy.

Agreed. This map is utter garbage and is just a whole zerg fest. Theres few spots to kite and to hide away from ranged pressure. The map is so small and nodes are so close to eachother that 'side noders' and 'roamers' lose their meaning because you can zerg with your whole team from point to point in a couple of seconds anyway

100 % agreement with the OP. This map doesn't belong in ranked.

@Mbelch.9028 said:Sidenote: If even one person votes for this map in unranked, it always seems to be chosen. Fishy :expressionless:Observation bias. Because it's in every set of 3 possible maps, it will almost inevitably be the most common map on which you play. The only way that wouldn't be true is if there was only ever 1 person voting it.

Doesn't even belong in unranked really, I stopped testing builds because of this map.

Visually it's quite nice. Gameplay wise, I think it's fine to have a yolo map.

At least this map is better than when Skyhammer was first released and Spirit Watch with the bugged Tornado while carrying the orb crap. I wonder if the people who made the old skyhammer and spirit watch are still working in ANET.

Though whether to include this map in ranked or unranked is whatever to me.

The time between mid and the side nodes needs to be increased by 50%. Mid needs more kite spots, no port spots, and line of sight to play with. The map mechanic needs to be worth a damn so people go for it, spread out players a bit more, and make the map feel less like you're perpetually fighting in a choke point.

Am I the only one who likes this map? :# I do find it gets enough votes during map selection though.

At mid I use the fountain and palm trees to kite and LoS. Generally, I think they were going for a fast-paced, "waves collide" concept since the teams spawn so close together. In that sense it's different from the other maps and presents its own set of strategies.

My main gripe is how often the trees and overhead structures block my view at the farthest camera zoom. But other maps have this issue as well. Also the special map feature, the lamp, seems kind of useless and mostly a noob trap.

Bring back courtyard

Welcome to "Kite Wars 2" where doing jumping puzzle in pvp is more important than anything else.

In the begining, i hated this map but now... it's one of my favorites maps, 100% action, no time to sleep waiting for someone to come to sidnode, always moving.

It's true, when i play mesmer in this map, i have to pay more attention, for exemple, a ranger with "Sick'Em" + unblockable hits annnnd i'm almost dead.

Still have some kite spots in the 3 nodes. (upper platform in sidenodes + fountain and trees in mid)

For sure, sidenoders + thiefs hate this map :D

Only people who can't use WASD and jump dislike Djinn. It's perfectly sized to the base movement of GW2, and it features a high amount of terrain variance which anyone can use in order to juke builds which heavily rely on low effort teleports and line of sight attacks. Breaking away from or rotating around unwinnable/unfavorable fights (which is 95% of this game's PvP) also doesn't result in a tremendous amount of wasted time since it's very easy to transition from one node to another even if it's while doing something undesirable like just outright running away from some guy with a build that easily kills yours.

@Swagg.9236 said:Only people who can't use WASD and jump dislike Djinn. It's perfectly sized to the base movement of GW2, and it features a high amount of terrain variance which anyone can use in order to juke builds which heavily rely on low effort teleports and line of sight attacks. Breaking away from or rotating around unwinnable/unfavorable fights (which is 95% of this game's PvP) also doesn't result in a tremendous amount of wasted time since it's very easy to transition from one node to another even if it's while doing something undesirable like just outright running away from some guy with a build that easily kills yours.

Agreed. Dare I say it's become one of my favorite maps. I feel like I'm in the minority though.

@Swagg.9236 said:Only people who can't use WASD and jump dislike Djinn. It's perfectly sized to the base movement of GW2, and it features a high amount of terrain variance which anyone can use in order to juke builds which heavily rely on low effort teleports and line of sight attacks. Breaking away from or rotating around unwinnable/unfavorable fights (which is 95% of this game's PvP) also doesn't result in a tremendous amount of wasted time since it's very easy to transition from one node to another even if it's while doing something undesirable like just outright running away from some guy with a build that easily kills yours.

If it is sized to the base movement it follows that it is too small for the actual movement.

@Quadox.7834 said:

@Swagg.9236 said:Only people who can't use WASD and jump dislike Djinn. It's perfectly sized to the base movement of GW2, and it features a high amount of terrain variance which anyone can use in order to juke builds which heavily rely on low effort teleports and line of sight attacks. Breaking away from or rotating around unwinnable/unfavorable fights (which is 95% of this game's PvP) also doesn't result in a tremendous amount of wasted time since it's very easy to transition from one node to another even if it's while doing something undesirable like just outright running away from some guy with a build that easily kills yours.

No, because the base movement of GW2 is horrifically sluggish, and this isn't Tribes in which everyone gets access to skis, hills and grenade jumps. This means that classes which don't run builds with high concentrations of scripted mobility (which doesn't require a target) can move around Djinn optimally and contribute to point contests as they crop up.

@Swagg.9236 said:

@Quadox.7834 said:

@Swagg.9236 said:Only people who can't use WASD and jump dislike Djinn. It's perfectly sized to the base movement of GW2, and it features a high amount of terrain variance which anyone can use in order to juke builds which heavily rely on low effort teleports and line of sight attacks. Breaking away from or rotating around unwinnable/unfavorable fights (which is 95% of this game's PvP) also doesn't result in a tremendous amount of wasted time since it's very easy to transition from one node to another even if it's while doing something undesirable like just outright running away from some guy with a build that easily kills yours.

And builds that do have mobility, if even a little, can just zerg this map due to short distances, thereby making it unfun for many, as seen in this thread. Persoanlly I care more about the atrocious performance on this map compared to the "classic" maps (temple, forest, legacy esp)

Definitely needs some work before it goes into the ranked rotation. Spawns are too close and the buff does absolutely nothing. It's actually worse than trebbing in Kyhlo.

I think the map selection is rigged. People pick Djinn between 10-50% (average 30%) so it should come up about a third of the time. It consistently comes up 60% of matches. Mathematically I don't think it's random selection.

Problems with Djinn

Graphically:

• Too much visual clutter on side nodes that obstructs vision while playing on those side nodes. I often find myself having to zoom the camera in a significant distance while on the side nodes, to avoid tree tops and building tops and big crates hanging on ropes, from completely blocking my view of what's happening on the node. Then when I leave the node, I have to zoom my camera back out, and then back in again when approaching a side node. This is just incredibly obnoxious for many reasons. Most of the graphics around the side nodes need to be completely removed from the map.
• The graphics in this tiny map are somehow so taxing on a cpu, that I get by far more lag in this one small conquest map, than I do in wvw while approaching zergs. How is this even possible? No idea but it's pretty annoying, especially for those of us who stream or record.

Mechanically:

• Although I adore the idea of new types of conquest maps and node placement, Djinn has proven itself to be either too small of space between the 3 nodes or plainly not enough room to move around between those nodes. The design of the map highly rewards the slower bruiser oriented builds and zergy play. High mobility Roamers have too much of a disadvantage in this map, for all of the reasons that other players have already discussed in this thread. It's ok to have a variation of maps that slightly favor certain types of build archetypes, but Djinn has taken it a couple steps too far. The nodes are so close together and there is so little variation in choice of how to get to the next node, that something like a Reaper can easily follow something like a D/P Daredevil from mid to a side, and actually get there in time to contest the node vs. the Daredevil, and do it while still being dangerous on that pursuit because the Daredevil has no room to kite the Reaper outside of these narrow passages. Honestly, Djinn is the only map we've ever had, that sometimes for me, it doesn't feel like I'm playing conquest while I'm in that map. It feels more like Courtyard. Not sure if that's a good thing or not. I would suggest opening up the narrow passages just a bit, give players room to move around a bit more.
• Ganking coming off respawn - I know Arenanet had said they were going to add a wall in between the spawn points at the opening of the match. I'd like to say that I believe this to be a very bad idea. All this is going to do, is further limit rotational options at the start of a match when Djinn already has extremely limited rotational options. Furthermore, all the wall is going to do is delay a gank situation for about 10s until the players reach the front of the Djinn platform near mid and then the same exact thing is going to happen anyway. I'm sure some players probably complained about being instagibbed at the start of a match, but this implementation to appease such blind complaint, is actually going to make things feel worse in the long run. If Arenanet still plans on adding this wall, I sure hope they at least put a picture of Donald Trump on it or an NPC that looks like him.
• The objective is completely useless to the point that any g1+ player would know to ignore it completely. Seriously Anet, the objective is so weak that normal player skills deal far more significant effects than the objective. Thus the objective becomes a complete waste of time off-node. The only thing it's good for is allowing your opponent to go cap it, so you can benefit a 5v4 for half minute or so until he gets back into the fight. The objective needs a complete overhaul, not buffing, a complete overhaul.

All in all, Djinn is a map that encourages extremely zergy blob play that often feels more like being in Courtyard, than a Conquest game. It's objective isn't nearly useless, it is completely useless. It also has serious graphical issues that obstruct clean gameplay. The map needs a lot of work and should not be implemented into ranked play until it is fixed.

The biggest problem with DJinn's is that it doesn't play my custom battle music. I run GW2 with custom combat music. Whenever I play Conquest it plays as soon as the match begins. Djinn's still doesn't play the battle playlist. So when I queue up to play it I'm just running around with no music.

I love the map aesthetically. I definitely notice an FPS drop. Instead of 100-200 per map it's usually like 60-70 on this map. For other players I wonder what their settings look like. I run with no reflections.

The distance between Mid and the Side Nodes is far too small. This map makes mobility decaping builds far less valuable.

Mid node needs more kite spots and no port spots.

The map mechanic is completely useless. This skills if people are going to try to grab them need waaaaaaay less wind up and should be as big as the nodes themselves, maybe bigger. I do like the idea of the mechanic as it reminds me of old school arena shooters like Quake, dipping somewhere real quick and grabbing a rocket launcher to gain a huge advantage. But right now the skills themselves are just useless.

As a side noder, some of my most engaging plays have actually been on Djinn's. The narrow alleyways can be dangerous when it comes to AOEs, but at the same time they offer some of the best escape routes for disengaging and rotating back. There's so much cover and LoS obstruction to save me from ranged builds as I run. Half the time my opponents have no idea where I went if I use a port. I let them take the point, leave, and I immediately decap. :smile:

When capping/decapping, I'm constantly rotating the camera left and right to peer down the 3 paths from which others can approach. I always see them coming. The fights on the cramped side nodes are of course intense, but there are some deliberate object placements for LoS. And when needed, I've had good experiences fleeing down the back way to mid or the alley towards spawn on several occasions.

Can't disagree with most of the issues people have raised, some of which I mentioned in an earlier post as well (lots of view-obstruction from overhead objects!). But personally, I've had fun on this map. Maybe our experiences with Djinn vary a bit based on MMR, which I believe is based on our invisible unranked rating.