Arken.3725

@Arcaedus.7290 At first I was thinking Zeal to feed fury/resolution for maximum crit-chance but now that I think of it more, Virtue's maybe the better choice for overall sustain and a tiny bit of Resolution access. IF things remain the way they are, Virtue's will provide SIGNIFICANT sustain given the short cd's of each new virtue. If you spec into both indomitable courage AND absolute resolution, you'll maintain a serious amount of both protection AND condition clear. However, given the low access to Aegis now, unscathed contender might never see the light of day for effectiveness. @The Boz.2038 Thanks brother, lol. @Hogwarts Zebra.8597 Here's more input as I think on it a bit more. Tyrant's Momentum can be a serious competitor because it applies to ANY virtue proc whereas Phoenix Protocol only works with Resolve and Deathless Courage only works with.....Courage. Flash's combo to me, is more useful just for the initial port which is BOTH instant and guaranteed. The return is just icing on top of the cake.

My picks for traits are going to be as follows(assuming they stay the way they are): Adept: Power for Power Master: Vanguard Tactics Grand Master: Phoenix Protocol The GM's are relatively close together in terms of POSSIBLE effectiveness.

That's the only way to use it and EVEN then, good luck landing it. This is essentially a weaker version of Prime Light Beam. It's not unblockable and requires melee range for it to work.

It's very possible for the on-hit virtue's to be nerfed but as it stands(for spvp specifically), i don't feel like it'll be incredibly powerful. WvW? Absolutely due to the sheer volume of players.

To the both of you: @otto.5684 It's true, you'll not have as much mitigation when actually in melee compared to both core and even dh. Core at least offers instant virtues for mitigation and dh offers durational-frontal blocks to continue fighting. @Exile.8160 It's technically not an invuln but if used at an opportune moment, it could pay off. It's essentially this: Pop it and don't dodge, just mess stuff up.

You're more or less not hinging Deathless courage for kills but rather the 4 seconds of initial invulnerability. I put it between A and S because 4 seconds is a long time especially given how short of a cd Crashing Courage has. Also, during that time your skills are coming off cd and potentially may trigger another heal.

Anytime. I have an idea of what I'll run so we'll see. Another key reminder is this specialization still doesn't offer soft- cc and no super speed. Granted you have a good amount ports to help. Also, you gain very little extra mitigation in melee as well. Almost no protection access.

Wanted to bump this since I attached some text providing BOTH a grade and my thoughts on the current spec.

Hey guys, hope you're all doing well. I did a short stream earlier today to go over my thoughts on the WillBender. This is strictly from an spvp point-of-view. It's very difficult to give an accurate overview without playing it firsthand but I tried with what we had to work with. Let me know what you guys think. https://www.twitch.tv/crusaedir/v/1117565703?sr=a&t=0s Brief TLDR for those who don't plan on watching it. Traits: Minors - Righteous Sprint: Awesome, it's about time Guardian got a minor speed trait Grade: A. Lethal Tempo: Pretty solid way of increasing damage output, fits the theme Grade: A. Majors- Adept: Boon Pact: Very boring and relatively useless to the overall kit. The amount of self-duration gained isn't worth the massive loss to your teammates, assuming you take utilities outside of WB Grade: F. Power for Power: It's a massive loss of toughness for incredible power gains. This one, just like Boon Pact is very boring in its design but serves a purpose of the whole "assassin" archetype Grade: C+. Conceited Curate: Just like Boon Pact, very useless given how selfish WB is going to be. The amount gained vs what's lost doesn't even come close to being equal Grade F. Master: Restorative Virtues: This one has a very unique interaction which I find pretty cool but it feels like it promotes spamming your virtues which is NEVER a good ideaGrade: C-. Holy Reckoning: The damage increase on this skill feels like it was tacked on for no apparent reason. The healing can be significant in a sizeable team-fight but if anything, the dmg increase should be removed and maybe a pulsing condition. Grade: C+ Vanguard Tactics: Easily the best of the three. Guardian has issues sticking to their targets due to the sheer volume of soft-cc to which this helps to resolve with the many ports WB will have access to. Grade: A Grand Master: Phoenix Protocol: This is an interesting trade-off for faster cooldowns to which I'm all for. You're not losing all your sustain with this trait but until I try it out, it looks relatively weak on paper Grade: B. Tyrant's Momentum: Fits the assassin theme WB is going for here. It seems relatively easy to keep any number of stacks going in any given fight so this increase could provide value Grade: B. Deathless Courage: This one sounds incredible. While technically not an invulnerability since you'll be stuck at 1hp, the increased length of staying alive could make the difference between victory or defeat. Grade: A - S New Virtues: General: I feel the need to land 5-hits to get any effect off on all of the new virtues might be a tad too high. We'll see how it plays live. Rushing Justice: Cool gap-closer, easily the weakest of the three when it comes to the procs given. Grade: C- Flowing Resolve: Arguably the strongest of the three since it's an evade and provides decent healing. Again, requiring 5 hits to land for 700 health seems a bit much. The removal of soft-cc is amazing. Grade: B+ Crashing Courage: Provides decent sustain but again, the number of hits required to keep that sustain feel a tiny bit too high, especially since there's no protection attached. Grade: B+ Off-hand Sword: Executioner's Calling: Amazing damage, going to be difficult to land. Why you may ask? It's essentially Death Strike for Revenant without the port attached. Granted this does seem like it hits harder but it should given how close you have to be and the necessity to use a 2nd skill to even get close to landing it. Grade: B- Advancing Strike: Looks amazing, solid damage with a relatively short cd. Great skill for setting up burst. Grade: A+ Utilities: Reversal of Fortune: This is easily the best Guardian has ever gotten in terms of a heal. High reward given for appropriate play with a relatively short cd. Grade: S Flash Combo: A short cd shadow-step with the stipulation of landing all strikes for a return actually sounds great. It's another skill that grants a decent reward for pulling off what's on the tooltip. Grade: B+ Whirling Light: Solid damage but with a HEAVILY obvious animation and the fact that you need to be in melee to get the full effect really shortens this skills potential. The short cd helps quite a bit but given how easily it'll be to interrupt/avoid, I don't see much use out of this. Grade: C- Heel Crack: A short cast-time hard CC, this is the first Stun Guardian will have access too. However, given the fact that hard-cc's do no damage AND you'll need to be within a decent range to pull it off, this takes up an important slot for survivability. Grade: D Roiling Light: A short cd stun-break with an evade, blind and daze attached. Actually sounds quite good. However, when you look at current stun-breaks, they all usually offer some significant sustain benefit after the actual breakage. This one doesn't. Say you're full of condi's and get cced, this will do NOTHING for you to sustain. Even afterwards from a power perspective, this doesn't provide any longer-lasting benefit that say Contemplation of Purity provides. Grade: B- Heaven's Palm: A melee-focused Hard-cc that provides no actual benefit to the WB with something that's heavily telegraphed? Yeah, this won't see the light of day in any serious, competitive scene. Grade: D After Beta Review: This is an updated review after playing the beta for a few days. Virtue's: All of the virtue's cd's are way too long given what you lose. As purely selfish skills, these should be much stronger for the user than any of the current specializations but....they're not. You lose your passives as well as the necessary hits to land for trigger effects are too many. F1's after-cast needs to be removed, F2 and F3 are very smooth otherwise. Off-hand Sword: Executioners calling hits like a wet-noodle, even when fully specced into dps. It's also WAY too difficult to land and clunky to boot. If this ability is to maintain its difficulty, the benefits(dmg) need to reflect that. Advancing Strike is really nice, maybe just increase the range a little. Utilities: Reversal of Fortune: Completely broken and buggy. If this works as a true full-counter skill, it would be amazing. Flash Combo: It's a fun ability to use just incredibly difficult to land the 5-hits needed for repose, even if the target is just moving. Cooldown could be slightly lowered as well. Whirling Light: This ability feels the most complete. Granted, it only works well within melee range, it still does good dmg with decent condition application. I'd put a reflect on this or MAYBE an evasion to make it perfect. It's almost there. Heel Crack: This is the first stun given to Guardian but you need significant follow-up to make this work. Without that, it's just a waste of a slot. This one feels like it needs the most work. Roiling Light: This stun-break is arguably one of the weakest currently available to Guardian across all specs. This does almost nothing to sustain you after the initial break. This needs more cleanse and a far shorter-cd to be viable. Heaven's Palm: This feels like an incredibly weak version of Jade Winds, Chill to the Bone, Prime Light Beam, ect. It's too hard to setup. This, just like Heel Crack probably need an overhaul. Traits: Minors: Righteous Sprint: Finally, a movement speed trait but the added swiftness feels redundant, maybe superspeed or quickness? Lethal Tempo: This is too difficult to upkeep the stacks given how many hits needed from virtue's. Reduce the necessary hits needed. Majors: Adepts: I'm all for trade-off's but these are taken way too far. You're not getting NEARLY as much as you have to give. Boon Pact: If you want to keep this as is, at least make it equal. 15% does not equate to losing 50%. Power for Power: Again, another boring trait. This one is at least closer to being equal. Maybe change this into something that gives you a benefit for having one or more swords equipped? Conceited Curate: See Boon Pact. Masters: Restorative Virtue's: This trait heavily encourages you to spam your virtue's which is NEVER a good idea. Rework this into something else. Holy Reckoning: The damage bonus to Willbender flames is tacked on for no reason. Not to mention, this requires you to keep an enemy within the small circle(just like symbols) to benefit. Stop giving static mechanics to an obviously dynamic specialization. Vanguard Tactics: I like this one, probably doesn't need changing. Grand Masters: Phoenix Protocol: Too much of a trade-off with the amount of hits to trigger any given effect. Again, not even close to equal. Tyrant's Momentum: This is a little bit easier to access given it works on all virtue procs/activations but It's still VERY difficult to keep those stacks going given how many hits is required in combination with the reduced duration. Deathless Courage: Needs a complete overhaul. This overview is STRICTLY for spvp.

That's fine but if the foundation of the profession itself isn't adjusted, then why bother trying DPS specs outside of willbender? Trapper runes should be removed but in turn, that will decimate dh in competitive play. I'm very much excited for a mobile Guardian specialization, make no mistake. Just it would be nice to have a look at problems plaguing the class that essentially shoehorns players into only playing support.

Unless anet fixes long-standing guardian issues, this will never be viable in pvp. Main issues for every DPS spec outside of trapper dh is the ability to stick to your target and do meaningful damage. Core has no chill, cripple and maybe one immobilization. Dh is only good because trapper runes carry it, without the stealth and superspeed, dh would be useless in pvp. FB is just non-existent. A melee class needs speed, controlling conditions or both to be effective. Guardian currently has none of these outside of trapper dh. Not even mentioning the buggy tracking on every meaningful skill out there. (scepter auto, great sword leap and binding blade just to name a few. )

As the God of Guardians(spvp), I'll just say that Hammer hasn't been utilized since before HoT. It's arguably one of the worst weapons in spvp.

Not sure which icon we're getting but it's probably a roamer spec. Probably off hand sword as well. Not sure what role the juggernaut had in gw1.

You'll find no reasonable Guardian-main that doesn't think Trapper Runes need to go. Anyone here who cares about the game wants it removed. Anyone here who thinks it should stay in its current iteration doesn't rep the Gurd community.

Off-hand sword, calling it.

Dude, imagine using Scepter since launch, being within range of an enemy and it almost always missing.....

Symbols: This mechanic contradicts how this game is supposed to be played (static vs dynamic motion). It wouldn't be a problem if say it was attached to one weapon only(marks for example) but it's on every Guardian weapon.

I'll be for keeping the sound if they fix the kitten tracking.

This man speaks the truth. Sometimes we've become so set in our ways that even after significant changes we assume things are still status-quo when in fact, they're far from it. It's unfortunate but if Anet continues down this path of balance destruction then maybe it is for the best that Holo get the same treatment. I do wonder though, what would rise from the ashes as the next meta spec? Renegade seems to still be performing exceptionally along with Scourge but what else would there be?

Except Scourge is very playable but I get your point. Everything is a numbers game, this is why FB got destroyed. The numbers got toned down SO much that even if you had 100% extra boon duration, it wouldn't make a difference. You could easily make similar changes to holo but not so severe that it's never played again.

None of what you suggested touches Grenades which again, as I've provided, does more damage in an AoE at both ranged/melee than most auto-attacks. This is base-damage my friend. You could nerf every suggestion and it would still be broken. I think you and me are somewhat on the same page but we're not looking at the whole picture. I'd be willing to wager that if Holosmith was weak, you'd still find engineer's with the tools necessary to function incredibly well. Here's my simple break down: Incredible dps(Nades, Corona burst, Auto, Sword 2/3) Incredible sustain(above-average heal skill, heat-therapy and compounding chemicals, stealth and superspeed access, solid condi-conversion, only block skill that STUNS in addition to its sustain with a reflect bubble) Also, I'm a Guardian main and I ADVOCATED for symbol-nerfs and an overhaul for retaliation because free-damage is terrible by design. The changes from retal to resolution are an indirect-buff to holo smith too.

It's a combination, friend. Having all of these variables contributes to the strength THAT is Holosmith. Looking at the whole picture, you'd have pre-nerfed Healing Signet levels of sustain on Heat-therapy that compound with compounding chemicals. You have incredible mobility that rids yourself of all movement impairing conditions. Insane sustain from shields ridiculous power-creep. Oh I forgot to mention, Engineer shield is also the best off-hand utility in the game. Can't think of a better one for pure sustain/utility. Constant shocking on a 2.5 sec durational block? Balanced. All of these compound to make Holosmith as strong as it is. Let's not forget the above-average condition sustain from Prismatic converter. 3 conditions converted at 100 heat? No problem.

@Kuma.1503 Oh this is going to be easy. Outside of you ignoring my OP, I'll give you prime examples. Alchemy: Elixir S Is the best utility in the game, prove me wrong. There's no other utility that gives the best get-out-of-jail card than this one, not a single utility comes close. Passive boon access greater than any class in this game, JUST from Alchemy alone. Explosions: Explosive Entrance is also the hardest-hitting on-dodge mechanic in this game with incredible utility. No other on-dodge trait comes close to the effectiveness that this trait offers. In combination with Grenadier, which offers you the STRONGEST melee/ranged AoE spam in the game for damage. Grenades: Like I mentioned earlier, with comparable power, the auto-attack on grenades exceeds MANY melee third-hit chain auto-attacks. How insane is it to have a skill that's spammable at both ranged and melee do MORE damage than most melee attacks that require the third-hit on the chain? This is factual proof my friend. As an example: I compared Guardian Sword third-chain hit to be at 843 while grenades of the SAME power do 834. Simple math my friend.

Forgive me but a lot of problems aren't JUST Holosmith. I'm a huge advocate of self-nerfing for the betterment of this game as anyone here who knows my post history could tell you IF the nerfs make sense. Really looking at the whole picture, you can't think of a SINGLE issue that elevates Holosmith(or Scrapper) to incredible levels? Honest question.

I know It's a bit off-topic but man do you deserve that immob for playing nades engineer lol. On a serious note, yeah it's quite crazy especially since It's difficult to tell where it came from.