Quickness Role:

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

From the studio update:

Warrior: Banner skills have been overhauled to provide boons. Through deploying banners, an update to warhorn’s Charge skill, and the Tactics trait Martial Cadence, warriors can provide quickness to allies.

So Charge will have quickness, my guess is 2-4s AoE. Martial Cadence will have quickness, again I can see 2-4s in an AoE, probably closer to 2s though.
Banners is boons, in the plural, so might on strength, fury on discipline, regen and maybe vigor on tactics, and defense could be protection but could also have resolution. Battle Standard will remain as is. Banner trait will make them also pulse quickness.

If the banners are still immobile they will remain dead to me. I'll take quickness on Warhorn and Martial Cadence though.

[anbujackson.9564]

It reads to me like you need banner, warhorn AND tactics for quickness. Maybe you can bypass something with more boon duration. Thats awful imo. Martial cadence is still on a 10sec ICD, maybe they change that to 5. If you take it, you cant take either heal shouts or PS. Again, if no changes are made im that regard.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

They probably didn't like it pointed out how warhorn is the only weapon in game that didn't do any damage to the enemy. So now they can say it's the only weapon in game that gives quickness?

Edit: Just checked other weapons give quickness to allies.

Edited June 22, 2022 by Red Haired Savage.5430

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

41 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

It reads to me like you need banner, warhorn AND tactics for quickness. Maybe you can bypass something with more boon duration. Thats awful imo. Martial cadence is still on a 10sec ICD, maybe they change that to 5. If you take it, you cant take either heal shouts or PS. Again, if no changes are made im that regard.

It's all teasers, so we don't know specifics on CDs or durations.

[Vancho.8750]

@Lan Deathrider.5910 If one of the banners gives stability even if it is wonky stick you drop like always it could be used in WvW zergs, maybe it could be even good enough in some combo with ele or something to counter the default necro guard on every slot.
Mostly wishful thinking since I don't think arenanet would bother to rub two braincells together to add more options on how people can play the game. 

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

Well as it sits today, martial cadence competes with PS so we won't be sharing as much might as we could.

[DanAlcedo.3281]

Im not sold on it.

But lets see how they do it.

As long as they dont force us to play Memesworn, it should be ok?

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

It reads to me like you need banner, warhorn AND tactics for quickness. Maybe you can bypass something with more boon duration. Thats awful imo. Martial cadence is still on a 10sec ICD, maybe they change that to 5. If you take it, you cant take either heal shouts or PS. Again, if no changes are made im that regard.

I bet you are right ... it would be VERY OUTSIDE design parameters established with other classes to require ALL these things to give quickness for full team coverage with Diviner's gear. I would even go so far as to say it would be outside design parameters to require more than just banners to do so. What I'm HOPING is that these are just options and only banners are required for full team coverage. 

In the case it's required, the irony is that people didn't think banners were 'engaging' enough. So I also suspect Anet is 'addressing' those people's complaints with 'engagement' through all these effects you have to take to cover the team to while allowing full DPS setups. Banners not engaging enough? No problem because now you may have the option to banner, WH AND burst to do it in full DPS gear. 

Holding my breathe here. The worst case is we have to play a Diviners WH with Tactics, Discipline. Engagement problem solved. 😆

 

Edited June 22, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Downstate.4697]

Wouldnt be suprised if the gave marching orders 5 might and they had Martial cadence give 3s quickness when soldiers focus is used.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

12 minutes ago, FrownyClown.8402 said:

Wouldnt be suprised if the gave marching orders 5 might and they had Martial cadence give 3s quickness when soldiers focus is used.

That, and maybe, just maybe they reduce the CD on Marching Orders.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

29 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

@Lan Deathrider.5910 If one of the banners gives stability even if it is wonky stick you drop like always it could be used in WvW zergs, maybe it could be even good enough in some combo with ele or something to counter the default necro guard on every slot.
Mostly wishful thinking since I don't think arenanet would bother to rub two braincells together to add more options on how people can play the game. 

If Battle Standard or defense pulses stability then yeah.

[anbujackson.9564]

14 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I bet you are right ... it would be VERY OUTSIDE design parameters established with other classes to require ALL these things to give quickness or full team coverage, even with Diviner's gear. I would even go so far as to say it would be outside design parameters to require more than just banners to do so. 

The irony is that people didn't think banners were 'engaging' enough. So I also suspect Anet is 'addressing' those people's complaints with 'engagement' through all these effects you have to take to cover the team. Banners not engaging enough? No problem because now you may have to banner, WH AND burst to do it. 

Maybe the engaging part is supposed to be "the deploying of banners". Reusing them as often as possible to proc the quickness since your sources with martial cadence and warhorn are on a fairly high cooldown.

[Obtena.7952]

9 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

Maybe the engaging part is supposed to be "the deploying of banners". Reusing them as often as possible to proc the quickness since your sources with martial cadence and warhorn are on a fairly high cooldown.

Well, WH Charge CD is 15 seconds and it's a pretty nice skill so if people just want to mash buttons and call that 'engagement', I think they will get that. It simply comes at a cost of using WH, which I suspect will draw as much ire from the banner hate club. 

Actually, if the prayers are answered, there might be an option to not use banners at all. Maybe between WH and Tactics, some Diviners, it's close or achieves team coverage. 

Edited June 22, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

I'm thinking 4s on Charge and 2s on Martial Cadence, so with +100% quickness duration you'll have full uptime. Banners are "overhauled" not just reworked, so it could very well be like gryos/facets.

[Katary.7096]

The phrasing "through deploying banners" has me thinking that banners might only apply quickness when summoned, which certainly makes no good first impression. And obviously a build with banner utility skills, warhorn as an offhand weapon and a trait from the tactics specialization (is the banner trait going to remain in discipline? that would be a mess) sounds like a terribly restrictive framework for quickness buffing, definitely need more details on that. But on the bright side: Herald is likely going to be pulsing boons, including quickness, around themselves.

Offtopic: With the removal of Banner of Discipline and Spotter everyone is going to be missing 200 points of precision, which is worth ~9.52% crit chance. The combination of +5% from Fury (in PvE) and an additional +5% added to certain power dmg traits means everyone [well, power dps builds] will be gaining ~0.48% crit chance compared to now. Unless of course you are a Warrior with Doubled Standards, since that means you are getting 250 precision right now, which is ~11.90% crit chance. Net loss of 1.9% crit chance compared to now - great.

Officially petitioning for Warriors to get a +7% crit chance increase instead of +5% somewhere in their power dmg traits to offset this.

Edited June 23, 2022 by Katary.7096
fixing formatting

[anbujackson.9564]

58 minutes ago, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

Im not sold on it.

But lets see how they do it.

As long as they dont force us to play Memesworn, it should be ok?

Playing that without a pistol would be quite bad for your dps.

 

29 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well, WH Charge CD is 15 seconds and it's a pretty nice skill so if people just want to mash buttons and call that 'engagement', I think they will get that. It simply comes at a cost of using WH, which I suspect will draw as much ire from the banner hate club. 

Actually, if the prayers are answered, there might be an option to not use banners at all. Maybe between WH and Tactics, some Diviners, it's close or achieves team coverage. 

I dont know why they touched warhorn in the first place to be honest. Its already overloaded with effects compared to other offhand weapons.

 

25 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I'm thinking 4s on Charge and 2s on Martial Cadence, so with +100% quickness duration you'll have full uptime. Banners are "overhauled" not just reworked, so it could very well be like gryos/facets.

That would cripple your precision as power. I am not sure even if you can reach 100% BD while maintaining 100% crit. Playing tactics as condi is also another story. Berserker would suffer from downtime probably. Imagine that soldiers focus is back up again but your mode ran out. So you have to wait another 10+ seconds additionally to apply quickness again. Of course thats only a berserker Problem i guess...

 

 

[Obtena.7952]

6 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

I dont know why they touched warhorn in the first place to be honest. Its already overloaded with effects compared to other offhand weapons.

I'm going to guess it's because they are rolling out the fully enabled support Warrior build for teams in this patch ... and WH is primarily support weapon. I would read into this for other classes and their support toolset as well, anticipating this isn't going to be one of those 'BIG DPS balancing" patches. 

[anbujackson.9564]

3 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I'm going to guess it's because they are rolling out the fully enabled support Warrior build for teams in this patch ... and WH is primarily support weapon. I would read into this for other classes and their support toolset as well, anticipating this isn't going to be one of those 'BIG DPS balancing" patches. 

Since they are forcing so much support into core, this probably that any possible support from reworked elite specs assets is out of the question.

[Myror.7521]

After read the Text i was like: "yay another buff to our Support pve warr build ........ oh wait we have no Support warr e-spec" and now i want to cry lol xd

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

29 minutes ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

Playing that without a pistol would be quite bad for your dps.

 

I dont know why they touched warhorn in the first place to be honest. Its already overloaded with effects compared to other offhand weapons.

 

That would cripple your precision as power. I am not sure even if you can reach 100% BD while maintaining 100% crit. Playing tactics as condi is also another story. Berserker would suffer from downtime probably. Imagine that soldiers focus is back up again but your mode ran out. So you have to wait another 10+ seconds additionally to apply quickness again. Of course thats only a berserker Problem i guess...

 

 

I'm thinking that they are pushing the support side at the expense of DPS. Hopefully so that a better non banner DPS comes out of it 

[JTGuevara.9018]

3 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

From the studio update:

Warrior: Banner skills have been overhauled to provide boons. Through deploying banners, an update to warhorn’s Charge skill, and the Tactics trait Martial Cadence, warriors can provide quickness to allies.

So Charge will have quickness, my guess is 2-4s AoE. Martial Cadence will have quickness, again I can see 2-4s in an AoE, probably closer to 2s though.
Banners is boons, in the plural, so might on strength, fury on discipline, regen and maybe vigor on tactics, and defense could be protection but could also have resolution. Battle Standard will remain as is. Banner trait will make them also pulse quickness.

If the banners are still immobile they will remain dead to me. I'll take quickness on Warhorn and Martial Cadence though.

Ridiculous. This patch is already a bust. Warrior has to sacrifice a weapon slot and an entire traitline for ONE measly boon? Let's not forget that boon-corruption exists. Let's not forget that other classes give quickness PASSIVELY.

On top of that, warrior is basically removed from raids with this change. (Not that I care) Good job, Anet!

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Just now, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Ridiculous. This patch is already a bust. Warrior has to sacrifice a weapon slot and an entire traitline for ONE measly boon? Let's not forget that boon-corruption exists. Let's not forget that other classes give quickness PASSIVELY.

On top of that, warrior is basically removed from raids with this change. (Not that I care) Good job, Anet!

Maybe. I think they are giving two ways to do it. Martial Cadence plus warhorn, or banners. All three for no BD gameplay. We'll see how they change them functionally though.

 

Like I said though, immobile banners are dead to me even if they have quickness. Some other poor fool can take them then.

[Obtena.7952]

 

51 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I'm thinking that they are pushing the support side at the expense of DPS. Hopefully so that a better non banner DPS comes out of it 

I'm not hopeful. Having a good support build doesn't necessarily lead to a specific DPS increase on a build. These changes don't really make much room for it. I just don't really see where that would occur. Maybe Heightened Focus if it's regarded as redundant?

Edited June 22, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

19 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

 

I'm not hopeful. Having a good support build doesn't necessarily lead to a specific DPS increase on a build. These changes don't really make much room for it. I just don't really see where that would occur. Maybe Heightened Focus if it's regarded as redundant?

If they removed the stats on Banners then there is room to improve things elsewhere, especially if the support build involves having both tactics and discipline.

[Scoobaniec.9561]

Lmao as expected warrior deleted in their last domain as bannerslave. Any other reason to bring them in?