Skye.1572 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 "We won’t change the existing license in a way that would invalidate the investment players have made" - ArenaNet PROh, like they did with Town Clothes? Remember when they took out an entire feature and replaced it with something that made our purchases completely worthless? They took out all the mix and match customization and dying of them and gave us clothing tonics of fixed outfits and colors to replace the items. They gave us the option of gem refunds for the investment they invalidated if we wanted that instead of the tonics. So.... why can't they do that here? I know why. It's because they want us to gamble for the ones we want, or fork over the $120 to get all of them. It's not our investment they're worried about, it's theirs.It's hard to take this halfhearted PR jargon seriously after reading that line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlandish.9784 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Lostariel.8470 said:could the mounts work on a ticket system like Black Lion Claim tickets? like each Adoption License is a one ticket, and less popular mounts cost only one, with the most popular costing three. This would be a way to allow players a choice rather than an RNG but still necessitate multiple purchases for certain mounts that are more sought after.idk just a thought, though I can respect your unwillingness to change the current system since some players have already spend $120 through the RNG system. ugh, i dont buy blc keys and sometimes i earn keys doing map completions. in 1 year i have gotten 2 tickets and bought an abaddon axe. putting mount skins in this system is the same as mount licenses are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaaba.5672 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Thank you for the response. I am disappointed, but accept that this is your stance. It was mentioned, but since this is the business model you are going with, I'd love to see the adoption packs broken down by specific mounts at the very least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthewr.3980 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 I'm cool with everything that was said but this part:"You get a brand-new, unique mount skin every time, for a substantial discount versus an individual purchase price."I mean, $5 for a single mount skin is not that fantastic of a deal. Asking $20 for the Jackal skin was WAY overpriced. A single mount skin should never be anywhere near the cost of a single glider/back piece skin. Ever.I think $2.50 would be okay for a non super special regular mount skin. But also I feel I probably wouldn't buy any individual mount skins. I like the packages. I am looking forward to the inevitable Wintersday Mount skins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim West.3194 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 It's for cosmetic items. GW2 one of the few games that doesn't have p2w items. Yes, they are expensive and a gamble, but it's our choice. Haven't bought any though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Morbius.1759 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Thanks for listening and thanks for getting back to us before the weekend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esterie.7409 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Echoing what others have said, I hope that the 2000 gem price for single skins is also not something that continues. A skin that costs almost as much as an expansion is hardly a "micro"transaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwilightSoul.9048 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Glad to hear we're not gonna see another mess like that, but I still don't see the point of having the skins not beeing tradable?What are we supposed to do with 10 Skins per Mount if we only wanted 1 out of 30 to begin with? Why not let us sell them (or buy the ones we want from other players)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adelheid.6931 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 The fundamental question you need to answer is "Why use a lootbox/randomization style mechanic instead of directly selling the skins"? If your answer has anything to do with making more money by exploiting the gambling urges of players, or obscuring the direct market value of an individual skin, then you lose. You have to justify this in terms of the benefits it brings the game and the players over directly selling the skins.None of the justifications in your OP address this. You could give a discount on skins by selling bundles of them directly, which would be just as, if not more, beneficial and fair to the player, since anyone who only cares about getting the discount on the randomization is clearly aiming to collect a lot of skins. Anyone who wants a particular skin is screwed, however.Loot boxes must always be justified in opposition to other microtransaction systems, not in opposition to no microtransaction system. Unless you have a really good pro-consumer, pro-game-mechanic, diegetic reason to have a random mount mount license in the game then I will remain vehemently opposed to the introduction of these licenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronos.6532 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Disappointing that the license isn't being split into two boxes because the positive feedback was too much, but I guess I was in the group of people not planning on buying it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashamir.9574 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Mike O Brien.4613 said:The Adoption License is a large set at 30 skins [...] it’s understandable to see this as pushing down the odds of acquiring any one skin, and to worry that we might add more skins to lower the chances further.It's a fact that having a random pull form a bundle of 30 is pushing down the odds of getting one specific skin. You literally can't see this any other way, because this is how it works.@Mike O Brien.4613 said:[...] our next planned mount skin releases will focus on individual sales like the Reforged Warhound and bundles like the Spooky Mounts Pack. Funny thing is that now I don't trust Arenanet about the mount skins ranymore. Here I just read: "The next time you'll have to pay 2000 gems for mount skins again, get used to it!" and "Well, we only promised for the next time!"No affordable mount skins then. 2000 gems or rng. That will be our choices.Okay, I get it, I'll get something else than gem cards for Christmas.Thanks for clearing that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WereDragon.6083 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 They can't change the boxes now, out in the wild any change would make them liable for legal action. They could back into the grey area of thier special currency, 'gems' already being purchased for legal ground, but that would sour the absolute hell out of this community. The best thing they can do is take the punch to the chin and fix future en-devours... Otherwise they might have a lawsuit on their hands from players who've already purchased the packs that were then changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preyar.6783 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Skye.1572 said:"We won’t change the existing license in a way that would invalidate the investment players have made" - ArenaNet PROh, like they did with Town Clothes? Remember when they took out an entire feature and replaced it with something that made our purchases completely worthless? They took out all the mix and match customization and dying of them and gave us clothing tonics of fixed outfits and colors to replace the items. They gave us the option of gem refunds for our investment they invalidated if we wanted that instead of the tonics. So.... why can't they do that here? I know why. It's because they want us to gamble for the ones we want, or fork over the $120 to get all of them. It's not our investment they're worried about, it's theirs.It's hard to take this halfhearted PR jargon seriously after reading that line. They are actually making all town clothes into outfits, see here under Outfits (retrofitted town clothes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daishi.6027 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Suggestion. In the future let it roll 3-4 mount skins we haven’t already unlocked (from entire pool) and let us select between them to reduce the RNG, or at least increase the likelihood of getting what you want. On the other hand you could also have contracts that roll for skins of a specific mount.2000 for ONE mount is way to much, 1000 is pushing it but would probably be fair, 800 would be ideal. As nice as it is, it has to be a bit more than what we got to justify that price. Maybe multi slot would have been received better? Like raptor + jackal despite same same skin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kapax.3801 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 I mean that the initial 30 skins must be given for lost, you should think this as a pyramid and see that every time the cost to get the desired skin is more expensive ... In the end loses the consumer in this strategy. Picture a closed box where inside there are 29 blue balls and 1 red, for each attempt you must spend 5 dollars, then your first 10 attempts will only come out blue, and in the attempt 11 you will finally get the red one, on the one hand you will be happy, but for the other unfortunate for having spent more than 55 dollars. I raise this because not all their skins are "attractive" and the consumer, in this case, go for the striking ...Well, your attention is appreciated.PS: 25 dollars for a skin, you should think better before that, even a DLC of any game today comes out cheaper ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freecarl.1320 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Mikey my boy all you had to do was add mount skins(and glider skins imo) into IN-GAME REWARDS THROUGH CONTENT and this would be a non-issue. But as usual you're out of touch. Literally could have avoided this by being video game developers and not pixel artists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOTco.4510 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 You get a brand-new, unique mount skin every time, for a substantial discount versus an individual purchase price.I find this to be quite deceptive. With the Halloween mount skins you set an expectation of price to be 320 gems per skin, while 400 gems for the Adoption License is not too far off, the 2000 gems for the Reforged jackal skin definitely is. And you are asking the community to believe that the single model swap for this one mount is worth twice what the 10 models for the Wedding Attire are priced at. And I am flabbergasted that no one is seeing this incongruity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hokk.1954 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Mike O Brien.4613 said:You get a brand-new, unique mount skin every time, for a substantial discount versus an individual purchase price.Except that we don't get the substantial discount since we can't actually buy them individually, in fact these cost more than an individual price because there's an expected value of 6k gems if you want a single individual skin given that you'd have to roll on average 15 times to get the one you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skepticck.9714 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 "We won’t change the existing license in a way that would invalidate the investment players have made"Seriously, that's your excuse to not change anything, your "care" for the players investment lol"our next planned mount skin releases will focus on individual sales like the Reforged Warhound and bundles like the Spooky Mounts Pack"do you mean individual skins at ~25$ each like the Warhound and bundles at 2000 gems ?how about INDIVIDUAL skins at reasonable prices like the glider skins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambit.9501 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Danikat.8537 said:Well...it's certainly not the answer I was hoping for (since I do like quite a few of these skins), but it's better than nothing. I'll keep my fingers crossed for the next batch.mightyno9 was also better than nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vyrulisse.1246 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Good to hear something and knowing it's meant as a progression of sorts makes it more palatable. It's a relief to know the path ahead most of all. Thanks.Edit: If this thread is being monitored at all I'd like to suggest you please look into including some skins as game rewards, they don't even have to be flashy but it would help a lot. The main takeaway is that A.net needs to be more agile in responding to brewing storms. Taking the time to explain it from their side of things and their thought processes and how they see something can go a long way in calming anger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucianTheAngelic.7054 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 offer a "choice at adoption" license at 4x the cost. People will buy it and then they have a choice for both random chance and mount selection, with mount selection being obviously more expensive and therefore "getting less value out of your gems," but at least being guaranteed what they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirjav.3702 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 Thanks for your feedback, we are not going to fix anything but we will try to not get caught next time. Enjoy your RNG boxes, there are here to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pifil.5193 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Esterie.7409 said:Echoing what others have said, I hope that the 2000 gem price for single skins is also not something that continues. A skin that costs almost as much as an expansion is hardly a "micro"transaction.Yeah, it's a transaction. Nothing "micro" about it. So, ArenaNet have done this, it sounds like they won't change it (or at least won't change it in a way to invalidate what people already have) and I don't see anything here to indicate that this random lootbox method definitely won't be used in the future, just not for mount skins. At the moment, well, this is... news but neither all that good nor bad. Oh and, if your idea of a reasonable price for a skin is €25, well, that's just crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witch of Doom.5739 Posted November 11, 2017 Share Posted November 11, 2017 @Mike O Brien.4613 said:You get a brand-new, unique mount skin every time, for a substantial discount versus an individual purchase price.OK, Mike, I'll bite. What IS the individual purchase price of one mount skin that I actually want??? I'll wait. ~Jeopardy music plays~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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