Pure OW PvE idea for legendary armor

[Woof.8246]

1 hour ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

 Then Anet decides to implement a much easier path to legendary armor from their perspective since they only enjoy open world. Sure there might be some that are ok with it, but I imagine the silent majority will feel betrayed. There are also the whales that had swiped their credit cards, convert gem to gold, and purchase their legendary armor from raid sellers. I don't think Anet would want to upset the whales. It's generally agreed on that they make up most of the revenue for any games with microtransactions.

As far i know the company , doesn't interfere with people buyng-selling services . That why even if someone betray you and don't hold their bargain the company cannot do much

If the "whales" feel so much  betrayed , then then company could offer them some free gems store skins equal to the money they spent and then turn around and prohibit any more selling raids

 

1 hour ago, The Boz.2038 said:

You said a single GoE was too much, because other legendary armors do not require GoE.

Sit down.

Maybe you take some eyes exams, because it was 6x GoE

Edited September 18, 2022 by Woof.8246

[Linken.6345]

17 minutes ago, Woof.8246 said:

As far i know the company , doesn't interfere with people buyng-selling services . That why even if someone betray you and don't hold their bargain the company cannot do much

If the "whales" feel so much  betrayed , then then company could offer them some free gems store skins equal to the money they spent and then turn around and prohibit any more selling raids

 

Maybe you take some eyes exams, because it was 6x GoE

Yea they remove the gold the seller got from said buyer and might temp ban the raid seller aswell.

What else should the do?

and 3 characters worth of gift of exploration should be fine since you got 5 slots alot of people only play 1 character anyway.

[Silent.6137]

2 hours ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

You misunderstood. They cannot do this on their main character in the first place. Anyone that chooses to start working on this new set of legendary armor will have to create a new character with that special mode selected. It's so people can't exploit map completion with mounts and jump puzzles with portals/tp to friends.

So everyone get a free character slot since chances are all available slots will be used already? As it is, your example of no access to virtually anything has already made it many times more legendary than getting Raid armor will ever be.

2 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

You have to spend more time in open world doing meta events than inside raids for the RAID armor.

Just create a rifle mech, faceroll through w1-4 6 times and you would be done with raids. still have to do all hot metas at least 30 times.

No, I mean what exactly are you getting at? Your comment : There can be a legendary open world armor when there is a true legendary raid armor, makes no sense to me at all. The request is for an OpenWorld. Raid is Instanced, not Openworld.

2 hours ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

A reason why Open World legendary armor should not be implemented is because it sets a precedence.

 

It sets a precedence. So what? The game is constantly evolving.

Anet implemented Transcendence, then it introduced Prismatic Champion Regalia more than a year later. It implemented Coalescence and then Conflux a year later. All totally different game modes.

Anet implemented Raid Armor, and later implemented PvP and WvW. All different game modes and all precendent setting.

Did the whales stage a revolt?

2 hours ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

The precedence will be why work towards a long term goal when Anet can just create an easier path if enough players constantly complain about it? If they ever do decide to implement Open World legendary armor, it will have to be longer and harder to achieve from the perspective of "open world only players". So my proposal at the top of this page for open world only legendary armor should be fair.

If you had read all the comments, you'd have seen that those that advocate OW Legendary armors are saying the same thing. Expect long and hard journey. Nothing easy. Nothing fast. Problem is a few of those who oppose the suggestion kept harping on the "easier and faster" mantra and kept ignoring what was said. So if you just started reading this thread and scan through the pages, and are opposed to the idea, you'll get the wrong impression of what is being asked.

Edited September 18, 2022 by Silent.6137

[MarkoGold.7126]

This nonsence is discussion is still going on ... amazing.

[idpersona.3810]

1 hour ago, MarkoGold.7126 said:

This nonsence is discussion is still going on ... amazing.

I would actually say that the fact that this topic comes up often enough and generates enough interest for produce 29+ pages (just this time) seems to imply that there is at least genuine interest in the concept. Exact implementation is up to Anet and I don't think much of what specifically gets said in these threads actually reaches anyone of influence (though obviously I could be wrong).

 

Gift of Exploration for each item? Sure. Wouldn't bother me personally at all. That would mean map completion 3 times per set. 9 times for all 3. That is an incredible time sink. And naysayers on here would still complain it was too fast or easy, even if that were just 1 part of the crafting.  Stack on other stuff as well. Make it more expensive than the other legendary sets.

 

3 hours ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

A reason why Open World legendary armor should not be implemented is because it sets a precedence. Imagine all the "open world only players" that had decided to dedicate their time crafting a full set (or maybe even all three sets) of legendary armor already. Enduring many months through raids/WvW/PvP to achieve their goal. Then Anet decides to implement a much easier path to legendary armor from their perspective since they only enjoy open world. Sure there might be some that are ok with it, but I imagine the silent majority will feel betrayed. There are also the whales that had swiped their credit cards, convert gem to gold, and purchase their legendary armor from raid sellers. I don't think Anet would want to upset the whales. It's generally agreed on that they make up most of the revenue for any games with microtransactions.

 

The precedence will be why work towards a long term goal when Anet can just create an easier path if enough players constantly complain about it? If they ever do decide to implement Open World legendary armor, it will have to be longer and harder to achieve from the perspective of "open world only players". So my proposal at the top of this page for open world only legendary armor should be fair.

This isn't a good argument against.
Even if it were easier, and basically no one is actually asking for it to be. A different path =/= easier.
But even is it were, this is a bad argument against, since things like the Return to achievements exist which make the Skyscale journey much easier than it used to be. Another example off the top of my head would be the Elder Dragon variants for the Aurene weapons. Anet did in fact make those collections easier than when they were first introduced. They seem to have a few precedents set where they did exactly that.
And again, no one who is really interested in this possibility, wants an "easy" path. At least that's not my overall impression from reading through the entirety of this thread.


 

[Sobx.1758]

14 minutes ago, idpersona.3810 said:

I would actually say that the fact that this topic comes up often enough and generates enough interest for produce 29+ pages (just this time) seems to imply that there is at least genuine interest in the concept. Exact implementation is up to Anet and I don't think much of what specifically gets said in these threads actually reaches anyone of influence (though obviously I could be wrong).

 

Gift of Exploration for each item? Sure. Wouldn't bother me personally at all. That would mean map completion 3 times per set. 9 times for all 3. That is an incredible time sink. And naysayers on here would still complain it was too fast or easy, even if that were just 1 part of the crafting.  Stack on other stuff as well. Make it more expensive than the other legendary sets.

 

This isn't a good argument against.
Even if it were easier, and basically no one is actually asking for it to be. A different path =/= easier.
But even is it were, this is a bad argument against, since things like the Return to achievements exist which make the Skyscale journey much easier than it used to be. Another example off the top of my head would be the Elder Dragon variants for the Aurene weapons. Anet did in fact make those collections easier than when they were first introduced. They seem to have a few precedents set where they did exactly that.
And again, no one who is really interested in this possibility, wants an "easy" path. At least that's not my overall impression from reading through the entirety of this thread.

It doesn't really come that often, it's repeatably the same people and pages are generated by repeated posts (that were responded back and forth over and over again until "the wrong point is reached" just to "genuinely" restart the whole ""discussion"" again) of mostly the same users. All these pages also include reasons for which the players don't want another path. But sure, you can try to bend this thread into interpretation you want to have from the start 😄

Edited September 19, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Silent.6137]

1 hour ago, idpersona.3810 said:

I would actually say that the fact that this topic comes up often enough and generates enough interest for produce 29+ pages (just this time) seems to imply that there is at least genuine interest in the concept. Exact implementation is up to Anet and I don't think much of what specifically gets said in these threads actually reaches anyone of influence (though obviously I could be wrong).

Anet personnels definitely pay attention to the forum regardless of what some people may claim. Wouldn't you if this game is how you make a living? You'd want to know what the players' concerns are.

As for interest, there are definitely tons of interests; 13k+ views, 700+ replies and 29 pages. No matter what some people may claim, you don't get these kind of numbers from just a few. Each poster will only have so much to contribute and so much time to spend here. Looking through past threads that are similar, there's definitely a few regular forummers that will post in virtually any controversial topics but overall, you do see lots of different users. I'd never posted on this kind of thread before because I was fine whichever way it goes then.

Even if the naysayers stay away from threads like this to prevent them from gaininjg tractions, there will still be lots of posts. Lots of pages. Lots of views. Mainly because this topic is of great interest to many.

[Solvar.7953]

As I said in a previous post, some people are for OW legendary weapons, some are against it, that will never change.

Some people are against any changes, and others want radical changes (not about armor, about the game in in general).  There isn't any right or wrong answer - it is all opinions.

As a note, all my characters (9 of them) already have full ascended gear.  They have also all completed world exploration.  So I'm not looking for an increase in power (though some of them probably need to be respeced now, and probably more more after the upcoming balance patch).  Legendary armor makes that easier.  Of course, I can also just play the existing spec, but the power difference in some is so much that running a lower power spec is less than ideal.

Someone mentioned long term goals, and for me, that is what OW legendary armor would be (currently do legendary weapons, but at some point, I'll have all of those I need).  And while there are ways for me to get it, none are game modes I enjoy playing.

I've considered the WvW path.  The solution I came up for that was to fire up GW2, go to WvW, and then do something else (browse the web, watch videos, etc), and periodically go GW2 to keep up the WvW participation.  With that, I would make reasonable progress.  But that isn't enjoyable or fun - it sounds a lot more like work (which I already do enough of), so I'm not going to do that.

It is very difficult to know what appropriate OW content would be to balance other game modes - some people have thrown out things that are an order of magnitude more difficult.  That is like saying "I'll sell you this can of soda for $1000" - while a price was put on it, it was so unrealistic no one would ever do it, so what is the point.  The prismatic regalia has been suggested - that doing the 24 meta achievements.  If one says it takes ~4 hours for each meta (that might be low), that is only 96 hours, and probably would be faster if you had already done it (and more other people doing them also)

If I could close this topic (I don't think I can), I would, because at this point, I think it has run its course.  I can just hope Anet maybe takes notice and thinks about this - maybe some future achievement, option for future content, who knows.

 

[Silent.6137]

56 minutes ago, Solvar.7953 said:

If I could close this topic (I don't think I can), I would, because at this point, I think it has run its course.  I can just hope Anet maybe takes notice and thinks about this - maybe some future achievement, option for future content, who knows.

There's absolutely no reason to close threads like these because they'll surface again as long as there's interest. If it has run its course, then it'll die a natural death. It only needs to be closed when people starts to get personal, or try to derail it when others don't agree with their viewpoints.

[Tiviana.2650]

On 9/16/2022 at 8:17 PM, Linken.6345 said:

Yes anyone would be happy for more free stuff if Anet asked would you like 250 gold a week majority would vote yes.

What are you talking about free? That makes no sense at all, you still have to grind out the content you still have to have the gold to craft it, by your example all legendary is free! As long as its a path for people to grind out who cares if there is a ow leggy set. It wont hurt anything except raid sellers pockets, it would be good for the health of the game actually.  If people dislike raiding and prefer ow content, why should they be cut out from the QoL of legendary armor? It still wouldnt be cheap and they would have to do a lot of events world bosses and world currency , and achievements to get. You act like people are asking to just mail them the armor, and thats not it at all. A set tied to the world and its events and lore is a great way to do a long journey to a legendary armor set. 

[Linken.6345]

11 minutes ago, Tiviana.2650 said:

What are you talking about free? That makes no sense at all, you still have to grind out the content you still have to have the gold to craft it, by your example all legendary is free! As long as its a path for people to grind out who cares if there is a ow leggy set. It wont hurt anything except raid sellers pockets, it would be good for the health of the game actually.  If people dislike raiding and prefer ow content, why should they be cut out from the QoL of legendary armor? It still wouldnt be cheap and they would have to do a lot of events world bosses and world currency , and achievements to get. You act like people are asking to just mail them the armor, and thats not it at all. A set tied to the world and its events and lore is a great way to do a long journey to a legendary armor set. 

It is content you already do anyway so it is a extra reward added on top so you get it for free.

Edit

With emboldened and normal eod strikes weekly li you can get your raid kills needed for collection and li without raid seller or use 1 of the other two modes if you like.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Linken.6345

[Tiviana.2650]

Just now, Linken.6345 said:

It is content you already do anyway so it is a extra reward added on top so you get it for free.

I dont do ow i raid log in raid do some fracts or strikes and log off. So yeah by that analogy my raid leggys are free 😏

[Silent.6137]

2 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

It is content you already do anyway so it is a extra reward added on top so you get it for free.

Edit

With emboldened and normal eod strikes weekly li you can get your raid kills needed for collection and li without raid seller or use 1 of the other two modes if you like.

By your reasoning, then any extra Raids, PvP or WvW you do to grind for your items will be free. They're just extra rewards. right?

Having extra ways to get LI is not the issue. As has been repeated over and over, the issue is game modes and not how much easier it is to get into something you don't enjoy

[Teratus.2859]

If there ever is to be a PvE implemented method outside of raids for Legendary Armour then it should just be craftable like other legendary weapons and involve a long, tedious and expensive journey to make an entire set of it.

And yes I am going to go there as well and say that it absolutely SHOULD!!! require you to do something in multiple maps for every single living world and expansion as well.

None of this core world only bull.. if you want this armour you are going to need the complete Gw2 game and you are going to have to work for it.

The nature of it being open world PvE armour will by default make it the easiest way to obtain legendary armour in the game.. so it needs to be balanced as such and the simplest way to do that will be to also make it the most expensive set of legendary armour in the game to get, and also the most time consuming way to get legendary armour.

[Silent.6137]

2 minutes ago, Teratus.2859 said:

If there ever is to be a PvE implemented method outside of raids for Legendary Armour then it should just be craftable like other legendary weapons and involve a long, tedious and expensive journey to make an entire set of it.

And yes I am going to go there as well and say that it absolutely SHOULD!!! require you to do something in multiple maps for every single living world and expansion as well.

None of this core world only bull.. if you want this armour you are going to need the complete Gw2 game and you are going to have to work for it.

The nature of it being open world PvE armour will by default make it the easiest way to obtain legendary armour in the game.. so it needs to be balanced as such and the simplest way to do that will be to also make it the most expensive set of legendary armour in the game to get, and also the most time consuming way to get legendary armour.

If you had read most of the responses, those that think there should be OW legendary armor are in consensus that they should be difficult to obtain. What gave you the idea that that's not the case?

[Astralporing.1957]

54 minutes ago, Silent.6137 said:

If you had read most of the responses, those that think there should be OW legendary armor are in consensus that they should be difficult to obtain. What gave you the idea that that's not the case?

Because made up fake arguments are easiest to defeat.

Someone creates a nice sounding argument that triest to put a negative spin on the other side's position (like "you all just want to get it for free and easy"). Then they base their whole argumentation on defeating that fake position. And if something does not match that assumption, they just ignore it and repeat that fake argumentation over and over again.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Astralporing.1957

[Teratus.2859]

1 hour ago, Silent.6137 said:

If you had read most of the responses, those that think there should be OW legendary armor are in consensus that they should be difficult to obtain. What gave you the idea that that's not the case?

There are 29 pages in this discussion, do you seriously think i'm going to waste my time reading every single one of them?
No dude I have much better things to do lol

 

The only post here I was even remotely directing mine at was the original one that started this thread.
I've seen plenty of threads like this over time with different ideas on how an overworld set should be implemented.

I was only giving my 2 cents on the only one I would actually support.
In general I do not support the idea of an open world set, not unless it was done more or less how I described.

[Astralporing.1957]

52 minutes ago, Teratus.2859 said:

There are 29 pages in this discussion, do you seriously think i'm going to waste my time reading every single one of them?
No dude I have much better things to do lol

 

The only post here I was even remotely directing mine at was the original one that started this thread.
I've seen plenty of threads like this over time with different ideas on how an overworld set should be implemented.

I was only giving my 2 cents on the only one I would actually support.
In general I do not support the idea of an open world set, not unless it was done more or less how I described.

So, basically, yes, you were making assumptions about the thread (and the whole idea) without actually reading through it.

Hint: the nature of the OW legendary armor, by default will make it targeted at the widest audience (which is exactly the point, btw), but not necessarily most easily available like you said. The most easily available legendary armor is currently the WvW one, and OW armor set would have to try really hard to be easier than that. It's just that the WVW armor, while still the easiest, is also targeted at a very narrow audience.

Hint nr. 2: OW armor suggestion threads are not about asking for lower effort approach. That's just the fake argumens tome people that dislike the idea use while trying to discredit it.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Astralporing.1957

[Silent.6137]

1 hour ago, Teratus.2859 said:

There are 29 pages in this discussion, do you seriously think i'm going to waste my time reading every single one of them?
No dude I have much better things to do lol

When anyone comments on a discussion, especially an extended one like this one, you kinda expect them to have at least have scanned through some of the debates. Don't expect you to go through the whole 29 pages.

What the OP wrote was a little too simplistic and had acknowledged some of his points as so. I think most who are advocating OW legendary armor, expect and are in favor of  something even tougher than what you had suggested. At least I do.

[yoni.7015]

5 hours ago, Solvar.7953 said:

If I could close this topic (I don't think I can), I would, because at this point, I think it has run its course. 

Maybe as the person who started this thread you can ask a moderator to close it. It has run its course and like all the threads on this topic before it is not really a productive discussion. 

[Silent.6137]

38 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Maybe as the person who started this thread you can ask a moderator to close it. It has run its course and like all the threads on this topic before it is not really a productive discussion. 

The only reason you view this discussion as unproductive is because you do not support it's implementation, no matter what. Out of sight, out of mind.

There's really no reason whatsoever for anyone that think so to continue commenting. Leave it to those who still wants to discuss it to do so.

 

Edited September 19, 2022 by Silent.6137

[yoni.7015]

6 minutes ago, Silent.6137 said:

The only reason you view this discussion as unproductive is because you do not support it's implementation, no matter what. Out of sight, out of mind.

There's really no reason whatsoever for anyone that think so to continue commenting. Leave it to those who still wants to discuss it to do so.

 

The OP has expressed his wish to close this thread. Do you want to exclude him from the discussion as well? Only those in favor are allowed to comment? This is not how a public forum works, sorry. 
Is it a productive discussion? No, it’s not. It’s just like the threads before that all got closed. 
 

Edited September 19, 2022 by yoni.7015

[The Boz.2038]

4 hours ago, Silent.6137 said:

If you had read most of the responses, those that think there should be OW legendary armor are in consensus that they should be difficult to obtain. What gave you the idea that that's not the case?

Reading most of the responses gives you the idea that it is not the case.

[SlayerXX.7138]

6 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

So, basically, yes, you were making assumptions about the thread (and the whole idea) without actually reading through it.

Hint: the nature of the OW legendary armor, by default will make it targeted at the widest audience (which is exactly the point, btw), but not necessarily most easily available like you said. The most easily available legendary armor is currently the WvW one, and OW armor set would have to try really hard to be easier than that. It's just that the WVW armor, while still the easiest, is also targeted at a very narrow audience.

Hint nr. 2: OW armor suggestion threads are not about asking for lower effort approach. That's just the fake argumens tome people that dislike the idea use while trying to discredit it.

Assumptions? Op Alone wants the same time frame(timegates) as WvW but with around 1/4th of time investment. And tagging worldbosses is probably one of the very narrow pools off activities that are actually less effort then flipping camps in WvW. He clearly states WvW takes to long and he wants something shorter.

OP is at least honest and flat out states he want a shorter version. Many people clearly underestimate how long it takes to get Legendary armor. Like someone already said Raid armor on top of the whole raiding challenge also does need collections and OW metas to complete. 600 PvP Shards are a lot of intense gameplay for 1 Piece even if you like PvP. While some clearly would be up to the challenge, most responses make it clear the just want an easier/less effort legendary armor if they even understand how difficult it is to get legendary armor with the current Methods in the first place. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by Albi.7250

[Astralporing.1957]

5 minutes ago, Albi.7250 said:

Assumptions? Op Alone wants the same time frame(timegates) as WvW but with around 1/4th of actual time investment. And tagging worldbosses is probably one of the very narrow pools off activities that are actually less effort then flipping camps in WvW. He clearly states WvW takes to long and he wants something shorter.

OP is at least honest and flat out states he want a shorter version.

If you bothered to reread the thread further on, beyond that initial post, you'd see that it wasn't the total length that was the issue for OP. When he was commenting about wanting "something shorter", he was really asking about somethiong that would be easier to parcel into smaller pieces, to be able to do it more slowly over a longer time. WvW in practice does not allow that - most of the tickets are backloaded, so you can't just do few chests in a week and expect any meaningful progress. You can't split the 20 hours you'd need to spend WvW in in the same week for full diamond on several weeks with time investment totaling to the same 20 hours, and still expect to get the same total amount of tickets (Which is not a new concern, but something that has been long argued about, with Anet already having made some adjustments to the system already, and supposedly considering even more changes in the future).

OP wanted something they could work on bit by bit on the side. They also admitted to being overly simplistic in the opening post, and said that that they were fine with other OW-related stuff as well and world bosses were picked just as an example, primarily as a result of the apreviously mentioned concern - because they were something that could easily be split into small individual pieces of time investment.

So, OW didn't want lower time investment, nor did they want to spend less effort. What they wanted was for that effort and time to be something easier to manage. I don't see this expectation as anything problematic.

5 minutes ago, Albi.7250 said:

Many people clearly underestimate how long it actually takes to get Legendary armor. Like someone already said Raid armor on top of the whole raiding challenge also does need collections and OW metas to complete. Likes 600 PvP Shards are a lot of intense gameplay for 1 Piece even if you like PvP. While some clearly would be up to the challenge, most responses make it clear the just want an easier/less effort legendary armor if they even understand how difficult it is to get legendary armor with the current Methods.

Oh, having acquired all raid legendaries, and doing WvW on on and off basis (and having done a ticket farming streak for WvW ring at some point) i am fully aware of how much effort is required for each of those paths. I.e. how raid armor/ring effort is mostly frontloaded, and after you get through the initial hurdle getting LI becomes nothing more than just a time gate. And how farming WvW tickets is locked primarily beyond tedium (because, while there are certainly moments in that mode that are great fun, you have to be a very attached fan for it to not turn into mind-killing boredom if you have to spend tens of hours on it weekly, for many weeks).

5 minutes ago, Albi.7250 said:

Your yourself got offended when the use of  GoE was mentioned.

You might want to reread that again, because (like The Boz) you seem to have not understood what i said. My primary concerns with GoE was never with the effort required, but only with the fact that GoEs are not repeatable on a single character - which is a concern that i have regardless of trying to tie that into a legendary armor thread. And which seems to be shared by Anet, seeing how the EoD map completion is repeatable (using the lantern mechanic). My second remark about GoE was more about how weird the argument about how it "has to be GoE, and cannot be repeatable, because Gift of Dedication [with that comparison not actually explaining anything])" was and how there wasn't any logic in it at all. To repeat it: i am completely fine with the GoE-equivalent of effort as a component (one of many) for 2 pieces of legendary armor (or even for one). My only issue is about how needing multiple GoEs (for 3 armor weight categories, and for at least some gen 1 weapons i assume some people might want) requires either buying additional character slots, or the practice of deleting/recreating characters just to farm for that one item (which i consider a very degenerate approach to the problem).

And the only thing i got offended with was The Boz trying to put words into my mounth that meant someting different than what i said. Because that is just rude.