Roaming in a kill squad is now a must.

[oatsnjuices.1698]

There are so many tanky players roaming. They cant be killed but will fight with their health not dropping below 75%, it just shoots back up to 100%. Or they run in, pretend to do damage, then run with aeges, barrier, invuln, and/or super healing to the nearest door that is half a map away, and make it with 10 people hitting on them. Come on, is this supposed to be fun? What is so competitive about this?

Edited April 29, 2023 by oatsnjuices.1698

[Hotride.2187]

There is nothing competitive about wvw? Its a sandbox mode. Though yeah cele makes solo roaming garbage.

You can play spvp conquest, less bunkering and sort of competition. And the bunkers are nowhere near as tanky as in wvw (cause no cele).

[SFShinigami.1572]

You don't have to fight them.  If a fight gets stupid and boring just let them go be stupid and boring.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

You can play spvp conquest, less bunkering and sort of competition. And the bunkers are nowhere near as tanky as in wvw (cause no cele).

 

😂.  Just make sure to avoid the games that have spellbreakers, or elementalists....

[oatsnjuices.1698]

I would trade my main, every part of it. just take it, but also delete celestial.

[Pengu.7481]

On 4/29/2023 at 6:56 AM, oatsnjuices.1698 said:

There are so many tanky players roaming. They cant be killed but will fight with their health not dropping below 75%, it just shoots back up to 100%. Or they run in, pretend to do damage, then run with aeges, barrier, invuln, and/or super healing to the nearest door that is half a map away, and make it with 10 people hitting on them. Come on, is this supposed to be fun? What is so competitive about this?

u need some sustain/defenses/escape tools if u are roaming, going full glasscannon is a sure fire way to get deleted when u are trying to kill a target thats hugging guards/camps/towers or getting outnumbered

glasscannons are great for zergs when u have support. they are kitten for roaming

Edited April 30, 2023 by Pengu.7481

[Dahkeus.8243]

17 hours ago, oatsnjuices.1698 said:

There are so many tanky players roaming. They cant be killed but will fight with their health not dropping below 75%, it just shoots back up to 100%. Or they run in, pretend to do damage, then run with aeges, barrier, invuln, and/or super healing to the nearest door that is half a map away, and make it with 10 people hitting on them. Come on, is this supposed to be fun? What is so competitive about this?

Why is killing the player important?  If you want the reward from the kill, it's pretty minimal and you'd get better rewards from any sort of group play in WvW.  If you just want the victory, well then any player who runs away has lost the fight, whether you stomp them or not. 

Bear in mind that some builds will always counter other builds in roaming to some degree.  Other players who know how to read fights better will also come across as a lot tankier than they are.  Consider if you are truly timing your damage abilities for when your opponent is vulnerable or just bursting as soon as your attack skills are off cooldown.  Are you applying poison/stripping boons before you attack?  Are you baiting out enemy dodges/cooldowns before attacking?  Also, is your build really competitive enough? 

Cele is a tough stat set, but it's not invulnerable and no one plays their build perfectly, so there will always be more at play than it seems.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Complaints about Cele all seem to boil down to skill issue. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

1 hour ago, Eekasqueak.7850 said:

Complaints about Cele all seem to boil down to skill issue. 

 

Tough one, as on one hand anything can be a skill issue--on the other hand, I've seen cele carry players that have no idea what they are doing otherwise. 

Now granted it's coupled with harbinger/willbender for the most part, but still, it's not really up for debate that cele is the low intensity WvW roaming/smallscale build.  

[Dawdler.8521]

3 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

Tough one

Nah man he's actually right its a skill issue. 

An issue with skills doing 10 things at once and giving you perma boons. 

See, people are more insightful than they know 🙃

 

[Eekasqueak.7850]

3 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

Tough one, as on one hand anything can be a skill issue--on the other hand, I've seen cele carry players that have no idea what they are doing otherwise. 

Now granted it's coupled with harbinger/willbender for the most part, but still, it's not really up for debate that cele is the low intensity WvW roaming/smallscale build.  

Idk man, every time I see it brought up it just sounds like people salty they can't steamroll. 

[Hotride.2187]

6 hours ago, Eekasqueak.7850 said:

Complaints about Cele all seem to boil down to skill issue. 

l o l

 

22 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

😂.  Just make sure to avoid the games that have spellbreakers, or elementalists....

You mean like how you run away from them when roaming in wvw, because they are twice as unkillable with cele?

 

Edited April 30, 2023 by Hotride.2187

[Gotejjeken.1267]

42 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

You mean like how you run away from them when roaming in wvw, because they are twice as unkillable with cele?

 

Issues for me are more pronounced in sPvP, because in WvW have a greater stat set to fight the cele variants with. 

Also, running away is an option in WvW where in sPvP that will 99% of the times lose you games unless you are specifically a roamer and not a duelist, etc.

That's why I find spellbreaker and ele in general more egregious in sPvP, regardless of if cele presence. 

As I said, I don't really see the issue with cele unless its on specific classes / builds (aforementioned harb and willbender for example), THEN it becomes quite a large issue.  

Edited April 30, 2023 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Xenesis.6389]

Just carry a pocket gun flame berserker around in your party, tank problem solved.

 

[RazieL.5684]

did... did you just try to justify ganking solo players with a group because you can't win fights?... oof...

[Vavume.8065]

On 4/30/2023 at 5:02 AM, Eekasqueak.7850 said:

every time I see it brought up it just sounds like people salty they can't steamroll. 

... and everytime I see someone defend cele I know they play cele.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Vavume.8065

[Riba.3271]

If you guys think cele is bad, you should see the power of minstrel willbender or druid tanking any 2 players forever.

Bore enemies to death.

Boon duration not problematic at all.

Edited May 2, 2023 by Riba.3271

[Arheundel.6451]

On 4/29/2023 at 5:56 AM, oatsnjuices.1698 said:

There are so many tanky players roaming. They cant be killed but will fight with their health not dropping below 75%, it just shoots back up to 100%. Or they run in, pretend to do damage, then run with aeges, barrier, invuln, and/or super healing to the nearest door that is half a map away, and make it with 10 people hitting on them. Come on, is this supposed to be fun? What is so competitive about this?

Tanky roamers started to appear due to garbage players incapable of winning on their own or thief gank/griefing groups, thieves are more the reason why tanky builds started to appear...or even pewpew glass rangers hiding inside towers.

You can't roam on glass builds because of thieves, mesmers and 1500 range pewpe sic'em...also because players these days won't leave home without a backup support/healer....literally I am only leaving the base on a tanky condi build now, it's the only way to kill stealth abusers, cele tanks, babysitted wannabe "roamers".

Power builds straight don't work anymore for simple roaming......stealth builds will simply stealth and run...come back at full HP , cele builds will simply facetank all your dmg without ever pressing the dodge button and babysitted wannabe too will facetank all your dmg...while a tanky tempest/firebrand/scrapper/vindicator keeping them alive.

As a matter of fact...I don't use glass builds at all anymore as there is no kittening point, between nerfed power dmg.... -dmg buff food, super healing, perma boon builds, even if you use full zerk/assassin burst...you see these people going back to full HP after 5s even after eating around 12k dmg in one go...and kill you with a grin plastered on their face. No no....my power builds now won't potentially oneshot anything but can still do scary bursts, while being able to withstand a tactical nuke explosion in the process.

In general, stealth is the main culprit followed by years of powercreep balance.....power build roaming is dead and buried, especially after the direct dmg nerf from 2 years ago. I still tried to play it "fair" for years to no avail, constantly harassed by d/p thieves and cele tanks and then I gave up after realizing how devastating condi burst can be against the aforementioned kitten

 

[Lalary.3561]

On 4/29/2023 at 5:15 PM, Eekasqueak.7850 said:

Complaints about Cele all seem to boil down to skill issue. 

Playing full cele requires so much skill huh?

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Just now, Lalary.3561 said:

Playing full cele requires so much skill huh?

Complaining you can't beat it sounds like a lack of skill yes.  Especially with how much people hype it up as basically making the game play itself when it really doesn't. 

[Lalary.3561]

29 minutes ago, Eekasqueak.7850 said:

Complaining you can't beat it sounds like a lack of skill yes.  Especially with how much people hype it up as basically making the game play itself when it really doesn't. 

Who says anything about complaining for not beating celestial carried players? I play power and sometimes celestial and its no secret that celestial stat absolutely overshines power and even condition on most of builds especially on EoD specs.

Go play both power and celestial harbinger and try telling me there isn't a drastic difference between two.

And lastly, I'd love to hear your explanation on why Anet removed celestial amulet in PvP mode.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

13 minutes ago, Lalary.3561 said:

Who says anything about complaining for not beating celestial carried players? I play power and sometimes celestial and its no secret that celestial stat absolutely overshines power and even condition on most of builds especially on EoD specs.

Go play both power and celestial harbinger and try telling me there isn't a drastic difference between two.

And lastly, I'd love to hear your explanation on why Anet removed celestial amulet in PvP mode.

Some specs aren't good for power builds, big surprise there? This whole thread was literally started by someone complaining about not being able to beat cele players (despite having no way to actually know the gear of who they are fighting) WvW isn't Spvp and I don't play Spvp so I won't even touch that. People lose fights and then they look for a scapegoat, in this case Celestial, and then just do nothing but complain and try to get nerfs to make up for their own lack of skill. It's so blatantly obvious from the ways people complain that this is the case. 

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

If they don't want to interact with you... Just leave?

 

You're not forced to fight them to the death. If you poke them a few times, see that they only take 300 damage on a crit, spam invulns and run around being immune to pulls- they are a waste of time. Go somewhere else.

 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497

[Widebody.5071]

There's hardly anyone to fight except for stragglers and people moving from point A to point B. Why do those "kill squads" run up on less mobile classes but away from classes they like to represent?

[Hotride.2187]

On 5/2/2023 at 12:10 AM, Xenesis.6389 said:

Just carry a pocket gun flame berserker around in your party, tank problem solved.

But what if the opponents have... 2 tanky players? And... even worse... a res signet?

Edited May 22, 2023 by Hotride.2187