EoD was a mistake

[SevlisBavles.3059]

The game in general but especially PvP is just oversaturated with meme mechanics now. There is so much that actual "balancing" is no longer possible because there is too much kitten to juggle. Also, to make EoD specs work, core/HoT/PoF specs were tinkered with to the point where some of those builds are out of control as well.

There are too many obnoxious condi builds, too many ridiculous glass cannons and too many bunker builds. The current "balancing" is some of the worst I have ever seen and PvP gameplay is just a meme at this point.

[Waffles.5632]

Out of all this, Mirage still only has one dodge.

[shion.2084]

On 5/14/2023 at 7:02 AM, SevlisBavles.3059 said:

The game in general but especially PvP is just oversaturated with meme mechanics now. There is so much that actual "balancing" is no longer possible because there is too much kitten to juggle. Also, to make EoD specs work, core/HoT/PoF specs were tinkered with to the point where some of those builds are out of control as well.

There are too many obnoxious condi builds, too many ridiculous glass cannons and too many bunker builds. The current "balancing" is some of the worst I have ever seen and PvP gameplay is just a meme at this point.

I'd say one of the biggest issues is the massive mobility creep.     They made Zergs viable because they can literally Zerg between two points and avoid their decap.  It made a very different dynamic possible.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

On 5/14/2023 at 7:02 AM, SevlisBavles.3059 said:

There are too many obnoxious condi builds, too many ridiculous glass cannons and too many bunker builds. The current "balancing" is some of the worst I have ever seen and PvP gameplay is just a meme at this point.

"Too much of everything" was the sentiment of players dissatisfied with their winrate in the game balance before the megapatch. We have seen the results of listening to that direction. 

Is "less" builds what you want? It seems like there's enough variety in that soup of memes you have there that you can counter any one particularly obnoxious thing.

And that is exactly what balancing needs, tbh. A multitude of memes that all work keeps people from getting bored of losing to the same three builds forever. 

Quote

mobility creep

I don't care about this. People being able to go fast now takes the teeth out of their thief complaints. Now I can be as degenerate as I want with stealth without feeling bad about it. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[DivineDreaming.7206]

eh EOD is not even that bad....worst power creep in history was heart of thorns, the first expansion.

 

balance is pretty decent right now compared to 5 years ago....though 2012-2014 was prob GW2 best era for pvp and wvw.

[WhoWantsAHug.3186]

57 minutes ago, DivineDreaming.7206 said:

eh EOD is not even that bad....worst power creep in history was heart of thorns, the first expansion.

 

balance is pretty decent right now compared to 5 years ago....though 2012-2014 was prob GW2 best era for pvp and wvw.

Nah, core gw2 was kinda boring compared to now. The expansions really raised the skillcap of the game. The elite specs are way more fun. 

[Spellhunter.9675]

On 5/15/2023 at 6:46 PM, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

"Too much of everything" was the sentiment of players dissatisfied with their winrate in the game balance before the megapatch. We have seen the results of listening to that direction. 

Is "less" builds what you want? 

If we are talking about feb.20 patch, right before it there were 4-5 meta builds, after it there were 5-8 meta builds and a couple of very close to meta builds. After eod there are 3-4 metabuilds and they are miles ahead of everything. Direction was right, execution was wrong (no stream of small tweaks that was promised).

[cyberzombie.7348]

Tl;Dr: The issue goes well beyond EoD since they can't pick a balance/design philosophy and stick to it.

The 2015 trait rework got the ball rolling. Inverting the 'F' skill traits like trickery and defence to make spamming skills rewarding instead of having to pace them out. Then came HoT with specs that began to water down the concept of 'no trinity.'

PoF leaned further into bolstering support roles along with the introduction of barriers watered down the combat philosophy of needing to avoid hits, not facetanking it with heals and boons. They at least had the foresight to add in anti-supports to keep things in check... Then all of the anti-supports got nerfed along with the global damage nerf of 2020.

In EoD's case it brought a lot more mobiliy than needed along with skills/mechanics that were cut or nerfed from core classes, only to be reintroduced to e-spec in stronger itterations.

Most notably is acidic elixirs from engi and ricochet from thief got cut during the 2015 trait rework only to be reintroduced to harbinger but stronger. On top of more mobility that overshadows necromancer's core weakness, the same can be said about willbenders.

The ability to heal and maintain turrets was cut and became susceptible to crits/condi because ppl were compaining about a kit that forces you to bunker down on a point is op. Yet we get an e-spec with an a.i. that allows the same thing on top of more dps, mobility with a teleport, susceptible to heals/boons, doesn't glitch out when immobilized by tangled vines, and somehow only a few people has an issue with this.

[JTGuevara.9018]

On 5/14/2023 at 7:02 AM, SevlisBavles.3059 said:

The game in general but especially PvP is just oversaturated with meme mechanics now. There is so much that actual "balancing" is no longer possible because there is too much kitten to juggle. Also, to make EoD specs work, core/HoT/PoF specs were tinkered with to the point where some of those builds are out of control as well.

There are too many obnoxious condi builds, too many ridiculous glass cannons and too many bunker builds. The current "balancing" is some of the worst I have ever seen and PvP gameplay is just a meme at this point.

Which is why I quit pvp in this game and, in general, mmos. Multiplayer action RPGs are a crap-shoot. Too many variables, too many things to account for. And the more stuff you add to them, the worse they get over time. It gets harder and harder to integrate the new things together cohesively. And BOY is this shown today lmao!

The "balancing" is just a game of hot potato.

The only "mmo" I play is gw1, since it's oriented for small parties and single-player. Nothing else.

[Downstate.4697]

To be fair, since cmc and Roy teamed up I think balance is headed in a good direction. The designers for EoD did not have PvP in mind when creating the elites nor did they have any business balancing. The poor management of the game and their inability to standardize processes or develop guidelines bled into PvP. Let’s just hope grouch and friends can learn from their predecessors. 

[Loboling.5293]

Best PvP was just before PoF. They managed to tune the HoT builds finally into something really enjoyable. The gameplay, mechanics, build diversity, all very fun. I'll never forget how the game never recovered from then, and EoD just sunk the bar even further.