Do something about pulls

[Arrow Blade of El Elyon.9341]

But, it can be funny to watch...
 

 

 

[TheGrimm.5624]

2 hours ago, Arrow Blade of El Elyon.9341 said:

But, it can be funny to watch...
 

 

 

lol, nope not enough coffee. Trying to track the video, the voice overlay and the choice of music and this non-coffee brain can't connect lol. Will try that again later. 🙂 

[Burnfall.9573]

3 hours ago, Arrow Blade of El Elyon.9341 said:

But, it can be funny to watch...
 

 

 

you are entitled to your feelings but I find this disheartening. Remember, your opponent/s...the same way you are putting effort into your gameplay, they are also putting effort into their gameplay.

The difference between you and them is; (don't take it personal), you are using a Toxic design mechanic, to suddenly end their effort in being successful. 

Effort is the issue here and this is why WvW and PvP population is declining with no end in site...Effort are being 'cut short', not by learning skills but my Toxic Designs. 

Instead of Anet minimizing Toxicity in their designs to encourage players efforts,  they increase it...... and finds it funny

In addition to this, Anet implements a Controlling Totalitarian Philosophy, 'to keep the players in check' , 'to keep the players in line', 'use Toxic designs to succeed instead of purring in effort- the game our way without efforts'  to punish the players efforts.

Anet Master Plan is; Toxic Philosophy

'Toxicity is about control, abuse of power and 'cutting short' efforts, using manipulative oppressive tactics to gain unfair advantages, using exploitive strategies to 'take the easy way out'....

 

"Consequences don't care about the decision making process that led you to them" 

Anet Master Plan is facing backlash with no end on sight.  Consequences has now on a equal Mutual Agreement with Anet

Now that is call Fair!!

Edited July 9, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[Kate.3679]

1 hour ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

you are entitled to your feelings but I find this disheartening. Remember, your opponent/s...the same way you are putting effort into your gameplay, they are also putting effort into their gameplay.

The difference between you and them is; (don't take it personal), you are using a Toxic design mechanic, to suddenly end their effort in being successful. 

Effort is the issue here and this is why WvW and PvP population is declining with no end in site...Effort are being 'cut short', not by learning skills but my Toxic Designs. 

Instead of Anet minimizing Toxicity in their designs to encourage players efforts,  they increase it...... and finds it funny

In addition to this, Anet implements a Controlling Totalitarian Philosophy, 'to keep the players in check' , 'to keep the players in line', 'use Toxic designs to succeed instead of purring in effort- the game our way without efforts'  to punish the players efforts.

Anet Master Plan is; Toxic Philosophy

'Toxicity is about control, abuse of power and 'cutting short' efforts, using manipulative oppressive tactics to gain unfair advantages, using exploitive strategies to 'take the easy way out'....

 

"Consequences don't care about the decision making process that led you to them" 

Anet Master Plan is facing backlash with no end on sight.  Consequences has now on a equal Mutual Agreement with Anet

Now that is call Fair!!

it ain't that deep. this guy is just a master at pinsniping. personally i find it hilarious that this one guy is outplaying entire zergs by screwing over the commander. lmao

[Zepoolpe.9217]

Laugh in Spectral Grasp

[Bunbury.8472]

5 hours ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

you are entitled to your feelings but I find this disheartening. Remember, your opponent/s...the same way you are putting effort into your gameplay, they are also putting effort into their gameplay.

The difference between you and them is; (don't take it personal), you are using a Toxic design mechanic, to suddenly end their effort in being successful. 

Effort is the issue here and this is why WvW and PvP population is declining with no end in site...Effort are being 'cut short', not by learning skills but my Toxic Designs. 

Instead of Anet minimizing Toxicity in their designs to encourage players efforts,  they increase it...... and finds it funny

In addition to this, Anet implements a Controlling Totalitarian Philosophy, 'to keep the players in check' , 'to keep the players in line', 'use Toxic designs to succeed instead of purring in effort- the game our way without efforts'  to punish the players efforts.

Anet Master Plan is; Toxic Philosophy

'Toxicity is about control, abuse of power and 'cutting short' efforts, using manipulative oppressive tactics to gain unfair advantages, using exploitive strategies to 'take the easy way out'....

 

"Consequences don't care about the decision making process that led you to them" 

Anet Master Plan is facing backlash with no end on sight.  Consequences has now on a equal Mutual Agreement with Anet

Now that is call Fair!!

"A scrub is not just a bad player. Everyone needs time to learn a game and get to a point where they know what they're doing. The scrub mentality is to be so shackled by self-imposed handicaps as to never have any hope of being truly good at a game. You can practice forever, but if you can't get over these common hangups, in a sense you've lost before you even started. You've lost before you even picked which game to play. You aren't playing to win.

A scrub would disagree with this though. They'd say they are trying very hard. The problem is they are only trying hard within a construct of fictitious rules that prevent them from ever truly competing." - https://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win

a good read if you don't like being frustrated, and do enjoy the experience of learning. if you don't enjoy learning or losing, as I guess will be the case with Burnfall here- don't play pvp modes if you don't want other players to use skills on you. it's really easy to avoid. I mean sure you can't use skills on them now, but think about it. do you really want to use skills on other players but not want them to use them on you? if that's the case you got some thinkin to do.

maybe I come off too serious, but it's really important to not have mental roadblocks preventing you from being happy and satisfied.

Edited July 9, 2023 by Bunbury.8472

[Zhaif.6421]

Just another day on the gw2 forums 

[Arrow Blade of El Elyon.9341]

I guess this topic must have pulled you in...

[Scolix.4879]

Personally i don't mind pulls if it happens when i am too moron to just stand on the hot spot like a complete tool but when it happens when i am inside the wall where no way i should just suddenly be outside the keep/tower wall then that is where i want to just throw my whole computer through the window buy a ticket fly down and burn down arenanet headquarters.

Pulls can be fun but pulling through the wall in 0,2 seconds without any ability to react to it is just awfull mechanic that makes fighting against stealth classes most fun gameplay ever.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

[Burnfall.9573]

4 minutes ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

certainty not

[Shazan.9638]

My commander reminds me about pulls by saying things like "Do not go too close to the edge of the wall, or you will be in range to get pulled off", or "Mount up so you will not get pulled".  I still get pulled every so often because I am not paying attention.  I consider the instant death that usually results as completely deserved, and a reminder to myself to pay attention to what is going on.

You also need to be careful of multiple pullers.  A well placed pull can pull you up the stairs to the top of the wall, and another pull then gets you over and out.  This does not seem to happen often, but I have had it happen to me a few times.  This same idea works for the wall crenels too, so hiding behind those is not really safe either. 

[XenesisII.1540]

2 minutes ago, Shazan.9638 said:

You also need to be careful of multiple pullers.  A well placed pull can pull you up the stairs to the top of the wall, and another pull then gets you over and out.  This does not seem to happen often, but I have had it happen to me a few times.  This same idea works for the wall crenels too, so hiding behind those is not really safe either. 

Double pulls don't happen often, it's an organized group doing it, while also bombing on top of the wall to get the down.

The pull from behind the wall curtain depends on angle and placement of the pull, most times the curtain can still prevent you from going out and over. There is a little bit of a trick to get more success on pulls. In any case pulls tend to be 50/50, there's plenty of defenses that stop them. The safest way to be on the wall is to be on the mount, or have defenses ready, which most players tend to do these days. 🤷‍♂️

[XenesisII.1540]

On 7/9/2023 at 8:16 AM, Dopamine.6324 said:

yea exactly that couple inch ledge that prevents you from running off w/o jumping

Not all walls have the same sized ledge or constructed perfected, there are still some you can just run over. 🤔

[babana.7521]

4 hours ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

nope.

 

BTW, this thread is talking like only players who are defending and standing on walls or hiding behind walls are getting pull, mind you we in the squad gets pull, spin around, knock off the ledge, immobilized, and more all the time, its not the pull that is the problem , it is because there are no  support or team work,. There is a reason I have to be on my FB the most boring toon I have when I am in a squad. 

Edited July 11, 2023 by babana.7521

[Chaba.5410]

5 hours ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

A blob will always have more of everything than a player.

What you are asking for is basically what happened when revenant was bugged and doing 95% damage reduction. Everyone understood immediately why you don't balance for 1v10 or 1v40. Imagine entire blobs with this cc immunity.

That is not good gameplay design either.

[TheGrimm.5624]

8 hours ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

Not sure I agree here, though, you can doubt me if you don't know me, which I don't think you do. So fair ball I guess. As in a small guild we have discussed CC on a normal basis. I see points about it in various lights. In my opinion over time you will see larger groups stack more boons and smaller groups stack more CC. The reason for this is the larger group will look for more force tactics and more boonballs to act as defense where as the smaller groups and clouds looking to try and pull out people within a boonball as a counter play option is a better choice versus guessing if they will have any support.

I think if you impact CC more you further increase the power of the boonball versus give play options to counter the boon meta by allowing players to be pulled out of the ball. I will admit even some of my older guildmates still ask for CC to have immunity but I still think that helps the boonball more than it aids a smaller group.  If the direction continues to be more boons versus anti-boon, then we need more strategic play to be added to CC and consider CC getting back damage and condi damage versus just their CC impacts,

[ZTeamG.4603]

Pulls are one of the best things in the game mode, and players that find themselves repeatedly getting pulled need to up their situational awareness and game sense. Both good positioning and good use of stability/other defensive buffs will save you and prevent you from being pulled.

 

TL;DR: get gud

[KrHome.1920]

16 hours ago, Psycoprophet.8107 said:

So to all the people confused by my post...u would rather be susceptible to continual pulls after u burned a stun break vs having a few secs of cc immunity after ur initial pull? A blob will always have more pulls than a player has stunbreaks etc so u just get continually pulled even through stun breaks,  that's a good gameplay design to u guys?

So 1 player should be able to comfortably escape 10 players all hitting him with their skills (pulls)? Is THAT good game design?

As a melee reaper player that has equipped two pulls (GS and Grasp) to make the build work at all, I can tell the following:

The GS pull only works in very specific cases. The player you want to pull of a wall has to be in a specific position. Want to pull a mounted player, a player with aegis, a player in the wrong angle? Not going to happen.

Spectral Grasp in WvW is the poor man's teleport. It gets reflected 9 out of 10 times and pulls you into your target, which is often the opposing blob. Combined with Spectral Walk this can create some epic moments, if the cooldown for that combo wasn't 50 seconds making it pretty useless overall.

TL;DR: If you want to enjoy the view on a wall, just mount up! It is that easy.

Edited July 11, 2023 by KrHome.1920

[Chaba.5410]

Haha reflected pulls are the best!

Edited July 11, 2023 by Chaba.5410

[Psycoprophet.8107]

24 minutes ago, KrHome.1920 said:

So 1 player should be able to comfortably escape 10 players all hitting him with their skills (pulls)? Is THAT good game design?

As a melee reaper player that has equipped two pulls (GS and Grasp) to make the build work at all, I can tell the following:

The GS pull only works in very specific cases. The player you want to pull of a wall has to be in a specific position. Want to pull a mounted player, a player with aegis, a player in the wrong angle? Not going to happen.

Spectral Grasp in WvW is the poor man's teleport. It gets reflected 9 out of 10 times and pulls you into your target, which is often the opposing blob. Combined with Spectral Walk this can create some epic moments, if the cooldown for that combo wasn't 50 seconds making it pretty useless overall.

TL;DR: If you want to enjoy the view on a wall, just mount up! It is that easy.

Naw ur right a player should automatically have 0 escape from pulls vs a blob and should just afk and wait for respawn...that's better design or wait....there is some classes than can thru having mtiple blocks and invulns ontop of stunbreaks, we kno this xuz those are complained about often in conversations about the powercreep of classes, guess having classes that can do so is actually good design to as to avoid being a auto kill when a blobs chasing u lol.

[kash.9213]

15 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Not sure I agree here, though, you can doubt me if you don't know me, which I don't think you do. So fair ball I guess. As in a small guild we have discussed CC on a normal basis. I see points about it in various lights. In my opinion over time you will see larger groups stack more boons and smaller groups stack more CC. The reason for this is the larger group will look for more force tactics and more boonballs to act as defense where as the smaller groups and clouds looking to try and pull out people within a boonball as a counter play option is a better choice versus guessing if they will have any support.

I think if you impact CC more you further increase the power of the boonball versus give play options to counter the boon meta by allowing players to be pulled out of the ball. I will admit even some of my older guildmates still ask for CC to have immunity but I still think that helps the boonball more than it aids a smaller group.  If the direction continues to be more boons versus anti-boon, then we need more strategic play to be added to CC and consider CC getting back damage and condi damage versus just their CC impacts,

Ya, the people I see getting pulled beyond recovery a lot don't stay tuned into body language. If you watch videos of pack animals hunting or fighting, they move or pivot in a way that tunes them into the flow of both sides and scope things out as they move and feel the plotting ahead so even if they get clipped, they can get rolled back up into their group or counter right away. Sometimes I know I could have mitigated a pull on someone pretty easily and got them into an even better position or jump on the chance to quick counter, but they didn't bounce when the way the map was breathing told them to bounce, and there's not much you can do for that because you're starting to get pulled also and it's time to scramble. 

I still get pulled off of walls, but every time I know exactly where it was that I should have noped out. Sometimes I feel like it can get to be a little much, but then I'll try to measure what they're not bringing if they brought that. 

Edited July 11, 2023 by kash.9213

[chripsy.1027]

I do agree that we should become immune to CC for XX seconds after we have been CC'd. Elder Scrolls Online has this mechanic. Being pulled then teleport back to group only to be caught in a gravity well, and then to be pulled back and burst in to oblivion by a zerg ball is not my idea of fun.

[Riba.3271]

I think pulling is nice minigame for attackers. Don't see reason to fix it. After all, casting from edge of wall does nothing unless you play staff ele and use the meteor channel tricks which avoid pulls anyways. I would recommend to make a build that can survive outside and react to incoming attacks.

I do think they should increase AoE pull cooldowns a bit as they're pretty overpowered in all kinds of fights. Optimal usage should be to wait for good time to use them, not spam them off cooldown hoping for free kills.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Riba.3271

[Ghertu.7096]

While I'm not exactly on board with OP's opinion on pulls, this post got me thinking how you kinda expect that being in a fortified position would be a combat advantage, and in GW2 WvW it's usually not.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Ghertu.7096