Anet admit world restructuring does not improve matchups

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

Seven Pines here.

WTF?! EBG has been queued forever with AFKers. The losing team is ganking everyone on the other maps (which are always outnumbered), while the winning team has blobs everywhere. And all they have of note are a few people from Mag and Devona’s Rest…

 just scrap the whole thing. You have no idea how to balance it. All you want is to feed people to big guilds because you think they pay the bills. Wait until everyone else quits the game and find out how valuable those guilds really are.

[Leger.3724]

4 hours ago, Thomas.2564 said:

What exactly is it u want anet to do?

 

Lets start with removing SEA IPs from NA WvW so we don't have to worry about balancing the offhours and those timezones completely screwing up the server rankings for the only time zone that should matter - NA primetime.

If you want something less offensive - I want them to make Guild Wars 3. Ignore any feedback you got from the end game pve community. Those modes are basically dead outside of T1-T2 fractals where the combat mechanics frankly don't matter much. These end game pvers have no idea how to attract people to a game or game mode... they're just happy being "the guy" and lording it over everyone else. And those are the last types of people you want to be taking advice from.

You see all the complaints about Boonball and it highlights the problem the same way end game pvers unintentionally highlight the problem. Combat is bad. Really bad. From the decision to remove monks in the design phase, the size of the skillbar in design phase, to the massive expansion of the skillbar from 2012 to 2014 and continued expansions with PoF and EoD. Boons, reflects, the ranged some specializations get. It's all bad. So the meta is now - memorize your rotation, sit in a giant ball of people or a ball of 10 if we're talking strikes/raids with some minor variation like maybe stack as 5 for certain raid phases/mechanics. Positioning doesn't matter aside from being stacked as close together as possible. Even when we talk solo roamers - things like thieves and mesmers have multiple abilities to escape from their own poor positioning choices.

This game's combat doesn't reward skill as much as people want to believe that. This game is much more like attending lectures, memorizing the content for the exam. And if that's how your game is being described it's probably time to look at it and ask yourself: where is the fun? Where is the player decision making that impacts the outcome?

The developers need to take a hard look at what makes the pvp games successful, what makes end game pve in other games successful. Players like decision making, intuitive combat design, rotations that don't take time to memorize but rather take time to practice mastering. And they'll find the common themes. Positioning matters. When you use your abilities matter outside of a set rotation you're trying to maintain 100% uptime of.

And then of course there are benefits to a new engine, how many players you can have on a map, more technical things than fixing this awful combat system.

Edited January 15 by Leger.3724

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

3 hours ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

Seven Pines here.

WTF?! EBG has been queued forever with AFKers. The losing team is ganking everyone on the other maps (which are always outnumbered), while the winning team has blobs everywhere. And all they have of note are a few people from Mag and Devona’s Rest…

 just scrap the whole thing. You have no idea how to balance it. All you want is to feed people to big guilds because you think they pay the bills. Wait until everyone else quits the game and find out how valuable those guilds really are.

Seven Pines here too and I know exactly who you are referring to here...luckily I am not in EBG often however the big fights in ABL are way more blobby than normally seen.

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

43 minutes ago, Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

Seven Pines here too and I know exactly who you are referring to here...luckily I am not in EBG often however the big fights in ABL are way more blobby than normally seen.

I'm just quitting WvW for good. No matter at what hour I log, the losing team always have gankers on and the winning team always have blobs/zergs on, so no point in wasting my time.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

6 minutes ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

I'm just quitting WvW for good. No matter at what hour I log, the losing team always have gankers on and the winning team always have blobs/zergs on, so no point in wasting my time.

I have been on time when this wasnt the case as well however. Ive seen times it was everyone has a blob regardless if it was the losing team. Hopefully data from this beta will fix something for next time.

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

57 minutes ago, Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

Hopefully data from this beta will fix something for next time

out of the four betas I’ve participated in, only one was perfectly balanced at pretty much all times. The first one consisted of my team, which was full of noobs, against the MAG blob. At least we had numbers, although I finished my pips on Sunday and didn’t bother to log in again for the rest of the week. The second one was perfect, with non-stop action at all times, pretty much all week. The third one involved my weak team against the RAWR/KOIN blob plus a ppt blob, so we just got rolled over. However, we had a few moments to do stuff when those weren’t on. But now, there is just no point in even trying to finish my pips or the weeklies.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

18 minutes ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

out of the four betas I’ve participated in, only one was perfectly balanced at pretty much all times. The first one consisted of my team, which was full of noobs, against the MAG blob. At least we had numbers, although I finished my pips on Sunday and didn’t bother to log in again for the rest of the week. The second one was perfect, with non-stop action at all times, pretty much all week. The third one involved my weak team against the RAWR/KOIN blob plus a ppt blob, so we just got rolled over. However, we had a few moments to do stuff when those weren’t on. But now, there is just no point in even trying to finish my pips or the weeklies.

This I can say that I had no issues completing weeklies. Maybe its the times or maybe I got lucky on when I jumped on (I tagged up once or twice). I Am also part of an alliance guild as well so that might help (WOOO GO BagS)

[Palikka.8249]

Anyone saying things are balanced or just tag up, i dare you to come play with us (red team t5 eu). 

[One more for the road.8950]

16 minutes ago, Palikka.8249 said:

Anyone saying things are balanced or just tag up, i dare you to come play with us (red team t5 eu). 

T5 EU unfortunately got a lil bit of what we usually encounter on relink when people do the server moves with unbalanced match up before the tiers settles a little bit. It should be worth noting that there's some big guilds/alliances on blue and green. Then again there's been some weird commanding from red during prime that doesn't help.

[Chaba.5410]

18 minutes ago, Palikka.8249 said:

Anyone saying things are balanced or just tag up, i dare you to come play with us (red team t5 eu). 

What's the team name?

[One more for the road.8950]

16 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

What's the team name?

Should be Griffonfall.
But EU also have some guilds and players that are mostly active during weekend, and some that's mostly active during week. And quite the difference in how and when they play as well. So servers with what might look like comfortable victory point leads on Sunday could lose the MU.

Edited January 15 by One more for the road.8950

[Aeolus.3615]

world vs world re-structure = EOTM blobs PVD but with  "fight" omni blobs doing pvd.

 

RIP GW2, all ic is ktrains eotm style nothing more...

Edited January 15 by Aeolus.3615

[SweetPotato.7456]

This is happening because Anet didn't give everyone that extra guild slots that is so needed for beta without alliance UI. 
if you check the guild names you will notice some of the more organized players already are in alliance group. This is why the Qs are extra long, because everyone who plays together has come together, they will run you down.

If your guild didn't already organize an alliance guild, you will most probably be separated from your usual pugs, side car guild, etc.  hence is feeling the pressure. will be queued out  because of the gathering of players that has been pull from other server into the same team.

This Beta's numbers will most probably not give precise data since half of the people are organized and half aren't, but then Anet should use data of how the players flows etc. and make good use of it for future match making.

Edited January 15 by SweetPotato.7456

[skoobydoo.9246]

20 hours ago, BumboJumbo.1308 said:

World restructuring improves playing with guilds rather than playing with servers. Where the former allows freedom of who you want to play with, whereas the latter you're essentially stuck with the people you're with until you pay up gems to swap servers.

Also, this is the first week of the beta. This is the worst time to complain about match ups. It's like complaining about the first week of new server pairings.

The  idea of this guild base teams is just bad all together and i don't see it ever been better then world base teams.  When you are on your own world there is sense of community and we had the freedom to play whatever way we want. With this guild base teams now you are grouped with random people for a week and you wont see them again, all sense  of community is gone. Every squad now have their own discord, i had to join like 7-8 different servers this weekend, some of them was non english speaking.  If you are casual or solo/duo roamer you can pretty much forget playing the game since its all guild blobs.  Also for people who don't want to joi WvW guild/Alliance we will just be put as filler on random teams. So now if you wanna play WvW you are kinda forced to join WvW guild, which i personally have no interest in doing at all. If this system really happen to replace the World teams i personally will just move on from gw2 because this week WvW have been by far worse time i ever had with the game f and already decided to take a for few weeks till the beta is over. I really hope they scratch this whole restructuring idea, or give people option to chose between alliance and world base team.

Edited January 15 by skoobydoo.9246

[BumboJumbo.1308]

36 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

When you are on your own world there is sense of community and we had the freedom to play whatever way we want.

The freedom part is not true. You have more freedom selecting from various guilds and their playstyles.

The sense of community is partly true. You do lose a sense of community without servers, but servers are made up of guilds. Guilds mostly hold the sense of community since they are the ones that communicate, organize and play with other people within a server. If you don't join a guild then why bother play an mmo? Just play something else.

41 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

If you are casual or solo/duo roamer you can pretty much forget playing the game since its all guild blobs

I don't know what you want specifically. You can still solo/duo roam with guild based matchmaking.  

 

44 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

So now if you wanna play WvW you are kinda forced to join WvW guild,

You're not forced to join a guild, but again I don't know what you want.

Also, it's a good thing that WvW encourages joining a guild since guild wars 2 is a social game with wvw being a social game mode.

[skoobydoo.9246]

36 minutes ago, BumboJumbo.1308 said:

The freedom part is not true. You have more freedom selecting from various guilds and their playstyles.

The sense of community is partly true. You do lose a sense of community without servers, but servers are made up of guilds. Guilds mostly hold the sense of community since they are the ones that communicate, organize and play with other people within a server. If you don't join a guild then why bother play an mmo? Just play something else.

I don't know what you want specifically. You can still solo/duo roam with guild based matchmaking.  

 

You're not forced to join a guild, but again I don't know what you want.

Also, it's a good thing that WvW encourages joining a guild since guild wars 2 is a social game with wvw being a social game mode.

Joining a guild mean you have to put some level of commitment, its by definition having less "freedom".  The part about " why bother play MMO if you dont wan't to join a guild" is just stupid, not even gonna bother to respond to it.

I wanna play on same world every weeks where i get familiar with people after a while and not have to constantly join new discord servers. I want to have the freedom to play whenever, whit whoever  and however i feel like without having to comply with guild/alliance needs/rules. I want to have more random fights where i find 1vs1, 1v2, small scale PvP as well as zergs and blobs from time to time. So far in this BETA this have not been possible at least in the team i am. Roaming is like dead for me, its all guild groups and blobs. At the very least ANET should give us the option to chose between this new alliance system and the old wold vs world system.

Edited January 16 by skoobydoo.9246

[Chaba.5410]

12 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

Joining a guild mean you have to put some level of commitment

Do you?  Would depend upon the guild, wouldn't it?  What's stopping you from running your own guild for players?

[skoobydoo.9246]

6 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Do you?  Would depend upon the guild, wouldn't it?  What's stopping you from running your own guild for players?

Why do i have to do extra work and make my own guild and so on? Why can't i keep playing the game the way it was till now and how i enjoyed it? Why they have to force such a fundamental change on players?

Edited January 16 by skoobydoo.9246

[Chaba.5410]

8 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

Why do i have to do extra work and make my own guild and so on? Why can't i keep playing the game the way it was till now and how i enjoyed it? Why they have to force such a fundamental change on players?

Ah, the ol' free rider problem.  You speak about levels of commitment in a way that makes it sound like you just want to play without any commitment at all and other players are NPCs.  Why do you treat those familiar faces as if they are there for your personal benefit?  They never were.

If you truly are all about zero commitment and super casual, nothing about WR changes for you.  Other players log in and do their thing and you reap their rewards from it.

Edited January 16 by Chaba.5410

[skoobydoo.9246]

1 minute ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Ah, the ol' free rider problem.  You speak about levels of commitment in a way that makes it sound like you just want to play without any commitment at all and other players are NPCs.  Why do you treat those familiar faces as if they are there for your personal benefit?  They never were.

That post don't even make sense, what?

[T G.7496]

13 hours ago, Thomas.2564 said:

What exactly is it u want anet to do? All I hear everyday, day in and day out. MU's are unbalanced. How exactly are these beta's unbalanced? Are they unbalanced because some ppl were smart enough to make their own alliances before hand, and not just leave it up to chance? How do ppl still not realise that wvw is made in way so that WE/US the players can make our own content!?!? Ppl complain that some servers are stronger then us, they are "stacked". Hell yeah some servers are stronger then others. Cause these servers are where the players take it seriously, and want good organised fights. It's ridiculous having to listen to players, who play on servers, where they litterally choose to play when there is 0 enemys around. And all they do is run around ppt'ing the entire time they have a tag. Then the other servers wake up, and they all disapear until the next day.

All I hear in this beta is, any tags? Anyone tagging up soon? Any coms around? Which is fine ofc, cause wvw is more fun in groups. But u know, anyone can tag up. Listen, u want a better wvw exp, then u, the player, has to take some initiative. Anet had given us a platform where we can baiscally do what we want, and play as we want. But still we have to listen to, unbalanced mu's, stacked servers etc... Even now, when they are FINALLY trying to sort out the banwaggon bs, and constant tranfering, messing up server balance. Ppl still complain about it. Its f'cking infuriating!!!

I got 2 words for anyone still complaining about mu balance. SKILL ISSUE!!

 

Basically this. Thank you Thomas and bless nuke.

Edited January 16 by T G.7496

[Chaba.5410]

5 minutes ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

That post don't even make sense, what?

What didn't you understand?  Was it the free rider part?

[skoobydoo.9246]

4 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

What didn't you understand?  Was it the free rider part?

Free riding what exactly? I really want to see you explain your logic on that one, very curious.

Edited January 16 by skoobydoo.9246

[Chaba.5410]

4 hours ago, skoobydoo.9246 said:

Free riding what exactly? I really want to see you explain your logic on that one, very curious.

Explanation of the free rider problem: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/free-rider/

"individual members of a group can benefit from the efforts of each member and all can benefit substantially from collective action"

"A free rider, most broadly speaking, is someone who receives a benefit without contributing towards the cost of its production. The free rider problem is that the efficient production of important collective goods by free agents is jeopardized by the incentive each agent has not to pay for it: if the supply of the good is inadequate, one’s own action of paying will not make it adequate; if the supply is adequate, one can receive it without paying."

So no, you don't have to do extra work because the supply of the benefit from collective action in WvW is generally adequate and in some cases overabundant (higher number of pips, winning fights more often due to player organization, players who tag up, etc.).  Why even bother getting on discord?

WR doesn't change anything for you because WR seeks to ensure that there is adequate supply for everyone through fine grained population balancing (it's important to note that the methodology is being currently tested and potentially adjusted).  It doesn't matter if the faces around you are familiar or not.  This hasn't been true for players who find their servers abandoned.  Their supply is inadequate and their own actions will not usually make it adequate.
 

Edited January 16 by Chaba.5410

[One more for the road.8950]

Also, a WvW guild doesn't need to be a full commitment thing with mandatory guild raids several days of the week, trainings, footage review and otherwise, there's plenty of server based guilds for roamers and alike that's just a guild for talking and teaming up with others when you are around. Could just make one of them yourself, invite people, leave it at level 1, and use it as a chat box and WvW guild.