Guild wars 3

[thedrumchannell.2405]

It wouldn't be in ArenaNet's best interest to abandon another Guild Wars game. It was shameful what they did to Guild Wars 1, tossing aside the players that made them a success in the first place. ArenaNet should combine popular features from both games and unite the player base with a single game.

[Blur.3465]

2 hours ago, thedrumchannell.2405 said:

It wouldn't be in ArenaNet's best interest to abandon another Guild Wars game. It was shameful what they did to Guild Wars 1, tossing aside the players that made them a success in the first place. ArenaNet should combine popular features from both games and unite the player base with a single game.

I cannot get over Guild Wars 1 and I don't think I ever will.
It was my first MMORPG and with no monthly subs it was the right game for me. Everything about it was magical and I grew up in that game. I was 12 when I started playing and nothing will ever -ever- replace GW1 for me.
I was so excited about GW2 because I thought it would just be better GW1. I expected a beautiful expanded world, the serious vibe and atmosphere of GW1, basically just how it was advertised : 'GW2 takes everything you love about GW1' -- in this case though, it took everything we loved about GW1 away from us. Becoming a universe much different to the one we saw in GW1. Characters, vibe, etc...it all became a joke and stopped taking itself seriously. 

I love GW2, but it's a much different game to the one I grew up with and I know I shouldn't compare the two games because they're day and night and GW2 is definitely more modern in terms of gameplay.
But the moment GW2 was announced that's when all that GW1 magic stopped. We all moved to GW2 knowing GW1 will just remain as a nostalgic memory for so many of us. Even if it's still up and running, there's very little point in continuing to play GW1. Now it's an old game, it needs expanding and updating -- but it won't be getting that because of GW2.

The only way GW3 will make me happy, is if they actually stick to the GW1 style of storytelling and start taking the characters and story seriously. GW2, imo, lacks the depth and immersion.
Nayos was supposed to mimic Realm of Torment, but instead of just... yeah. Shallow version of it, sadly. 

Edited April 2 by Blur.3465

[Gehenna.3625]

14 hours ago, Artemis.8034 said:

Do you ever wonder why? WoW launched in 2004 and its still the king. They found a formula that works to start with, then they adjusted that formula just enough over time to suit the changes in society. Keeping WoW relevant and fun. I dont expect people that never played wow long term to get it, but as a long term wow player of 12 years it was the most fun mmo experience on a massive scale i ever had. If wow had gw2s combat system it would be even better

A lot of people flocked to that game and you're right, it was at the right place in the right time. What I feel that many MMOs have tried to do is copy WoW's path and that's the mistake a lot of MMOs made. They thought that players would be as patient as with WoW at the start, but by then, because of WoW and how it developed, a lot of MMO players were used to a certain standard. SWTOR comes to mind.

That game started without a lot of QoL things like shared account storage and reskinning of armor sets. I still remember the early raid armor that looked absolutely ridiculous but that's all you had as a look if you wanted the best gear. Also on release they had only one raid ready (and it was bugged), because they assumed players would be busy with playing through the story for at least a month or two, not understanding that a good number of players weren't interested in story content but endgame. So within a few weeks the first max level characters were there and they didn't have many players to team up with and only one raid to do which was extremely buggy. In my view, new MMOs have to start with the standard amenities and a good plan for endgame content because players are used to having them and as such they have become the new standard. 

You can't count on the same patience that early adopters had for WoW.

And even though SWTOR and GW2 have become relatively successful and both games are still around doing ok, they both could've been so much more. But then you see games like FF XIV that are a bust at the start and then Square Enix admitted their mistakes, pulled the game back and rereleased it in MUCH better shape. So they were willing the invest even more in their IP. I doubt that NcSoft or BioWare (EA) would ever do the same.

[Forgotten Legend.9281]

Anet, please add a feature to the forums to allow me to block entire threads so I don't have to see all this childish drama in my "new comments" thread...

[Ashen.2907]

12 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

You can't count on the same patience that early adopters had for WoW.

Exactly. Any game released now is competing with existing titles with a decade or two of content, tons of QoL additions, and so on. Sure the new game might have a gimmick, or a few of them, to separate it from the more mature games but it will need to compete on a feature to feature basis to attract a mass player base for any length of time.

[Vayne.8563]

On 3/29/2024 at 2:25 AM, tzaeru.3742 said:

It's still rather the turnaround from when just a few years ago ANet said that they aren't going to do GW3 and nothing of such is in plans.

My experience with these sort of things is that if once people said "never gonna happen" and later it turns to "well maybe..", that "maybe" really means "likely to happen".

I think the correction might also be a reaction to appease the paying customers. People don't want to spend money on a MMO game that is going to have a sequel.

Did they say that, because I strongly doubt it. They almost never make solid future statements. They never said they wouldn't raise the level cap. They never said they wouldn't introduce a new tier of gear. They never said they'd not put mounts in the game. They never said they wouldn't release another expansion.

I'd love to see a quote of Anet saying they're not going to do GW 3.

[VoodooChurch.6513]

/tinfoil hat on: if the developers really are working on GW3, it might explain why these new expansions are such bare-bones barely-there content, a lot of reused art assets,  and why they won't address power creep or add new elite specs. They probably want gw2 to eventually wind down once gw3 comes out so they don't have to actively develop both games. They can also use their good ideas they have now on the upcoming title instead of using them on an old one.  /tinfoil hat off.

edit: I hope they really are working on a gw3. That would be awesome. Consider it pre-ordered.

Edited April 2 by VoodooChurch.6513
shameless bootlicking

[ScottBroChill.3254]

honestly if we look down the line 5 years from now, how old does that make all the big mmo's? pretty old and dated so if we are talking about gw3 going up against the big baddies, it won't be against them in 2024, but 2029. At that point there might be vacancy of of current gen mmo's. Everything will be so dated that pulling off a rewarding mmo with current graphics and systems would be amazing. I think there would be a place for a gw1+gw2 style mix that could corner a nice market. So gw1 world vibe I think was helped by it being instanced, you felt more immeresed  with just your squad traversing the maps and it added to the preparation and strategy part of the game. Then add in the action-y combat of gw2 and movement and stuff and you got a less dated gameplay style that is more involved and fun. You could have a lot of content and end game content smashed into instanced style grouping, public or private, like strikes, convergeances, dungeons, fractals, raids, etc. but with it more focused with less game modes. Large scale wvw I think would have to be in it, I don't play it really but its incredibly fun and can be made better from the ground up with what they have learned. And better pvp, bring "guild wars" back to the game. And then also, I like the old way and classic way of having skill bars. I like the old limited amount of skills but being able to take anything you want. I think builds should be more modular and I feel like build crafting should be a higher priority. Player made thematic builds are fun, making builds in gw2 feels like trying to hammer a nail with a screwdriver. Sure you can eventually get the nail in, but it's janky.

bring on the gw3 or new ip. Send it. 

[wiffinberg.6451]

If GW3 is an MMORPG, it would be awesome if they port over all our Legendary items and have them function similarly to how the legendary relic currently does
Get the core (or a decent selection of) stats to select on gear and unlock more as you play and future content. So we would still get the utility without cheesing it from day one and still requiring a max level a character to use them. maybe max level would be 100, but you can start using your legacy legendary gear from lvl 80? just an idea.

Porting characters and achievement points/titles over but starting at level 1 could be a good way to experience it too.
As a 12 year veteran that's what I would hope for at the very least. Until anything is confirmed/announced, I'll just keep playing the game

Give us cool new stuff for sure, but don't devalue the time, effort and money spent by the current playerbase

Edited April 3 by wiffinberg.6451
Extra words

[hellsmachine.4085]

I think what worries me the most is the uncertainty. Knowing that GW3 is in production, makes me think that GW2 has an expiry date. Even if the servers are kept alive on life support, doesn't mean many players will play it. Without a mass of players, you don't have an MMO.

GW2 is my favourite MMO since it launched. I wish Anet would be more transparent with what their intentions are.

[Vayne.8563]

1 hour ago, wiffinberg.6451 said:

If GW3 is an MMORPG, it would be awesome if they port over all our Legendary items and have them function similarly to how the legendary relic currently does
Get the core (or a decent selection of) stats to select on gear and unlock more as you play and future content. So we would still get the utility without cheesing it from day one and still requiring a max level a character to use them. maybe max level would be 100, but you can start using your legacy legendary gear from lvl 80? just an idea.

Porting characters and achievement points/titles over but starting at level 1 could be a good way to experience it too.
As a 12 year veteran that's what I would hope for at the very least. Until anything is confirmed/announced, I'll just keep playing the game

Give us cool new stuff for sure, but don't devalue the time, effort and money spent by the current playerbase

This will never happen. It's like starting the game with the best of everything. They'll more likely do what they did in Guild Wars 1. They'll give us unique skins and titles.

[Vayne.8563]

1 hour ago, hellsmachine.4085 said:

I think what worries me the most is the uncertainty. Knowing that GW3 is in production, makes me think that GW2 has an expiry date. Even if the servers are kept alive on life support, doesn't mean many players will play it. Without a mass of players, you don't have an MMO.

GW2 is my favourite MMO since it launched. I wish Anet would be more transparent with what their intentions are.

No company is going to tell you they're making a new game that's five years out, if it affects their current game.  It's not a reasonable expectation. By the same token, everything has an expiration date. Even the sun. Expecting any game to last forever is likewise not reasonable. IMO Guild Wars 2 has five good years ahead of it, whether or not GW 3 is coming out, and probably more like 7. You can't ask for more than that.

[hellsmachine.4085]

40 minutes ago, Vayne.8563 said:

No company is going to tell you they're making a new game that's five years out, if it affects their current game.  It's not a reasonable expectation. By the same token, everything has an expiration date. Even the sun. Expecting any game to last forever is likewise not reasonable. IMO Guild Wars 2 has five good years ahead of it, whether or not GW 3 is coming out, and probably more like 7. You can't ask for more than that.

Ncsoft just did though... WoW has been going for 20 years with no signs of it being abandoned anytime soon, Runescape even longer. This thread is titled "thoughts about GW3". Those are my thoughts, why do you feel the need to invalidate my thoughts?

[Ashen.2907]

48 minutes ago, Vayne.8563 said:

No company is going to tell you they're making a new game that's five years out, if it affects their current game

ANet announced GW2 in 2007, five years before it was launched in 2012, and it did affect the current game at that time.

[notebene.3190]

On 4/1/2024 at 6:23 AM, AliamRationem.5172 said:

"Sudoku" is a numerical puzzle game.  You probably meant Seppuku, a form of ritual suicide.  But I think sudoku sounds funnier, so let's go with that!

Or Harry Carey, and start calling ball games for some reason. 🤔

[Vayne.8563]

3 hours ago, hellsmachine.4085 said:

Ncsoft just did though... WoW has been going for 20 years with no signs of it being abandoned anytime soon, Runescape even longer. This thread is titled "thoughts about GW3". Those are my thoughts, why do you feel the need to invalidate my thoughts?

Expressing my opinion is invalidating your thoughts? You posted a comment on a public forum and expect no one to disagree with that opinion? That too isn't a reasonable expectation.  Your thoughts aren't invalid just because I have a different opinion. What I stated in my opinion of your thoughts. At the end of the day, this is a discussion forum. If you don't want people to respond, it might not be the best place to post.

Edited April 3 by Vayne.8563
spelling/grammar

[Vayne.8563]

1 hour ago, Ashen.2907 said:

ANet announced GW2 in 2007, five years before it was launched in 2012, and it did affect the current game at that time.

Sure, but it was already affecting their current game. They announced it specifcally because they'd already announced an expansion which they were no longer making. In that very specific situation, they had a very specific reason for announcing it. Otherwise, how could they explain an announced expansion never materializing?  It was the lesser of two evils. The point remains, business reveal what they reveal when the timing it right for them.

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

Sure, but it was already affecting their current game. They announced it specifcally because they'd already announced an expansion which they were no longer making. In that very specific situation, they had a very specific reason for announcing it. Otherwise, how could they explain an announced expansion never materializing?  It was the lesser of two evils. The point remains, business reveal what they reveal when the timing it right for them.

And do you think that the change in development cycle that gave us SotO, and the reduction in quality we've seen are unrelated? It's the same thing. The only difference is change in Anet's stance towards their players - at the time of GW2 reveal they cared about the community far more than they do now.

[Vayne.8563]

11 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

And do you think that the change in development cycle that gave us SotO, and the reduction in quality we've seen are unrelated? It's the same thing. The only difference is change in Anet's stance towards their players - at the time of GW2 reveal they cared about the community far more than they do now.

This is a strange thing to say.

Anet ANNOUNCED an expansion. They told us Utopia was coming. Then they took it off the market. They had to say something. ANY company would have to say something. So they did.

Right now, they didn't HAVE TO say something, so they didn't. They'll announce it when it's in the best interest of the game.  Not everyone hates the new expansion for example. There was  thread on reddit saying it was a great expansion and it got pretty heavily upvoted. 

Sure a lot of people don't like what we're getting now, but the same was true when HoT came out. A lot of people didn't like that either. I also remember a lot of people not being happy with EoD. And a remember people a month after POF came out complaining about that expansion.

I like the new expansion, so far. I haven't judged the whole thing yet, because I haven't seen the last episode either. At any rate, using two completely different situations to say Anet used to care more, when the two were obviously different situations is just drawing conclusions with no real evidence.

If Anet hadn't already announced the expansion that they were never going to deliver, do you have any evidence that they would have told us as soon as they started working on it?

[Noidea Incognito.9607]

My 2 cents on this.

I really thought GW2 was the final raison d'être of the IP to be honest. Everything just makes sense, from the how the story progressed, expansion of the world.

(Just look at the current worldmap, still so much left unexplored; they could go on for years to come)
 

I'm not reallly techsavvy but...

Isnt GW2 running fine? You can do practically anything one would expect from an mmo. I have yet to see any disturbing/gamebreaking bugs personally.

I hear People talk about GW3 being the possible solution to the current (limiting/restricting/outdated?) Engine. But consider for a  moment they decided to use UE5 with Nanite and Lumen. Thats definitely not gonna run smoothly on that old GW2 rig. times 50 if  for instance you gonna go into wvw + particles density + physics + raytracing + Lumen per rendered player. ( again i dont know if its possible to create dumb-down UE5 engine to the pc system req level of  GW2 with preservation of all UE5 features... probably not )

Fancy bells and whistles will req some serious horsepower. Are people willing to invest in upgrades or just stick with GW2?;   A game only suitable for High-end rigs is also a loss of potential players. But maybe they gonna go with a middle-ground solution like a optimized UE4 based engine wich works pretty well on alot of current systems.   

 

Personally i would be in favor of GW3 being its own epic big Single Player Game(Npc Party based) with some drop-in/drop-out multiplayer elements.

As a single player game it becomes a more focused effort rather a dispersion of effort + there will be no infighting about bugs/problems between gamesmodes cause there are none. its a single player game doing its own thing so problems can be tackled better. 

Its not an impossible idea either cause Pearl Abyss is doing the same with Crimson Desert(single player) wich is a spinoff from Black Desert.  

Shiftup entertainment had a succesfull skimpy mmo shooter and are now working on Stellar Blade(single player).

But If they do gonna go the mmo focused route again it seems best to separate pve from pvp/wvw completely; so they can make proper hand tailored adjustments for each game mode wich also separates the possible bugs/problems for faster fixes; less clutter of putting everything on one big pile.

And if people wanna do other game mode on a whim they can be a "guest player" in those modes; just for a little diversity.

 

But i hope GW3 will stay very far away. GW2 still has the potential to grow even larger/better.... i think. 

 

 

[Chaos God.1639]

59 minutes ago, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

My 2 cents on this.

I really thought GW2 was the final raison d'être of the IP to be honest. Everything just makes sense, from the how the story progressed, expansion of the world.

(Just look at the current worldmap, still so much left unexplored; they could go on for years to come)
 

I'm not reallly techsavvy but...

Isnt GW2 running fine? You can do practically anything one would expect from an mmo. I have yet to see any disturbing/gamebreaking bugs personally.

I hear People talk about GW3 being the possible solution to the current (limiting/restricting/outdated?) Engine. But consider for a  moment they decided to use UE5 with Nanite and Lumen. Thats definitely not gonna run smoothly on that old GW2 rig. times 50 if  for instance you gonna go into wvw + particles density + physics + raytracing + Lumen per rendered player. ( again i dont know if its possible to create dumb-down UE5 engine to the pc system req level of  GW2 with preservation of all UE5 features... probably not )

Fancy bells and whistles will req some serious horsepower. Are people willing to invest in upgrades or just stick with GW2?;   A game only suitable for High-end rigs is also a loss of potential players. But maybe they gonna go with a middle-ground solution like a optimized UE4 based engine wich works pretty well on alot of current systems.   

 

Personally i would be in favor of GW3 being its own epic big Single Player Game(Npc Party based) with some drop-in/drop-out multiplayer elements.

As a single player game it becomes a more focused effort rather a dispersion of effort + there will be no infighting about bugs/problems between gamesmodes cause there are none. its a single player game doing its own thing so problems can be tackled better. 

Its not an impossible idea either cause Pearl Abyss is doing the same with Crimson Desert(single player) wich is a spinoff from Black Desert.  

Shiftup entertainment had a succesfull skimpy mmo shooter and are now working on Stellar Blade(single player).

But If they do gonna go the mmo focused route again it seems best to separate pve from pvp/wvw completely; so they can make proper hand tailored adjustments for each game mode wich also separates the possible bugs/problems for faster fixes; less clutter of putting everything on one big pile.

And if people wanna do other game mode on a whim they can be a "guest player" in those modes; just for a little diversity.

 

But i hope GW3 will stay very far away. GW2 still has the potential to grow even larger/better.... i think. 

 

 

and you think a lot of artists want to work on outdated engine? i'm pretty sure anet themselves want to move to another engine where they can be more creative and free to do whatever they want. artists aren't robots that will do whatever they are asked to do. maybe AI will have more influence on the development of games.

anet could also lose their players, because they will move to a more modern game.

comparing gw to wow or final fantasy is not correct in my opinion, because people pay every month to play those game and will stay there longer.

also a lot of wvw/pvp players don't get much content atm and so they also want something new.

the good news is that gw2 will stay and you can keep playing it. i'm pretty sure most of the players here will plan to go to gw3 if it will get released/announced, because it will have new features,...

Edited April 3 by Chaos God.1639

[Cyninja.2954]

1 hour ago, Chaos God.1639 said:

and you think a lot of artists want to work on outdated engine? i'm pretty sure anet themselves want to move to another engine where they can be more creative and free to do whatever they want. artists aren't robots that will do whatever they are asked to do. maybe AI will have more influence on the development of games.

anet could also lose their players, because they will move to a more modern game.

comparing gw to wow or final fantasy is not correct in my opinion, because people pay every month to play those game and will stay there longer.

also a lot of wvw/pvp players don't get much content atm and so they also want something new.

the good news is that gw2 will stay and you can keep playing it. i'm pretty sure most of the players here will plan to go to gw3 if it will get released/announced, because it will have new features,...

Every single thing you mentioned seemes to not be an issue for all the older MMORPGs in the market, some of which are vastly more successful than GW2.

Wonderous how those game manage just fine.

Meanwhile going by your logic: any engine will eventually be outdated, as such there is never a reason to support a game past point X.

Small food for thought: you are assuming that GW3 will even have pvp. GW1 had pvp at its center, yet became the majority of content was PvE focused eventually.

GW2 started with far more PvE with far less a focus on PvP, and is pretty much pure PvE for years now.

What exactly makes you so sure there will be ANY PvP in GW3? I'd say that belief in and of itsself might already be very questionable.

I think a very reasonable assumption is that GW3 will be entitely PvE focused with maybe something similar to WvW if at all. It's very clear that Arenanet doesn't have the resources to support multiple game modes and cutting down to core essentialls seems very reasonable.

Edited April 3 by Cyninja.2954

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

This is a strange thing to say.

Anet ANNOUNCED an expansion. They told us Utopia was coming. Then they took it off the market. They had to say something. ANY company would have to say something. So they did.

Right now, they didn't HAVE TO say something, so they didn't. They'll announce it when it's in the best interest of the game.  Not everyone hates the new expansion for example. There was  thread on reddit saying it was a great expansion and it got pretty heavily upvoted. 

Sure a lot of people don't like what we're getting now, but the same was true when HoT came out. A lot of people didn't like that either. I also remember a lot of people not being happy with EoD. And a remember people a month after POF came out complaining about that expansion.

I like the new expansion, so far. I haven't judged the whole thing yet, because I haven't seen the last episode either. At any rate, using two completely different situations to say Anet used to care more, when the two were obviously different situations is just drawing conclusions with no real evidence.

If Anet hadn't already announced the expansion that they were never going to deliver, do you have any evidence that they would have told us as soon as they started working on it?

First of all, Utopia wasn't announced. It was assumed, because that was their release policy, but we knew the name and some details about it only from unofficial leaks. If they followed the current policy then, they'd have just announced change in delivery schedule that made them make an expansion instead of campaign, without mentioning anything about GW2 until it was absolutely necessary - which would have been 2 years later at the soonest (and even that time could likely have been pushed back a bit). They didn't act that way however, because at that time their interactions with the community were at a much, much better level than they are now. And they genuinely didn't want to keep us in the dark.

Now they very much do want exatly that. The less we know, the better, it seems.

And if you think there was no change that might have waranted more honest explanations, i'd say dropping whole LS6 (which has already been mentioned very shortly after EoD launch- in it we were supposed to get more than one Canthan map, and much earlier than Gyala launched), if they were following their original GW1 approach, should have resulted in a much earlier, and much more detailed explanations. Instead what we've got was an attempt to obscure siphoning off resources from GW2 towards whatever they are doing in the background (which more and more looks like GW3, btw) and a drop of releace quality and quantity by presenting it as just reshuffling of release cadence.

You might try to act like you don't see it, but there is a visible change of approach towards the community. And it is much, much worse now.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

44 minutes ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Every single thing you mentioned seemes to not be an issue for all the older MMORPGs in the market, some of which are vastly more successful than GW2.

Wonderous how those game manage just fine.

Meanwhile going by your logic: any engine will eventually be outdated, as such there is never a reason to support a game past point X.

Small food for thought: you are assuming that GW3 will even have pvp. GW1 had pvp at its center, yet became the majority of content was PvE focused eventually.

GW2 started with far more PvE with far less a focus on PvP, and is pretty much pure PvE for years now.

What exactly makes you so sure there will be ANY PvP in GW3? I'd say that belief in and of itsself might already be very questionable.

I think a very reasonable assumption is that GW3 will be entitely PvE focused with maybe something similar to WvW if at all. It's very clear that Arenanet doesn't have the resources to support multiple game modes and cutting down to core essentialls seems very reasonable.

People stick with mmo's because of sunk cost fallacy. Since they pay every month to play they have spent way more money on the game, there is much more invested than just time. To move to another mmo while the current one still garners that many monthly subscriptions would be more ridiculous than gw2 moving to gw3 because we don't pay subscriptions. The game is designed around playing it and then being able to stop whenever because there isn't a gear treadmill and once you've bought the game and expansions then you own it, no need to pay extra money just to access the game you already own.

And yeah, every engine will become outdated eventually, but the only reason for Anet to try and make something with a newer engine is because they do risk more player dropoff than the other games due to the sunk cost fallacy. I haven't spend $180 a year for the past 20 years on the game. GW2 was designed to run on a potato when it was released, that's why fps is so bad when there's a lot of people because it's not optimized to run on current cpu's that utilize multithreading. They wen't from dx9 to dx11, but it was such a marginal difference it didn't do much on that front. I'm sure it allows them to due more, but it's still a fact. Something like black desert runs infinitely better with even better graphics. Gild Wars 2 thankfully doesn't rely on predatory spending, but it results in having to actually make really good content to keep people in game. They are working with 2012 tools. Well actually they are working with older tools because it's using GW1 engine. 

I'm not the dude this is the response to, but pvp was kind of fudged in this game. The original intent was to make Guild Wars 2 an esports mmo, but it didn't pan out. Guild Wars 1 was a heavily pvp mmo. The thing with pvp is that it can keep people playing without needing the subscription. Hardcore players love pvp and they love competition. Having more pvp means it's more exciting to stream. You can have actual tournaments people want to watch. Guild Wars 2 has a really small streamer base with only a few big names. This as well as a bunch of other reasons is why a lot of people don't really have the game on their mind or they think it's dead. It's a missed opportunity to keep hardcore players interested when theres a content drought, and to have free advertising that gets new players. 

And also GW1 was a small game. But look at the team they had at release, it was much larger than the GW1 team. So to assume they don't, or can't have the resources to make a large game is ridiculous. They get money from investors to develope a game so the developement team will be temporarily larger than it will be for maintening the game.

And I really don't think it's safe to assume anything. Everyone's just spitballing what they like or don't like about the game. The reason GW2 studio is smaller is a direct correlation to it's success. It is a successful game monetarily and still profits pretty good, but it's a smaller studio because there's less reliable flow of money into the studio. The question is are we at a crossroads where they are weighing out the current profits with desired profits. Being that it was at a shareholder meeting, shareholders might think more money needs to be raked in and have approved of a new game. For the other mmo's it would be silly because they can have the subscriptions and can ride the wave on that even when they have a bunch of bad expansions. They're just a much more lucrative business model than Anet deliberately is against, which is great for us, but the studio is a business and takes profits into account. They might just being seeing more profits along the horizon and it's really up to the financers of the game to decide when it's time. 

[Cyninja.2954]

1 minute ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

People stick with mmo's because of sunk cost fallacy. Since they pay every month to play they have spent way more money on the game, there is much more invested than just time. To move to another mmo while the current one still garners that many monthly subscriptions would be more ridiculous than gw2 moving to gw3 because we don't pay subscriptions. The game is designed around playing it and then being able to stop whenever because there isn't a gear treadmill and once you've bought the game and expansions then you own it, no need to pay extra money just to access the game you already own.

And yeah, every engine will become outdated eventually, but the only reason for Anet to try and make something with a newer engine is because they do risk more player dropoff than the other games due to the sunk cost fallacy. I haven't spend $180 a year for the past 20 years on the game. GW2 was designed to run on a potato when it was released, that's why fps is so bad when there's a lot of people because it's not optimized to run on current cpu's that utilize multithreading. They wen't from dx9 to dx11, but it was such a marginal difference it didn't do much on that front. I'm sure it allows them to due more, but it's still a fact. Something like black desert runs infinitely better with even better graphics. Gild Wars 2 thankfully doesn't rely on predatory spending, but it results in having to actually make really good content to keep people in game. They are working with 2012 tools. Well actually they are working with older tools because it's using GW1 engine.

WoWs engine is about as old as GW1s even if it is their custom engine. You are putting all your argument on sunk cost fallacy, which indeed affects some players, but not all. The counter point to this are the price sensitive players which can't or do not want to afford a new game. Some players of this franchise have issues paying even for only the mini expansions.

Also you are focusing on only WoW and FF14 it seems. What about even older MMORPGs which are going to this date?

You not having spent as much is a pure you thing. I know a lot of players which have spent at least a similar amount of money as a yearly subscription, some even more. That's without even considering the main revenue, which as is known in the industry is carried by a minority. For every 90 players that spend the bare minimum, you have 10 which spend a significant amount more on average. Those "high revenue" players certainly would have significant sunk cost fallacy following your reasoning. Thus there is a chance to lose customers on both ends of the spectrum.

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I'm not the dude this is the response to, but pvp was kind of fudged in this game. The original intent was to make Guild Wars 2 an esports mmo, but it didn't pan out. Guild Wars 1 was a heavily pvp mmo. The thing with pvp is that it can keep people playing without needing the subscription. Hardcore players love pvp and they love competition. Having more pvp means it's more exciting to stream. You can have actual tournaments people want to watch. Guild Wars 2 has a really small streamer base with only a few big names. This as well as a bunch of other reasons is why a lot of people don't really have the game on their mind or they think it's dead. It's a missed opportunity to keep hardcore players interested when theres a content drought, and to have free advertising that gets new players. 

Okay, this just supports my presented thesis that GW3 might very likely not focus on PvP at all or if only to a bare minimum.

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And also GW1 was a small game. But look at the team they had at release, it was much larger than the GW1 team. So to assume they don't, or can't have the resources to make a large game is ridiculous. They get money from investors to develope a game so the developement team will be temporarily larger than it will be for maintening the game.

I am making that assumption based on Arenanets ability to support 3 game modes for the last 12 years, which they did not have.

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And I really don't think it's safe to assume anything. Everyone's just spitballing what they like or don't like about the game. The reason GW2 studio is smaller is a direct correlation to it's success. It is a successful game monetarily and still profits pretty good, but it's a smaller studio because there's less reliable flow of money into the studio. The question is are we at a crossroads where they are weighing out the current profits with desired profits. Being that it was at a shareholder meeting, shareholders might think more money needs to be raked in and have approved of a new game. For the other mmo's it would be silly because they can have the subscriptions and can ride the wave on that even when they have a bunch of bad expansions. They're just a much more lucrative business model than Anet deliberately is against, which is great for us, but the studio is a business and takes profits into account. They might just being seeing more profits along the horizon and it's really up to the financers of the game to decide when it's time. 

True, it's all speculation. I'm just presenting some ideas which players might want to consider before going all hype and assume certain elements WILL be present, when said elements where on the backburner already for years.