Guild wars 3

[notebene.3190]

I'm kinda hoping it's something else, so they can have both my monies. 

[NapalmDest.1786]

All the people upset about "losing" the stuff in GW2 if a GW3 is ever made, obviously have never put much time into GW1

[Cyninja.2954]

35 minutes ago, NapalmDest.1786 said:

All the people upset about "losing" the stuff in GW2 if a GW3 is ever made, obviously have never put much time into GW1

Your saying that there was no issue when Arenanet transitioned from GW1 to GW2?

The alternative is you saying: well it sucked back in the day so it will suck again but this time you are all idiots for feeling the same way I did back then.

Didn't think this one through did you?

Edited April 10 by Cyninja.2954

[Holmindeboks.3490]

5 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Was there anything unclear about my previous post? Let me know what exactly and I'll explain. Because currently I'm not sure what this is supposed to be responding to, but it surely isn't responding to the part you're quoting.

...so your claims about quitting mmorpgs (as part of your complaints) were a lie. That's what I was pointing at. I'm not sure why you feel the need to be dishonest about these things.

So "it's free, but it isn't". Way to support what you constantly keep complaining about.
You can farm for mounts the same way you can farm for things from gemstore in gw2, pretty sure we've been through this already. I find it weird that you keep complaining about grind/drop rates, claim you quit wow because of not getting drops, but then going back to praising it again as if you forgot your own words and actions. Similarly to farming gold in gw2 being bad but... farming for things in wow being good (still keeping in mind your claims about "quiting due to no drops in wow"). Why are you going all over the place with this all the time?

Wait, so now paying is not a problem for you? But in gw2 it is? Again, you're all over the place with what you're writing.

Didn't you just say in your previous post that gw2 won't be surviving for long because the players keep using gold to buy gemstore items? Now it's back to being impossible to get without using wallet? Can you try being at least somewhat consistent on anything here?

 

Also seeing how you keep writing about d4 and wow, I wonder why you're still ranting on this forum instead of being on those games' respective forums.

You just try to diss me. Things can change. It isnt that if i dont do something now that it is for the rest of my life. And i am always honest. You write like some gymnasium person. But you should also put some effort in understanding what someone write. Or you just dont want to face the reality.  
 

quitting isnt forever. Things can get better. But if ppl are sure they come back they call it a break. If ppl are not sure if a game gets better they say they quit. But if the game get improvements and they play it again… what is your problem. 
 

i  already explained it. I didnt sub again because i didnt get a mount drop in those 90 days playtime. But the years before when i played it actively i have looted many mounts. Also i did the raid on a few characters and not always every week. 
 

in guildwars 2 i have looted 1 item of 880 gold in 7 YEARS. One item!! But never over 1k. 
 

the time i played wow i got much more. And that was from 2009 till 2015. I know white knights are defending guildwars 2 greed. But wow just has better rewards. Also in wow you can obtain nice skins while doing a new raid (solo because old content i missed) so new skins. The skins that cost 5+ euro each. 

Edited April 10 by Holmindeboks.3490

[Bladestrom.6425]

with regards to this thread, it is full of odd extrapolations and people airing random grievances about XYZ but the inescapable truth is the following assuming GW3 is planned to be made:

Either you continue to enjoy and love GW2 as you do now and then decide if you want to Buy GW3 when it releases with the knowledge GW2 will flip to maintenance mode or you don't and leave the GW universe when you decide to stop playing GW2.

 

Edited April 10 by Bladestrom.6425

[Sobx.1758]

41 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

You just try to diss me.

No, I'm just responding to what you're saying. There's no need to try and play a victim because you don't like what's being pointed out about your own words.

41 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

Things can change. (...)

quitting isnt forever. Things can get better. But if ppl are sure they come back they call it a break. If ppl are not sure if a game gets better they say they quit. But if the game get improvements and they play it again… what is your problem. 

I agree that things can change but according to your post they change 180 degrees every few hours. Which is why it looks like it doesn't have anything to do with "things just changing", but has everything to do with you "just writing whatever, regardles of it being true".

41 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

i  already explained it. I didnt sub again because i didnt get a mount drop in those 90 days playtime. But the years before when i played it actively i have looted many mounts. Also i did the raid on a few characters and not always every week. 
 

in guildwars 2 i have looted 1 item of 880 gold in 7 YEARS. One item!! But never over 1k. 
 

the time i played wow i got much more.

So if that format is that much better then why aren't you just staying there and using their forum instead?

41 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

But wow just has better rewards. Also in wow you can obtain nice skins while doing a new raid (solo because old content i missed) so new skins. The skins that cost 5+ euro each. 

You can also get skins from raids/strikes in gw2 though. And now on top of having a sub, wow also has a rather extensive use of ingame store with costs... probably much higher than "5 euro each", doesn't it? 🤔

 

For some reason you're still avoiding this from the initial response: And yes, if they dropped often, they'd lose on value, not sure what issue you have with this statement.
And this from my last post: Didn't you just say in your previous post that gw2 won't be surviving for long because the players keep using gold to buy gemstore items? Now it's back to being impossible to get without using wallet?  -so is it too easy or too hard to get everything with gold?

Edited April 10 by Sobx.1758

[QueenKeriti.5176]

29 minutes ago, Holmindeboks.3490 said:

n guildwars 2 i have looted 1 item of 880 gold in 7 YEARS. One item!! But never over 1k. 

I still want to know how your account of supposedly 7 years has significantly less AP than my alt accounts of <100 hours that I only do occasional WV dailies on.

Continuing, though, you know the more things drop/more accessible they are, the less they're typically worth, right? 

At the time I made Twilight, the precursor Dusk sold for ~700g. It's now 300g. When I made Sunrise, Dawn was ~550g. It's now 135g. Neither has shown up in the WV legendary boxes yet, but gen1 precursors now are so much more accessible and appear more frequently than they did just a few years ago. They've tanked in price. I sold a Zap for 440g a few years ago; it sells for 60g now (thanks WV!). The Liquid Aurilium Infusion used to sell for >2k gold. It's now ~1.6k gold if you're lucky; I think it got below 1k not too long ago. It drops more frequently + isn't in a silly amulet anymore, so people aren't accidentally destroying it. Various other exotics used to sell for multiple gold and now sell for 40s on a good day.

Most valuable drop I've gotten on my preorder headstart main account of thousands of hours is the 440g Zap a few years ago. Thousands upon thousands upon thousands of festival chests/bags/presents, most valuable drop I've gotten was Toy Shell for ~150g at the time. 

There are changes I'd like Anet to make (like a vendor where you can exchange map/strike/whatever currency for the infusion, like how you can with Everbloom and some other infusions, or even systems similar to how there are alternate ways to get the Frost Legion infusion), but a blanket massive droprate increase won't fix it if you're looking for money. Making your hyper-valuable items drop more frequently will only make them "lose value" if you're wanting those drops for money and not fashion/utility.

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, NapalmDest.1786 said:

All the people upset about "losing" the stuff in GW2 if a GW3 is ever made, obviously have never put much time into GW1

It's exactly because i have put a lot of time in GW1, that i'd rather not go over it ever again.

[Cuks.8241]

8 hours ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Which in turn means GW3 is never going to happen, given it's at least 3-5 years away at best.

Are you seeing the problem here with your assumption? The assumption you need to make to justify GW2 being in a bad spot directly contradicts your ambitions or hopes for GW3.

Now let's assume you are half right and GW2 is barely sustainable and will keep the company afloat long enough for GW3 to even get finished and released. Of what quality do you expect a product of that developing environment to be at most realistically?

The best case scenario for GW3 is ironically GW2 doing as best as it can to allow for enough funding be siphoned off to develop GW3 or entice enough investor money to take the risk on GW3 only to then pull the plug on GW2 once GW3 releases (thus GW2 would have been doing fine or at least okay until then). That's what most doomers here seem to not understand.

I don't know how NCSoft+Anet or just game developing publishers+developers usually run "greenfield" projects but from my experience from a different industry you usually secure the funds in advance. Maybe not 100% but at least a substantial amount. In case of projects I am involved it's 100% backed up with current quotes for all external expenses + contingency. Basically before your project even gets kicked off you need to have secured funding, insurances, established core team and a very good plan how everything will run including hiring plans and outsourcing if required to extend teams during project.

This is just my speculation and experience from completely different field. But I doubt any serious company would go into multi million long term project without at least a good portion of what I described above and would definitely not leave a project's funding at the mercy of a single 12yo products market performance. I'm quite confident if GW3 was greenlit they already got the funds secured and teams working on it.

But maybe I am also completely off and this industry is prone to taking massive risks. 

[QueenKeriti.5176]

11 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I don't know how NCSoft+Anet or just game developing publishers+developers usually run "greenfield" projects but from my experience from a different industry you usually secure the funds in advance. Maybe not 100% but at least a substantial amount. In case of projects I am involved it's 100% backed up with current quotes for all external expenses + contingency. Basically before your project even gets kicked off you need to have secured funding, insurances, established core team and a very good plan how everything will run including hiring plans and outsourcing if required to extend teams during project.

This is just my speculation and experience from completely different field. But I doubt any serious company would go into multi million long term project without at least a good portion of what I described above and would definitely not leave a project's funding at the mercy of a single 12yo products market performance. I'm quite confident if GW3 was greenlit they already got the funds secured and teams working on it.

But maybe I am also completely off and this industry is prone to taking massive risks. 

It's the last line. MMOs (and gaming as a whole) are a mess of an industry, with MMO development especially suffering from things like feature creep and other issues that will delay a game to oblivion (Ashes of Creation when?? lol. NCsoft's T&L also took like 8 years to actually release from the time development actually started, after they supposedly scrapped prior projects multiple times, and then they had to change the combat prior to launch because everyone hated it in beta). NCsoft itself is also not a competent company, at least anymore. MXM was a spicy disaster of their own making, and big RIP to FUSER, let alone other games in the NCsoft graveyard. :x

NCsoft not posting their individual game stats in Q4 (while also saying GW2 did well) is kind of a big tell that things are a little bit spicy there. I don't think T&L performed well, but we'll have to see what Q1 report in probably May says.

[Cyninja.2954]

2 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I don't know how NCSoft+Anet or just game developing publishers+developers usually run "greenfield" projects but from my experience from a different industry you usually secure the funds in advance. Maybe not 100% but at least a substantial amount. In case of projects I am involved it's 100% backed up with current quotes for all external expenses + contingency. Basically before your project even gets kicked off you need to have secured funding, insurances, established core team and a very good plan how everything will run including hiring plans and outsourcing if required to extend teams during project.

This is just my speculation and experience from completely different field. But I doubt any serious company would go into multi million long term project without at least a good portion of what I described above and would definitely not leave a project's funding at the mercy of a single 12yo products market performance. I'm quite confident if GW3 was greenlit they already got the funds secured and teams working on it.

But maybe I am also completely off and this industry is prone to taking massive risks. 

Not so much risk taking but rather unpredictability.

Have you ever read about how a game has been delayed by x weeks/months/years or how a game has exceeded budget by y million?

A common occurance in the field of game development and there are articles left and right about this. Most recent example: Skull and Bones from Ubisoft, and that's pretty much a single player game. I dare not mention Starfield here, which is hilarious with its 500+ million budget by now, or is it 600 already?

That's without taking a look at all the projects which are cancelled or reworked (see Blizzard and Overwatch for example).

Also this is not gaming industry specific. The amount of industries which go over budget is not small. Best example is housing and construction projects, which go over budget pretty much always.

Now obviously this is highly dependent on scope and how well different elements can be planed and foreseen, which for multi year long projects is usually very unreliable.

Let's make it simple: if Arenanet or NCSoft West had the couple of hundred millions needed for developing GW3, NCSoft global would not have had to invest 130 million a few years ago. On top of which we know that NCSoft West has been running a deficite for over 8 years now, and investors were not happy about it (hence the hostile questions during the last call).

Edited April 10 by Cyninja.2954

[NapalmDest.1786]

5 hours ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Your saying that there was no issue when Arenanet transitioned from GW1 to GW2?

The alternative is you saying: well it sucked back in the day so it will suck again but this time you are all idiots for feeling the same way I did back then.

Didn't think this one through did you?

I think I struck a nerve with this one 😁.  There was no issue with me when they transitioned to GW2. 

My point is that it is just a game and new games come out. GW2, they make new games. Also, I still have all my stuff in GW1.

[NapalmDest.1786]

3 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

It's exactly because i have put a lot of time in GW1, that i'd rather not go over it ever again.

You still have GW1. Still a great game. You did not lose anything.

[Cyninja.2954]

33 minutes ago, NapalmDest.1786 said:

I think I struck a nerve with this one 😁.  There was no issue with me when they transitioned to GW2. 

My point is that it is just a game and new games come out. GW2, they make new games. Also, I still have all my stuff in GW1.

Yeah no, I could care less.

I did find your choice of wording for basically saying: it's a game and I had no issue with moving from GW1 to GW2, strange but you do you.

[Cuks.8241]

1 hour ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Not so much risk taking but rather unpredictability.

Have you ever read about how a game has been delayed by x weeks/months/years or how a game has exceeded budget by y million?

A common occurance in the field of game development and there are articles left and right about this. Most recent example: Skull and Bones from Ubisoft, and that's pretty much a single player game. I dare not mention Starfield here, which is hilarious with its 500+ million budget by now, or is it 600 already?

That's without taking a look at all the projects which are cancelled or reworked (see Blizzard and Overwatch for example).

Also this is not gaming industry specific. The amount of industries which go over budget is not small. Best example is housing and construction projects, which go over budget pretty much always.

Now obviously this is highly dependent on scope and how well different elements can be planed and foreseen, which for multi year long projects is usually very unreliable.

Let's make it simple: if Arenanet or NCSoft West had the couple of hundred millions needed for developing GW3, NCSoft global would not have had to invest 130 million a few years ago. On top of which we know that NCSoft West has been running a deficite for over 8 years now, and investors were not happy about it (hence the hostile questions during the last call).

Sure, projects take it's course and not all of them get to the end and many don't stay within the initial budget or scope. That's common for all industries, maybe some more volatile, some less.

But that doesn't mean that gw2's revenue has much of an impact on future projects beyond just a general NCSoft financial outlook. I have no idea what is the current NCSoft's financial situation and how they fund their projects but in the past they were able to release quite a few mmorpgs (not saying there were many good, but I wouldnt call them cheap) so I guess they have some clue how to close it.

Also do you actually know why they invested 130mil? It sounds like a good amount for a new project or an additional studio, teams.

Running deficit is not what you would really want and sure you don't want existing products to tank more but that doesn't really mean much for how you run your projects beyond that they are probably running tighter shift and need to find more external funding. And if they sink, well they sink, it happens and doesn't necessarily mean it's the end for Anet and Gw. 

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, NapalmDest.1786 said:

You still have GW1. Still a great game. You did not lose anything.

It's a dead game. One that stopped being developed, and lost its community. Sure, its single-player aspects remained, but the MMORPG ones are no more. And notice how GW2 is much, much weaker in its single-player side than GW1 was. So, if the same happens to GW2, there will be next to nothing left.

[Cyninja.2954]

9 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Sure, projects take it's course and not all of them get to the end and many don't stay within the initial budget or scope. That's common for all industries, maybe some more volatile, some less.

But that doesn't mean that gw2's revenue has much of an impact on future projects beyond just a general NCSoft financial outlook. I have no idea what is the current NCSoft's financial situation and how they fund their projects but in the past they were able to release quite a few mmorpgs (not saying there were many good, but I wouldnt call them cheap) so I guess they have some clue how to close it.

Also do you actually know why they invested 130mil? It sounds like a good amount for a new project or an additional studio, teams.

It happend shortly after the news broke that there are mass layoffs, right during the time when Arenanet was forced to stop working on IBS and focus on an expansion (EoD).

While also shutting down all except 1 side project they had.

So pretty much the exact opposite.

The cash infusion was part of a restructuring because the studio (and NCSoft West overall) was spread over to many projects and I guess the funding for all of them was not there.

EDIT:

Figured I'd backup my claims with some sources, given it's been 4 years by now and I am sure the memory of some people is foggy.

Here a source from back then on the investment: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/dvrox5/ncsoft_made_a_132b_krw_investment_on_ncwest/

Articles back then were talking about 110-130 million dollars.This is end of 2019 (November 30th to be exact).

Here an article about the mass layoffs early 2019: https://kotaku.com/guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-plans-for-mass-layoffs-1832799804

Back when people were also panicking that the game would shut down, followed by THE lowest quarterly revenue for GW2 due to an underwhelming Icebrood Saga announcement later that year. It's not until the EoD announcement early 2020, paired with the successful Return to achievement chain and the legendary armory that revenue started to recover.

 

Edited April 11 by Cyninja.2954

[Gehenna.3625]

15 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

It's exactly because i have put a lot of time in GW1, that i'd rather not go over it ever again.

But it's going to happen at some point because the game will have too few players at some point. I do get it, I also had too big an attachment to games back then, however, I learned my lesson with Aion Online. The lesson was to not get invested too much into online games. As a reminder: you do not own ANYTHING in online games. When you buy a skin you effectively lease it for the duration of the game. Same with your characters, achievements etc. 

But you will have to experience it again, it's a simple reality. If not in 5 years then maybe 10. I fully expect the servers will be unplugged for this game at some point... unless GW3 becomes a reality and they keep the servers going like they did with GW1. In fact, afaic, GW3 is the only thing that might save GW2 from its eventual demise, or at least delay it.

Edited April 11 by Gehenna.3625

[Astralporing.1957]

8 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

But it's going to happen at some point because the game will have too few players at some point.

That's fine. I can accept natural order of things in this. What i won't accept is devs trying to accelerate the decay. Any studio that intentionally acts to kill their game long before its time (and GW2 still could have many, many years in it if it was cared for well) is just not trustworthy enough for me to believe them when they release a long-engagement style game once again.

8 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

The lesson was to not get invested too much into online games.

So, not play MMORPGs? That is indeed an option.

8 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

In fact, afaic, GW3 is the only thing that might save GW2 from its eventual demise, or at least delay it.

It's the opposite. GW3 would only accelerate that demise, it will never delay it (much less save this game from it).

 

[Ashantara.8731]

On 4/10/2024 at 11:36 AM, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

Hall of Monuments being an area (with many Services and NPCs) within Eye of the North.

You don't say! 😱

Still, the Hall of Monuments is not the area in the Eye of the North where the vendor NPCs are located. The HoM is the back room where the GW1 achievements are put on display, where in GW2 you can acquire the GW1 rewards in an instanced version of the place, and where (also in GW2) Aurene, Taimi and Gorrik can be found during and after the IBS.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

3 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

You don't say! 😱

Still, the Hall of Monuments is not the area in the Eye of the North where the vendor NPCs are located. The HoM is the back room where the GW1 achievements are put on display, where in GW2 you can acquire the GW1 rewards in an instanced version of the place, and where (also in GW2) Aurene, Taimi and Gorrik can be found during and after the IBS.

I am afraid you are mistaken:  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hall_of_Monuments#Services

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

I am afraid you are mistaken:  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hall_of_Monuments#Services

That's the wiki being wrong. The area/whole structure is called Eye of the North. Hall of Monuments is just the northern chamber of it.

[Gehenna.3625]

1 hour ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

That's the wiki being wrong. The area/whole structure is called Eye of the North. Hall of Monuments is just the northern chamber of it.

Because there's discussion about this, I actually went and looked it up. 

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Eye_of_the_North_(outpost)

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Eye_of_the_North

First I looked at the wiki of the OG GW and then at the GW2 wiki for Eye of the North

Both of those agree with you and the link that @Inculpatus cedo.9234 is therefore contradictory to both of these wiki pages I linked. However, the screenshot of this page they linked is based on a screenshot of the map and as such the map is wrong in GW2. It shows Eye of the North as a zone and the entirety of the tower as the Hall of Monuments. This is not correct, so it's actually a mistake in the game's map system. When you have the portal scroll/book it's also listed as Eye of the North and not the Hall of Monuments.

Ergo, my conclusion must be that you and @Ashantara.8731 are right and the wiki page Inculpates linked is a faulty wiki page.

[Yerlock.4678]

Ncsoft showed their hand, we not getting anything of note thats new unless its stuff we’ve already gotten (new meta events, maps, personal story, weapons etc). 
 

No new PvP game modes or player housing or wvw updates other than server restructuring. Never getting new raids. Never getting dungeon reworks. Never getting a new class. Not a chance, it’s too much work and would take away devs that are working on GW3.

New weapons coming to the game is also too much work. Every class will eventually get every weapon at best, no spears or harpoons or whips or great axes. The amount of dev time to model every new skin to compare to the weapons we have now would be enormous. They don’t have the manpower if they also making GW3. 
 

The game is about retention at this point. It’s too late in the games life to get new players with big risks, so the new Soto style expacs to keep already established players invested is all that matters. Don’t expect anything big ever from gw2 from this point forward, it’s on its way out and into the sunset. 
Sure it’ll take a number of years to finally get GW3 still, and GW2 is by no means a “dead game” (unless it’s PvP, which is totally dead). But expecting anything other than Soto style going forward is copium.

[Blacklust.4638]

There is absolutely no reason to think that guild wars 3 will be the same style of game. Might not even be an MMO. Might be a battle royal kind of game. There is no indication that Guild wars 2 will stop being developed. 

This is like saying WOW will stop being developed just because they will make a Warcraft 4. 

I am not worried in the slightest that the attention will continue to be on guild wars 2 as most likely whoever is working on maybe that guild wars 3 mobile game or whatever it is is a completely different team from the new batch of hires. So stop the drama.