PUSH - WHY??

[Moneyshot.7694]

I just had to make a forum account just to post this. I am absolutely appalled that ArenaNet made this mode thinking it was a good idea. We already have 2 other 5v5 modes and for everyone dying to play 2v2 and 3v3 has to wait an ENTIRE season to play. Now we had that taken away now as well. PLEASE ArenaNet, give us permanent 2v2 ranked play. Don't you think it would make sense to have a different size sPVP mode? 2v2 is perfect because a lot of people want to play with a friend. 5v5 has a ton of RNG because you are much more dependent on teammates and class composition. PUSH is even MORE RNG on teammates because it has less strategy. It makes no sense at all. 

I can't tell you the level of disappointment when I found out that I wasn't going to be able to 2v2 today after waiting months. Me and my friend were counting down the days and it was swiftly taken from us. 

PLEASE ditch PUSH, or keep it but PLEASE make 2v2 and/or 3v3 a permanent ranked game mode! If not, I will be quitting this game sadly. I cannot just keep face rolling RNG 5v5 any longer. 

[sacrifyx.3470]

So their response to all the people begging for a small-scale PvP/WvW format like 2v2 or duel is to delete the 2v2 season 😁 and replace it with yet another 5v5 RNG fiesta.
Honestly, surprisingly for me Im not even frustrated. I am starting to lose hope, they either have no idea how to make PvP better, or they just do not want people to play PvP.
I got used to logging in and wandering what to do. I am not a PVE person. Every MMO I have played in my life I play to PvP. This is the first game I have ever seen with PvP system so bad, that it actually forces me to do something else.
The truly ironic thing is that I adore everything else but the PvP in Guild Wars2. So I guess I will log in and go sightseeing again. No comment...

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

2 hours ago, Moneyshot.7694 said:

PLEASE ditch PUSH

No

This Push game mode is actually good dude.

@sacrifyx.3470

You guys are doomers. Did you even go in and play the new mode? These complaints look like you didn't tbh.

Credit is due where credit is deserved, and so far they've done right with Push.

Edited September 11 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[sacrifyx.3470]

10 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

No

This Push game mode is actually good dude.

@sacrifyx.3470

You guys are doomers. Did you even go in and play the new mode? These complaints look like you didn't tbh.

Credit is due where credit is deserved, and so far they've done right with Push.

Of course they will make another 5v5 format when the players are like this guy...

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

8 minutes ago, sacrifyx.3470 said:

Of course they will make another 5v5 format when the players are like this guy...

Bro you're post doesn't even mention the Push game mode. You're just complaining broadly because you didn't get exactly what you imagined you wanted.

This game mode is good dude. Just chill and give it a chance.

[Luthan.5236]

I did not like the death machtes with the smaller teams. Liked conquest PvP more than WvW. As the push is now I'd prefer WvW or even 2vs2/3vs3 death match.

(Conquest > WvW > 2vs2/3vs3 death match > push.)
It might change though. But it will never replace the conquest as ranked since they intend to make it as introduction to conquest. (Meaning it would end up in unranked as a permanent replacement or with a checkbox like stronghold. Or in ranked with a checkbox.)

We just need to wait - then the real PvP is back again until the next beta. Not sure if/whether they should make a permanent death match option for people that liked it. They always say it is about not splitting the player base. But maybe it is just better to split it - and take longer times into account when then everyone can play what they want? (Trying to get more people to play with more rewards instead.)

At the moment it seems like a regular 2 weeks thing after every 9 or 11 weeks normal conquest season I guess - and the 2vs2/3vs3 on hold in ranked (I think it is in some tournaments though?) - and we can expect at least a few years of beta (unless they scrap it) ... WvW has shown this ... that it takes some time. (Though a map might be simpler than that whole world restructuring thing. Less danger in breaking something else.) Beta stage could progress faster. Depends on the feedback and what they change ... I guess.

[maxwelgm.4315]

13 minutes ago, Luthan.5236 said:

I did not like the death machtes with the smaller teams. Liked conquest PvP more than WvW. As the push is now I'd prefer WvW or even 2vs2/3vs3 death match.

(Conquest > WvW > 2vs2/3vs3 death match > push.)
It might change though. But it will never replace the conquest as ranked since they intend to make it as introduction to conquest. (Meaning it would end up in unranked as a permanent replacement or with a checkbox like stronghold. Or in ranked with a checkbox.)

We just need to wait - then the real PvP is back again until the next beta. Not sure if/whether they should make a permanent death match option for people that liked it. They always say it is about not splitting the player base. But maybe it is just better to split it - and take longer times into account when then everyone can play what they want? (Trying to get more people to play with more rewards instead.)

At the moment it seems like a regular 2 weeks thing after every 9 or 11 weeks normal conquest season I guess - and the 2vs2/3vs3 on hold in ranked (I think it is in some tournaments though?) - and we can expect at least a few years of beta (unless they scrap it) ... WvW has shown this ... that it takes some time. (Though a map might be simpler than that whole world restructuring thing. Less danger in breaking something else.) Beta stage could progress faster. Depends on the feedback and what they change ... I guess.

Will they stop making people want to play the mode with the most rewards though? If playing what we want was the point, I'd frankly choose to skip the alt title farming matches in ranked and play Conquest in unranked with pip rewards all day long. But as it is I'm both a PvE/WvW/PvP player and ranked is a no brainer for the pips even if I have to withstand some bad matches. But then yes, I'm also sort of playing non competitively in a competitive ladder mode just for rewards. If they split Push into unranked without the pip rewards it might just become the next Stronghold up until the point it is today with a single guild farming the few remaining scraps of players who tick the box. So imo the only (real) option to increase the chances of a successful implementation would be to have a checkbox in ranked - which would split the population in some ways but perhaps not split it at all in other ways, as people can't queue simultaneously for both but we already have plenty of queue dodging and alt multiboxing anyways - people would just play both modes alternating so they can hoard titles from two modes as they already hoard them in Conquest. And still the group that would not play ranked but would like to have pips/farm progression will have to be on either mode anyway. It seems Anet simply wants to make ranked intrinsically rewarding and that's it, no matter what game modes they introduce.

[arazoth.7290]

3 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Bro you're post doesn't even mention the Push game mode. You're just complaining broadly because you didn't get exactly what you imagined you wanted.

This game mode is good dude. Just chill and give it a chance.

true.

Also wanted to mention since I noticed, you're having a streak of likes instead of confused faces for once, record !

[Skary.8956]

I think the push mode is basically the worst from Overwatch with the Annoying Permanent Bunker meta of conquest.
You basically insta lose if you dont have chrono and spb on the team and the enemy has 🤦‍♂️

Edited September 11 by Skary.8956

[DanAlcedo.3281]

I'm more baffled that it's not 10v10.

Now that would bring in players. 

[Kuya.6495]

42 minutes ago, Skary.8956 said:

I think the push mode is basically the worst from Overwatch with the Annoying Permanent Bunker meta of conquest.
You basically insta lose if you dont have chrono and spb on the team and the enemy has 🤦‍♂️

It helps to have a bunker but bunkers can't stay on the point long because they get a debuff that makes them take more damage and take less healing. 

[DannyPA.8647]

Funny, because all I hear from people is they want 10v10 or even better 15v15 sPVP modes. I really think that's what is more desired than smaller matches.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

12 minutes ago, DannyPA.8647 said:

Funny, because all I hear from people is they want 10v10 or even better 15v15 sPVP modes. I really think that's what is more desired than smaller matches.

But yet it already exists in eotm arena, guilds doing 10 vs 10 all the time, and these people don't care to get involved.

[Vavume.8065]

21 minutes ago, DannyPA.8647 said:

Funny, because all I hear from people is they want 10v10 or even better 15v15 sPVP modes. I really think that's what is more desired than smaller matches.

They cannot even make decent 2 v 2 maps... so the have no hope with 10 v 0.

[Duke Nukem.6783]

8 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

No

This Push game mode is actually good dude.

@sacrifyx.3470

You guys are doomers. Did you even go in and play the new mode? These complaints look like you didn't tbh.

Credit is due where credit is deserved, and so far they've done right with Push.

this post does not respond to their criticism at all.

[Greyrat.2378]

Fun mode, crippled by favoring boon vomit and stacking AoEs around the objective, occasionally feels like fighting boon ball in WvW.

Not enough options for kiting, making certain playstyles difficult to execute.

Short duration is good, occasional comebacks feels nice as well.

Overall not bad, but I don't think that this will teach new people about conquest anything.

Feels more like more chaotic team deathmatch with side objective of pushing the ball.

Not sure what the devs are cooking but overall fun alternative.

 

Edited September 11 by Greyrat.2378

[Leif.4092]

11 hours ago, Moneyshot.7694 said:

 PUSH is even MORE RNG on teammates because it has less strategy. 

I agree with this, partially. A group with 1-2 supports will easily beat one without because this mode is purely based on teamfights.

I think a couple things could help address this, because overall I think the mode is fun and promising. Something like stronger secondary objectives that can allow roamers to influence victory conditions.

I guess the analogy I'd make is quidditch - moving the point to the end like the golden snitch, usually wins the game. But other things can chip away at the total "points" your team wins. Secondary objectives, smaller secondary cap points? What if a certain buff lets ONLY your team move the point for X time, for example. Lots to play with here and thank you ANet for your work here.

[jdawgie.1835]

12 hours ago, Moneyshot.7694 said:

We already have 2 other 5v5 modes

12 hours ago, Moneyshot.7694 said:

to play 2v2 and 3v3 has to wait an ENTIRE season

12 hours ago, Moneyshot.7694 said:

Don't you think it would make sense to have a different size sPVP mode

9 hours ago, sacrifyx.3470 said:

So their response to all the people begging for a small-scale PvP/WvW format like 2v2 or duel is to delete the 2v2 season

9 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Bro you're post doesn't even mention the Push game mode

So - To be honest. they're refusal to allow for 2v2 / 3v3 on a permanent basis has actually slowly pushed me out of the game. Im currently enjoying the WW expac on wow. Arenas this season are amazing, and they also added a bunch of rated options for solo quers where things are completely separated. @Multicolorhipster.9751 You'd appreciate the level of separation in the PvP Menu. @Trevor Boyer.6524 They have Solo Shuffle, and Blitz BGs - the new mode.  (Where I think they got there Push Mode Inspiration from, and no Shade cuz WoW stole GW2 mount system lol) Point being - that in the ques your either qued up with a team in 2s/3s/ and 5s (Standard Arena) or you can solo que into solo shuffle which is a really good implementation of solo que and balance for it. Arena nets refusal to remove RNG from their RANKED game play has honestly gotten silly. Im weary of they're evasiveness too regarding pvp. I appreciate very much that they're adding a new game mode and it really is a huge sign of good things so thats really good - but OP is right man. Unranked, Ranked Conquest, and now Push. Three game modes with the same numbers. The number of game modes vs the repetitiveness of what they offer is out of balance and its annoying. 

[jdawgie.1835]

3 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

But yet it already exists in eotm arena, guilds doing 10 vs 10 all the time

**Instanced** 10v10 or 15v15 like Alterac Valley or Arathi Basin. EOTM is not instanced play and requires some luck. No1 uses it. Very different than opening up the swords and queing from anywhere and getting ported into ur matches while u do other stuff, or just chill in HOTM. 

[Grimjack.8130]

5 hours ago, Skary.8956 said:

I think the push mode is basically the worst from Overwatch with the Annoying Permanent Bunker meta of conquest.
You basically insta lose if you dont have chrono and spb on the team and the enemy has 🤦‍♂️

WvW sucks cause you cant play it without Firebrands or Chronos

PvE sucks cause you cant play it without Quickness or Alacrity

Conquest sucks cause you cant play it without a brain

Push sucks cause you cant play it with do nothing sidenode specs filling up 4 of your team

Maybe the problem is the community should be willing and able to play more than the 1 build they want to play 🙂

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

2 hours ago, jdawgie.1835 said:

So - To be honest. they're refusal to allow for 2v2 / 3v3 on a permanent basis has actually slowly pushed me out of the game. Im currently enjoying the WW expac on wow. Arenas this season are amazing, and they also added a bunch of rated options for solo quers where things are completely separated. @Multicolorhipster.9751 You'd appreciate the level of separation in the PvP Menu. @Trevor Boyer.6524 They have Solo Shuffle, and Blitz BGs - the new mode.  (Where I think they got there Push Mode Inspiration from, and no Shade cuz WoW stole GW2 mount system lol) Point being - that in the ques your either qued up with a team in 2s/3s/ and 5s (Standard Arena) or you can solo que into solo shuffle which is a really good implementation of solo que and balance for it. Arena nets refusal to remove RNG from their RANKED game play has honestly gotten silly. Im weary of they're evasiveness too regarding pvp. I appreciate very much that they're adding a new game mode and it really is a huge sign of good things so thats really good - but OP is right man. Unranked, Ranked Conquest, and now Push. Three game modes with the same numbers. The number of game modes vs the repetitiveness of what they offer is out of balance and its annoying. 

I do appreciate that, I appreciate you too
Push; if anything, is proof that it wouldn't be too hard to do with the slightest modicum of effort and attention. It was announced and has a playable beta in the same week, and that's an entirely new gamemode. 2v2/3v3 already exist, it's just a matter of adding a button for them and making 5v5 conquest soloq only.

[Reznov.5423]

I liked it so much more than conquest. I played so much last night that l almost finished half of the pipe reward. 

[Cuks.8241]

Nothing against small scale modes personally. But if they want to bring in more players they should increase the team size to reduce individual responsibility.

GvGs are fun but very inaccessible for an average player. And theres alot of prep  required because  there  are almost no dedicated support systems and interface to accomodate it. And guild arenas have plenty limitations also. It needs to be 2 clicks and youre in.

[Flowki.7194]

To be fair to OP, it makes little sense that 2s and 3s are not perminant fixtures. This is just one of many reasons the sPVP playerbase is so low. I persoanlly enjoyed the last 3s season, it was a nice break from the roam/duelist heavy 5s that was leading to 0 teamwork.. there was more team work in 3s, despite it just being DM. I would still be playing it now if it was up.

Edited September 11 by Flowki.7194