So I'm seeing a lot of Spear Warriors in ToL

[bethekey.8314]

9 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

It was stealth fixed on release. It was a bug. Try it again.

I'm pretty sure I was watching Ops or someone stream it farming people a couple days ago. To be clear, I'm not saying these builds are meta, but they're easily good enough to get top 100 (or whatever metric you care about) if you're competent on them.

9 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/sharp-lessons-spear-beta-feedback-update/

Spears/expansion feedback is a bit different from regular balance. They're trying to sell you something and will therefore devote more resources.

And from the perspective Engi feedback, the spear was an obvious cluster-kitten on day 1 and hardly anything has changed from forum feedback. Surely giving the class without a weapon swap a weapon with 0 defensives, a leap finisher that doesn't finish, slow skills unaffected by quickness, and low damage is good design. All called out early in the feedback. Their changes like tuning animation speed and adding more visual effects felt more like "finishing up planned development on an incomplete weapon" disguised as "we listen to you!".

[bethekey.8314]

9 hours ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Hard to take a thread seriously when I read "rifle zerker unblockable one shots groups of players".

Sorry did something change recently that makes Signet of Might not grant unblockable, Gun Flame not crit 10-14k in an AoE, and Blood Reckoning not reset Gun flame? Not to mention 2x Explosive Shell follow-ups?

Maybe you're just bad at playing it lol. Seems like a theme among forum people.

Examples of damage potential, not necessarily skill:

Edited September 22 by bethekey.8314

[Hotride.2187]

34 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Sorry did something change recently that makes Signet of Might not grant unblockable, Gun Flame not crit 10-14k in an AoE, and Blood Reckoning not reset Gun flame? Not mention 2x Explosive Shell follow-ups?

Maybe you're just bad at playing it. Seems like a theme among forum people.

Yes yes its clearly one of the viable war builds. How could I have missed it? Oh, right, I've fought it.

[bethekey.8314]

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Yes yes its clearly one of the viable war builds. How could I have missed it? Oh, right, I've fought it.

Warrior mains wanting non-tank builds after their class dominates 2 metas: https://imgflip.com/i/94cec6

Sorry, I was replying to your original wrong comment claiming that Zerker rifle couldn't unblock-obliterate groups of people. It's a bit off topic, but if you want to discuss it, it would help if you defined "viable" for you. Maybe include what rating you typically play at. From what I've seen I assume most of you are Gold players at best and that's fine.

Just don't tell me "viable" is winning major tournaments level, unless you've come close to winning one recently. TBH if I was paid well to do it, I might spend a fun few months getting to top 100 on builds bad players insist aren't "viable".

Also as it seemed relevant, I watched:

If it isn't the video personification of forum Warrior...my favorite moments:

https://youtu.be/IRa7sSBLzjM?feature=shared&t=67 Full heals Revenant with Volley, then makes point about being perceptive

https://youtu.be/IRa7sSBLzjM?feature=shared&t=120 Talks about Kill Shot casting time as a major issue, when Gun Flame already addresses it, then dives into top tier "Woe is Warrior" whine

https://youtu.be/IRa7sSBLzjM?feature=shared&t=157 Manages to complain about Volley while showing footage of it hitting 7-8k twice, downplaying the 2x charges relative to Rapid Fire, and acts like 1200 range isn't enough. As if not having the "best" of everything on every ability = bad / ignoring that skills should be considered as part of a whole

https://youtu.be/IRa7sSBLzjM?feature=shared&t=235 "Explosive Shell isn't an objectively bad skill, but falls behind in every category in every way possible". Complains about having to play strategically to maximize damage, 1200 range not being enough again (lol), then dumps full Burst skill into a bush after presenting Adrenaline as a precious resource

Dude's whole channel is just hyperbolic, bad Warrior claims.

Edited September 22 by bethekey.8314

[Shagie.7612]

1 hour ago, bethekey.8314 said:

I might spend a fun few months getting to top 100 on builds bad players insist aren't "viable".

You can do that on anything just from macro level gameplay honestly.

I dunno about your definition of "fun" there though lol

[Last Crab.6054]

22 hours ago, Grimjack.8130 said:

SNAIL PACE BALANCE GO BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR cant wait for war nerfs(in 2 months) to make the largely untouched druid come back before we get even the smallest of chances of seeing a new class excel on the sidenodes(in 7 months)

as long as that "new" class isn't ele, it is all good

[Hotride.2187]

7 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Sorry, I was replying to your original wrong comment claiming that Zerker rifle couldn't unblock-obliterate groups of people. It's a bit off topic, but if you want to discuss it, it would help if you defined "viable" for you. Maybe include what rating you typically play at. From what I've seen I assume most of you are Gold players at best and that's fine.

I went to ranked I think in 2021? No idea, played only 120 games as str SPB. I was in p1 for that. I got close to p2 a few times but never reached it. I think I also dropped to g3 a few times. So say g3p1. I was still mostly just dueling in wvw, I didnt play conquest all that much. Zero gunflame zerkers then btw.

From then I've moved to unranked (I was getting plenty of kitten at the start of EoD for playing SPB and not bladesworn, that got tiring). Have seen exactly 1 gunflame zerker that survived team targeting and I've never seen that player playing at prime time.

Meanwhile I got 2k games on war, at prime time I generally get matched with what to me are good players (usually 1+ champion brawler, usually the players are on non-meta builds, its unranked). I have not seen a gunflame zerker that survives a call target at prime time. Generally I barely see gunflame zerkers, despite unranked being a good place for crap builds.

Do you know why? Because most players (contrary to what I see you assume here) have eyes and reflexes. See a gunflame build? Focus it. See the signet for unblockables pop? Dodge or LoS. It has no stealth, no ports, some mobility if its playing GS (I've not seen anyone on staff, thats how few players are on the build).

There was this guy when I was still in ranked, was gonna reach top 100 on core war (to prove war was not crap at the time). Never really saw more from the person, other than the claim. So, go, reach 100 with gunflame. You'll have proven nothing, but maybe you'll have understood why the build doesnt work.

You can moan about signet spear core, condi zerker, defense SPB, go ahead and even moan about str SPB (its still an OK build, I even sometimes see some players try the new weapons on it). I can even understand retrospectivley moaning about bladesworn, when it was a thing. I fight or have fought all these, they range from OK to OP. Vs an actually good player I have trouble with them. But gunflame zerk? I really had a higher opinion of you from reading your posts so far.

Anyway, thats it from me. As I said, I read "but you can play gunflame" and lost interest in the thread. Go play grenade scrapper, its about on that level. Maybe that is a comparison you can understand. Or go play gunflame and cure yourself of the delusions.

Edited September 23 by Hotride.2187

[bethekey.8314]

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Zero gunflame zerkers then btw.

Surely the presence of more popular builds means this one isn't viable 🙂 And nice, getting plat. That's better than most.

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Do you know why? Because most players (contrary to what I see you assume here) have eyes and reflexes. See a gunflame build? Focus it. See the signet for unblockables pop? Dodge or LoS.

I agree it's a good focus target. But I think I may have found the issue here. You see, on one-shotty builds with must-hit burst, you count their dodges or force them to eat your 2x 8k volleys or Explosive Shells etc. Radical concept that dramatically improves your ability to hit.

And if a mid-tier player is able to sacrifice themselves to take out the carry it's worth it every time. Long term survival doesn't necessarily matter.

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

So, go, reach 100 with gunflame. You'll have proven nothing

You're not very inspiring 😕

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

I really had a higher opinion of you from reading your posts so far.

Thanks lol. I was just offering up builds I'm pretty sure I could do well on when others acted like Warrior doesn't have options outside Spear Spb.

[Myror.7521]

I like how peops still think that spellbreaker is the standalone Problem about the whole Meta build xP

Did anet adressed some things that should been nerfed? 

Yes they nerfed the staffs basehealing wich was good choice (tho they did it a bit weird ... they should have made the on stat use only big healing Variant)

they also nerfed spears overall dmg wich also was good (even while the 4th skill is now in a realy weird state)

But did they realy nerfed the main Problems about the whole build?

This answer is No! The Problem was the stacking of multiple non hit stuff .... means defiant stance/staff 5/spear 5/ spear burst/ full counter. In the end they should have nerfed the spear burst to have no evade frame at all cause its too broken in comb with the evade frame of fullcounter. This way the only thing that would realy get hurt would be .... the spellbreaker spear since on core mode it does Stack dmg and in Berserker its a complete other burst skill

[Terrorhuz.4695]

Do you all remember when warrior mains were claiming left and right that the class became LITERALLY UNPLAYABLE because FC started requiring to hit targets before proccing traits? Good old times, really 🙂

Edited September 23 by Terrorhuz.4695

[WingSwipe.3084]

I’m sorry, are people genuinely complaining about Gunzerker and how it does damage?

THE Gunzerker playstyle that quite unironically could be classified as the only pure glass build in the game?

THE Gunzerker playstyle that waves a massive red flag every time it’s about to do damage so you get to use your defensives?

THE Gunzerker build that folds like a house of cards under and kind of pressure?

I was fully aware y’all were some casuals but this is some next level kittenery. 🤡

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

I’m sorry, are people genuinely complaining about Gunzerker and how it does damage?

THE Gunzerker playstyle that quite unironically could be classified as the only pure glass build in the game?

THE Gunzerker playstyle that waves a massive red flag every time it’s about to do damage so you get to use your defensives?

THE Gunzerker build that folds like a house of cards under and kind of pressure?

I was fully aware y’all were some casuals but this is some next level kittenery. 🤡

They're going to cry harder on October 8th because that build is getting more Ferocity boosts.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

8 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

 

And if a mid-tier player is able to sacrifice themselves to take out the carry it's worth it every time. Long term survival doesn't necessarily matter.

 

But the tools should exist for players who don't want to sacrifice themselves to oneshot people not paying attention, because people start paying attention over gold 1.

Also didn't you make several meme videos scolding berserkers for oneshotting you with the silly 0 defensive arc divider build?  Is that the direction we should be satisfied with now?

If that was all it took to be viable people would be playing it more. They're flocking to willbender so obviously the drive for that playstyle is there, no?

Edited September 23 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[bethekey.8314]

Oh hey it's the guy who was arguing Spear is bad now, right before ToL had 2x SpearBreakers per winning team. Think you dropped this son:

2 hours ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

🤡

As for:

2 hours ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

I’m sorry, are people genuinely complaining about Gunzerker and how it does damage?

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

They're going to cry harder on October 8th because that build is getting more Ferocity boosts.

There's this:

10 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Thanks lol. I was just offering up builds I'm pretty sure I could do well on when others acted like Warrior doesn't have options outside Spear Spb.

This:

https://imgur.com/a/SezxZYG

Followed by:

https://imgur.com/a/1lyXFuR

And ultimately a suggestion:

https://www.callofduty.com/

[bethekey.8314]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

But the tools should exist for players who don't want to sacrifice themselves to oneshot people not paying attention, because people start paying attention over gold 1.

Also didn't you make several meme videos scolding berserkers for oneshotting you with the silly 0 defensive arc divider build?  Is that the direction we should be satisfied with now?

If that was all it took to be viable people would be playing it more. They're flocking to willbender so obviously the drive for that playstyle is there, no?

Idk Captain Crapface seems to manage to pull off amazing Rifle War kills while not dying. But he is an expert after all.

And most top rated people are meta bandwagoners. You should not be surprised that class/spec picks aren't spread out among all viable builds among people Gold+.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

22 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Oh hey it's the guy who was arguing Spear is bad now, right before ToL had 2x SpearBreakers per winning team. Think you dropped this son:

As for:

There's this:

This:

https://imgur.com/a/SezxZYG

Followed by:

https://imgur.com/a/1lyXFuR

And ultimately a suggestion:

https://www.callofduty.com/

Salty because I'm pointing out the build that you are whining about will be doing more damage in the next patch? So weird...

[WingSwipe.3084]

11 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Oh hey it's the guy who was arguing Spear is bad now, right before ToL had 2x SpearBreakers per winning team.

Ah yes, another intellectual thinking that’s a “gotcha” statement.

Spear is dramatically worse, but get this, on playstyles that isn’t spellbreaker. Im aware its a very radical notion that warrior as a profession can be played other ways.

Spellbreaker still gets to play with most weapons and finds good success because its baseline performance in PvP is so much higher then other warrior play styles.

Keep your 🤡, you earned it all on your own, I’ll even throw in a ⭐️ for your naughty boy attempt at moving the goal posts.

 

[WingSwipe.3084]

29 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Thanks lol. I was just offering up builds I'm pretty sure I could do well on when others acted like Warrior doesn't have options outside Spear Spb.

While we appreciate the offer, SPB in general is performing so much better then anything else warrior has to offer that it’s just a straight and heavy handed downgrade to play anything else.

Thats why most sane warrior mains have been advocating day and night to redistribute the power budged and functionality to core traits.

SPB would go down in viability but Zerker, BSW and Core would get drastically improved.

Most warriors are actively theory crafting on PvP builds but what currently exists is VERY hard to beat.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

1 hour ago, bethekey.8314 said:

And most top rated people are meta bandwagoners. You should not be surprised that class/spec picks aren't spread out among all viable builds among people Gold+.

Id imagine players are slightly smarter than that when it comes to buildcrafting. Theres players theorycrafting new builds all the time, and randomly popping up on something new and viable is an even sharper competitive edge than mimicry.

Builds seeing play under Gold 1, then vanishing at Gold 2 is precisely indicative of that.  It's not bandwagoning to the abandonment of unorthodox play in most cases, but something markedly underpowered in many of the less played specs, I reckon. Not all of them, but a notable amount. 

But maybe the one offhand mace warrior will agree with you. 

 

Edited September 23 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[bethekey.8314]

7 hours ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

Spear is dramatically worse, but get this, on playstyles that isn’t spellbreaker.

Warrior Spear as a whole still seems pretty great to me 🤷‍♂️

7 hours ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

I’ll even throw in a ⭐️ for your naughty boy attempt

Wtf?

7 hours ago, WingSwipe.3084 said:

While we appreciate the offer, SPB in general is performing so much better then anything else warrior has to offer that it’s just a straight and heavy handed downgrade to play anything else.

Thats why most sane warrior mains have been advocating day and night to redistribute the power budged and functionality to core traits.

SPB would go down in viability but Zerker, BSW and Core would get drastically improved.

Lol. "Hey Anet we like how OP Spellbreaker is, but it's so OP that we're tired of playing the same kitten. Can we take some OP points from Spellbreaker and allocate them to our other specs?"

Meanwhile Engineers are outside in the dirt banging two rusted turrets together, just trying to spark a fire to survive.

My god dude. You all seem like such Debbie-Downers complaining that all of Warrior isn't meta-viable at once / pre-whining about nerfs that haven't happened. Be happy you're relevant at all and take whatever comes in stride.

6 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Id imagine players are slightly smarter than that when it comes to buildcrafting.

Nope.

Edited September 24 by bethekey.8314

[Myror.7521]

Hell yeah If they gonna hard nerf Spellbreaker ill simply go core warrior and doing the Same kitten as before xP. 

Core Warr Builds that are as good as spellbreaker is:

Staff/Dagger,Sword

Staff/Spear

The only diff is you gonna have no Spam from fullcounter..... litterly xP

[Saiyan.1704]

I'm just glad people stopped talking about my avatar icon *sips ☕️ *

...at least until we get another PUSH beta 😈

[Vancho.8750]

18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Meanwhile Engineers are outside in the dirt banging two rusted turrets together, just trying to spark a fire to survive.

See that is your main problem, not that Warrior is good, its that what you play sucks in the current meta, but instead of trying to get your profession on the up and up allot of people whine about such and such being OP. See Warrior mains whined to get kitten working to have some synergy in the traits and got it after years, also they didn't whine about someone having better toys then them, they just wanted to have some toys of their own.
See here is an Idea create and Engi Omnibus forum post , discuss Ideas how to fix issues with engi and bump it from time to time, create similar post with parts from the main post since the devs don't read the long pages (they said so), keep this up for years,  Anet releases new elite spec be disappointed cause it does the same kitten as the other specs on engi, be double disappointed cause some elite spec from the ideas got copy pasted on other profession, after like 2 or 3 years there is some movement for reworks on core specializations that somehow use the suggestions and tada Engi works, but it no longer matters cause you switched professions like year one and don't give a kitten anymore. 
Also if you try to scour my writings for some gotcha, at this point I'm Necro main or more exactly Power Reaper main and I get to whinge about stupid kitten one shotting my kitten teleporting around or having unreadable telegraphs. 

[jdawgie.1835]

On 9/21/2024 at 9:54 PM, bethekey.8314 said:

Nothing on these forums causes balance decisions. Prove me wrong.

Are you serious? The forum balance changes are responsible for the destruction of this game mode. They have historically pulled more than half there balance choices from the forums. And their discord. No one needs to prove anything wrong - look at the correlation between the forums and the balance choices. Anets biggest mistake has been listening to the absolute nonsense of this forum. Its destroyed PvP.  I advocated STRONGLY against the nerfing of enigs in 2022-2023. STRONGLY. Mostly alone too. Now look - just like I said - Engis are completely gone from the meta. You're here upset about engis being gone (me too and I dont even play engi) Guess where Anet took there ques from? This tear factory of a forum. Make a forum post asking for engi to be looked at, and buffed. I will HAPPILY support you loud af. This post about warriors isnt helping anything. You're perpetuating the vacum of "nerf this, creates a space for this, now nerf this." Its just reduction based whack a mole until nothing is left. If your response is to flame me and argue with me instead of focusing on my point of offering to support you btw (because engi needs help BAD) then itll just prove my point. These forums are pure dog water. 

Edited September 24 by jdawgie.1835

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

3 hours ago, Vancho.8750 said:

See that is your main problem, not that Warrior is good, its that what you play sucks in the current meta, but instead of trying to get your profession on the up and up allot of people whine about such and such being OP. See Warrior mains whined to get kitten working to have some synergy in the traits and got it after years, also they didn't whine about someone having better toys then them, they just wanted to have some toys of their own.
See here is an Idea create and Engi Omnibus forum post , discuss Ideas how to fix issues with engi and bump it from time to time, create similar post with parts from the main post since the devs don't read the long pages (they said so), keep this up for years,  Anet releases new elite spec be disappointed cause it does the same kitten as the other specs on engi, be double disappointed cause some elite spec from the ideas got copy pasted on other profession, after like 2 or 3 years there is some movement for reworks on core specializations that somehow use the suggestions and tada Engi works, but it no longer matters cause you switched professions like year one and don't give a kitten anymore. 
Also if you try to scour my writings for some gotcha, at this point I'm Necro main or more exactly Power Reaper main and I get to whinge about stupid kitten one shotting my kitten teleporting around or having unreadable telegraphs. 

RIP Omnibus...