Theorizing future plot directions

[Jimbru.6014]

Making this post mostly to record my own thoughts on the present game, to see how right I am in the future. Warning: SPOILERS! If you haven't played up through the current game story content, you might want to stop now.

1. "Joko" in the LS4 story line isn't the real Joko, and the REAL Joko comes back and kicks his cabbage, creating a hugely awkward moment for everyone when the villain saves Tyria.

2. Kralkatorrik at this point is a mega monster restrained only by writer fiat. He was already so big that the Charr mistook his back for a mountain range, which implies that he's pretty much immune to any "normal" amount of force. Now that he's supercharged with the powers of Zhaitan, Mordremoth, and Balthazar, he probably could just fly in circles and turn the whole world into one giant Brand if he felt like it, and there's not much anyone could do about it. But that's not going to stop Rytlock from getting killed trying, and I REALLY don't want to see that happen. We've lost too many heroes already. :(

3. Rox goes native with the Olmakhan, which may or may not remove her from Dragon's Watch.

4. Taimi takes a hint from Blish and turns herself into a golem, to be relieved of her disease and physical limitations. Taimi + Scruffy 2.0 = Taimi 1.0. "My old body was just the beta version."

5. Caithe makes yet another bad emo decision which screws over the entire world for at least the third time.

6. Aurene eats Phlunt and then misses an episode with indigestion. OK, that's just a hopeful one.

7. We get some weird revelations about the strongly implied past connections between the Asura and Mursaat. Possibly that the Mursaat created the Asura, who then built their civilization on the ruins of their creators. Or maybe even that the Asura are descended from Mursaat ancestors who fled to the Depths when their civilization fell.

[perilisk.1874]

We'll see how right you are. But, for posterity, here are mine:

1. Rox learns from the Olmakhan and becomes a Druid (or something close), but stays with DW, reinforcing my theory that DW are stand-ins for the absent Six (Rox = Melandru).
2. Rytlock cleanses a new Ascalonian area of ghosts (no weirdness with Sohothin this time -- previously, it was called into the mists by Balthazar to lure help) to redeem himself with the Charr leadership. Meaning, we are introduced to the new Ascalonian area in a ghost-filled story instance, but the open world area has no ghosts. We also learn more about the Foefire, Sohothin and Magdaer, and their connection to Balthazar, reinforcing the notion that he has been a kitten for a long while rather than his attitude being a bad retcon.
3. Rytlock reveals that his lineage is actually FL, though he was raised Blood. He battles his way to become Flame Legion Imperator (cuz, holy fire sword). With his support, Smodur finally becomes Khan Ur. Rytlock has too much on his hands politically and in terms of reforming Flame Legion culture, and so he resigns from DW.
4. Both Kraalkatorik and Aurene are suffering from the effects of ingesting Balth energies (basically, slowly turning massively aggressive). Aurene got a lot less, and isn't corrupted, so we can help her with some balancing divine energies from... Dwayna or Melandru or someone (by eating a blessed relic or something). Or maybe Aurene isn't affected because she has a soul or something due to being descended from Glint, whatever.
5. Kraalkatorik (per #4) wants to wage war on the other dragons and claim their power. Since he already has a fair bit of Jormag and Primordus's power, by way of Balthazar, he instead goes after Serendipity.
6. The next expansion takes place somewhere between Cantha, the Jade Sea, and the deep ocean. A new solid ocean has been created by Branding magic, but there's still a lot of actual water as well.

[alcopaul.2156]

the mursaats finally reveal the secrets to the asura and the asuras open portals to different universes (space ships, space travels, planetary worlds) and all we do is fashion wars and pve loot wars.

[Jimbru.6014]

@"perilisk.1874" said:We'll see how right you are. But, for posterity, here are mine:

2. Rytlock cleanses a new Ascalonian area of ghosts (no weirdness with Sohothin this time -- previously, it was called into the mists by Balthazar to lure help) to redeem himself with the Charr leadership. Meaning, we are introduced to the new Ascalonian area in a ghost-filled story instance, but the open world area has no ghosts. We also learn more about the Foefire, Sohothin and Magdaer, and their connection to Balthazar, reinforcing the notion that he has been a kitten for a long while rather than his attitude being a bad retcon.

Magdaer, or what was left of it, was last seen being taken away by Eir at the end of the Ascalonian Catacombs story path, with her dialogue implying it could be reforged. It hasn't been seen in the game since, and of course, Eir is now dead. Hunting down Magdaer and restoring it could be the subject of an entire Living World season in itself.

And agreed, I think the next major expansion will be directed south and have a major aquatic element to it. Maybe they'll finally fill in those holes on the Tarnished Coast as part of the way south.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

@"Jimbru.6014" said:

1. "Joko" in the LS4 story line isn't the real Joko, and the REAL Joko comes back and kicks his cabbage, creating a hugely awkward moment for everyone when the villain saves Tyria.

I still don't get this whole "Joko is not actually Joko" theory. Would one of Joko's top commanders who hates Joko and is magically bound to listen to Joko and Joko alone really not know who enslaved them and is ordering them around? Would the Pact Commander, Taimi, the Inquest, and the entirety of an espienage and spy focused guild (the Order of Shadows) be so easily fooled by some imposter? Especially when the Commander and Taimi had just dealt with such a situation? Would ArenaNet really pull the same exact plot twice in a row?

I just don't get why people think this will be the case...

@"Jimbru.6014" said:

5. Caithe makes yet another bad emo decision which screws over the entire world for at least the third time.

To be fair, her only bad decision was caused by her being confused by Mordremoth's whispers. No Elder Dragon whispers to confuse her, not much chance she'll screw things up.

@"Jimbru.6014" said:

7. We get some weird revelations about the strongly implied past connections between the Asura and Mursaat. Possibly that the Mursaat created the Asura, who then built their civilization on the ruins of their creators. Or maybe even that the Asura are descended from Mursaat ancestors who fled to the Depths when their civilization fell.

....

What implied past connections? The only ones I could possibily think of would be the ruins' origins or Rata Sum anagram. The former, the ruins in the TC, were never hinted to be mursaat origin (and never even matched mursaat architecture), while the whole Rata Sum anagram has been pure player speculation that's been pretty much debunked since Quora Sum's name came out if not from the get go (but even more so with Rata Novus, Rata Primus, and Rata Arcanum; all of which, like Rata Sum, having similar translations: I Thought (Sum), New Thought (Novus), Secret Thought (Arcanum), and First Thought (Primus)).

And the idea of asura descending from mursaat is just silly. They hold no similar physiological traits.

[Jimbru.6014]

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

I still don't get this whole "Joko is not actually Joko" theory. Would one of Joko's top commanders who hates Joko and is magically bound to listen to Joko and Joko alone really not know who enslaved them and is ordering them around? Would the Pact Commander, Taimi, the Inquest, and the entirety of an espienage and spy focused guild (the Order of Shadows) be so easily fooled by some imposter? Especially when the Commander and Taimi had just dealt with such a situation? Would ArenaNet really pull the same exact plot twice in a row?

I just don't get why people think this will be the case...

1. Because the last place we saw Joko was in a cage in another dimension, bound by the power of a god. Now admittedly, that god is now dead, so it's possible those chains are broken.
2. Dialogue from "Joko" in LS4 Ep 1 about "the old me" and "the new me".
3. The Awakened are bound to Joko, but the Mordant Crescent are still living humans. Both were fooled easily enough by the Commander disguised as Iberu. Someone else posing as Joko to fool them (especially an insider, such as a leader of the Mordant Crescent trying to preserve the status quo) isn't that much of a stretch.
4. As for fooling Taimi, she may be a genius, but she's also fundamentally a teenage girl. In the situation she found herself in with Joko, she most likely wasn't able to analyze anything out of sheer fear.

[Michram.6853]

I think Joko is Joko.

Also it'd be better if it would turn out that not the Mursaat had created Asura, but the Forgotten- the Forgotten are from totally elsewhere so maybe thats why the Asura are so eager to find out the world beyond.

I think the story will reveal the mystery about Lyssa, or at least we'll get another weird hint like Balthazar not cursing her while he was dying.

Aurene isn't corrupted, we can see she had gained the powerful magic, but not sign of the corruption, yet...

About Aurene- I also think there will be a tough moment between her and the Commander, that will break the connection between us and her, but I think this will be used to involve the Ancient Forgotten again to really prepare us and her to become the most powerful Dragon in the world, as Glint was used to be and they will mend the broken connection.

Edits:corrections

[Castigator.3470]

• Palawa Joko tries to unleash the Scarab Plague on the Sunspear rebellion led by the Commander, but the ancient lich meets his end when Kralkatorrik turns him into a branded minion. After that, the Focus shifts towards getting Kralkatorrik out of the picture without outright killing him.

Jennah marries another noble, his lineage is traceable to the ancient kings of Kryta, and his current estates include Beetletun. Yes, I am talking about Lord Faren. Jennah remains queen regnant, though, as the alternative would be to put Faren in charge of Kryta. He's much better off as a king consort.

I like the Idea that Rytlock is a descendant of the Gold Legion Imperator, this gives a new dimension to his joke in Plan of Attack, where he said:"If it means I succeed at breaking the Foefire curse, I'd put on a robe and call myself Shaman Brimstone.". Well, Tribu- er, Imperator, time to put on your robe and wizard hat. Sadly, we'd lose him as a member of Dragon's Watch, since being Imperator to a legion is a full time commitment, since you're head of state and head of a military government at the same time.

As the newly minted Gold Legion starts to abandon their old ways and concentrate on mist channeling magic, taught by their new leader, we turn our attention back to the Kralkatorrik issue. We need an artifact, that was last seen in the Cathedral of Flame, so we have to travel into the Blood Legion Homelands to get it.

We use the artifact to build a weapon. With the weapon we transfer the magic from Kralkatorrik to Aurene, so that the former is now a small dragon, while the latter takes his place as an elder dragon.

Next we head towards Cantha, as rumors of amphibian dragon minions spread to the coast of Tyria, and the source may be located there. We fly there to find Cantha sieged by the minions of Steve Bubbles, but when we dive deep into the ocean, the elder dragon tells us it is perfectly willing to leave us alone, we just have to retrieve Steve's egg from the emperor, who wants to absorb dragon powers to become an immortal twisted tentacle monster.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

@"Jimbru.6014" said:

1. Because the last place we saw Joko was in a cage in another dimension, bound by the power of a god. Now admittedly, that god is now dead, so it's possible those chains are broken.
2. Dialogue from "Joko" in LS4 Ep 1 about "the old me" and "the new me".
3. The Awakened are bound to Joko, but the Mordant Crescent are still living humans. Both were fooled easily enough by the Commander disguised as Iberu. Someone else posing as Joko to fool them (especially an insider, such as a leader of the Mordant Crescent trying to preserve the status quo) isn't that much of a stretch.
4. As for fooling Taimi, she may be a genius, but she's also fundamentally a teenage girl. In the situation she found herself in with Joko, she most likely wasn't able to analyze anything out of sheer fear.

1. Bound by a former god, who's power source was stated to be tied to said former god's will, and everyone who meets Joko says its Joko.
2. This is pretty obviously referring to the differences we see in Joko's behavior between GW1 and GW2. Seems more of a subtle fourth wall break to explain why he's so much less comedic relief this time around, as well as explaining why he's not doing his usual "stay in the back of his armies and let them do ALL the work while Joko gloats about his victory before it's been had". He's lost multiple times since GW1's ending, and even suffered a similar defeat in GW2 (by Balthazar's hand) so he's changed his tactics. After 400-some years of doing things one way, he's now doing things a new way. Hence "old me" and "new me".
3. Most Mordant Crescent are Awakened too, but that's not relevant. Iberu held no magical command over the Awakened generals who were "tricked" by Joko, his command was no different than Bangar's command over the Blood Legion, except our equivalent of the Blood Legion would be so heavily indoctrinated into thinking Joko could do no wrong that no one could falsify Joko's orders. It really is a bit of a stretch since Joko's orders are literally said to be magically binding in Daybreak by Koss.
4. She likely wouldn't have been suffering from sheer fear right off the bat, but what about everyone else who was present to see Joko? Like the Commander or Lonai who is literally magically forced to follow Joko and only Joko's commands? Lonai wouldn't be following the commands of an impostor.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@"Jimbru.6014" said:

"Joko" in the LS4 story line isn't the real Joko, and the REAL Joko comes back and kicks his cabbage, creating a hugely awkward moment for everyone when the villain saves >Tyria.

Someone in disguise 10.0

Caithe makes yet another bad emo decision which screws over the entire world for at least the third time.

Caithe being Caithe 2.0, or the emo messing all up 3.0

We get some weird revelations about the strongly implied past connections between the Asura and Mursaat. Possibly that the Mursaat created the Asura, who then built >their civilization on the ruins of their creators. Or maybe even that the Asura are descended from Mursaat ancestors who fled to the Depths when their civilization fell.

Sylvari and Mordremoth 2.0

[hugo.4705]

Anything is possible now, from kralkatorrik destroying the whole tyria to fighting along giant Inquest Mechas against our common enemy Palawada Joko. But some lanes seem very predictable:1-Taimi will find a cure for her disease or turn into a golem/Scuffy 3.02-Recent introducing of Olmakans are either temporary to make the player have a Star Wars/Avatar vibe or about a long term story, and so we will explore charr homelands, or very far land of the flame legion.3-We have to stop Joko and Kralkattorik, both are dangerous, whereas the dragon is surely suspended, we will fight joko.4-Still don't know anything about Inquest, not even their leader, only the fact they have bases anywhere.5-Don't have a ton of news from Rata Novus or Phlunt maybe a comeback?6-The FMA duo will have a great role in future stories, don't know if Inquest still consider them as allies or not, but Gorrik seem very intelligent, and his brother too. A serious knowledge about scarabs... we will see if that is helpful..

[Jimbru.6014]

@"Arden.7480" said:

I think the story will reveal the mystery about Lyssa, or at least we'll get another weird hint like Balthazar not cursing her while he was dying.

Aurene isn't corrupted, we can see she had gained the powerful magic, but not sign of the corruption, yet...

About Aurene- I also think there will be a tough moment between her and the Commander, that will break the connection between us and her, but I think this will be used to involve the Ancient Forgotten again to really prepare us and her to become the most powerful Dragon in the world, as Glint was used to be and they will mend the broken connection.

Regarding Lyssa: Good catch about the cursing. Kormir mentioned in the story that "even Lyssa" went along with imprisoning Balthazar in the Mists. And Lyssa was arguably the sneakiest of the Six. Makes me wonder about possible implications.

About Aurene: Good on both points. There's going to be a reckoning coming for all this crazy energy Aurene has been absorbing and speeding her growth.

[Overlord RainyDay.2084]

I think Joko's plans will be foiled in the LW Probably with some kind of final battle with him in Kourna, maybe at the fortress of Jahai. I've got a feeling we'll find a way to break his absolute control over the awakened, allowing Koss to aid us (Maybe my reasoning's too meta, but I think there's a reason he only exists in an instance right now) and Talkora to either pass on, or regain her faculties and strengthen the sunspears. I feel like we have too little information to know exactly where Kralk is going next, and some of what we do have may be red herrings. I'm guessing we probably won't make it to his random mountain before he moves again, so, where he goes next is the real question.

Do we know where Aurene has been hanging out lately? I don't think there's been any mention of her returning to Tarir since the end of PoF. Has she just been milling about Elona watching from afar and waiting to swoop in and help?

[worlds biggest losers.4230]

Aurene's been helping us and our allies continuously in LS4, so I guess she follows the commander from a distance. @Arden.7480 It would be pretty sweet if we became some kinda magical replacement for the dragons w/ Aurene, seeing how Glint's plan required both one of her scions and a champion to work together.

As for Joko- I hope that it's at least the Real Joko. I just want to kill him once and for all. In a horrible fashion.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

Not necessarily theorizing... but here is what I want to see:

• Cooperate with Joko again, just like in GW1, for some epic undead vs. branded. I don't want to defeat and kill Joko. I want to see this guy keep his reigns and maintain that awkward and questionable hold in Elona.
• Sky battle against Kralkatorrik where we get to fly on Aurene like a griffon mount, but only Aurene is able to "Actually fly" instead of glide. I want awesome aerial combat skills and a truly difficult battle against the elder dragon. Then after the content is released, I want to see an Aurene griffon skin in the gem shop.
• Next expansion is underwater? This is true? It is confirmed right? If that is really happening, I think it would be hilarious to find out that Quaggans were dragon minions. I want an underwater shark mount and Quaggans as a playable race!

[Jimbru.6014]

@"Overlord RainyDay.2084" said:

Do we know where Aurene has been hanging out lately? I don't think there's been any mention of her returning to Tarir since the end of PoF. Has she just been milling about Elona watching from afar and waiting to swoop in and help?

At the end of the "Precocious Aurene" episode in LS3, you get the Exalted Portal Stone item, which teleports you to a personal instance of the egg chamber in Tarir. Aurene is there, and you can play with her and complete some achievements associated with her. I presume that's where she hangs out when she's not out actively following the Commander around.

[norbes.3620]

Even for a flying dragon that's Not "just around the corner"I agree with the hanging out in elona PoV

[Aaron Ansari.1604]

@Jimbru.6014 said:

@"Overlord RainyDay.2084" said:

Do we know where Aurene has been hanging out lately? I don't think there's been any mention of her returning to Tarir since the end of PoF. Has she just been milling about Elona watching from afar and waiting to swoop in and help?

At the end of the "Precocious Aurene" episode in LS3, you get the Exalted Portal Stone item, which teleports you to a personal instance of the egg chamber in Tarir. Aurene is there, and you can play with her and complete some achievements associated with her. I presume that's where she hangs out when she's not out actively following the Commander around.

Did they update her model there? If so, that's proof that the timeline's current; if not, if she's still a baby, then the instance is set in the past.

EDIT: Checked on my main, and yeah, that's still the baby model.

[MudkipLover.3792]

@"perilisk.1874" said:

6. The next expansion takes place somewhere between Cantha, the Jade Sea, and the deep ocean. A new solid ocean has been created by Branding magic, but there's still a lot of actual water as well.

YES YES YES WE NEED TO GO TO CANTHA!!! Gonna be interesting to see what's happened down there in the 250+ years since we last saw it. Maybe even have the Tengu FINALLY become a playable race (I WANT TO RUN AROUND AS A FAKING TENGU SOOO BADLY!!! xD). I also think that we're gonna have the make the decision of how to deal with the elder dragons, either put them back to sleep, find a way to kill em without faking with Tyria or find something to replace them in the magic cycle. As for Phlunt, I would love for us to sick Aurene on him and see him run away like the coward he is!!! As for Joko, its a 50/50 chance that its actually him. He was bound in the Realm of the Lost with Basketzar's power, and since we killed him, its very possible that spell was broken the moment he bit the dust. Only time will tell though.

[Trejgon.9367]

@Overlord RainyDay.2084 said:I think Joko's plans will be foiled in the LW Probably with some kind of final battle with him in Kourna, maybe at the fortress of Jahai.

downing joko for good at the Jahai bluffs has a poetic rign to it - I like that

[Jimbru.6014]

@"norbes.3620" said:Even for a flying dragon that's Not "just around the corner"I agree with the hanging out in elona PoV

She drops change into the waypoint vending machines just like the rest of us. ;)

[Cristalyan.5728]

@"Jimbru.6014" said:Making this post mostly to record my own thoughts on the present game, to see how right I am in the future. Warning: SPOILERS! If you haven't played up through the current game story content, you might want to stop now.

1. "Joko" in the LS4 story line isn't the real Joko, and the REAL Joko comes back and kicks his cabbage, creating a hugely awkward moment for everyone when the villain saves Tyria.

This remembers me the "Lazarus" episode: I'm the resurrected Lazarus for now, but you know, Lazarus is dead so I'm Balthazar. And OH!. Lazarus is dead but he is resurrected also, but only to be killed?!?! again by his mentally unbalanced foes (The Shiny Blades).

2. Kralkatorrik at this point is a mega monster restrained only by writer fiat. He was already so big that the Charr mistook his back for a mountain range, which implies that he's pretty much immune to any "normal" amount of force. Now that he's supercharged with the powers of Zhaitan, Mordremoth, and Balthazar, he probably could just fly in circles and turn the whole world into one giant Brand if he felt like it, and there's not much anyone could do about it. But that's not going to stop Rytlock from getting killed trying, and I REALLY don't want to see that happen. We've lost too many heroes already. :(

The point where Kralky was brought by the story team may indeed be a problem. The most obvious way of solving this is to make Aurene strong enough to absorb his energy. But without careful planning, the story team may turn this into another "Miracle ex machina" thing. No matter what happens, the point 6) - Aurene eats Phlunt is excellent :-).

3. Rox goes native with the Olmakhan, which may or may not remove her from Dragon's Watch.

4. Taimi takes a hint from Blish and turns herself into a golem, to be relieved of her disease and physical limitations. Taimi + Scruffy 2.0 = Taimi 1.0. "My old body was just the beta version."

I still believe that the story team missed a good opportunity to cure Taimi by letting the episode with the research of the "chack organ" in HoT to pass without a notable result. Taimi could try to use a "transplant" of chack cells in order to cure his condition using ley energy.Turning into a golem is a grotesque solution in my opinion.

[Castigator.3470]

@"Cristalyan.5728" said:I still believe that the story team missed a good opportunity to cure Taimi by letting the episode with the research of the "chack organ" in HoT to pass without a notable result. Taimi could try to use a "transplant" of chack cells in order to cure his condition using ley energy.Turning into a golem is a grotesque solution in my opinion.

This is amazing: She may actually be able to cure herself with the chak organ and a steady influx of ley line magic, as the thing can be used to filter restorative magic and transfer it to Taimi's body. This is very convenient right now, as the current lack of two elder dragons has overloaded the world with magic, to the point that the commander was able to see magic manifestations. Anomalies were running amok and Bloodstone Crazed monsters appear in remote places like the Sandswept Isles.Any magical process she might use to heal herself is currently at its most potent. Well, any more potent magic and we risk losing Tyria to the Mists.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@Overlord RainyDay.2084 said:Do we know where Aurene has been hanging out lately? I don't think there's been any mention of her returning to Tarir since the end of PoF. Has she just been milling about Elona watching from afar and waiting to swoop in and help?

On Istam meta, shes randomly cames to help, firing some energy on the ground.

[Tyson.5160]

I want Cantha as well, to see familiar places like the crystal desert and Elona has been a real treat. That being said, I want the charr homelands and far shiver peaks as well so afterwards we can see uncharted areas that we haven’t seen in any CW game.