Griffon is useless after getting Skyscale

[Xstein.2187]

@Vayne.8563 said:

@"Xstein.2187" said:

So, what situation is "Gliding" better at then?

There is little difference between trivializing armor in other mmos vs trivializing masteries in gw2.The only question is, how will they achieve trivializing all the current mounts in the next expansion?

There are places you can glide where mounts are disabled. I'd consider that a win. lol

You missed the mark. I admitted I was wrong and that gliding has its uses already multiple days ago.

However, on a second note (not necessarily directed at you or anyone in particular), I am really starting to think based on this thread that people in this community are being awfully biased.A lot of people think gliding and mounts are equally valid and useful? fine.

However, then why would @Zephyr.5382 comment about buffing gliding get so much support?This doesn't make a lick of sense

I'm starting to think that if someone says that mounts are more useful than gliding, a lot of people just assume that that person wants mounts nerfed. However, if someone says they want gliding buffed, they are perfectly fine with it?

How can this be? If you think gliding is just as useful as mounts, you shouldn't want gliding buffed either!

Perhaps I barked up the wrong tree and could be wrong, but based on this thread, this community is confusing to me and currently seems awfully biased towards being pro buff/anti nerf, even if it entails disregarding their stance to the actual question being asked.Which would make sense anyway if you spent a lot of time and gold collecting something.

[Vayne.8563]

@Xstein.2187 said:

@Vayne.8563 said:

@Xstein.2187 said:

So, what situation is "Gliding" better at then?

There is little difference between trivializing armor in other mmos vs trivializing masteries in gw2.The only question is, how will they achieve trivializing all the current mounts in the next expansion?

There are places you can glide where mounts are disabled. I'd consider that a win. lol

You missed the mark. I admitted I was wrong and that gliding has its uses already multiple days ago.

However, on a second note (not necessarily directed at you or anyone in particular), I am really starting to think based on this thread that people in this community are being awfully biased.A lot of people think gliding and mounts are equally valid and useful? fine.

However, then why would @Zephyr.5382 comment about buffing gliding get so much support?This doesn't make a lick of sense

I'm starting to think that if someone says that mounts are more useful than gliding, a lot of people just assume that that person wants mounts nerfed. However, if someone says they want gliding buffed, they are perfectly fine with it?

How can this be? If you think gliding is just as useful as mounts, you shouldn't want gliding buffed either!

Perhaps I barked up the wrong tree and could be wrong, but based on this thread, this community is confusing to me and currently seems awfully biased towards being pro buff/anti nerf, even if it entails disregarding their stance to the actual question being asked.Which would make sense anyway if you spent a lot of time and gold collecting something.

Gliding servers a purpose and mounts serve a purpose. I have nothing against gliding being buffed. However, if you ask ANY group of people randomly should something be buffed, you're inevitably going to get a lot of support for it, because people like buffs. You'll always here about more people wanting a profession buffed than nerfed. The exception of course is when you're talking about other people. Mesmers should be nerfed in PvP because I'm not a mesmer and they kill me.

With gliding it's not competitive. With mounts we're not competing. So the number of people who want buffs is going to outnumber the people who want nerfs, because that's human nature. We want more. We're generally greedy. We want our toys. Taking away something we already have feels bad. Giving us something we don't have now feels good. Are you really surprised that received support.

Gliding by itself is not powerful, but in the zones it's meant to be used in like HoT zones, it's very powerful, particularly when you add updrafts and leylines into the mix. Then it's powerful. I spend far more time gliding in Bloodstone Fen, a season 3 zone designed for gliding, than I do mounted. I get aerial combat there. It really is conditional.

Gliding does exactly what it's supposed to do. Mounts do what they're supposed to do. Mounts are generally over all more useful, but having to dismount my griffon to try to catch an updraft only to mount it again is more work than just gliding in Bloodstone Fen. It all depends on what you're trying to do and where.

[Nokomis.5076]

Are there really any places you need or even allowed to reach (invisible walls..) where the Skyscale is more useful than the Springer? I think, the Springer is faster to be used, and with the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bond_of_Faith you can reach an additional height. And even if that is not enough, you still can mount your Griffon (or Skyscale...) midair in case, you're missing just a little bit of height.

But then again, this comes from me, who uses Jackal as default mount while on ground, whereas most others seem to prefer the (in average) slower Raptor :Dhttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Movement_Speed#Mounts

[draxynnic.3719]

The Jackal's base speed is higher, but I think the raptor leap gets it a bit further than the jackal, at least in race-like environments (particularly when using the faster energy regen skill) where beetles aren't practical. They're pretty close to one another, though - I suspect it's as much because the raptor is seen as having a better engage skill.

[Sojourner.4621]

@draxynnic.3719 said:The Jackal's base speed is higher, but I think the raptor leap gets it a bit further than the jackal, at least in race-like environments (particularly when using the faster energy regen skill) where beetles aren't practical. They're pretty close to one another, though - I suspect it's as much because the raptor is seen as having a better engage skill.

Basically, when you account for the movement skill, the canyon jump being a fast accelerate over 2.5x the distance of a jackal leap causes the raptor to outpace the jackal over flat or downhill terrain. However most terrain isn't flat, and is at least half uphill which does kinda make the jackal better.

[NaramSin.2693]

@Vayne.8563 said:There are places you can glide where mounts are disabled.

And this is one of the most stupid nonsense of this game, I can't imagine they waste time, money and effort to code how to disable mounts near ALL the JP instead to Fix the pletora of bugs that affect this great game.

[Tarlonniel.6534]

@NaramSin.2693 said:I can't imagine they waste time, money and effort to code how to disable mounts near ALL the JP instead to Fix the pletora of bugs that affect this great game.

First, because it's part of their design philosophy to encourage co-operative play. If skipping a JP meant just getting on a mount instead of teaming up with someone (either a mesmer or using teleport to friend), it would go against their vision for the game. Plus, even portal/teleporting requires at least one person to have done the puzzle legitimately.

Second, because there seems to be a large - or at least vocal - group of people who'd get royally pissed off if you could skip JPs that way.

[Vayne.8563]

@NaramSin.2693 said:

@Vayne.8563 said:There are places you can glide where mounts are disabled.

And this is one of the most stupid nonsense of this game, I can't imagine they waste time, money and effort to code how to disable mounts near ALL the JP instead to Fix the pletora of bugs that affect this great game.

Stupid nonsense? Some people would enjoy JPs and would probably never know how they were meant to be done if they could just mount through them. I'm one of the people who think JPs are some of the best content this game has to offer. I would do them as intended even if mounts were allowed. This is a logical thing to do to preserve the integrity of a form of content some people like.

As for bugs, there are bugs fixed all the time. There are just more bugs than time.

[gateless gate.8406]

We may have entered the period of continuous and unsustainable "jumping the shark" moments.

Do you think it's a coincidence that GW2 releases a dragon mount at the exact same time that one of their competitors starts bragging about adding dragons to their game? I'm sure ANet executives gave the order to do so, and I wouldn't be surprised that the reason they recycled the Griffon animations twice in the span of just a few months (first with WvW mount, then with Skyscale) was because they were given a strict timeframe to respond to that competitor.

Anyway, as others have said in the thread, will the next mount make the Skyscale obsolete? And what about the mount after that? The Skyscale does make the Griffon, the previous "prestige" mount, generally obsolete in 99% of everyday activities.

[hostileskeleton.7364]

@draxynnic.3719 said:Generally speaking, they're outclassed by raptors and flying mounts.

I use the jackal all the time. Jackal is much more reliable when dodging enemies or crossing uneven terrain in a short amount of time. Raptor definitely smokes Jackal when on flat terrain or on a downward slope but Raptor just can't keep up with Jackal in most situations especially with only 2 leaps. Of the 4 mounts that always suffer from fall damage, Raptor is the weakest (don't really know about Warclaw so I could be wrong). Griffon, Skyscale, and Skimmer will never take fall damage (aside from Skimmer being dismounted when it hits water from too high. real strange). Jackal should never take fall damage if you know how to ride it. Personally I find myself struggling to find use for the Raptor in most situations because of how much more use I get out of Jackal/Griffon. The fact that I am not limited by a vertical drop on Jackal when compared to Raptor makes all the difference. This is coming from a big dinosaur nerd who was thrilled to receive my own personal Raptor. It was my favorite mount until Griffon came along but even so, I would argue Raptor still has the best engage skill.

As far as the Griffon vs. Skyscale debate goes, in terms of what I've seen, it's like arguing apples and oranges. Yeah they're both flying mounts but their uses are intended to be completely different, so grading them on the same scale is just ignorant. Grading any mount as if it were supposed to be as good as any other for their unique mobility is ignorant. Yes Skyscale is better at covering short distances immediately but that was never the appeal of the Griffon. It's like saying a fighter jet is a shit aircraft because it can't take off vertically like a helicopter. Aside from that why does it even matter which one you think is better if you don't use it? I don't have a Warclaw yet but I will definitely be trying WvW soon to get it. Not because I think it's better than any of the others but because it's unique and I like it. I always wanted ANet to add a feline mount and while this isn't really how I imagined it, I still want it. That's why everyone uses the mounts they choose. They like them. In my opinion, no mount deserves to be changed aside from possibly Springer to buff it's max height but I'm sure that has consequences I'm not big enough to see. In short, you don't like them and that's okay but making the claim that they are useless now is a little overzealous.

[draxynnic.3719]

Personally, I find that in most terrains that you wouldn't just fly over, you can usually find points to jump from that maximise the raptor's leap (including for getting past mobs). The longer distance makes up for having less of them.

Broadly speaking, though, we could probably find specific situations where one just edges out the other, but the truth is that they largely perform much the same role and are close enough that most players will just pick one: it's not worth the effort to think through those situations, and generally even less worth it to switch between them when you're already on one. They're close enough that even if people disagree on which, most people will probably find that they almost always use one in favour of the other.

Griffon and skyscale, on the other hand, are both flying mounts, but are very different in their roles.

[kratan.4619]

There is no better. Every person on here is just giving their opinion on the different mounts. It is only what you personally like to use, as far as functionality you like better.

[Dreams.3128]

Lol the griffon is not useless tho.

I'm using it all the time and have zero desire to ever get the Skyscale mount. No point. Having a half lion, half bird creature mastered is much more of an achievement to me than having some mount that flies like a literal helicopter.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@"gateless gate.8406" said:We may have entered the period of continuous and unsustainable "jumping the shark" moments.

Do you think it's a coincidence that GW2 releases a dragon mount at the exact same time that one of their competitors starts bragging about adding dragons to their game? I'm sure ANet executives gave the order to do so, and I wouldn't be surprised that the reason they recycled the Griffon animations twice in the span of just a few months (first with WvW mount, then with Skyscale) was because they were given a strict timeframe to respond to that competitor.

C'mon now, do you seriously mean that while you're riding the Skyscale, you're thinking to yourself "man, this feels just like a Gryphon"?

I don't see it myself. I could care less if they re-used the same mesh for Warclaw and Skyscale, because to my eyes, they all move and feel different. Now maybe I'm just not seeing it, but I'm also not bothering to look too deeply either..

[Tiviana.2650]

I dont have either yet, and i wouldnt be going for griffon had i not got 2 dang griffon skins back to back out of adoption licenses. But i think im going to like the griffon more, its cute and it chirps.

[Vancho.8750]

@Sojourner.4621 said:

@draxynnic.3719 said:The Jackal's base speed is higher, but I think the raptor leap gets it a bit further than the jackal, at least in race-like environments (particularly when using the faster energy regen skill) where beetles aren't practical. They're pretty close to one another, though - I suspect it's as much because the raptor is seen as having a better engage skill.

Basically, when you account for the movement skill, the canyon jump being a fast accelerate over 2.5x the distance of a jackal leap causes the raptor to outpace the jackal over flat or downhill terrain. However most terrain isn't flat, and is at least half uphill which does kinda make the jackal better.Mind break time without the leaps the springer is faster then the raptor and the jackal if you bunny hop.

[Nezekan.2671]

If you need gold, you can skip Griffon for as long as you like if you got Skyscale. There are certainly situations where Griffon shines, so its not "useless".

However if you don't spend gold in getting Skyscale and wait 22 days, then you can save that 250 gold for something else and get Griffon whenever you have excess gold.

[LucianDK.8615]

Personally I use the Skyscale a lot more now over the Griffon. The Griffon just shines in different, but far rarer situations, instead of being the single choice at all. Skyscale is just far more generally useable. But yes, griffon have its niche uses.

[Cobrakon.3108]

Depending on what type of player you are, yes, you can totally skip using griffon all the time. However, if you're the type that likes to be as efficient as possible then you will undoubtedly be switching to griffon on numerous occasions.