Nerf grenades, explosive entrance and sword damage on holosmith

[Pengu.7481]

@Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:On renegade if you go for 25 might trait's then you get so fragile to condis and any other damage. As holosmith, you get 25 might you go god mode, shield, mobility, stealth, exlixir for few sec invulnerablity etc it just needs to have weakness. It is ok for it to have 25 might but then block many defensive options from its kit. So its fix should be either damage cut off or allowed damage but defenses cut off or third option is to make its overheat damage and effect stronger in order to punish its oppresivness.

So any build that has the potential to kill your stupid bunker build needs a nerf. I hate when others dismiss suggestions based on what the OP is playing, but knowing the full context here, that's exactly what I'm going to do: all you do is play kalla/jalis bunker in the game, and all you do on forums is crying to nerf anything that even remotely counters your build.I can go play anything with similar offensive capability and end up either winning or losing a duel against them, and the outcome is based mostly on skill. The build may be overperforming(it might, I'd like to see some more proof though), but the fact that it can kill your bunker build is irrelevant at best. If anything this game needs bunker killers to prevent the return of the worst meta we ever had.

First of all, there are many players who agreed that holosmith does too much damage at the moment, that is why i made this thread because i think the same with them :)Second thing, as you can see there are same/similar threads about this which proves it is not just me. Third thing there is condi rev, condi thief and few other things that you can see on this forum, hopefully devs gonna fix condi thief too, less things for you to abuse ;)

Holo got nerf before because of similar reason which is its opressivness without weaknesses. As i remember very well, sword damage didn't get nerf on big balance patch,

i tested it and i could one shot reaper with 2,3 and 150% heat.

Not just that trait for extended heat levels directly boosts sword effects but also adds might to it and seems like it scales so well with power. There just should be big smart choice in traits instead of picking the best stuff. Hopefully devs rework some engy traits and change their positions if not nerfing its damage/defenses.i actually logged in because of that highlighted statement alone , u got me excited about omega dmg from swords when it clearly cant 1 shot anything other than wet tissue paper. pls stop fake news mate .edit: yea i was at 140 heat and popped all my elixirs and 20+ might / zerk scholar crit etc etc u get what i mean

[UNOwen.7132]

@viquing.8254 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:Youre joking right? We already have the overall damage being so low that no one dies without being outnumbered, and the sidenoder meta is knocking back to decap, and you want to

nerf

damage further? What a joke.

Holo has low dmg ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????No one dies to Holo ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I wanna buy this game, where do I find it?

Youre playing it, its called GW2. Why do you think the sidenoder meta is knockbacks?

If u are that holo, you r bad, not the class. The build is the most OP atm.

Its strong, but its strong because its unkillable and can knock people off of the point to decap. And when outnumbering it kills faster. But in a 1v1, no half-decent player should

ever

be downed by a Holo.

Play power mesmer/mirage then show me how you don't die to a holo please, I want to learn.

Sadly the gap between meta and non-meta builds is too wide, so Im not sure if thats going to be doable. But thats the result of lowering diversity and widening the gap, yknow?

[viquing.8254]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:Youre joking right? We already have the overall damage being so low that no one dies without being outnumbered, and the sidenoder meta is knocking back to decap, and you want to

nerf

damage further? What a joke.

Holo has low dmg ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????No one dies to Holo ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I wanna buy this game, where do I find it?

Youre playing it, its called GW2. Why do you think the sidenoder meta is knockbacks?

If u are that holo, you r bad, not the class. The build is the most OP atm.

Its strong, but its strong because its unkillable and can knock people off of the point to decap. And when outnumbering it kills faster. But in a 1v1, no half-decent player should

ever

be downed by a Holo.

Play power mesmer/mirage then show me how you don't die to a holo please, I want to learn.

Sadly the gap between meta and non-meta builds is too wide, so Im not sure if thats going to be doable. But thats the result of lowering diversity and widening the gap, yknow?

In this use case, that's exaclty the same situation as before : you have one bursty spec facing another bursty spec AND one of them has more tools/pressure than the other. <3

[UNOwen.7132]

@viquing.8254 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@anjo.6143 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:Youre joking right? We already have the overall damage being so low that no one dies without being outnumbered, and the sidenoder meta is knocking back to decap, and you want to

nerf

damage further? What a joke.

Holo has low dmg ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????No one dies to Holo ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I wanna buy this game, where do I find it?

Youre playing it, its called GW2. Why do you think the sidenoder meta is knockbacks?

If u are that holo, you r bad, not the class. The build is the most OP atm.

Its strong, but its strong because its unkillable and can knock people off of the point to decap. And when outnumbering it kills faster. But in a 1v1, no half-decent player should

ever

be downed by a Holo.

Play power mesmer/mirage then show me how you don't die to a holo please, I want to learn.

Sadly the gap between meta and non-meta builds is too wide, so Im not sure if thats going to be doable. But thats the result of lowering diversity and widening the gap, yknow?

In this use case, that's exaclty the same situation as before : you have one bursty spec facing another bursty spec AND one of them has more tools/pressure than the other. <3

No, before the matchup wouldve been far more even. The gap got a lot wider as a result of the diversity killing february patch.

[viquing.8254]

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

In this use case, that's exaclty the same situation as before : you have one bursty spec facing another bursty spec AND one of them has more tools/pressure than the other. <3

No, before the matchup wouldve been far more even. The gap got a lot wider as a result of the diversity killing february patch.

How can the gap get wider on a duel versus two bursty spec if damage were lowered ?Maybe somethink more about class spec nerf than damage reduction no ?Btw I have high doubt that you ever faced holo with a power mes prepatch ¯_(ツ)_/¯ .

[UNOwen.7132]

@viquing.8254 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

In this use case, that's exaclty the same situation as before : you have one bursty spec facing another bursty spec AND one of them has more tools/pressure than the other. <3

No, before the matchup wouldve been far more even. The gap got a lot wider as a result of the diversity killing february patch.

How can the gap get wider on a duel versus two bursty spec if damage were lowered ?

Not all damage was lowered equally. Not all burst specs have the same design. Not exactly difficult, is it?

Maybe somethink more about class spec nerf than damage reduction no ?

Nope.

Btw I have high doubt that you ever faced holo with a power mes prepatch ¯_(ツ)_/¯ .

A few times. Much more beatable than it is right now.

[Entropo.1524]

The class, and build specifically, is most def NOT lacking in condition cleanse. You want a class lacking in condi cleanse? Weaver, especially LR weaver.

are u acctualy serious saying weaver lacks condi cleans ?

[Master Ketsu.4569]

@Shiyo.3578 said:and if you do get them low they can just run away and full heal then re-engage whenever they want because for some reason they have superspeed AND stealth?

BUt sTeALth Is usELesS iN cOmBAt DuRuuuRRRRrrrrrRrR

[Shiyo.3578]

That's some mental gymnastics and deflecting(what? no this other spec is op too!!) to defend the fact your alchemy trait line goes against the entire design philosophy of the feb mega balance update.

Notice how most of those are condi only dmg + defensive, while alchemy is might(all damage)?

But engineers have always defended their class, even when turret engineer was a thing.

[choovanski.5462]

@Shiyo.3578 said:That's some mental gymnastics and deflecting(what? no this other spec is op too!!) to defend the fact your alchemy trait line goes against the entire design philosophy of the feb mega balance update.

Notice how most of those are condi only dmg + defensive, while alchemy is might(all damage)?

But engineers have always defended their class, even when turret engineer was a thing.

the might isn't even predominantly coming from alchemy, so nerfing that is just going to cuck core and scrapper and holo will still be able to stack a ton of might.

that's because it has Enhanced Capacity Storage Unit, which does this

Increases maximum heat capacity. While above 100% heat, periodically gain might. Some skills and traits gain additional heat tiers.

Interval: 1 secondCombat Only— In-game description

simply nerfing the might application on this trait is enough to impede the might stacking holo can do passively. there are also many ways to nerf it, both by adjusting the number of might applied and the rate it's applied at. nerfing this will seriously hurt holo, and only holo. all other engineer builds will be fine.

I would seriously suggest actually looking at the offending traitline and the holo spec itself for nerf if it's the only type of engineer that's over-performing. the problems are not in the alchemy line, I assure you.

as for suggesting that alchemy, the boon support line for engineer shouldn't have the boon might in it, idk man. the lines about boons, it's gonna have boons, nothing weird about that.

[Kodama.6453]

@"Shiyo.3578" said:That's some mental gymnastics and deflecting(what? no this other spec is op too!!) to defend the fact your alchemy trait line goes against the entire design philosophy of the feb mega balance update.

Notice how most of those are condi only dmg + defensive, while alchemy is might(all damage)?

But engineers have always defended their class, even when turret engineer was a thing.

You are claiming that HGH is OP, since it provides might share in a supportive/defensive trait line.Druid literally has the same thing. You just use your celestial avatar skills instead of elixirs (which means that the engineer actually has to invest utility slots for elixirs, while druid gets the might from a spec mechanic, meaning no further investment needed).

If you really think that it is their design philosophy that a trait line should not provide both defense and offense, then I don't get why you think it is "mental gymnastics" if I point out that there are tons of specialisations that break that "rule" (I actually doubt that Anet considers this to be a hard design rule).

And there are still many specialisations which also provide defense + damage boosts for both damage types.Earth - gaining condition damage, several bleed sources, has a trait that increases power damage against bleeding foes, defense is self explanatoryArcane - gaining might on attune swap, restoring health on attune swap, getting vigor, etcValor - gaining might for blocking attacks, several heal mechanics, protection and other defensive stuffTactics - gaining might on burst skills, healing for granting allies might, gaining resistance, shake it off, etc.

I can go on with that. There are quite alot of specialisations which provide offense for both damage types while also giving defense.Instead of just writing that off again with "engineers have always defended their class", can you please provide an argument why you think HGH in particular is problematic, while all the other trait lines which do the same thing (providing might while granting defense on other traits) are not?Especially since, as I already stated, HGH actually requires further investment by having to pick elixirs, while many other trait lines grant might for using your class mechanics.

[Poledra Val.1490]

Come on guys give Anet a break they might nerf this clearly obvious build in an increment period of 2 years possibly, you never know.

[Shiyo.3578]

Elixirs are your best utilities, that isn't an investment.

[Kodama.6453]

@Shiyo.3578 said:Elixirs are your best utilities, that isn't an investment.

Elixirs are our best utilities because gadgets and turrets both are probably some of the worst skills in the entire game.They need good buffs or reworks to make them worth taking at all.

[Shiyo.3578]

Your class isn't the only class with completely useless utilities by the way.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"Shiyo.3578" said:Your class isn't the only class with completely useless utilities by the way.

laughs in most mesmer utilities like veil disenchanter and "summon 2 clone the utility "

[Tayga.3192]

@"Leonidrex.5649" said:laughs in most mesmer utilities like veil disenchanter and "summon 2 clone the utility "

Disenchanter, if it hits, removes a lot of boons (chrono used to use this) and Veil is wvw only for some reason, same for feedback

Other bad skills would be stunbreak mantra, signet of domination and null field.

[Henrik.7560]

Holo isn't that bad quit crying, bunker renegade is worse, fb and condi rev still really strong too

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"Leonidrex.5649" said:laughs in most mesmer utilities like veil disenchanter and "summon 2 clone the utility "

Disenchanter, if it hits, removes a lot of boons (chrono used to use this) and Veil is wvw only for some reason, same for feedback

Other bad skills would be stunbreak mantra, signet of domination and null field.

I mean, if you double Disenchanters value then its preety good, 10 aoe boon rip is a alot, even its long cooldown, unreliability, long cast time and garbage damage could be overlooked since it ripped 10. with 5 its just not worth it, EVER.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Holo was ooc in stealth. Nades are fine.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:Holo was ooc in stealth. Nades are fine.

9,7k :)here is mine9570 barrage, with 3058 entrance.12,6k dmg :)

[Shiyo.3578]

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:Holo was ooc in stealth. Nades are fine.

jUsT doDgE xD

[Strider.7849]

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@"Svez Poizon XD.5268" said:On renegade if you go for 25 might trait's then you get so fragile to condis and any other damage. As holosmith, you get 25 might you go god mode, shield, mobility, stealth, exlixir for few sec invulnerablity etc it just needs to have weakness. It is ok for it to have 25 might but then block many defensive options from its kit. So its fix should be either damage cut off or allowed damage but defenses cut off or third option is to make its overheat damage and effect stronger in order to punish its oppresivness.

So any build that has the potential to kill your stupid bunker build needs a nerf. I hate when others dismiss suggestions based on what the OP is playing, but knowing the full context here, that's exactly what I'm going to do: all you do is play kalla/jalis bunker in the game, and all you do on forums is crying to nerf anything that even remotely counters your build.I can go play anything with similar offensive capability and end up either winning or losing a duel against them, and the outcome is based mostly on skill. The build may be overperforming(it might, I'd like to see some more proof though), but the fact that it can kill your bunker build is irrelevant at best. If anything this game needs bunker killers to prevent the return of the worst meta we ever had.

Wow...another salty teef.... Please, calling Renegade OP is ridiculous.

2/10, too obvious. Act less dumb and like you're adressing me in good faith next time and I'll fall for it guaranteed.

I'd rather not tilt at windmills. This subject has been discussed countless times, and you still fail to see how biased and one-sided your 'argument is....so....-shrug- See you in the arena,

Fyi one of the "salty" thief's as you put it, who said that the build was faceroll, is also the number 1 thief in PvP (consistently). You should check out his videos and you might see that perhaps you are one sided in your beliefs.

[Bazsi.2734]

@Strider.7849 said:

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@"Svez Poizon XD.5268" said:On renegade if you go for 25 might trait's then you get so fragile to condis and any other damage. As holosmith, you get 25 might you go god mode, shield, mobility, stealth, exlixir for few sec invulnerablity etc it just needs to have weakness. It is ok for it to have 25 might but then block many defensive options from its kit. So its fix should be either damage cut off or allowed damage but defenses cut off or third option is to make its overheat damage and effect stronger in order to punish its oppresivness.

So any build that has the potential to kill your stupid bunker build needs a nerf. I hate when others dismiss suggestions based on what the OP is playing, but knowing the full context here, that's exactly what I'm going to do: all you do is play kalla/jalis bunker in the game, and all you do on forums is crying to nerf anything that even remotely counters your build.I can go play anything with similar offensive capability and end up either winning or losing a duel against them, and the outcome is based mostly on skill. The build may be overperforming(it might, I'd like to see some more proof though), but the fact that it can kill your bunker build is irrelevant at best. If anything this game needs bunker killers to prevent the return of the worst meta we ever had.

Wow...another salty teef.... Please, calling Renegade OP is ridiculous.

2/10, too obvious. Act less dumb and like you're adressing me in good faith next time and I'll fall for it guaranteed.

I'd rather not tilt at windmills. This subject has been discussed countless times, and you still fail to see how biased and one-sided your 'argument is....so....-shrug- See you in the arena,

Fyi one of the "salty" thief's as you put it, who said that the build was faceroll, is also the number 1 thief in PvP (consistently). You should check out his videos and you might see that perhaps you are one sided in your beliefs.

Oh man I wish. LoL.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:Holo was ooc in stealth. Nades are fine.

you lied btw, It wasnt OOC. otherwise you would have been hit by explosive entrance :)