Rangers again

[welch.2785]

i am tired of rangers being told they are useless in WvW. if arnet does not want them in WvW then remove the abililty to join WvW. Or improve their abilities to be of use in WvW....  no group wants rangers. i am sure arnet did not design them to be kept out of groups. groups get the best and most loot, lot more social aspect to the game, and more fun experience. so please make us more useless in groups so we can join the community or make them unable to get into WvW...

[Pacificterror.7805]

Is this a really common thing? I've asked groups if they're open to join in WvW and have been sent invites without being asked my profession, experience level, etc.

 

Surely another member of the group is better than not having one for most people?

[XerMeLL.6042]

it depends on your gameplay. i prefer solo roam and my ranger is the best to ever do it.

[Danikat.8537]

Admittedly it's been a long time since I've taken my ranger into WvW (I mainly use my tempest and weaver for WvW at the moment) but things were no different when I did play a ranger in WvW, I was always hearing on the forum that no one wants rangers in groups and you'd be kicked instantly if you were playing a ranger.

 

But if that ever happened to me they were very secretive about it (which would be stupid, because then they couldn't ask me to swap characters). The only reasons I wasn't able to join a group were if they were full, it was a guild group or a dedicated 'raid' or havoc squad which wasn't open to any new members or very occasionally because they required everyone to use voice chat and I wasn't able to at the time. No one ever said they're not taking rangers.

 

Maybe Desolation is just different (only server I've ever played WvW on, so I don't know how others are, except the ones we'd linked with). But it seems more likely that it's the same situation as when I was told rangers are not accepted into any groups for dungeons, Fractals, raids, Mad Kings Labyrinth or basically anything else. Some people just get stuck on not liking rangers and are very, very vocal about it but most don't actually care, or are able to articulate their concerns more clearly and find a more sensible solution, like "it's important no one uses knockbacks" or "we need these specific buffs" or whatever and then everyone can adjust to meet the requirements.

[SoullessOne.1289]

Rangers are cool and don't let anyone tell you different - Go Solo.  Don't listen to other people and do your own thing. You can still follow the a zerg and make them your meat shields 😄 while you pick off the kills 

 

I agree 100% lets Buff this class 😄 😄 😄 

[anduriell.6280]

59 minutes ago, SoullessOne.1289 said:

Rangers are cool and don't let anyone tell you different - Go Solo.  Don't listen to other people and do your own thing. You can still follow the a zerg and make them your meat shields 😄 while you pick off the kills 

 

I agree 100% lets Buff this class 😄 😄 😄 

I think the op is complaining that no group wants the ranger, so my guess is going solo is not an option. 

 

Also about using the zerg as meat shield, if you are not in the party you will not benefit from boons or heals from the squad.

 

The fact that all projectiles are getting base piercing makes that other players will not protect you from most attacks.

 

The reflection uptime creep makes most of ranger's weapons useless, the lack of reliable unblockable access makes the issue even worst. 

 

The application creep in superspeed also makes very difficult to apply constant damage at range, they can close up really fast, trying to channel a barrage is a death sentence now, that's why the Dragon hunter Hunter's_Ward got buffed to a reduced no-rooting channelling time of 1 second for example. 

 

This applicable even for small groups. 

 

So as resume this last patch really pushed the ranger to have a very hard time in WvW adn impossible to be accepted in an squad. The higher the Tier of the server the less solo roaming you will be able to do as well. So i can understand a T5 link not to have much trouble to roam around but a ranger in a T1 link would have a very unfun time. 

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Run Druid and use immobs during the portal bomb.

[Dami.5046]

After my experience, it's not about being a ranger or a necro or a thief, it's about trolling, plain and simple. Add in sites like Meta battle 'to back it up'  and the fact anet just nerf them, then people have a field day. 

I posted in another thread about the nerfing of the 'immob' build . It doesn't make much difference, people for their own benefit only look at the 'meta' builds. 

For the sake of the argument, it's not what you do it's who you know and i certainly know of rangers who have no issues getting in squads. 

No class should be exempt from any content but nothing is done about it.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Dami.5046

[Dami.5046]

11 hours ago, Pacificterror.7805 said:

Is this a really common thing? I've asked groups if they're open to join in WvW and have been sent invites without being asked my profession, experience level, etc.

 

Surely another member of the group is better than not having one for most people?

oh it is. I get the same kitten with reaper. I think Damage is a dirty word.

[joneirikb.7506]

Rangers are great in wvw, just not at what you want it to be great at.

 

They're one of the best roamer classes. And it's a class that for the most part doesn't actually need the buffs/bonuses from a zerg, since it's quite self dependent. They have no weapons that work well with zerg play, where the bows are a liability more than an advantage due to reflect. Rangers can also work excellent by just staying near zergs, and pick of stragglers, aim for everyone outside the actual zerg, locate weak links and pick them off.

 

But for Zerg play, not really. You can find groups that doesn't care what you run, and you might enjoy that but at that point expect the entire zerg to wipe to any group of near similar size. Ranger just doesn't benefit much fromb eing in a zerg squad, and the zerg squad doesn't really benefit at all from having the ranger inside it, rather than just running next to it.

 

But to flat out ban so rangers can't get into wvw would flat out deny anyone to roam on ranger, where it is bloody excellent. Probably only second to thief. Basically, the way the ranger is designed/works, you're trying to force a square block through a round hole.

[Dami.5046]

4 minutes ago, joneirikb.7506 said:

Rangers are great in wvw, just not at what you want it to be great at.

 

They're one of the best roamer classes. And it's a class that for the most part doesn't actually need the buffs/bonuses from a zerg, since it's quite self dependent. They have no weapons that work well with zerg play, where the bows are a liability more than an advantage due to reflect. Rangers can also work excellent by just staying near zergs, and pick of stragglers, aim for everyone outside the actual zerg, locate weak links and pick them off.

 

But for Zerg play, not really. You can find groups that doesn't care what you run, and you might enjoy that but at that point expect the entire zerg to wipe to any group of near similar size. Ranger just doesn't benefit much fromb eing in a zerg squad, and the zerg squad doesn't really benefit at all from having the ranger inside it, rather than just running next to it.

 

But to flat out ban so rangers can't get into wvw would flat out deny anyone to roam on ranger, where it is bloody excellent. Probably only second to thief. Basically, the way the ranger is designed/works, you're trying to force a square block through a round hole.

It wouldn't be a ranger thread without this generic response. 

[Voltekka.2375]

L2p issue. Thats it.

[Dami.5046]

7 minutes ago, Voltekka.2375 said:

L2p issue. Thats it.

Since you will ignore me, i do love you💗

[maddoctor.2738]

I haven't played WvW in quite a while, but from back in the day, the  reason many players hated Rangers was because of the pet as it was a "free" epidemic. Apply conditions on a pet that can't do much to defend itself, use epidemic, wipe a whole group. When conditions were overused everywhere that was an issue. I thought that the merging of Soulbeasts solved that "problem", although you did have to roll a Soulbeast to use merging. That and the annoying Longbow 4 push, are the two reasons for hating Rangers, I don't think their kit is weak or "useless" in WVW otherwise.

[anduriell.6280]

2 minutes ago, maddoctor.2738 said:

I haven't played WvW in quite a while, but from back in the day, the  reason many players hated Rangers was because of the pet as it was a "free" epidemic. Apply conditions on a pet that can't do much to defend itself, use epidemic, wipe a whole group. When conditions were overused everywhere that was an issue. I thought that the merging of Soulbeasts solved that "problem", although you did have to roll a Soulbeast to use merging. That and the annoying Longbow 4 push, are the two reasons for hating Rangers, I don't think their kit is weak or "useless" in WVW otherwise.

Once the soulbeast come out then the zerg realized the reflected projectiles from the ranger (longbow, shortbow, Axe mainhand, Torch offhand, Axe offhand, Dagger offhand) can do a lot of damage to friendlies. 

And because Soulbeast and Auramancer came almost at the same time the reflection creep got out of hand. Who doesn't die to a reflected rapid fire from a friendly soulbeast. 

 

Also ranger does not bring anything else to the squad, the unique mechanics from Druid and Ranger are so nerfed they mean nothing in squad combat. 

 

[welch.2785]

well let me correct one thing i said.. i do get in squads, but entire time you hear how worthless you are and almost all groups put all rangers in one group with no healer or anything...  also my ideal to ban them was only to let arnet know we need help to be competitive in all areas. look almost every character has two elite skills they can choose and one of them is always super in WvW.. all that is except rangers.. they medium use at best in both.   they do the least amount of damage ,yet think for a second. in real life you hit by an arrow you are out. with armor on you can take multiple hits by most weapons.  so ranger should do as much or more damage as anyone else in this game.  why should we be stuck on edge picking off players already injured by others. let us have a choice to join main battle if we choose....  that is not asking too much

 

[Dami.5046]

5 minutes ago, welch.2785 said:

well let me correct one thing i said.. i do get in squads, but entire time you hear how worthless you are and almost all groups put all rangers in one group with no healer or anything...  also my ideal to ban them was only to let arnet know we need help to be competitive in all areas. look almost every character has two elite skills they can choose and one of them is always super in WvW.. all that is except rangers.. they medium use at best in both.   they do the least amount of damage ,yet think for a second. in real life you hit by an arrow you are out. with armor on you can take multiple hits by most weapons.  so ranger should do as much or more damage as anyone else in this game.  why should we be stuck on edge picking off players already injured by others. let us have a choice to join main battle if we choose....  that is not asking too much

 

Like I said it's pure trolling. 

I have had this with my ranger and my necro. Take a look at you tube.. there are squads with rangers in, squads that put reapers in with real parties.

unless Anet do something it isn't going to change.

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by Dami.5046

[anduriell.6280]

46 minutes ago, Dami.5046 said:

Like I said it's pure trolling. 

I have had this with my ranger and my necro. Take a look at you tube.. there are squads with rangers in, squads that put reapers in with real parties.

unless Anet do something it isn't going to change.

 

Reaper is meta from very long time from the nerf to scourge's Sand_Savant, we should not be comparing. 

 

It does not matter if what the other players say is trolling or not, the fact is ranger is not wanted in WvW and it is the first to go as soon as the squad fills up. They tolerate the class for as long as the spot is not contested by any other class. 

 

Also wvw guilds announcements discriminate against rangers, they will not want any ranger main if they don't denounce the class while playing guild raids. The thing is it wasn't that bad before all the nerfs done during those years. Ranger used to have ranged AoEs with Trapper's_Expertise and Spirits_Unbound. Pets have access to self heals using Carnivorous_Appetite which at the time was more than enough to get some use of them because the damage was lower and there was much less AoE spam. 

 

All that  is what weights on other players comments not the comments themselves.  

 

Ranger could do with some love restoring some of those missing traits. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by anduriell.6280
grammar

[Dami.5046]

9 minutes ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Reaper is meta from very long time from the nerf to scourge's Sand_Savant, we should not be comparing. 

 

It does not matter if what the other players say is trolling or not, the fact is ranger is not wanted in WvW and it is the first to go as soon as the squad fills up. They tolerate the class for as long as the spot is not contested by any other class. 

 

Also wvw guilds announcements discriminate against rangers, they will not want any ranger main if they don't denounce the class while playing guild raids. The thing is it wasn't that bad before all the nerfs done during those years. Ranger used to have ranged AoEs with Trapper's_Expertise and Spirits_Unbound. Pets have access to self heals using Carnivorous_Appetite which at the time was more than enough to get some use of them because the damage was lower and there was much less AoE spam. 

 

All that  is what weights on other players comments not the comments themselves.  

 

Ranger could do with some love restoring some of those missing traits. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quite agree, it needs some love which anet doesn't give it. I find the whole thing quite tiresome and play other classes which what i think the idea is in the first place.

My point about the reaper isn't a comparison to it class x class. No you can't compare them. I am talking about how I have been treated and how that compares to a ranger.

  

[mindcircus.1506]

15 hours ago, welch.2785 said:

i am tired of rangers being told they are useless in WvW. if arnet does not want them in WvW then remove the abililty to join WvW. Or improve their abilities to be of use in WvW....  no group wants rangers. i am sure arnet did not design them to be kept out of groups. groups get the best and most loot, lot more social aspect to the game, and more fun experience. so please make us more useless in groups so we can join the community or make them unable to get into WvW...

Rangers are not unwelcome in WvW.

The way most people play Ranger, however, is.

[Dami.5046]

4 minutes ago, mindcircus.1506 said:

Rangers are not unwelcome in WvW.

The way most people play Ranger, however, is.

I was happily going to the leave the thread, but pray tell me more ...

[DaVid Darksoul.4985]

Perhaps an elite melee spec that steers away from projectiles would help. Some of the fastest defeats in roaming I've suffered were from melee rangers.

[anduriell.6280]

48 minutes ago, DaVid Darksoul.4985 said:

Perhaps an elite melee spec that steers away from projectiles would help. Some of the fastest defeats in roaming I've suffered were from melee rangers.

Do you mean like Soulbeast with dagger  or Druid with the staff? 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

2 hours ago, Dami.5046 said:

I was happily going to the leave the thread, but pray tell me more ...

 

The fact that almost all of them use Sic Em, OWP, RF 'burst' which is GREAT for unaware ganking but horrible for literally everything else.  Seriously, most Soulbeasts I see spend more time running than doing anything useful.  Like not running to kite, just plain running not to die.  

 

Outside of that, you get the 'wall rangers' that will try to be useful by picking off a single target or using barrage behind a door, but they get run over as soon as the door/wall comes down.  

 

All that said, I've found great success as playing roamer/scout/flanker.  I don't use longbow or greatsword though.  

[Gotejjeken.1267]

7 minutes ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Do you mean like Soulbeast with dagger  or Druid with the staff? 

 

Staff isn't melee lol. 

 

MH dagger may be the biggest abomination of a weapon we have; I think he means more like the old days of Sword/Warhorn and Axe/Axe, or Sword / Axe and Axe / Warhorn (both 'partial' melee but not involving arrow spam) or Sword / Warhorn + GS (actual melee).  

 

When pets didn't suck and could draw some aggro (and live for more than 5 seconds) so that ranger could get in close and do a lot of damage.  

Edited May 20, 2021 by Gotejjeken.1267