Hammer actuality

[JohnAlterat.8576]

Good day. There was few topics about hammer as main weapon in revenant gameplay but moslty it was info for skilleble players. 

If you have a opportunity could you explain or give a link for actual guide about that if hammer can be use as main weapon for pve-pvp content? 

[Shao.7236]

Hammer as of right now has been a bit broken with it's second skill since the rework. Terrain has a lot more influence and sometimes even completely miss targets that are still. (I am actually working on a showcase video about this.)

 

The rework also brought the hitbox forward so much that point blank hits are impossible as well.

 

Otherwise it can be an absolute beast given terrain is in your favor.

 

All of the skills should never be used individually either, if you can't set an opportunity it's not worth it.

 

First skill while slow is incredibly powerful with Quickness and it's ability to always do combo finishers can do for really fun options. It also pierces so you're never gonna be worried about not hitting your target.

 

Second skill as I already mentioned has a problems that can be circumvented but no less still are annoying. This is still one of the most powerful skills accessible to players in the game and using it right can turn around fights quite easily as on full glass that thing can hit up to 10k and not just once per skill, it's really easy to hit multiple targets in team fights.

 

Third skill is often misunderstood, it serves multiple purposes but never should be used for only damage. There's a lot, but a lot of uses for it given you have the right traits, it's main use should be to safely proc Song of the Mists on mutiple targets in team fights, this can earn you a lot of Quickness with bonus damage which can be useful for everything else in the weapon set. You can kite long channeling attacks with it's final strike to punish or bait players who are unaware of it's property to teleport back the user, this can lead their attacks away from teammates as well. It's also great for blasting into useful fields such as dark or water.

 

Fourth skill while frontal still counts as a field that can be used for anything Dark. It also remains there even on weapon swap, with Planar Protection you can have up to 10 seconds of projectile hate which I say is really useful with how stuff like Lich Form is often used.

 

Fifth while just a CC and slow as it is, you can still pair it with a ton of stuff to increase it's potential. Things like unblockables, Quickness or even just bait people evades. It's blast effect can be used defensively, most notably with Dark Field for a CC and Blind, if not for the CC, the blind helps and considering the quickness and stability access that players don't always anticipate, you can surprise foes.

Edited July 4, 2021 by Shao.7236

[JohnAlterat.8576]

Thank you very much for such a detailed answer. This is great food for thought.

[Jaykay.9641]

@Shao.7236

Do you use Rev hammer in any situation outside of WvW zerging?

 

@Yasai.3549 created a Hammer rework thread a few months ago that focused on making Hammer more available for dueling yet still retain its zerg strength. I have to agree that it's poor for dueling and Rev is the only profession that lacks a ranged duelist weapon for core. I've had an itch to necro that thread since I think hammer does need a semi rework if it's the only core ranged weapon for Rev.

 

Anyway, just wanted to know if you've ever had success using Hammer for WvW roaming or even -  dare I say, sPvP. Any input is welcome. Thanks.

[Shao.7236]

@Jaykay.9641Yes I use it in PvE and PvP. Mostly PvP.

 

It works given you understand the niches and synergy that helps it. In WvW players mostly use it exclusively for CoR while in PvP you have to be creative with your options. It's possible to sustain yourself and quickly down unwary players reliably, in 1v1 it depends what you are facing. Thieves that rely on blind hard counter hammer.

 

It's obviously not the best for holding node since most attacks are easier to land at range but it can punish people for not taking action on you freecasting and with the projectile hate you have it's easy to force players into coming close, the style is rather comparable to ranger.

 

Maps are also an important part, I don't use it on Khylo or Skyhammer, the nodes are too claustrophobic or the middle sucks to be at.

 

Hammer does have incredible leverage on teamfight if underestimated. It can halve the HP of necro's at the very start of a fight while kitting is identical to have swords like regular power.

 

I'd say the most important part of playing hammer is to make sure you swap legend in the middle of a team fight with Phase Smash for the Quickness/Vulnerability. The rest is up to you.

[Buran.3796]

  I did play sometimes a Jalis/Glint PvP build with hammer/sword+shield with the Demolisher amulet, trying to be as tanky as possible. Overall doesn't work because in most of matches the teamplay doesn't exist and is not as tanky neither deals as much damage as other classes, and is a shame because has good sustain and provides a lot of useful boons in skirmishes (stab, protection, might...). So oftenly even if you success in the inital fight for the central control point after a long  fight, 90% of the times your team usually disband letting any enemy to easily decap, and if you stay you will die horribly due the hammer is terribad in duels.

 

   Outside that, absolutely garbage weapon which only fills a small niche in one of the least played parts of the game. The CoR skill is particulary bad due the changes over time not only nerfed the damage but entirely changed the mechanics: CoR is cancelled if you move in diagonal, strafe laterally, walk backwards...   Is also cancelled by minimal slants in the terrain and all kind of objects in the environment. Fits well in a class which in PvE oftenly gets jammed between walls in instanced content if uses sword #3. Hammer #5, the slowest weapon skill in the game, is particulary bad since we lost the quickness on demand from Impossible Odds and the Feb 2020 patch nuked its damage in WvW and PvP. If you need ranged damage in PvE you either swap to Renegade or change to another class (being said that: no reason to go ranged in PvE with Revenant, ever).

[Telgum.6071]

Can't tell you about PvE and I doubt is worth at all, but for WvW zerging Hammer is the mandatory Revenant weapon, OP power spike

[Buran.3796]

23 hours ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Can't tell you about PvE and I doubt is worth at all, but for WvW zerging Hammer is the mandatory Revenant weapon, OP power spike

   True, because has ranged physical AoE damage which can't be prevented with skills which null/defelct projectiles. But the hammer is a shadow of his former self in both damage and mechanics, and other classes as the Necromancer are WAY better at dealing damage at range in large scale WvW battles. So the question is not "is hammer the best choice for Rev in this situation?" but "is still hammer Revenant mandatory in a large WvW group?" And my answer would be "nope".

[Telgum.6071]

39 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

   True, because has ranged physical AoE damage which can't be prevented with skills which null/defelct projectiles. But the hammer is a shadow of his former self in both damage and mechanics, and other classes as the Necromancer are WAY better at dealing damage at range in large scale WvW battles. So the question is not "is hammer the best choice for Rev in this situation?" but "is still hammer Revenant mandatory in a large WvW group?" And my answer would be "nope".

This is simply not true. Necromancers are way better at corrupting and THEN dealing damage. Hammer Revenant can perform an amazing power spike regardless if is safe or not on a really short CD. Revenant burst is simply better.

Revenant not being mandatory is debatable, no other DPS/burst class can fill your party with permanent might and fury while also being able to share superspeed and stability and allowing really safe charges with Dwarf's elite skill. And we could even argue about Renegade with 10 men alacrity, also Kalla's Fervor and Mallyx for huge melee pulls.

 

So yeah, if you want to go full melee we could talk about replacements for Revenant, but in general Revenant is a mandatory DPS class in every squad. The combination of Facets + Hammer + Domination makes Revenant a must in WvW, despite the mongoloid efforts of this subforum to set Revenant as a literally unplayable class.

[Buran.3796]

22 hours ago, Telgum.6071 said:

 

 

So yeah, if you want to go full melee we could talk about replacements for Revenant, but in general Revenant is a mandatory DPS class in every squad. The combination of Facets + Hammer + Domination makes Revenant a must in WvW, despite the mongoloid efforts of this subforum to set Revenant as a literally unplayable class.

   There was a time in the game in which you could see Justine uploading on regular basis excellent videos using his hammer/staff Rev to wreack havock in WvW, oftenly in roaming or even dueling 1 vs n. You no longer find that kind of videos from him or anyone, not only due the stacked nerfs turned the hammer in garbage but mustly also because nerfed damage and bunker meta aside, the current hammer skills aren't funny to use, specially for anyone which still remembers how it felt in the past.  

[Telgum.6071]

1 hour ago, Buran.3796 said:

   There was a time in the game in which you could see Justine uploading on regular basis excellent videos using his hammer/staff Rev to wreack havock in WvW, oftenly in roaming or even dueling 1 vs n. You no longer find that kind of videos from him or anyone, not only due the stacked nerfs turned the hammer in garbage but mustly also because nerfed damage and bunker meta aside, the current hammer skills aren't funny to use, specially for anyone which still remembers how it felt in the past.  

"Funny" and "worth" are not synonyms. AFAIK this post is about how worth is hammer on revenant for PvE and PvP, hence my answer. And hammer being stronger years ago doesn't mean is not worth now. Berserker is nerfed every year and still retain a permanent spot on every single raid boss, despite being weaker than ever.

 

And I have fun playing revenant, not specific weapons, sorry but I don't share your sentiment about that.

[Justine.6351]

On 7/7/2021 at 5:27 PM, Buran.3796 said:

   There was a time in the game in which you could see Justine uploading on regular basis excellent videos using his hammer/staff Rev to wreack havock in WvW, oftenly in roaming or even dueling 1 vs n. You no longer find that kind of videos from him or anyone, not only due the stacked nerfs turned the hammer in garbage but mustly also because nerfed damage and bunker meta aside, the current hammer skills aren't funny to use, specially for anyone which still remembers how it felt in the past.  

Yeah there were a few of us hammer revs posting vids here and others that talked about it. They don't play the game anymore afaik.

 

Turkey

Danielsuprient

Coffin

Rubberducky?

Myself

Sorry those were names that came off the top of my head. Didn't mean to forget everyone else.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

47 minutes ago, Justine.6351 said:

Yeah there were a few of us hammer revs posting vids here and others that talked about it. They don't play the game anymore afaik.

 

Turkey

Danielsuprient

Coffin

Rubberducky?

Myself

Sorry those were names that came off the top of my head. Didn't mean to forget everyone else.

Add me to that list too, though I never talked about it much openly on the forums.  Hammer was my primary go to in WvW Roaming and PvP and it was my favorite weapon in the game for years.  Now I very literally haven't touched the build since October 2019 due to the horrendous changes

Edited July 13, 2021 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[Justine.6351]

4 hours ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Add me to that list too, though I never talked about it much openly on the forums.  Hammer was my primary go to in WvW Roaming and PvP and it was my favorite weapon in the game for years.  Now I very literally haven't touched the build since October 2019 due to the horrendous changes

 

 

"Gods I was strong back then"

-Robert Baratheon

[Aeolus.3615]

42 minutes ago, Justine.6351 said:

 

 

"Gods I was strong back then"

-Robert Baratheon

 

 

CoR at release was much stronger than that 😛  and ha donly a 2sec CD.

Back in the days i was  doing 14k-16k aoe heals  🙂 and team had perma regenon 1.3k tick per sec, thing is people prefered spam over decent hp support lol... they still prefer spam gameplay over anything else.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Aeolus.3615

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Yeah @Justine.6351 your vids were always a joy to watch. 

 

Tbh I have always disliked hammer because I came from maining Thief and was more into the assassin-style playstyle when playing DPS. But now especially it feels disappointing to use. Yeah, it can still chunk, and it is still valued in zerg play, but #5 is lackluster for the animation and cast time it has , and #2 feels like trash with how unreliable it is and the fact that it has a deadzone. Gotta love it when you use it on terrain and it disappears or goes a completely different direction.

 

A really uniquely designed weapon that is the unfortunate victim of excelling at the only niche it excels at in the game. @Shao.7236 I was watching one of your vods and it was funny seeing you delete people with it in PvP, but you can definitely see you are working much harder for your results. The combos and setups were fun to watch though.

[phokus.8934]

I send in my daily bug report to ANet letting them know that hammer (especially coalescence of ruin) is hilariously broken.