Well GW2 has ruined me ☹

[Firebeard.1746]

3 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said:

I'm not sure games released by private companies are necessarily any better. Until recently Elder Scrolls Online was owned by a private company (Zenimax Media) and they use the subscription + cash shop model. Admittedly its a bit different because the subscription is optional (although tied to several useful QoL features) and one of the things it gives you is a monthly allowance of cash shop currency, but I know a lot of people end up buying more in addition to that because they can't get everything they want with the subscription allowance.

 

Conversely Anet has been owned by NCSoft, which is a public company, since before GW1 was announced and GW1 had very little monetisation beyond selling campaigns and GW2 has no subscription.

I will say though that to me it's glaringly obvious that the NCsoft bean counters have been interfering with GW2: They've rehired some of the staff they laid off, implying that the studio was not allowed to keep everyone they wanted. I forgot which devs specifically I was researching when I found this out, but it's not just colin they brought back.

And the reason they were rehired imo is GW2 actually saw massive revenue increases during the pandemic. So basically NCSoft gutted anet and then re-allowed them to hire the talent they needed back once the bean counters said it was okay.

You're right though that a private company is capable of being just as greedy, but only a private company would have the freedom not to be.

And TBH, publishers don't offer a ton of value to video game companies anymore. I'll I've ever seen them do is interfere with the dev process in destructive ways when they don't hit their quarterly profit targets. Like yes, it was needed way back when because you needed help getting your product to market, but now, with the internet and how easy it is to distribute, publishers should be axed.

Edited July 27, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Perisemiotics.4579]

On 7/24/2021 at 7:43 AM, rrusse.7058 said:

Can you give an estimate of how long it takes to get through the ARR campaign?

I won't even try, really. It's basically about the story - that's a common ground with GW2 but personally I prefer XIV's style of not giving in to over-quipping and keeping the focus on the big dramatic crisis at hand... while stiill being sensible to some sort of moral and ethic.

Whether you just wanna blast through to the xpacks or take your time exploring and reading all the initial texts and side quests... that's at least a couple months' worth of your time. 🙂

On 7/24/2021 at 8:27 AM, Dante.1763 said:

Unfortunately FFXIV couldn't grab me at all, and im not going to push through the horrible lower levels to get to the "good stuff". Game needs to be good from the get go. FFXIV imo is not that.

oh but it is good, it's just... old? not to mention the remaking of it. Compare Core Tyria hearts, mechanics, etc. with any PoF map... same thing goes for every othe rgame I've played. Also, your mindset of boosting past the leveling process to get to "the good stuff" invalidates the notion of what an mmorpg should be about... I don't even like boosters or shortcuts, but that's another point.

[Dante.1763]

2 hours ago, Perisemiotics.4579 said:

I won't even try, really. It's basically about the story - that's a common ground with GW2 but personally I prefer XIV's style of not giving in to over-quipping and keeping the focus on the big dramatic crisis at hand... while stiill being sensible to some sort of moral and ethic.

Whether you just wanna blast through to the xpacks or take your time exploring and reading all the initial texts and side quests... that's at least a couple months' worth of your time. 🙂

oh but it is good, it's just... old? not to mention the remaking of it. Compare Core Tyria hearts, mechanics, etc. with any PoF map... same thing goes for every othe rgame I've played. Also, your mindset of boosting past the leveling process to get to "the good stuff" invalidates the notion of what an mmorpg should be about... I don't even like boosters or shortcuts, but that's another point.

We disagree on that and their isnt anything wrong with that.

 

It was the exact opposite of good.

[DoomNexus.5324]

On 7/23/2021 at 4:54 AM, Zuldari.3940 said:

playing GW2 made me realize what a dumpster fire character movement and combat are in any other game. I tried for hours to get into it but I kept looking for that spatial freedom I get in GW2, not to mention combat feels slow and our combat feels perfect. And the ui was starting to get on my nerves, plus for being an old game GW2 actually looks pretty and clean. Our world is prettier! So I cant wait to see what EoD will look like, because I dont think I can go back to FF or WoW im spoiled on our combat and movement system. 

Exactly this. I REAALLY would like to be able to enjoy ESO and FF14 but I just can't due to the (in comparison) horrible combat and movement system. It just feels clunky and floaty and meh...  And the world in ESO sucks kitten, I mean it's beautifully designed but traversing it is just a pain in the kitten. If you take even the slightest shortcuts you'll face a wall of boulders or something and have to go the intended way anyway. Exploration is super boring because of this as you just walk on the actual path for an eternity and maybe go slightly left or right if you spot something interesting. Trying to get into other MMOs really shows me how good GW2 actually is. But that's actually something I've known for years, it's just super frustrating that Anet neglects basically any competitive content and only focuses on a bit of PvE and mainly story (which subpar anyway imho).

I really hope that this will change during/after 2021 and with EoD released. The alliance update and engine upgrade spark new hope for me. And I really hope they will bring some new PvP stuff into the game with Cantha.. It was a massive addition to competitive content in GW1 so yea.. my hopes are high (but expectations low).

[Lighter.5631]

On 7/26/2021 at 10:49 AM, Brandon Uzumaki.1524 said:

Funny you say that about subscription vs cash shop, when both Final Fantasy and WoW have a cash shop on top of all the other forced paid aspects, so this whole "we need a sub fee to avoid milking the players" is a big pile of kitten.

Yeah i know, "it's mostly cosmetics", but isn't the friggin sub fee there so ALL items can be earned in-game?? Cause if i have to buy the game, buy each expansion, and then pay a monthly fee on top of all that i expect everything to be earned in-game.

There was a time when the monthly fee argument made sense, not anymore.

 

 

your notion of cash shop is twisted by anet for their heavily milked cash shop for you thinking the point of cash shop is to sell you better skins every week and make you gamble over loot boxes.

5 points for you.

 

1.the weapon skins they sell in cash shop i can count with two hand (less then 10) and are just npc weapons with no effect, the latest weapon updated 2020/feb and the previous weapon was from 2017.

 

2.for how underwhelming the cash shop already is, most of if not all of the holiday related skins which make up majority of ff14 cash shop can also be obtained through in-game quests. 

 

3.all the best looking armor/weapon/mount skins are obtained in-game

 

4. in-game/cash shop item update ratio 

    ff14 90%/10%

    gw2 20%/80%

( not even mentioning the difference of quality/effort put in in-game item and cash shop item)

 

5. no gamble.

 

this is all you need to know,

personally tho i could care less about what they have in CS, for their in-game items are far superior and people buying stuff from CS ultimately result in me getting even better stuff in-game

 

funny how it's the opposite for gw2 in it's current state. with the only exception of legendary, which is also being challenged recently with the phoenix set.

gw2 is milking cs so hard because the whole game depend on it to run, and i'm pretty sure some of the funding they get from milking cs is to make even more cs items while the rest goes to server fee and minimum in-game update.

unlike ff14, people buying from cs is just extra side funding to make the game even better, livelihood not depend on it, which is why latest cs weapon update was 1 year+ ago, and before that was 2017.

oh yea and they actually deal with bots and responsive towards reports, i wonder why.

 

Edited July 30, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[Pyriin.3291]

I completely disagree, i left gw2 at the start of Icecream saga to go ff14, ive played gw2 for many years and wille gw2 has lowered its standards, ff14 has risen above them with every new content better then the last.

[radda.8920]

On 7/23/2021 at 5:06 AM, Touchme.1097 said:

 

GW2 requires skills, even for flying with a mount. 

 

 

excellent joke

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

On 7/23/2021 at 4:54 AM, Zuldari.3940 said:

OH EM GEE! playing GW2 made me realize what a dumpster fire character movement and combat are in any other gam

exactly. And FF XIX is one of the worst. WoW does it much better for an tab-target system.

But not only the combat. non voiced Main Quest are a joke. GW2 sets the bar really high in this regard and not one game can really compete here.

[Xanadrine.4352]

On 7/27/2021 at 11:59 AM, Firebeard.1746 said:

And the reason they were rehired imo is GW2 actually saw massive revenue increases during the pandemic. So basically NCSoft gutted anet and then re-allowed them to hire the talent they needed back once the bean counters said it was okay.

Well the one thing bean counters need to get through their heads is the way you keep a product relevant and keep people interested is to have the people that can and will keep the game running smooth updated and engrossing. Cutting off your nose to spite your face is a stupid idea. Game corporations have no vision, they are all about the bottom line without understanding their customer base at all. The real devs and systems people that truly have the vision to make a game fantastic are throttled by the suits. And thats why suits dont get it, and corporate games are shells of what they could be.

[Xanadrine.4352]

3 minutes ago, Stalkingwolf.6035 said:

exactly. And FF XIX is one of the worst. WoW does it much better for an tab-target system.

But not only the combat. non voiced Main Quest are a joke. GW2 sets the bar really high in this regard and not one game can really compete here.

Yes i agree. I kept trying to get back into FF, and man it felt so awkward.

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

On 7/23/2021 at 11:10 PM, Perisemiotics.4579 said:

For those critiquing FFXIV for slow combat, no voiceovers, etc., please play at least the core game to the end, and possibly the first expansion too (which is, now, also free) - combat picks up nicely and voiceovers are added past the first part of the game. Play the full game before comparing, guys.

no it doesnt. its getting bloated thats it. 2.5s GCD stays a 2.5sgcd and the bosses are designed around it. the off gcds are few and far between.

and i played Shadowbringers. there a still a lot of non voiced MSQs. And even if, it doesnt matter 90% of the MSQ is porting around and talking to NPCs. sure if you had combat in a MMO. FF XIV is the way to go.

Edited July 30, 2021 by Stalkingwolf.6035

[Touchme.1097]

2 hours ago, radda.8920 said:

 

excellent joke

"But griffon is just a glider" - YouTube

"But flying on griffon is boring" - YouTube

"But griffon can't fly" - YouTube

Enough for you or do you want more?

Edited July 30, 2021 by Touchme.1097

[radda.8920]

43 minutes ago, Touchme.1097 said:

"But griffon is just a glider" - YouTube

"But flying on griffon is boring" - YouTube

"But griffon can't fly" - YouTube

Enough for you or do you want more?

 

impressive,I almost fell off my chair.

 

gw2 is definitely the mmo that requires the most skill on the market, without a doubt

[Firebeard.1746]

7 hours ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

Well the one thing bean counters need to get through their heads is the way you keep a product relevant and keep people interested is to have the people that can and will keep the game running smooth updated and engrossing. Cutting off your nose to spite your face is a stupid idea. Game corporations have no vision, they are all about the bottom line without understanding their customer base at all. The real devs and systems people that truly have the vision to make a game fantastic are throttled by the suits. And thats why suits dont get it, and corporate games are shells of what they could be.

I completely agree. Unfortunately this isn't how they're trained to think XD.

[Lilieze.8290]

So much jealous shill post for other MMO.

This won't make GW2 look and do better. Stop that.

[Follyfoot.2803]

I am pretty useless at competitive MMO's, that's why I play GW2.  I can watch the TV while button mashing.  Not much demand for skill or attention here.

The game generates the illusion of being hard by the use of dirty tricks, dropping a mob on your head or a boss that will one shot 50% of the field no matter what you do to try and prevent it,  just a couple of examples.  But at it's heart it is still built for casuals.

Edited July 31, 2021 by Follyfoot.2803

[Touchme.1097]

4 hours ago, Follyfoot.2803 said:

I am pretty useless at competitive MMO's, that's why I play GW2.  I can watch the TV while button mashing.  Not much demand for skill or attention here.

The game generates the illusion of being hard by the use of dirty tricks, dropping a mob on your head or a boss that will one shot 50% of the field no matter what you do to try and prevent it,  just a couple of examples.  But at it's heart it is still built for casuals.

I think the game is pretty balanced for both challenging content and casual play. I would be disappointed if the best gear (stat wise) would be locked in harder and harder content.

[Xanadrine.4352]

14 hours ago, Follyfoot.2803 said:

I am pretty useless at competitive MMO's, that's why I play GW2.  I can watch the TV while button mashing.  Not much demand for skill or attention here.

The game generates the illusion of being hard by the use of dirty tricks, dropping a mob on your head or a boss that will one shot 50% of the field no matter what you do to try and prevent it,  just a couple of examples.  But at it's heart it is still built for casuals.

Umm there is plenty of hard content in this game lol, no illusion about it. You choose to play the game in the least difficult way, i can do that in any game too. But if you want to try something you have to use more than 1111 with there are options in this game.

 

[Chemistral.7318]

15 hours ago, Follyfoot.2803 said:

I am pretty useless at competitive MMO's, that's why I play GW2.  I can watch the TV while button mashing.  Not much demand for skill or attention here.

The game generates the illusion of being hard by the use of dirty tricks, dropping a mob on your head or a boss that will one shot 50% of the field no matter what you do to try and prevent it,  just a couple of examples.  But at it's heart it is still built for casuals.

Just curious, have you tried raids?

[Bladezephyr.5714]

On 7/23/2021 at 1:59 AM, yoni.7015 said:

And legendary gear is just optional, it’s not Bis.

Yes, actually, it IS best in slot.  Like ascended gear, it has the best stats in the game (that alone makes it best in slot, BTW, since there's not a gear type that has better).  But it also has 3 properties that ascended gear does not have:

• It has unique skins and animations
• It is freely stat-selectable on demand
• It can be transmogrified for free, no charges needed

In other words, it does everything that ascended does, plus more.  That makes it best in slot, whether or not you personally care about the extra bits.

Edited August 1, 2021 by Bladezephyr.5714

[Bladezephyr.5714]

On 7/23/2021 at 12:33 PM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

I have legendary armor through WvW and my world rank prior to joining a guild this year was somewhere around 600.  There is no grind, just playing the game on and off (sometimes with year long breaks) over the past 9 years.

If you don't enjoy WvW then I assure you, any time you spend there is grind.  And 9 years is an awful long time to take to get anything in any video game.  That said, exotic is good enough for everything but high-level fractals, for which you can get ascended in a much shorter period of time.  Still, even if you don't "need" legendary gear, for many if not most players it's desirable to have, and for a lot of players (myself included) the grind is prohibitive.  But you don't have to let that stop you from enjoying the rest of the game...

[PookieDaWombat.6209]

Over the years I've had no shortage of things to get salty about regarding GW2, and will probably have more in the future, however GW2 is still by far the BEST MMO offering on the market right now pound for pound.  Not even including the volume of content for new players just getting into the game and the ease of playing with them, they also have the best active combat system I've ever played in an MMO.  More importantly, and this is a big one for me as someone who's worked in IT for over 20 years, they have some of the best server uptime out there, which for a live game is honestly impressive in ways many might not fully understand.

 

All in all, even when I'm not necessarily enjoying a decision for storytelling (please PLEASE do not rush the xpac story or add in too many Dues Ex Machina nonsense, I beg), they still find a way to make the game engaging enough for me to come back to it, even if I take a break.

[Bladezephyr.5714]

23 hours ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

Umm there is plenty of hard content in this game lol, no illusion about it.

That depends on who you ask...  For the average player that's true, but remember that being average means roughly half the population is better than you.  Once your skill gets to a certain point, all the content gets easy for you.  MightyTeapot has a really good video about this on YT called "Difficulty in Games and Guild Wars 2's Greatest Flaw!"

[Bladezephyr.5714]

On 7/28/2021 at 2:41 AM, Perisemiotics.4579 said:

oh but it is good, it's just... old? not to mention the remaking of it. Compare Core Tyria hearts, mechanics, etc. with any PoF map... same thing goes for every othe rgame I've played. Also, your mindset of boosting past the leveling process to get to "the good stuff" invalidates the notion of what an mmorpg should be about... I don't even like boosters or shortcuts, but that's another point.

Depends what you like I guess... I agree with Dante's opinion.  I tried FF and found it dull.  I've heard other people say it gets better in the late game, but games are about fun--if you have to play 100 hrs, 50 hrs, or even 5 hrs before it starts to be fun, I'm not gonna play it.

 

As for your comment about "boosting past the leveling process" I don't see where Dante said that, at least not in the post you replied to.  But regardless, there's no law that MMOs have to be the same... There's no particular reason you need to have leveling as part of your game.  You just need to make a game that has engaging game play.  Leveling is one way to provide that (well, maybe, maybe not) but you could also do it through story progression, exploration, etc..  No game has any mandatory game element, except for the one overriding one: FUN.  I've been level 80 in guild wars 2 for almost 9 years... I never once felt like the game was missing something because I don't have more levels to get.  In fact quite the opposite: Now that I've been through the leveling process a bunch of times on a bunch of toons, I find it a bit tedious, unless I go out of my way myself to make it less so.  Take map discovery--I've never been a fan of having to "rediscover" the map in MMOs on new toons. I mean IRL we've had maps for as long as we've had travel... This is especially true of MMOs set in a modern/futuristic world--I've never been to Paris but I don't need to walk there before I can "quick travel" (by airplane) to Charles de Gaul.

[Dante.1763]

3 minutes ago, Bladezephyr.5714 said:

 

 

As for your comment about "boosting past the leveling process" I don't see where Dante said that, at least not in the post you replied to. 

i had to go back to page 1 just now. But i mentioned that i wasnt going to play through the boring low levels of a game to get to the good fun stuff locked away at the higher levels. Basically a game needs to be fun from the start and i found FFXIV dull to begin with, and it just didnt get better for the ~30 levels i played.