When can we get a playable Tengu Race? [Merged]

[Sirius.4510]

On 8/8/2021 at 5:45 AM, Teratus.2859 said:

I'm just a bit tired of seeing new threads asking for the same thing over and over again and having to explain various reasons why it can't be done or shouldn't be done or why now isn't the right time etc etc.

You don't have to explain that. You can if you want to, but if you're getting tired of it, it might be better to ignore them.

[Pirindolo.9427]

6 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

It's "exactly the same as charr" in about the same way as Sylvari and Norn body structure is exactly the same as Human one.

Actually, even less considering that tengu do not run on all fours and animate differently.

5 hours ago, The Greyhawk.9107 said:

Thats a good point, I hadn't thought about the charr running animation in this context before.

Charr have 2 running animations: 2 and 4 legs. Remember that if your charr is in combat and starts running, it does it with the standing, 2 leg animation.  Tengu has only the 2 leg one, So still shares the same body structure and running animation of charr.

 

 

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by Pirindolo.9427

[The Greyhawk.9107]

4 hours ago, Pirindolo.9427 said:

Charr have 2 running animations: 2 and 4 legs. Remember that if your charr is in combat and starts running, it does it with the standing, 2 leg animation.  Tengu has only the 2 leg one, So still shares the same body structure and running animation of charr.

Yes, I'm quite aware that Charr have two running animations 🙄

[Chip.9267]

You like it or not but the tengu are comming! One of the masteries will be tengu related, you will see. And for those who dont like anything thats coming i say one thing: see mounts...

[Esorono.1039]

2 hours ago, Chip.9267 said:

You like it or not but the tengu are comming! One of the masteries will be tengu related, you will see. And for those who dont like anything thats coming i say one thing: see mounts...

I am not quite positive about that, there are no longer non-humans in Cantha. So I feel like if they are released as a playable race, it will be sometime after EoD.

[The Greyhawk.9107]

9 hours ago, Chip.9267 said:

You like it or not but the tengu are comming! One of the masteries will be tengu related, you will see. And for those who dont like anything thats coming i say one thing: see mounts...

Yes, because mounts worked out in the end that means anything anyone comes up with on the forums will magically work out just as well.

[Faridah.8431]

On 8/10/2021 at 10:22 PM, Esorono.1039 said:

Yes, because A-Net cares for the story. XD Now, excuse me while I make a Revenant and play through the personal story line, and then do HoT to meet the brand new never seen before profession. And then do IBS, I heard the story was really well made and not at all rushed through. Let's just ignore the idea that two creatures as powerful as gods fighting can cause wide spread destruction, but two creatures more powerful than the gods hitting each other AND causing a massive influx of magic from two Elder Dragons into the world at the same time is completely fiiiiiiiine.

 

Also no, the old models use the same body frame as Charrs, but slightly different animations.

This is just obtuse. Not claiming the story is amazing or anything. However its quite clear the player character fulfills a specific role within it. 

 

Revenant is a weird blip, but certainly an apples to oranges comparison to a new race that up till now has been completely isolated within the game world and as a race would not slot into that role at all which is a completely different issue than the addition of a new class.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Faridah.8431

[Esorono.1039]

2 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

This is just obtuse. Not claiming the story is amazing or anything. However its quite clear the player character fulfills a specific role within it. 

 

Revenant is a weird blip, but certainly an apples to oranges comparison to a new race that up till now has been completely isolated within the game world and as a race would not slot into that role at all which is a completely different issue than the addition of a new class.

It's poorly thought out DnD DM story telling at best, at worst it is an incoherent mess of endless whys and hows. I'd give examples, but I'd be at it for days. So if they drop the commander storyline for the new race, nothing of value would be lost. It can easily be included as a new game+ thing after EoD ends because that is where the GW2 story is just going to end. Or should end, but I am sure they will just handwave all the consequences away despite the billions of implications of killing all the elder dragons will do to the world, not just magically but the entire social structure as well. Everything in the game worked because we are fighting the dragons, once they are gone, everything falls apart. If they can handwave that away, a new race is easy in comparison.

[Faridah.8431]

2 minutes ago, Esorono.1039 said:

It's poorly thought out DnD DM story telling at best, at worst it is an incoherent mess of endless whys and hows. I'd give examples, but I'd be at it for days. So if they drop the commander storyline for the new race, nothing of value would be lost. It can easily be included as a new game+ thing after EoD ends because that is where the GW2 story is just going to end. Or should end, but I am sure they will just handwave all the consequences away despite the billions of implications of killing all the elder dragons will do to the world, not just magically but the entire social structure as well. Everything in the game worked because we are fighting the dragons, once they are gone, everything falls apart. If they can handwave that away, a new race is easy in comparison.

What you are forgetting is that in order to create a new story/role for a new race, you need a new leveling area (potentially), including a new leveling personal story is a bigger scope than expansions have given for maps/story so far. That's the bigger issue.

[Esorono.1039]

6 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

What you are forgetting is that in order to create a new story/role for a new race, you need a new leveling area (potentially), including a new leveling personal story is a bigger scope than expansions have given for maps/story so far. That's the bigger issue.

They already have their area, and no it really is not, it is nothing compared to HoT.

[Faridah.8431]

6 minutes ago, Esorono.1039 said:

They already have their area, and no it really is not, it is nothing compared to HoT.

Really, one map for 0-80? Sounds boring. I get a lot of people don't bother with 0-80 anymore with boosters and tomes, but come on, everyone on the new Tengu race side here is really going all out to say sacrifice everything else for the sake of just having it. Honestly from my side, that sounds awful. I'd love a new Tengu race too, but I'd want every aspect of it done well, not half assed.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Faridah.8431

[Esorono.1039]

3 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

Really, one map for 0-80? Sounds boring. I get a lot of people don't bother with 0-80 anymore with boosters and tomes, but come on, everyone on the new Tengu race side here is really going all out to say sacrifice everything else for the sake of just having it. Honestly from my side, that sounds awful. I'd love a new Tengu race too, but I'd want every aspect of it done well, not half assed.

You do Caledon Forest when you start as a Sylvari from level 2 to 80? I'm impressed by your dedication. And what are they sacrificing? More ideas like fishing? I'd rather have more reasons to try out new clothing aesthetics than having something like a new yoga mastery system.

[Obtena.7952]

When will we get Tengu as a playable class? Likely never, for the dozens of reasons that have been discussed dozens of times in the past. 

[Faridah.8431]

2 minutes ago, Esorono.1039 said:

You do Caledon Forest when you start as a Sylvari from level 2 to 80? I'm impressed by your dedication. And what are they sacrificing? More ideas like fishing? I'd rather have more reasons to try out new clothing aesthetics than having something like a new yoga mastery system.

Are you just purposefully being obtuse?

 

When you said Tengu already had an area, I assumed you we're referring to the Dominion of Winds. So all the other races get an entire Central Tyria region for a personal story, are we going to have one of those for Cantha too? Is it going to be limited to just the Dominion of Winds, come on think this out.

[Esorono.1039]

1 minute ago, Faridah.8431 said:

Are you just purposefully being obtuse?

 

When you said Tengu already had an area, I assumed you we're referring to the Dominion of Winds. So all the other races get an entire Central Tyria region for a personal story, are we going to have one of those for Cantha too? Is it going to be limited to just the Dominion of Winds, come on think this out.

No, I am just sick of stubborn people pinging me for silly questions that are easily thought out about. It's like people here are purposefully making problems that are easily solved for the sake of argument. But for your question likely just the Dominion of Winds area, a personal quest and done. That is really all it needs. And why Cantha? What would Tengu, a race who has been kicked out of a region for centuries have anything to do with it anymore? Come on, think about this for a moment.

[ReaverKane.7598]

Never?
Why would you want a tengu playable character?
I have no affinity or attachement. If anything it would be awesome to have a Dwarf as playable race, with a whole new bunch of stuff in the depths of Tyria.
Even Largos or Kodan would be better, since those would open doors to entirely new areas and cultures...

[Faridah.8431]

49 minutes ago, Esorono.1039 said:

No, I am just sick of stubborn people pinging me for silly questions that are easily thought out about. It's like people here are purposefully making problems that are easily solved for the sake of argument. But for your question likely just the Dominion of Winds area, a personal quest and done. That is really all it needs. And why Cantha? What would Tengu, a race who has been kicked out of a region for centuries have anything to do with it anymore? Come on, think about this for a moment.

I'm just throwing out the fact that to give the race parity with the other ones, you really need its story and 0-80 gameplay/development to not be a half-assed blip. In order to do that, it's not "easily solved". It's more development on a much larger scope than we've seen expansions cover thus far.

 

Don't get me wrong, I would totally like to see a new playable race, but for me, it needs to make sense, and so far we've had 2 expansions and I can say neither has had that sort of scope. Based on that data, the expectation of a new race this expansion didn't make sense to me, but was happy to be proven wrong. Seeing how they jumped from IBS to this, I just don't see it happening.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Faridah.8431

[DoomNexus.5324]

Never.

[Esorono.1039]

1 minute ago, Faridah.8431 said:

I'm just throwing out the fact that to give the race parity with the other ones, you really need its story to not be a half-assed blip. In order to do that, it's not "easily solved". It's more development.

 

Don't get me wrong, I would totally like to see a new playable race, but for me, it needs to make sense, and so far we've had 2 expansions and I can say neither has had that sort of scope. Based on that data, the expectation of a new race this expansion didn't make sense to me, but was happy to be proven wrong. Seeing how they jumped from IBS to this, I just don't see it happening.

Everything in this game storywise is half-kitten solved. We know A-Net is going to rush through the Cantha storyline to kill the last Elder Dragon and hand wave away any consequences it has. That is just what the story is for GW2, a quick rush to the end, it will be the same if it is a new expansion or a new race. We didn't even get build up for Primordus before he was offed. Defending not having the race because they will half-kitten the story is silly, because they are going to half-kitten any story given to them.

[Faridah.8431]

1 minute ago, Esorono.1039 said:

Everything in this game storywise is half-kitten solved. We know A-Net is going to rush through the Cantha storyline to kill the last Elder Dragon and hand wave away any consequences it has. That is just what the story is for GW2, a quick rush to the end, it will be the same if it is a new expansion or a new race. We didn't even get build up for Primordus before he was offed. Defending not having the race because they will half-kitten the story is silly, because they are going to half-kitten any story given to them.

I did edit my post to be clearer about the entire 0-80 experience for a new race. Yeah the story sucks or whatever, I largely agree, but regardless you still need content.

[ReaverKane.7598]

3 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

I'm just throwing out the fact that to give the race parity with the other ones, you really need its story and 0-80 gameplay/development to not be a half-assed blip. In order to do that, it's not "easily solved". It's more development on a much larger scope than we've seen expansions cover thus far.

 

Don't get me wrong, I would totally like to see a new playable race, but for me, it needs to make sense, and so far we've had 2 expansions and I can say neither has had that sort of scope. Based on that data, the expectation of a new race this expansion didn't make sense to me, but was happy to be proven wrong. Seeing how they jumped from IBS to this, I just don't see it happening.

tbh and accurate, the racial part of the story ends at around lvl 50, and the lvl 50 part is canned and shared among races, what changes is the selection of 3 races from which you can pick what you're helping. And the previous part (lvl 40 chapter) is shared between all races already. The only trully unique section is 1-40.

 

Also like you said a new race would be fun, but from all the prospective candidates for a new playable race, Tengu is both the least appealing and the least likely. Their only known area of residence is just outside LA, which would require an expansion or LW chapter that brings us back to central Tyria, which is somewhat unlikely, also in terms of the culture and race appeal, its kinda been done to pieces. I'd rather explore some of the more (currently) mysterious races like the Largos, Kodan, or Dwarves.
Even playing as a Skritt scratch would be fun (you'd be a group of skritt instead of just the one individual, and the number of skritt would increase as you lvl up, since they get smarter as they increase in numbers).

[Esorono.1039]

7 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

I did edit my post to be clearer about the entire 0-80 experience for a new race. Yeah the story sucks or whatever, I largely agree, but regardless you still need content.

And there is content in the game, you don't even need to go to half of the maps to reach 80, and next to no one is going to care if the personal quest ends sooner than 80 because no one cares about the current personal quests. I say instead of wasting time on more than the basics of the story, they focus it elsewhere. Besides, do you really want to do that Zhaitan quest again? Did you REALLY find pressing 2 and making fireworks fun? Of course not, the entire execution of the final quests were bad and a waste of time. If they only focus on like two or three tengu stories maximum, then it would be most likely passable.

[Faridah.8431]

8 minutes ago, Esorono.1039 said:

And there is content in the game, you don't even need to go to half of the maps to reach 80, and next to no one is going to care if the personal quest ends sooner than 80 because no one cares about the current personal quests. I say instead of wasting time on more than the basics of the story, they focus it elsewhere. Besides, do you really want to do that Zhaitan quest again? Did you REALLY find pressing 2 and making fireworks fun? Of course not, the entire execution of the final quests were bad and a waste of time. If they only focus on like two or three tengu stories maximum, then it would be most likely passable.

So basically your argument is just put in a new race to have a new race, whether it makes sense or not. 

 

Ok then. I think that's dumb, you don't. Guess we are at an impasse.

 

EDIT: And at no point did I say there should be another Zhaitan fight. This is where I think you are obtuse in your argument style. Nobody wants that. What I am saying is if a hypothetical Tengu race was introduced, it would not fit into the current role of the player character with the player character's history since the personal story, through the living world, and both expansions. Therefore, it needs its own path that then segues into EoD the expansion.

 

Could that be done? Sure, I believe so. But I didn't expect it. Expansion's scopes have never been particularly big in story, maps, etc. Features and systems, sure.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Faridah.8431

[Esorono.1039]

1 minute ago, Faridah.8431 said:

So basically your argument is just put in a new race to have a new race, whether it makes sense or not. 

 

Ok then. I think that's dumb, you don't. Guess we are at an impasse.

Honestly, it makes more sense than anything else in this game. I mean you literally enter Mordremoth's mind to kill him, he gives you the way into his mind, knows you are going to do it, and does absolutely nothing to stop it. And that is just one example. I can do this for days. And let's think about this from a logical standpoint, new races gets hype from people outside the game. I hear all the time about the exciting new races coming to WoW and FF14 and multiple people going to go back to the game to play it. Want to know how much I hear about fishing from other MMO chats? None. Want to know the reaction I get when I mention fishing? "Really? that's it? We have fishing here, and I don't think I have ever done it."

[Esorono.1039]

10 minutes ago, Faridah.8431 said:

EDIT: And at no point did I say there should be another Zhaitan fight. This is where I think you are obtuse in your argument style. Nobody wants that. What I am saying is if a hypothetical Tengu race was introduced, it would not fit into the current role of the player character with the player character's history since the personal story, through the living world, and both expansions. Therefore, it needs its own path that then segues into EoD the expansion.

 

Could that be done? Sure, I believe so. But I didn't expect it. Expansion's scopes have never been particularly big in story, maps, etc. Features and systems, sure.

And this is where you are being stubborn. No one cares about these stories. And this is why it would be a new game + race. It will assume the story is already done, no need to go back to change dialog, no need for the commander because all the Elder Dragons are dead. None of it matters anymore. And again, why EoD? What the hell is in Cantha for Tengu? It would be something after all the dragons are dead because that is where the GW2 story ends.