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Anet needs to balance PvE more!

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  • Lucio.4190Lucio.4190 Member ✭✭✭

    @Teratus.2859 said:
    I think your problem OP isn't so much about the balance of PvE but more your own play habits.
    i'm not saying that there isn't a balance problem, we all know that some classes perform better than others that's just the nature of games with options like that.

    But if you're playing the same build and you are "bored" then that says to me that you don't actually enjoy playing that build and probably do so because it's the "optimal" or "meta" for your class and that fault is really on you then.

    I recommend watching this very recently uploaded video by Josh Strife Hayes, while the title is about game guides he actually gets into a lot about how games have fallen into a state of fun vs efficiency and how the more optimised you play the game the more fun you optimise out of the game which can be greatly applied to Gw2 and the meta culture that exists in this game which many people have often criticised and in some cases claimed is toxic or elitist.. this is especially prevalent in discussions surrounding raid content as anyone who's been in those kinds of threads has very likely seen very often in those discussions.

    As someone who has been an advocate in these forums for many years telling people to play Gw2 how they want to play and not how the meta culture tells them to play I have to agree with a lot of what he talks about in the video.

    So if you are bored OP.. then I strongly suggest you listen to people here who are advising you to change your build or try another class and make something that you enjoy playing instead of copying some build off some website that will let you hit the biggest numbers.
    The fun is in the journey not the ending and building your own builds is far far more enjoyable than just copying someone else's and playing it how they tell you to.
    Go with a build that is something unusual and different.. that alone will make you feel kinda unique from everyone else, trust me I've been doing this for years and it's one of the reasons I still enjoy playing Gw2 :)

    Great post and I totally agree.
    I've been reading some guides, but I've never copied them. I read the guides to get a better understanding on how different attributes contribute to the build. Then I try to modify that guide into a build that will suite me and my playstyle better. I also don't compete with anyone, I just try to do what I think is fun (which seems to be the point of the video you linked). I have a very casual and chill attitude when playing Guild Wars 2, even when I'm farming. At the moment, crafting 250 mithril axes for the Astralaria will require 1500 mithril ore and 1500 elder wood. Which means it will take time. So I will take my time, mining when there's an opportunity but I can ignore that mine for a couple of hours (or actually days!) if a friend is in need of help with another mission... or if someone asks in /map for help with something.
    Trying to enjoy the game and take the opportunities that appear to try out stuff that I usually don't think about, trying the experience and also take an hours just to /sit and make some jokes in /map. Sometimes we need to take the distance and have fun, which I believe that's why we play the games.
    Also, helping another player is helping that player to get a good experience of the game, having fun.

    When I play fractals and dungeons, so far I've had the luck to be in parties where everyone had lots of patience. See, my jumping is bad and I always need lots of tries before I manage to get to the end. I fall a lot and always end up being last there. I still laughed so hard when three party members stood at the end cheering me on and saying "Come one! You can do it!"
    That was "having fun". I loved them for it, and their patience.
    In another party when we played another dungeon and were fighting a dog/puppy. Someone made a joke and I noticed everyone just stopped fighting, it almost wiped out the entire party. My guess is, we all laughed and eventually we killed the puppy and we also had lots of fun doing it (no real animals were harmed, I promise).
    The same way, we need to be able to find a build or take a break from the daily farming/grinding and accept that it may take an extra day or two to reach the goal. When we forget about having fun, that's when we start asking if the game has become boring or if it's time to take a break from the game.

    But I believe that guides are okay, it's more about how you use them and adapt them to your build that will make the difference. Do you just copy it and implement as is, or do you get inspired and try to understand it before implementing your own version of it?

  • KelyNeli.4516KelyNeli.4516 Member ✭✭✭

    @Kodama.6453 said:

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:
    I too love to get killed by any single breeze of air on my elementalist. I need to take some lessons with sasuke uchiha so i could learn sharingan, so i could play this profession effectively without dying to a veteran mob skill out of blue.

    You are doing it wrong. The trick is not to get killed by a breeze as the elementalist, but to kill the enemies with a breeze.

    That would be the case if ele had any good damage.
    Berserker has higher damage, higher burst and is like 3 times as tanky.

  • Pirogen.9561Pirogen.9561 Member ✭✭✭

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:

    @Kodama.6453 said:

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:
    I too love to get killed by any single breeze of air on my elementalist. I need to take some lessons with sasuke uchiha so i could learn sharingan, so i could play this profession effectively without dying to a veteran mob skill out of blue.

    You are doing it wrong. The trick is not to get killed by a breeze as the elementalist, but to kill the enemies with a breeze.

    That would be the case if ele had any good damage.
    Berserker has higher damage, higher burst and is like 3 times as tanky.

    This https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lz2IuVLrnQ is low damage and squishy?

  • Kodama.6453Kodama.6453 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:

    @Kodama.6453 said:

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:
    I too love to get killed by any single breeze of air on my elementalist. I need to take some lessons with sasuke uchiha so i could learn sharingan, so i could play this profession effectively without dying to a veteran mob skill out of blue.

    You are doing it wrong. The trick is not to get killed by a breeze as the elementalist, but to kill the enemies with a breeze.

    That would be the case if ele had any good damage.
    Berserker has higher damage, higher burst and is like 3 times as tanky.

    Weaver beats all warrior specs when it comes to damage benchmarks.....

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lucio.4190 said:

    @Teratus.2859 said:
    I think your problem OP isn't so much about the balance of PvE but more your own play habits.
    i'm not saying that there isn't a balance problem, we all know that some classes perform better than others that's just the nature of games with options like that.

    But if you're playing the same build and you are "bored" then that says to me that you don't actually enjoy playing that build and probably do so because it's the "optimal" or "meta" for your class and that fault is really on you then.

    I recommend watching this very recently uploaded video by Josh Strife Hayes, while the title is about game guides he actually gets into a lot about how games have fallen into a state of fun vs efficiency and how the more optimised you play the game the more fun you optimise out of the game which can be greatly applied to Gw2 and the meta culture that exists in this game which many people have often criticised and in some cases claimed is toxic or elitist.. this is especially prevalent in discussions surrounding raid content as anyone who's been in those kinds of threads has very likely seen very often in those discussions.

    As someone who has been an advocate in these forums for many years telling people to play Gw2 how they want to play and not how the meta culture tells them to play I have to agree with a lot of what he talks about in the video.

    So if you are bored OP.. then I strongly suggest you listen to people here who are advising you to change your build or try another class and make something that you enjoy playing instead of copying some build off some website that will let you hit the biggest numbers.
    The fun is in the journey not the ending and building your own builds is far far more enjoyable than just copying someone else's and playing it how they tell you to.
    Go with a build that is something unusual and different.. that alone will make you feel kinda unique from everyone else, trust me I've been doing this for years and it's one of the reasons I still enjoy playing Gw2 :)

    Great post and I totally agree.
    I've been reading some guides, but I've never copied them. I read the guides to get a better understanding on how different attributes contribute to the build. Then I try to modify that guide into a build that will suite me and my playstyle better. I also don't compete with anyone, I just try to do what I think is fun (which seems to be the point of the video you linked). I have a very casual and chill attitude when playing Guild Wars 2, even when I'm farming. At the moment, crafting 250 mithril axes for the Astralaria will require 1500 mithril ore and 1500 elder wood. Which means it will take time. So I will take my time, mining when there's an opportunity but I can ignore that mine for a couple of hours (or actually days!) if a friend is in need of help with another mission... or if someone asks in /map for help with something.
    Trying to enjoy the game and take the opportunities that appear to try out stuff that I usually don't think about, trying the experience and also take an hours just to /sit and make some jokes in /map. Sometimes we need to take the distance and have fun, which I believe that's why we play the games.
    Also, helping another player is helping that player to get a good experience of the game, having fun.

    When I play fractals and dungeons, so far I've had the luck to be in parties where everyone had lots of patience. See, my jumping is bad and I always need lots of tries before I manage to get to the end. I fall a lot and always end up being last there. I still laughed so hard when three party members stood at the end cheering me on and saying "Come one! You can do it!"
    That was "having fun". I loved them for it, and their patience.
    In another party when we played another dungeon and were fighting a dog/puppy. Someone made a joke and I noticed everyone just stopped fighting, it almost wiped out the entire party. My guess is, we all laughed and eventually we killed the puppy and we also had lots of fun doing it (no real animals were harmed, I promise).
    The same way, we need to be able to find a build or take a break from the daily farming/grinding and accept that it may take an extra day or two to reach the goal. When we forget about having fun, that's when we start asking if the game has become boring or if it's time to take a break from the game.

    But I believe that guides are okay, it's more about how you use them and adapt them to your build that will make the difference. Do you just copy it and implement as is, or do you get inspired and try to understand it before implementing your own version of it?

    Yeah, I don't think guides are a negative thing at all either, I use them a lot myself especially for things like achievement hunting but I don't use them to the detriment of my experience.
    If I see one saying use these stats or obtain this item asap cause it's so great then that stuff I'll avoid and make a note to try or come back to another time to see how different it is to what I did on my own.

    Those moments you mentioned in fractals are definitely memorable experiences and yeah I agree you'll remember them because of how fun they are and how you felt in that moment ^^
    It's stuff like that which is really why people enjoy MMO's imo.
    When I run that kind of content as well I always advertise my groups with "All Welcome" I don't care if there are under leveled or under geared people wanting to play, if anything it makes me want to look out for them and keep them alive as best I can which adds a whole new layer of fun to the experience for me.

    One of my favourite memories of looking out for others was a few years back when I was finishing up some bounty creatures I was missing in my achievements and I finally managed to get the LEgendary bounty Seneb the Desecrated to spawn in Sandswept isles (previous attempts had resulted in Joko trolling)
    I was going to just solo him like I had been doing with the other bounties but I figured I'd give a shoutout in chat in case anyone else may have needed it.. why not right?
    Only 3 other people decided to come for the fight and they quickly started talking about our chances of success with such a small group lol
    I told them we'll be fine and jokingly proclaimed that we would definitely win because I can't die XD (I was running a power tank minion Master build)
    I also told them that I'd look out for them keep them alive as best I could and then pretty much dived right in to the fight to stop wasting the timer.

    I kept every single one of those guys alive for the whole fight, healing them with my shroud 4 and reviving them when they went down and we even got the kill as well with only a few seconds left on the timer much to everyone's surprise.
    We all hung out for a few minutes after cheering our success and having fun, I even got praised when one of the players said I kept my promise to keep them all alive lol
    It was a good fight and it really felt like we had achieved something when we won because of the circumstances of the fight.
    Our low numbers, the confidence of success in the minds of each of the players involved, the presence of that particular enemy due to it's Legendary status.

    It's easy to feel like you can't win in those circumstances and your just "wasting your time" as Josh says in the video but it was those circumstances which made that particular fight so memorable and fun for me and I expect for the the other 3 players who got to share that experience with me as well.
    I've killed so many legendary creatures and world bosses and stuff in Gw2.. but the battles I remember best with them are the ones where I fight them alone or with only a handful of other people and we really have to work for that kill ^^

  • Armen.1483Armen.1483 Member ✭✭✭

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:

    @Kodama.6453 said:

    @KelyNeli.4516 said:
    I too love to get killed by any single breeze of air on my elementalist. I need to take some lessons with sasuke uchiha so i could learn sharingan, so i could play this profession effectively without dying to a veteran mob skill out of blue.

    You are doing it wrong. The trick is not to get killed by a breeze as the elementalist, but to kill the enemies with a breeze.

    That would be the case if ele had any good damage.
    Berserker has higher damage, higher burst and is like 3 times as tanky.

    Elementalist got a very good damage. Both power and condi weaver and tempest. Same with bursts. Even condi weaver's burst can be higher than power berserker. Squishiness is not an issue either if you play the same stats and in certain scenarios in open world you have builds with a very tanky ele. In group content where dealing much damage is relevant your supports will keep you alive. In open world try another builds wiht self sustaining boons, use water and earth and you won't die, but it is not easy if you just wanna mash keys. Gotta learn playing ele unlike warriors. It takes some time, but worth it.
    Warrior is just extremely easy to play, you don't need any practice to do good damage as berserker while some ele builds are very difficult, so we end up seeing warriors outdpsing elementalists because of the skill gap of the players.