Mirage cloak while CC'd... are you serious? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Mirage cloak while CC'd... are you serious?

How did almost no one notice this...in a year since PoF came out? Fighting a class being able to dodge while cc'd is the most unfun fight i've fought in all my 6 years of PvP/WvW roaming. I've been looking all over the wiki about Mirage cloak and even there it doesn't say anything about mirage cloak being able to be activated while CC'd.
And also what I'd like to point out... Mirage is a complete upgrade to (core) mesmer. Like firebrand, there are almost NO risks or drawbacks using the elite spec. Holosmith (which i love to play.. but has horrendous spam) has to deal with the Heat levels. Spellbreakers has to deal with the fact that their burst is always having the effect of lvl 1 adrenaline bursts. And Renegade....well...renegade.
And what do mirages have to be careful of? What drawbacks to they get? No dodge-roll animation?... Sorry i just hate god-mode carry-me classes.
(also, I'm not talking about EM as that already has it's nerfs as it deserves. IMO being able to activate dodge while CC and have jaunt at the same time is worse atm)

<1

Comments

  • mrauls.6519mrauls.6519 Member ✭✭✭

    Real talk - I didn't realize until recently that Mirages can still dodge while CC'ed. I thought it was only with the stunbreak trait LOL

    Twitch | YouTube

    Currently enjoying Holosmith.

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    How did almost no one notice this...

    Welcome to 2017

    Never dodge while dazed (EM handicap) | My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • Horan.7013Horan.7013 Member ✭✭
    edited December 6, 2018

    Mesmer and its elite specs cannot be nerfed. It has to be OP in all game modes until GW2 is no longer in service.
    All hope is lost. But it is not too late. Get on the Mirage bandwagon. :)

  • Mirage Cloak it's only causing problems.
    Not only they should not be able to use Mirage Cloak while stunned without a stun break.
    Ambushes, Deceptions, and all core skills usable while using the core dodge roll, like shatters is all Mirages should be able to use during a mirage cloak.

    Nothing else.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    Mirage Cloak it's only causing problems.
    Not only they should not be able to use Mirage Cloak while stunned without a stun break.
    Ambushes, Deceptions, and all core skills usable while using the core dodge roll, like shatters is all Mirages should be able to use during a mirage cloak.

    Nothing else.

    This is a recipe for the remaining mesmer mains to all tumble out of the top 250 despite how they're currently the second lowest represented only above ele.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    Mirage Cloak it's only causing problems.
    Not only they should not be able to use Mirage Cloak while stunned without a stun break.
    Ambushes, Deceptions, and all core skills usable while using the core dodge roll, like shatters is all Mirages should be able to use during a mirage cloak.

    Nothing else.

    This is a recipe for the remaining mesmer mains to all tumble out of the top 250 despite how they're currently the second lowest represented only above ele.

    Even if that was true, it still has to be done. Because wether you want to tune mesmers up or down, this has to be out of the way first.
    Once this is fixed, if they are still having trouble, it's time for some further improvements.
    Do you think they are going to get any decent buffs while their metrics keep showing how some people can avoid being interrupted and evade while stunned so often?

    Being able to evade while stunned and while activating core skills that can't be activated during a core dodge is also harming Mirage on the long run. Keeping some cheese builds that exploit this is not worth the downsides.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 7, 2018

    I thought this Thread was another meme. I was right!
    Insert Mirage EM complaints here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/56870/mesmer-elusive-mind-nerf-are-you-happy-now#latest

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 7, 2018

    @Crinn.7864 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    This is a recipe for the remaining mesmer mains to all tumble out of the top 250 despite how they're currently the second lowest represented only above ele.

    I'm calling BS on this. the data necessary to make that claim isn't available to players.

    I'm generally pretty familiar with what most everyone in the top 250 plays on NA since I've seen the exact same people for over a year now. Can I break down 100% exactly how many games they played in ranked this season per class? No, but I know enough to know what they main. And for some I'm not familiar with in game through experience I'm familiar with them from the forums, necro main.

    Almost no one is like WoodenPotatoes and has to play a different build everyday except Koto in my experience.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 7, 2018

    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    CLICK HERE FOR A FREE SCREEN CLEANING SERVICE
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion - Playing till last friend leaves.

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    That's not how that works when Holo and Spellbreaker are also better sidenoders than Mirage at this point.

    And also, if Mirage is so strong it would have more representation throughout the top 250 than second lowest representation.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • Tiah.3091Tiah.3091 Member ✭✭✭

    As I recently came into platinum games, all I can see are HOLO (2-4 per game) and SPELLBREAKERS (1-2 per game). Boonbeasts are still quite rare. May be 1 per 2-3 games. Sick-em LB sniper is still much more popular build at this rating.
    Condi mirages are may be 0.5-1 per game. Power mirages are kitten 0 per game, apart from myself, lol. (seriously, I forgot the last time I saw a power mirage above silver).

    But seriously, though, this trio (holo, sb, boonbeast) is kitten nuts right now. I have a feeling, that whoever is whining about them is still sitting in bronze-silver-low gold

  • bravan.3876bravan.3876 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 7, 2018

    I don't get what problem ppl have with hitting a mirage, as long as they do not stack stealth and detargetskills (illusionary ambush, axe 3 still too low cd, still broken in how strong they are) you don't even need a stun or cc to hit them. And in case you want a cc with follow up that can't get dodged than bait and count dodges. Every class can perma spam high dmg a mirage needs to avoid due to no facetank ability. So what exactly is the problem? Mirage cloak is not op or broken, it has counter play. Its a strong feature true but that's it. Boonbeast, Holo are the biggest beasts out there. And core guard is still way to easy to play for the reward it gives. Condimirage is "only" the 3. lamest in the row of side/node duelists and power mirage is not viable, not even with mirage cloak. What makes condi/hybrid mirage so strong is not the dodge mechanic itself.

    "playing revenant is borderline exploiting" - up condimirage 2k18

  • @whoknocks.4935 said:
    If you think about it dodging while CC'd is nothing compared to get 1000 toughness and heal when you get CC'd. Or people carried by double elixir s.
    Last day I fought and engi he used 6 damb elixir s during a single fight and always kept resetting the fight and at the end he managed to win because of that carrying kitten, that's fair yeah.

    Welcome to my world xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

  • @Crinn.7864 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    This is a recipe for the remaining mesmer mains to all tumble out of the top 250 despite how they're currently the second lowest represented only above ele.

    I'm calling BS on this. the data necessary to make that claim isn't available to players.

    If you're playing at a certain level you know every players around your level so let's say your top 30-50 you probably know every players from top 1 to top 100-150, wich enable people to know what classes are represented the most within that range.

  • Sampson.2403Sampson.2403 Member ✭✭✭

    Funny how many people think mirage is busted, then they go try n play it themselves and they suck at it. What's the common variable there? Not understanding how to play around the mechanics of mirage.

    Like others have mentioned, just watch the buff bar on the mirage for the cloak boon & super speed. Then also on your own buff bar for confusion/torment and stow your weapons/stop moving accordingly.

    Stop nerfing mirage. I've had to switch to playing condi mirage since power mirage (which i think is way more fun) isn't very viable anymore.

  • @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 8, 2018

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • XECOR.2814XECOR.2814 Member ✭✭✭

    @Sampson.2403 said:
    Funny how many people think mirage is busted, then they go try n play it themselves and they suck at it. What's the common variable there? Not understanding how to play around the mechanics of mirage.

    Like others have mentioned, just watch the buff bar on the mirage for the cloak boon & super speed. Then also on your own buff bar for confusion/torment and stow your weapons/stop moving accordingly.

    Stop nerfing mirage. I've had to switch to playing condi mirage since power mirage (which i think is way more fun) isn't very viable anymore.

    Power mirage is as viable as it can be. Its just not god mode now and needs high level of skill. Try playing other classes and go back to condi mirage to feel the difference between god and peasants. Obviously you will feel it if you are skilled. A pleb wont understand the difference.

  • Sampson.2403Sampson.2403 Member ✭✭✭

    @XECOR.2814 said:

    @Sampson.2403 said:
    Funny how many people think mirage is busted, then they go try n play it themselves and they suck at it. What's the common variable there? Not understanding how to play around the mechanics of mirage.

    Like others have mentioned, just watch the buff bar on the mirage for the cloak boon & super speed. Then also on your own buff bar for confusion/torment and stow your weapons/stop moving accordingly.

    Stop nerfing mirage. I've had to switch to playing condi mirage since power mirage (which i think is way more fun) isn't very viable anymore.

    Power mirage is as viable as it can be. Its just not god mode now and needs high level of skill. Try playing other classes and go back to condi mirage to feel the difference between god and peasants. Obviously you will feel it if you are skilled. A pleb wont understand the difference.

    I don't think condi mirage is god mode but it is very easy to play.

  • XECOR.2814XECOR.2814 Member ✭✭✭

    @Sampson.2403 said:

    @XECOR.2814 said:

    @Sampson.2403 said:
    Funny how many people think mirage is busted, then they go try n play it themselves and they suck at it. What's the common variable there? Not understanding how to play around the mechanics of mirage.

    Like others have mentioned, just watch the buff bar on the mirage for the cloak boon & super speed. Then also on your own buff bar for confusion/torment and stow your weapons/stop moving accordingly.

    Stop nerfing mirage. I've had to switch to playing condi mirage since power mirage (which i think is way more fun) isn't very viable anymore.

    Power mirage is as viable as it can be. Its just not god mode now and needs high level of skill. Try playing other classes and go back to condi mirage to feel the difference between god and peasants. Obviously you will feel it if you are skilled. A pleb wont understand the difference.

    I don't think condi mirage is god mode but it is very easy to play.

    I dont agree with you. Mirage IS god mode in this game. Sheer amount of sustain is sickening. And relentless condi bombs that tick 1/4 of your hp every second. Oof.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 8, 2018

    @XECOR.2814 said:

    @Sampson.2403 said:

    @XECOR.2814 said:

    @Sampson.2403 said:
    Funny how many people think mirage is busted, then they go try n play it themselves and they suck at it. What's the common variable there? Not understanding how to play around the mechanics of mirage.

    Like others have mentioned, just watch the buff bar on the mirage for the cloak boon & super speed. Then also on your own buff bar for confusion/torment and stow your weapons/stop moving accordingly.

    Stop nerfing mirage. I've had to switch to playing condi mirage since power mirage (which i think is way more fun) isn't very viable anymore.

    Power mirage is as viable as it can be. Its just not god mode now and needs high level of skill. Try playing other classes and go back to condi mirage to feel the difference between god and peasants. Obviously you will feel it if you are skilled. A pleb wont understand the difference.

    I don't think condi mirage is god mode but it is very easy to play.

    I dont agree with you. Mirage IS god mode in this game. Sheer amount of sustain is sickening. And relentless condi bombs that tick 1/4 of your hp every second. Oof.

    What sustain? You know there's a difference between the terms survivability and sustain right? Mirage has high active survivability and very low sustain.

    If you look at the four main side noding builds right now, Holosmith, Boonbeast, Spellbreaker, and Soulbeast all of them have leagues more self healing than Condi Mirage on top of better ways of handling being heavily loaded with conditions that Mirage actually can't deal with very well at all. That's actual sustain. And aside from portaling out, which is almost a waste of portal, all of them have similar levels of disengage as Mirage.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • everyman.4375everyman.4375 Member ✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited 1:30AM

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

    That's not proof of the stats being irrelevant so much as evidence suggesting that Holo is over performing and thus is represented more in platinum tier games than it's population suggests it should be.

    Yeah, it's GW2 overall and not just PvP. But people queuing ranked are not likely to be that different from those stats either. There's still likely about 11% of the community queuing as elementalists. It's just they're mostly stuck in gold and silver and you're unlikely to ever see them. There's likely still about 9% of the community queueing ranked as Holosmiths, but Holosmith is way over performing so more and more of them are being carried to Platinum and top 250 rated games.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • everyman.4375everyman.4375 Member ✭✭
    edited 1:26AM

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

    That's not proof of the stats being irrelevant so much as evidence suggesting that Holo is over performing and thus is represented more in platinum tier games than it's population suggests it should be.

    It is.
    -> A large majority of players play PvE
    -> Engineer has never been the best in PvE (almost)
    -> So most people don't play engineer

    Pvp population being a minority those stats mean nothing.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited 1:36AM

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

    That's not proof of the stats being irrelevant so much as evidence suggesting that Holo is over performing and thus is represented more in platinum tier games than it's population suggests it should be.

    It is.
    -> A large majority of players play PvE
    -> Engineer has never been the best in PvE (almost)
    -> So most people don't play engineer

    Pvp population being a minority those stats mean nothing.

    There's always some flavor of the month bandwagoning going on in PvP (Like last season when Anet Ben said Reaper had "one of the highest participation and win ratios in Ranked") but at the end of the day if you're in platinum or the top 250 it's less that you're seeing massive shifts in player class population towards engineer so much as more holosmiths being carried to platinum with a build that is greatly over performing at the moment and muscling out builds with less high win ratios in conquest. Simple as that.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

  • everyman.4375everyman.4375 Member ✭✭

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

    That's not proof of the stats being irrelevant so much as evidence suggesting that Holo is over performing and thus is represented more in platinum tier games than it's population suggests it should be.

    It is.
    -> A large majority of players play PvE
    -> Engineer has never been the best in PvE (almost)
    -> So most people don't play engineer

    Pvp population being a minority those stats mean nothing.

    There's always some flavor of the month bandwagoning going on in PvP (Like last season when Anet Ben said Reaper had "one of the highest participation and win ratios in Ranked") but at the end of the day if you're in platinum or the top 250 it's less that you're seeing massive shifts in player class population towards engineer so much as more holosmiths being carried to platinum with a build that is greatly over performing at the moment and muscling out builds with less high win ratios in conquest. Simple as that.

    That's not the point, my point was that the stats that you used were worthless.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @everyman.4375 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What's hurting Mirage is that after a year of nerfs nibbling away at the margines in every area of the class have caught up to mirage
    and left a number classes who have remained relatively unscathed or even buffed, notably holosmith, boonbeast and spellbreaker, and able to run rough shot over the ladder. It doesn't help that boonbeast is easily the strongest side noder in the game, directly competes against Mirage as a side noder, is overtuned enough to always see 2-4.of them every single platinum game, and hard counters mirage about as hard as a build can counter another build in this game.

    But none of that means Mirage is weak.
    It has a hard counter that is as common as Mirage.
    Making it like the second strongest class, as the strongest one is a direct counter to it.
    (totally not sure what the power ratings from class to class are atm, take that as an example)

    Why it's the least represented is because nobody likes playing mesmer. I know I never did.

    Also mesmer is middle of the road in player population overall. Less played than warriors, guardians and rangers among the player population. About the same as thieves, eles and necros. Revanents are 2nd to last and Engineers are last when it comes to players.

    And Anet HAS released those statistics. So arguing player population for Mirage's low representation doesn't cut it.

    1. Guardian, Warrior, Ranger 12%
    2. Elementalist, Necromancer, Mesmer, Thief 11%
    3. Revanent 10%
    4. Engineer 9%

    @Stallic.2397 said:

    @sephiroth.4217 said:
    Dont worry next expansions will have invulns on dodge or nuke drops on dodge.

    Dodge roll towards an enemy and one-shot them

    Mine Sweeper Holosmiths were doing exactly that when POF launched.

    Those stats aren't relevant because those are the stats from Guild Wars 2 overall and not PvP, and most people play pve so that's not representative at all.
    As proof in your stats engineer is the least represented class while in PvP it might be the most represented.

    That's not proof of the stats being irrelevant so much as evidence suggesting that Holo is over performing and thus is represented more in platinum tier games than it's population suggests it should be.

    It is.
    -> A large majority of players play PvE
    -> Engineer has never been the best in PvE (almost)
    -> So most people don't play engineer

    Pvp population being a minority those stats mean nothing.

    There's always some flavor of the month bandwagoning going on in PvP (Like last season when Anet Ben said Reaper had "one of the highest participation and win ratios in Ranked") but at the end of the day if you're in platinum or the top 250 it's less that you're seeing massive shifts in player class population towards engineer so much as more holosmiths being carried to platinum with a build that is greatly over performing at the moment and muscling out builds with less high win ratios in conquest. Simple as that.

    That's not the point, my point was that the stats that you used were worthless.

    Even in PvP participation stats are unlikely to stretch too far outside 11% median for any one class, even with people finding some classes under powered and some classes over power and Flavor of the Month. Elite specs you'll likely see more lopsided representation.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion.

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