Tayga.3192

Rework hammer, buff elites Cya

where were u when necromancer is kil i was watching thief streams and eating dorito when phone ring "necromancer is kil" "no" All jokes aside, death shroud will have more value (in tanking) post patch. They probably nerfed stability for this.

Doesn't this patch nerf necro corrupts? Firebrand is a totally different issue.

Fighting a mesmer (using the same build) is the best, except oneshot core.

Oh, I forgot to take 0.75 into account. I'll edit my original comment.

Metabattle effect.Weaver was viable, but people just didn't play it. It was always a nice counter for condi mirage (on high level). Now we don't know what will or won't be meta.

I am tired of saying this but here we go again: Balance patch is the global changes.PvP changes aren't balance patch notes. They are just there for making a baseline, they will (if we trust their words) continue as usual with their balance patches. Everybody loves unused weapons, offmeta builds, homebrews etc. but remember that they were weak before the patch too. Nothing really changed for them.

Now that they have a baseline, hopefully they are reworked or buffed soon.

I'm a mainly PvP player, I don't play PvE at all, but this is great news!Also, this kind of communication (admitting shortcomings and pushing forward) makes me and probably many other players want to play all 3 game modes. Hopefully, the studio brings new content (instead of just talking) but it seems like Anet has been getting itself together lately with the big patch on competitive modes and fixing copy paste weapon skins from LNY.

Since complaints only give a few examples, After the patch, rework hammer and mace and we are good to go.

People of the forums, This was NOT a balance patch. It wasn't supposed to touch underused/overused skills. These pvp changes are just setting a base for incoming patches. If you want to see the real balance patch, go check the global changes.

This isn't a high paced FPS game like Quake, it's a fast paced MMORPG. You already don't have global cooldown.

POST PATCH EDIT:All except one of my "pretty sure"s are guessed correctly.3 of my "not that sure"s are guessed correctly. I think our current meta builds may stay meta, but we will most likely see more condi rev and renegade in our ranked matches. Other than that, not much will probably change. Pretty sure:Condi revenant (with or without any elites)Kalla X renegade (something tanky)Guardian (of at least one type)Necromancer (of at least one type)Thief (of at least one type)Spellbreaker (probably the same build as before) Not that sure:Lightning rod weaver (will still crit for 3k-4k)Fire weaverBunker scrapperPower holosmithCondi mesmer (probably mirage)Power heraldPower ranger (with or without soulbeast)Condi ranger (with or without soulbeast)

Some math:1 dodge is 300 units in 0.75 seconds in any direction.Mirage dodge is 261 units in 0.75 seconds, only going forward.

No, you are right but we are touching on different things.I guess some of my "toughness" words are used for "4-stat amulets with toughness in it", for example demolisher and paladin. Since it's a percentage damage reduction, if you get hit by a higher damage attack, your toughness does more work.So, if the total damage is nerfed, toughness loses value as a stat since it'll block x% of a lower damage skill instead of x% of a higher damage skill.

They didn't say it was a tradeoff, did they?

If a skill did 100 damage to light armor, if 13% is correct, heavy armor would take 87, which is 13 damage reduction. Now if the same skill does 10 damage to light armor, heavy armor would take 9 which is just 1 damage reduction.The difference gets more irrelevant as the damage gets smaller. If DS is Death Shroud, it probably will have more value since it can be "healed" as fast as it was before but it will get reduced relatively slower since damage is lower.

I was hinting to what you said in the conclusion section :)However, in the end, vitality is better in terms of pure math so healing power will have more value after patch hits.

I'll just dump my calculations and ideas here. Feel free to discuss. With the next patch, vitality and toughness on 4 stat amulets will be nerfed to 500 from 560. This has some consequences. Before you start:I used exotic weapons/armor stats since that's what I think pvp uses. Weapons use midpoint strength.The formula for damage calculation is = (weapon strength power skill coefficient) / (toughness + defense)A level 80 character has 1000 base power, 1000 base toughness and 1000 base vitality.Different armor classes have 920, 1064 and 1211 defense respectively.Before patch, critical attacks are always 187%, after patch they are 183% since we lose 50 ferocity.1 vitality increases maximum health by 10.Toughness is always there but vitality needs to be healed.Toughness doesn't affect conditions.Before patchLet's imagine a skill on hammer (midpoint 1048) with a power coefficient of 1 hitting a light armor target. If the attacker has 2050 power:No toughness: Damage done = (1048 2050 1) / (1000 + 920), approximately 1119 (crits for 2093).560 toughness: Damage done = (1048 2050 1) / (1560 + 920), so approximately 866 (crits for 1619).So in case of a critical hit, 560 extra toughness absorbed 474 damage. (This is less than Warrior's Healing Signet's two ticks) Trying this again with a bigger attack, for example with a coefficient of 2:No toughness: Damage done = (1048 2050 2) / (1000 + 920), approximately 2238 (crits for 4185).560 toughness: Damage done = (1048 2050 2) / (1560 + 920), so approximately 1733 (crits for 3241).So in case of a critical hit, 560 extra toughness absorbed 944 damage. (This is less than Warrior's Healing Signet's three ticks) 560 vitality gives 5600 maximum health, which is healed in approximately 17 ticks from Healing Signet. New question: Now that damage and healing is getting nerfed, which one gains more value? After patchNew coefficients for our hammer skills will be 0.67 and 1.34, considering both of our skills got nerfed by approximately 33%. Also, now that our attacker has 2000 power and 500 ferocity, meaning the damage will be less. On the other hand, 4 stat vitality amulets lose 600 base health and 4 stat toughness amulets lose 60 toughness.Also healing signet now heals less per tick, 230 instead of 344. Let's recalculate everything:No toughness: Damage done = (1048 2000 0.67) / (1000 + 920), approximately 750 (crits for 1373).500 toughness: Damage done = (1048 2000 0.67) / (1500 + 920), so approximately 580 (crits for 1061).So in case of a critical hit, 500 extra toughness absorbed 312 damage. (This is less than Healing Signet's two ticks) Trying this again with a bigger attack, for example with a coefficient of 1.34:No toughness: Damage done = (1048 2000 1.34 / (1000 + 920), approximately 1463 (crits for 2677).500 toughness: Damage done = (1048 2000 1.34) / (1500 + 920), so approximately 1160 (crits for 2123).So in case of a critical hit, 500 extra toughness absorbed 554 damage. (This is less than Healing Signet's three ticks) 500 vitality gives 5000 maximum health, which is healed in approximately 21 ticks from Healing Signet. Remark: Toughness helps more against bigger attacks, but is useless against conditions. However, vitality needs to be healed to be of use. After nerfs, 4-stat toughness amulets' values drops approximately 34% for small attacks and 41% for large attacks.With less healing, a 4-stat vitality amulet's vitality loses 19% of its value (healing extra health from amulet takes longer).New question: What if these low and high damage skills hit us 2 times? Conclusion and my opinionsConsidering two hits, 500 toughness absorbs 624 damage from 0.67 coefficient skill and 1108 damage from 1.34 damage skill.This patch makes toughness a bit less value, but against power damage it is still better considering you will get hit more than one time: Only if you can't really heal.If you can heal yourself or you are against condi damage, vitality still wins, but it also lost some of its value since healing is nerfed too.If you read everything until here, congratulations.

Why do ice creams have different flavors?

So now that they are lowering everything, hopefully overnerfed/underused/plain bad stuff will get buffed/reworked and overpowered stuff will get nerfed/reworked.