Does Anet hate Mesmers?

[Salt Mode.3780]

2 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Devs seem to come to the solution aslong as popular specc and classes are the ones overperforming theyre doing it right sadly. 

Hating on mesmer seems to be more popular then playing it, which likely is what leads to decisions. 

Although tbh player hatred surrounding mesmer has calmed down over the years we just seem to have trolls who like to come around everytime changes happen to mesmer and enjoy to post about how amazing it is. 

That and Anet are unwilling to dedicate the time to core mesmer needed to get it on a better path as it'd need a full rework.. Anet rarely go back and fix things they can't sell realistically. 

Its hilarious how they hate probably the most unique class across all MMO platforms. Then again its not the first time they shot themselves in the foot. Just look at the hypocrisies with the EoD specs, Feb patch made it so all CC skills did no damage, yet ALL of the EoD spec's CC skills do damage, pretty high damage as well.

Lets nerf Mesmer's Phantasms and clones because we want to remove the AI aspect of the game, here we are with untamed and mech.

Edited March 22, 2022 by Salt Mode.3780

[Veprovina.4876]

2 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Devs seem to come to the solution aslong as popular specc and classes are the ones overperforming theyre doing it right sadly. 

Hating on mesmer seems to be more popular then playing it, which likely is what leads to decisions. 

Although tbh player hatred surrounding mesmer has calmed down over the years we just seem to have trolls who like to come around everytime changes happen to mesmer and enjoy to post about how amazing it is. 

That and Anet are unwilling to dedicate the time to core mesmer needed to get it on a better path as it'd need a full rework.. Anet rarely go back and fix things they can't sell realistically. 

To be perfectly honest, over the years, they messed up so many related and unrelated things, with nerfs on top of each other, that nothing short of a complete rework can save Mesmer. 
And judging by the "does Anet hate mesmer" thread... Not likely to happen.

[Puck.3697]

1 minute ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Its hilarious how they hate probably the most unique class across all MMO platforms. Then again its not the first time they shot themselves in the foot. Just look at the hypocrisies with the EoD specs, Feb patch made it so all CC skills did no damage, yet ALL of the EoD spec's CC skills do damage, pretty high damage as well.

Lets nerf Mesmer's Phantasms and clones because we want to remove the AI aspect of the game, here we are with untamed and mech.

Weird how they basically shred the poster child of guild wars 2.  If anything id of expected them to capitalise on it. 

It's the proffession that sets gw2 apart from other mmorpgs. 

[Veprovina.4876]

1 minute ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Weird how they basically shred the poster child of guild wars 2.  If anything id of expected them to capitalise on it. 

It's the proffession that sets gw2 apart from other mmorpgs. 

I know right? Since the beginning, every publication has been praising the design and how unique it is.

But kitten that apparently.

[Puck.3697]

4 minutes ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

To be perfectly honest, over the years, they messed up so many related and unrelated things, with nerfs on top of each other, that nothing short of a complete rework can save Mesmer. 
And judging by the "does Anet hate mesmer" thread... Not likely to happen.

It's possible. But I doubt they will rework enough. Mesmer seems very alike elementalist as a proffession they seem to have rly struggled to make its elite mechanics different to each other. 

They release power creep on one aspect of the same mechanic and nerf everything surrounding it on repeat. 

I think personally Anet messed up making core mesmer clone / shatter focused as it's now become too hard to break it from that. 

Same with eles attunements. They can't break free from em 

While I like clones, at the same time I think clones coulda come in with a elite rather then groudbed into every aspect. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by Daddy.8125

[Veprovina.4876]

33 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

It's possible. But I doubt they will rework enough. Mesmer seems very alike elementalist as a proffession they seem to have rly struggled to make its elite mechanics different to each other. 

They release power creep on one aspect of the same mechanic and nerf everything surrounding it on repeat. 

I think personally Anet messed up making core mesmer clone / shatter focused as it's now become too hard to break it from that. 

Same with eles attunements. They can't break free from em 

While I like clones, at the same time I think clones coulda come in with a elite rather then groudbed into every aspect. 

Well, core wasn't always shatter focused. There was a phantasm build that was great for a while. 

You didn't need to shatter at all.

 

But they decided they want "active gameplay" or something, and made a mess. 

 

As for mechanics being different, they could have done that easily had they bothered. Putting mirage ambushes on F skills, or deception skills on F skills, that would have been different enough.

 

But Anet always goes the easy road, only, i'm not sure if it's because people working there are so incompetent that they can't (which - reworks on other profession mechanics suggests otherwise, they can do it), or lazy (again, doubt it), or hey, maybe biased and all of this was designed so mesmer can fail? 

 

More and more likely...

[viquing.8254]

11 hours ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Want to experience real PvP start dueling people in WvW with actual builds that you can customize.

As I agree that PvP amulet diversity is something, WvW is 80% of random PvE builds... Or oversustainable builds.

 

7 hours ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

Mesmer is very powerful. But most players suck with mesmer.

Feel like some times ago dev saying "rev are over-represented on top because top players love rev and tend to win" argument 😄 .

 

6 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

who is exactly "Dominating with Mesmer". RiP Quit GW2 because of the State of mesmer, Shorts Deleted the game along with everything he has tied to GW2 over the state of mesmer. Helseth is not happy with the state of mesmer.

You can add Misha who change class long time ago, and 3 other less known usuals plat3 mesmers to the list.

[Dr Meta.3158]

23 minutes ago, viquing.8254 said:

Feel like some times ago dev saying "rev are over-represented on top because top players love rev and tend to win" argument 😄 .

Which is why I said mesmers probably need a redesign rather than a buff. Because then the average mesmer will pub stomp the average player and top mesmers will be unstoppable gods. Game devs cannot balance to compensate for lack of wit, only just completely redesign.

[bibolda.8621]

I just want the Blackwater Mesmer built back. Now that we have so many strong classes in PVP, I really would love to have fun.
I find it unfair that it had been removed and in the meantime the thief still can do it. I do not even get why they need to restrict the builds and why we can not make unique ones focusing on couple of skills.
I do not find these new builds long lasting, I can not stand the ground long enough to hit out most of the players. It is a punishment to play and always get downed by someone.

[Legend of Rogue.5394]

On 3/16/2022 at 11:07 AM, raineybilly.6439 said:

Like for real, I know Power Mirage was kind of busted back in the day... but is there no way to make the spec even enjoyable in PVP Anymore or ANY Mesmer Build to just be on a fair standing ground in PVP. Mesmer has always been my main since 2017 when I started playing and since 2019 it's felt as if Anet doesn't even pay attention to it unless its nerfing something. I consistently hit Plat 2-3 most seasons playing other stuff but I don't get as much enjoyment from any other class then when I played Mes! I love the game and playing it, I just want the Class I love playing to feel like i'm not completely just holding my team back by playing a class I enjoy

 

tldr: Quit the game in 2020 cause Mesmer has been trash since 2019, Came back for EoD after 2/Hlf Yrs, They haven't touched Power Mes, being Mirage or Chrono or just Base.

- How does a Company just not balance a Class after multiple years of it under-performing other Classes & add a new Spec that's also pretty trash.

Anet just hates themselves and their player base

[Salt Mode.3780]

5 hours ago, bibolda.8621 said:

I just want the Blackwater Mesmer built back. Now that we have so many strong classes in PVP, I really would love to have fun.
I find it unfair that it had been removed and in the meantime the thief still can do it. I do not even get why they need to restrict the builds and why we can not make unique ones focusing on couple of skills.
I do not find these new builds long lasting, I can not stand the ground long enough to hit out most of the players. It is a punishment to play and always get downed by someone.

This is a big no....I've seen how stupid the blackwater build and I've personally played it. With how easy clones are to kill these days this arguably is worse then condi mirage, this setup paired with mirage is just gross.

However i do agree they need to give back some of our stuff to diversify our builds again.

[mortrialus.3062]

10 hours ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Its hilarious how they hate probably the most unique class across all MMO platforms. Then again its not the first time they shot themselves in the foot. Just look at the hypocrisies with the EoD specs, Feb patch made it so all CC skills did no damage, yet ALL of the EoD spec's CC skills do damage, pretty high damage as well.

Lets nerf Mesmer's Phantasms and clones because we want to remove the AI aspect of the game, here we are with untamed and mech.

The new lead balance dev, CMC, was a former pro player who mained Cele Ele back in pre-hot.  Even got into some of the world tournaments back in the day.

I dunno if you remember what fighting Cele ele was like.  It was one of if not the absolutely strongest builds in the game. You couldn't do this on a paid tournament level, but in game you could dominate group PvP with teams of 5 cele eles.

It was extremely unfun to fight against.  Cele Ele in fact represents the absolute worst of GW2's combat system when it comes to PvP.   It didn't hit particularly hard at all because it was on celestial stats.  But it had really really excellent self healing. 

So while it wasn't a true bunker, fights involving cele eles were absolutely boring sloshy messes.  Just players going back and forth dumping their entire skill bars into each other over and over while it is just resustained.  Just a boring sloshy mess, no one skill is unimpactful. There's no clearly landed attack that changes the course of the fight.  There's no good use of a defensive skill to completely avoid a devastating attack or stun.  It's just sloshy, boring, and insanely spammy and unimpactful. 

And this is what the guy who is now the lead balance dev said was the best era of GW2 PvP he wants to bring back.  When his boring af build that represents the absolute worst of GW2 combat and design was meta.  

And oh hey what did we get after Megabalance? An era where damage is lower than it was in vanilla, where fights are sloshy and drawn out and individual skills are extremely unimpactful, and where unkillable bunkers keep popping up over and over.

Not even about Mesmer in specific, but the entire direction of balance has been operating under the absolutely wrong philosophy.  GW2's combat is best when it's fast, snappy, and decisive.  When it's too characters impotently and limpwristedly slapping each other back and forth like it's largely been post megabalance it's an embarrassment. 

[psi.9304]

How about fixing the Glamour skills and put in a trait line that still exist... That should tell you how Anet thinks about Mesmers...

[Dr Meta.3158]

Also Mesmer is not a unique class, it is a dungeons and dragons bard that gives the ability to mesh different aspects of the different colleges into one build.

[Salt Mode.3780]

19 minutes ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

Also Mesmer is not a unique class, it is a dungeons and dragons bard that gives the ability to mesh different aspects of the different colleges into one build.

Please read....Mesmer is unique to the MMO genre....

[Dr Meta.3158]

5 minutes ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

Please read....Mesmer is unique to the MMO genre....

Build up charges then release and make clones. Never been done before.

[Levetty.1279]

On 3/21/2022 at 4:16 AM, mortrialus.3062 said:

Mesmer hasn't been remotely close to thief as a roamer since portal was smiters booned.

 

I meant a clunky bad pink thief. 

[Salt Mode.3780]

6 minutes ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

Build up charges then release and make clones. Never been done before.

The clones are charges you don't build up charges for clones to come out as well as how the clones interact god why do people post in threads they are unsure of...

Edited March 22, 2022 by Salt Mode.3780

[mortrialus.3062]

33 minutes ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

Also Mesmer is not a unique class, it is a dungeons and dragons bard that gives the ability to mesh different aspects of the different colleges into one build.

Kind of? Not really?  It's kind of bard like in that it combines using a sword and using spells the way D&D bards do.  But it very much is taking a huge amount of it's abilities from the D&D's Wizard school of Illusions. 

Blurr

Invisibility

Mirror Images

Mislead (Decoy)

Phantasmal Force

Phantasmal Killer

Phantasmal Nightmare

Silence.

And in terms of video games, especially MMORPGs, it is very very unique to see any game go as hard as realizing a dedicated illusionist / mentalist as Mesmer.  Compare Illusions in Skyrim where "Make person attack anything" or "Make person not attack" or "become invisible" is as deep as that game goes into illusions. 

Speaking of which Anet missed out on an opportunity to give mesmers fear with Virtuoso.  Also a glamour called Illusionary Terrain. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by mortrialus.3062

[Levetty.1279]

Anet missed out on an opportunity to give Mesmers an elite spec with Virtuoso.

[agrippastrilemma.8741]

17 hours ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

Worst balance in the genre.

It is pretty funny that they managed to make thief counter mesmer EVEN MORE than before, with spectre.

Edited March 23, 2022 by agrippastrilemma.8741

[mortrialus.3062]

23 minutes ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

It is pretty funny that they managed to make thief counter mesmer EVEN MORE than before, with spectre.

It'd be pretty funny if I didn't main mesmer.

"In PVP we have two classes that have good mobility and are designed to help capture objectives and quickly move from fight to fight." 

Oh so the two will be competitive with one another?

"Actually thief is going to always hard counter the mesmer by default."

oh

"We gave thief unparalleled speed.  Mesmers can use portal to return to objectives as well as move their team around." 

Oh cool so they both move around rapidly but in very unique and different ways.

"Actually we nerfed portal so bad it's unusable.  Also thieves have their own version of portal that's better but they don't use it because they don't need to because they're already so fast."

oh

"We added new elite specs, the specter and the virtuoso, that will really change the name of the game for both Thieves and Mesmers.  This should really shake things up after 2 years of Megabalance and mesmer being the worst class in the game"

Oh neat, so will Virtuoso counter thief the way thief has always countered mesmer?  Can virtuoso move around the map easier?

"Actually specter counters mesmer even harder than thief already countered mesmer. And virtuoso is hard counted by thief harder than mesmer already was for it's entire existence."

Edited March 23, 2022 by mortrialus.3062

[Dr Meta.3158]

29 minutes ago, mortrialus.3062 said:

It'd be pretty funny if I didn't main mesmer.

"In PVP we have two classes that have good mobility and are designed to help capture objectives and quickly move from fight to fight." 

Oh so the two will be competitive with one another?

"Actually thief is going to always hard counter the mesmer by default."

oh

"We gave thief unparalleled speed.  Mesmers can use portal to return to objectives as well as move their team around." 

Oh cool so they both move around rapidly but in very unique and different ways.

"Actually we nerfed portal so bad it's unusable.  Also thieves have their own version of portal that's better but they don't use it because they don't need to because they're already so fast."

oh

"We added new elite specs, the specter and the virtuoso, that will really change the name of the game for both Thieves and Mesmers.  This should really shake things up after 2 years of Megabalance and mesmer being the worst class in the game"

Oh neat, so will Virtuoso counter thief the way thief has always countered mesmer?  Can virtuoso move around the map easier?

"Actually specter counters mesmer even harder than thief already countered mesmer. And virtuoso is hard counted by thief harder than mesmer already was for it's entire existence."

This is pretty accurate.

Also to me, thief is the most unique class I've seen. It's a reality warping wizard that's posing as an assassin.

[Salt Mode.3780]

2 minutes ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

This is pretty accurate.

Also to me, thief is the most unique class I've seen. It's a reality warping wizard that's posing as an assassin.

I dont understand where the reality warping comes from...do you even play the game...? Or ru confused with DnD...

[Dr Meta.3158]

1 hour ago, mortrialus.3062 said:

Kind of? Not really?  It's kind of bard like in that it combines using a sword and using spells the way D&D bards do.  But it very much is taking a huge amount of it's abilities from the D&D's Wizard school of Illusions. 

Blurr

Invisibility

Mirror Images

Mislead (Decoy)

Phantasmal Force

Phantasmal Killer

Phantasmal Nightmare

Silence.

And in terms of video games, especially MMORPGs, it is very very unique to see any game go as hard as realizing a dedicated illusionist / mentalist as Mesmer.  Compare Illusions in Skyrim where "Make person attack anything" or "Make person not attack" or "become invisible" is as deep as that game goes into illusions. 

Speaking of which Anet missed out on an opportunity to give mesmers fear with Virtuoso.  Also a glamour called Illusionary Terrain. 

You can get this entire spell list with a single classed bard with the bard spell list and the few missing spells with magical secrets. And you can mimic the different specializations with the different college subclasses.