One Shot Soulbeast

[chokela.4823]

A simple stair can deny all projectiles, Trevor is right just learn to use environment.

[Hotride.2187]

1 hour ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

You guys need to chill out on these silver 2 wah wah wah Rapid Fire is so strong complaints. It's ridiculous and embarassing man. If you only knew how mediocre Ranger builds were in p2+ you'd just stop. Even in WvW, the most ABUSIVE Soulbeast builds in roaming aren't even using Longbow. They use Axe and Greatsword while stating for ultimate sustain. Longbow Soulbeasts are strong at range but if another strong roamer engages it, say a p2+ Condi Mirage vs. a p2+ Longbow Soulbeast stated for DPS, both of those players know the Condi Mirage is going to win in time.

No idea why you are quoting me and following with that. I've already commented what my problem is with the GS/LB build, it has too much sustain for what it does. What you are quoting is my reply to you listing a bunch of skills that supposedly dismount warclaws, but never do from all the time I spend roaming in wvw.

Also just lol with the silver mentions.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

15 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

Other ranged attacks that dismount Warclaw riders in less than 2 seconds:

1. Killshot - Warrior
2. Gunflame - Berserker
3. 7-shot - Renegade
4. True-shot - Dragonhunter
5. Grenades - Engi, Scrapper, Holo, Mechanist
6. Death's Judgement or PD condi bursts - Deadeye & all condi Thief builds
7. Druid Staff with a single use of Sharp Stone - To example how easy it is to dismount Warclaw riders in general
8. Power Shatters - Mesmer, Chrono, Mirage, Viruoso
9. Fresh Air channels - Ele, Tempest, Weaver, Catalyst
10. Harbinger Shroud or any ranged combo attack from the plethora of ranged AoEs the Necromancer has
11. Literally any teleport in melee burst which for all intents & purposes has as much range as ranged projectiles 

Also, something important to note:

Ranger is the only class left that does not have ground target/disengage teleports. Even Bladesworn now has ground target teleportation as well as Mechanist. Consider that maybe Ranger needs to have ranged attacks if it is the only class that doesn't have ground target teleports that can be used for instant disengagement.

Furthermore, for any of you who are having sooooo much trouble with Soulbeast Longbows, let me explain to you what you are doing wrong, by explaining how to deal with it class to class and build to build:

1. First and foremost, understand that LOSing is a real thing and it is intended to be used so start using it.
2. Warrior/Berserker/Spellbreaker/Bladesworn - They counter Soulbeast DPS, just get aggressive and stop trying to kite a ranged class with a melee class. What did you expect would happen when you do this? You have to utilize the reveals on Magebane and Shouts, chase the Soulbeast and be aggressive with CCs. This is not difficult to do.
3. Heralds & Vindicators - You counter Soulbeasts if you stay aggressive with teleport bursting. If you can land the first burst on the Soulbeast before it bursts you, you should win unless the Soulbeast is such a good player that it can outskill you and make a comeback in this situation where it should be getting countered.
4. Renegade - Use Dwarf Taunt - Lightning Reflex is bugged and doesn't work vs Taunt CC. This is easy to exploit vs any Ranger.
5. Guardians Firebrands - STAY AWAY from Soulbeasts. Everything about your archetype gets countered by anything with ranged pressure that can kite.
6. DH - Abuse LOS in conjunction with trap stacks to block the Soulbeast's movement. Don't go ham on the Soulbeast, it wins easily if you over extend cool-downs. But if you play the long-game and face it very defensively and counter-offensively, it is extremely difficult for the Soulbeast to get at you and it can easily get one-burst by a pull into traps just as easily as it can one-burst you. 
7. Willbender - This is strong vs Soulbeasts actually. It has enough teleports to stay on top of the Soulbeast so it has no breathing room for reposition or offensive cycles without taking a lot of DPS while performing the offense. If you stay aggressive with Willbender, it forces the Soulbeast to play nearly 100% defensively or it dies, which will discontinue his DPSing. It's the same reason why Power Herald should always counter DPS Soulbeast.
8. Engineer - It's in a bad place in general. Don't plan on countering anything with a Core Engi.
9. Scrapper - If it uses Flame Thrower and stays on top of the Soulbeast, the Soulbeast will lose unless the Soulbeast is an exceptionally better player than the Scrapper. When the Soulbeast is unable to use CCs to stop up the Scrapper, due to Juggernaut, the Soulbeast can't do what it needs to do to set up for bursts or survive.
10. Holosmith - It counters Soulbeast if it stays aggressive. However, if the Holo is a mediocre player and dawdles his actions wasting time and isn't aggressive enough, the Soulbeast will win.
11. Thief Daredevil Deadeye Specter - Sic Em One Wolf Pack Soulbeast is your ultimate counter. Stay away from Soulbeasts. You're own fault if you don't.
12. Ranger Druid Soulbeast Untamed - Tanky Ranger variants counter DPS Ranger variants. It's always been this way and it always will for certain reasons of how the class is designed. IF you want hard counter Soulbeast DPS, run tanky Ranger variants, especially condi. If the Soulbeast DPS is still beating you, he is outskilling you.
13. Mes Chrono Mirage Virtuoso - Any sustainy Mesmer build counters Soulbeast DPS, eventually. If you are dying to Soulbeast DPS as any Mesmer variant, you are seriously misunderstanding how to correctly play the Mesmer class.
14. Ele Tempest Weaver Cata - If you are not able to routinely kill Rangers or at least survive against them as any Ele build, you are doing something very wrong. Everything about the Ele class is designed to completely counter Ranger longbow DPS.
15. Necro Reaper Scourge - Sic Em One Wolf Pack Soulbeast is your ultimate counter. Stay away from them. You're own fault if you don't.
16. Harbinger - Right now it slightly counters Soulbeast IF it can get in close and stay on the Soulbeast. Don't approach the Soulbeast unless you know it is unaware of the approach and you can get in on him first, and then the Harbinger can statistically bully it.

Buff soulbeasts! 

[Crozame.4098]

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

Other ranged attacks that dismount Warclaw riders in less than 2 seconds:

1. Killshot - Warrior
2. Gunflame - Berserker
3. 7-shot - Renegade
4. True-shot - Dragonhunter
5. Grenades - Engi, Scrapper, Holo, Mechanist
6. Death's Judgement or PD condi bursts - Deadeye & all condi Thief builds
7. Druid Staff with a single use of Sharp Stone - To example how easy it is to dismount Warclaw riders in general
8. Power Shatters - Mesmer, Chrono, Mirage, Viruoso
9. Fresh Air channels - Ele, Tempest, Weaver, Catalyst
10. Harbinger Shroud or any ranged combo attack from the plethora of ranged AoEs the Necromancer has
11. Literally any teleport in melee burst which for all intents & purposes has as much range as ranged projectiles 

Have you considered the range? And most of them do not dismount + kill in 2 seconds..

 

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Also, something important to note:

Ranger is the only class left that does not have ground target/disengage teleports. Even Bladesworn now has ground target teleportation as well as Mechanist. Consider that maybe Ranger needs to have ranged attacks if it is the only class that doesn't have ground target teleports that can be used for instant disengagement.

 

if I remember correctly untamed has port? On another note, given the amount of stealth, do rangers really need disengage teleports?

 

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Furthermore, for any of you who are having sooooo much trouble with Soulbeast Longbows, let me explain to you what you are doing wrong, by explaining how to deal with it class to class and build to build:

1. First and foremost, understand that LOSing is a real thing and it is intended to be used so start using it.

LOSing is an argument for everything, lich can also be LOSed.... But again, you are assuming the necros are retards that pop lich up on CD/

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

1. Warrior/Berserker/Spellbreaker/Bladesworn - They counter Soulbeast DPS, just get aggressive and stop trying to kite a ranged class with a melee class. What did you expect would happen when you do this? You have to utilize the reveals on Magebane and Shouts, chase the Soulbeast and be aggressive with CCs. This is not difficult to do.

 

 

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

1. Heralds & Vindicators - You counter Soulbeasts if you stay aggressive with teleport bursting. If you can land the first burst on the Soulbeast before it bursts you, you should win unless the Soulbeast is such a good player that it can outskill you and make a comeback in this situation where it should be getting countered.
2. Renegade - Use Dwarf Taunt - Lightning Reflex is bugged and doesn't work vs Taunt CC. This is easy to exploit vs any Ranger.
3. Guardians Firebrands - STAY AWAY from Soulbeasts. Everything about your archetype gets countered by anything with ranged pressure that can kite.
4. DH - Abuse LOS in conjunction with trap stacks to block the Soulbeast's movement. Don't go ham on the Soulbeast, it wins easily if you over extend cool-downs. But if you play the long-game and face it very defensively and counter-offensively, it is extremely difficult for the Soulbeast to get at you and it can easily get one-burst by a pull into traps just as easily as it can one-burst you. 
5. Willbender - This is strong vs Soulbeasts actually. It has enough teleports to stay on top of the Soulbeast so it has no breathing room for reposition or offensive cycles without taking a lot of DPS while performing the offense. If you stay aggressive with Willbender, it forces the Soulbeast to play nearly 100% defensively or it dies, which will discontinue his DPSing. It's the same reason why Power Herald should always counter DPS Soulbeast.
6. Engineer - It's in a bad place in general. Don't plan on countering anything with a Core Engi.
7. Scrapper - If it uses Flame Thrower and stays on top of the Soulbeast, the Soulbeast will lose unless the Soulbeast is an exceptionally better player than the Scrapper. When the Soulbeast is unable to use CCs to stop up the Scrapper, due to Juggernaut, the Soulbeast can't do what it needs to do to set up for bursts or survive.
8. Holosmith - It counters Soulbeast if it stays aggressive. However, if the Holo is a mediocre player and dawdles his actions wasting time and isn't aggressive enough, the Soulbeast will win.
9. Thief Daredevil Deadeye Specter - Sic Em One Wolf Pack Soulbeast is your ultimate counter. Stay away from Soulbeasts. You're own fault if you don't.
10. Ranger Druid Soulbeast Untamed - Tanky Ranger variants counter DPS Ranger variants. It's always been this way and it always will for certain reasons of how the class is designed. IF you want hard counter Soulbeast DPS, run tanky Ranger variants, especially condi. If the Soulbeast DPS is still beating you, he is outskilling you.
11. Mes Chrono Mirage Virtuoso - Any sustainy Mesmer build counters Soulbeast DPS, eventually. If you are dying to Soulbeast DPS as any Mesmer variant, you are seriously misunderstanding how to correctly play the Mesmer class.
12. Ele Tempest Weaver Cata - If you are not able to routinely kill Rangers or at least survive against them as any Ele build, you are doing something very wrong. Everything about the Ele class is designed to completely counter Ranger longbow DPS.
13. Necro Reaper Scourge - Sic Em One Wolf Pack Soulbeast is your ultimate counter. Stay away from them. You're own fault if you don't.
14. Harbinger - Right now it slightly counters Soulbeast IF it can get in close and stay on the Soulbeast. Don't approach the Soulbeast unless you know it is unaware of the approach and you can get in on him first, and then the Harbinger can statistically bully it.

OMFG, you are so kittening delusional... I guess for every class, you can write a list of how to counter them theoretically...

[Hotride.2187]

1 hour ago, Crozame.4098 said:

OMFG, you are so kittening delusional... I guess for every class, you can write a list of how to counter them theoretically..

Lol did I just read that war counters power SB. I guess if the ranger is braindead. Though maybe bladesworn has enough damage, who knows. It should have the sustain.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Hotride.2187

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

3 hours ago, Crozame.4098 said:

if I remember correctly untamed has port? On another note, given the amount of stealth, do rangers really need disengage teleports?

Notice I said specifically "the only class that does not have ground target/disengage teleports". Untamed has 1 janky teleport with the range of swipe that requires a direct opponent target that isn't even a stun break. Smoke Assault on Soulbeast is a better teleport.

 

3 hours ago, Crozame.4098 said:

OMFG, you are so kittening delusional... I guess for every class, you can write a list of how to counter them theoretically..

It's not theoretical, that's how it works.

What I explained to you is why you see no representation of Ranger in p2+ or in MATs or in things like Teapot's tournament.

 

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Lol did I just read that war counters power SB. I guess if the ranger is braindead. Though maybe bladesworn has enough damage, who knows. It should have the sustain.

You're not able to see it because the games you're in are probably full of silver & gold where people don't utilize environmental positioning and they don't know how to run their class correctly to begin with, and in that case Rapid Fire is easy to land.

We've been all through this in the forum for years and years. Ranger is a class that is very effective from low to middle tiers for the reasons I just mentioned. It is easy to land ranged attacks on players with bad map awareness who don't utilize their class kits correctly, and in that case when those players try to walk directly through 1500 range Longbow to close the gap on a Ranger while eating Rapid Fire, of course the Ranger is going to get a lead in damage. <- Stop doing that. It's that simple. However in higher tiered play, and I'm talking 1500+, Ranger's effectiveness curve begins to really drop off because players at those skill levels do have better map awareness, they know where the Ranger is and are keen to position to avoid obvious bursts, when they enter 1v1 against it, they don't walk in a direct line at it but rather move at it from behind obstacles until they can get on top of it, they utilize their class kits correctly like anti-projectile fields, blocks, dodges, invulns, blind spam, ect ect, and they in general have a much better intuitive feel for when a Ranger's burst is off CD and they begin kiting to make the Ranger fumble the burst, which is actually pretty easy to do, it's just that low to middle tiered players don't pay enough attention to opponent's CDs because well, they don't know the game well enough to worry about anything beyond their own CDs.

In a p2+ vs. p2+ 1v1 between a Spellbreaker and a DPS Soulbeast, the Spellbreaker definitely has the upper hand when he is utilizing environmental obstacles and knows the right times to switch between playing 100% counter-offensively and when to do short offensive dip-ins, which is the way he should be playing, not trying to go ham and chase a Ranger. This is how this situation usually pans out: A Soulbeast is on a node. The Spellbreaker approaches the node in such a manner to make sure it doesn't get popped by a Sic Em On Wolf Rapid Fire burst. When the Spellbreaker gets on the node, the Ranger has about 3 or 4 seconds to attempt to land a burst before it has to leave the node or die to CC train. The Ranger will then stay off node about mid-range and attempt to keep landing damage on the Spellbreaker with ranged attacks. Silver & Gold Spellbreakers will try to stand there on the node and keep capping it as they face tank damage and burn their CDs/Adren trying to mitigate damage, which sets them up to lose to the Ranger when it pushes back into the node. But Plat+ Spellbreakers know they need to stay on the Ranger and keep pressuring its CDs before it can regroup. The Plat+ Spellbreaker will chase the Ranger to keep it from obtaining a new advantageous positioning where it can utilize range. They push and pressure it with a lot of CC, which generally in turn makes the Ranger forced to have to kite even further out than mid range from the node. When happens, if the Spellbreaker is not already winning, they know to back up and begin kiting themselves, because they know the Ranger's next burst is about to recycle. This forces the Ranger to make a decision. Is he going to stay and attempt to offensively push a Spellbreaker who is now kiting and using LOS? When the Spellbreaker is the one kiting, he has a large advantage because Spellbreakers are very strong in their kill potential when they are the ones doing the kiting. If the Ranger thinks it isn't worth it, he can just leave, but the Spellbreaker takes the node. If the Ranger chooses to stay, he enters what can be one of the longest 1v1s to engage in conquest, Ranger vs. Spellbreaker, where it is easy for the Spellbreaker to push him off nodes for neutralization, but extremely difficult for the Ranger to cap a node or even neutralize the node out from under the Spellbreaker, and can take a very long time to land kill damage on the Spellbreaker if it can at all. In other words, it doesn't even matter who ultimately kills who, the Spellbreaker will have control of the node during the 1v1, and even if the Ranger kills it after an elongated 1v1, was it worth the time invested to stay and do it? Usually no it's not. Usually in that time the Ranger gets +'d and dies or dies to the Spellbreaker directly because if the Ranger messes up even once, the Spellbreaker can kill it from 100% health to 0% in 2 to 3 strikes after a good CC. Even the point gain isn't worth it compared to what the Ranger could have achieved elsewhere.

Spellbreaker counters DPS Soulbeasts in conquest. I'm not talking about tanky Core Rangers with Tail Swip and Maul. I'm talking about DPS Soulbeasts using Sic Em One Wolf Rapid Fire bursts, which is what you keep referencing.

Not lying to you here bro. This is how it goes. Soulbeast DPS is a mediocre build that works great in middle to low tiers while exploiting l2p issues, but struggles to maintain viability at all in higher tiered matches.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Crozame.4098]

3 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Notice I said specifically "the only class that does not have ground target/disengage teleports". Untamed has 1 janky teleport with the range of swipe that requires a direct opponent target that isn't even a stun break. Smoke Assault on Soulbeast is a better teleport.

LB 3 basically stealth every weapon swap.. Why would you need that? And war.. You can call that  500 range teleport fa disengage teleports, I guess... I would rather want the port tbh.

 

Quote

It's not theoretical, that's how it works.

What I explained to you is why you see no representation of Ranger in p2+ or in MATs or in things like Teapot's tournament.

 

 

There are plenty of rangers in p1 p2 games in the EU, and even condi trapper ones. And as I argued before, balance should not be based on MATs. But thats for another topic.

The main point is. I think Sind or Drazeh can also write detailed explanations how to counter scepter. Even the pre nerf Spellbreaker, one can write: bait the FC and dodge the F1, easy.  For harbinger, one can write that their harbinger bursts have slow animation and hence can dodge them, and then counter pressure.. etc etc... So, your arguments are just biased...

lastly, I cannot help to write something about your response to the other guy:

"In a p2+ vs. p2+ 1v1 between a Spellbreaker and a DPS Soulbeast, the Spellbreaker definitely has the upper hand when he is utilizing environmental obstacles and knows the right times to switch between playing 100% counter-offensively..."

Its just hilarious you think LB slb is a dueller... If you state this way, then one should not nerf HOLO at all, becuase Spellbreaker counters it in 1v1....

Edited March 31, 2022 by Crozame.4098

[Downstate.4697]

This whole thread is pepega and I regret creating it.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

1 hour ago, Crozame.4098 said:

Its just hilarious you think LB slb is a dueller..

That's because I'm one of like 5 people left between NA and EU that actually understands how to play Ranger at that level and get way with it amongst higher tiered players. You guys should listen to what I'm saying instead of arguing against it all of the time. I have no reason to lie to you. All I do is point out how things differ in dynamic vs. Ranger, between low tiers to high tiers. And I especially feel the need to point out when people are throwing around low tiered outlooks on Ranger balance, because what they see pan out in low to middle tiers, is nothing like how it pans out in middle to high tiers.

Someone needs to keep it real man, because if Rangers are nerfed even further than they already have been, the class will fall out of viability completely for middle to high tiers of play. Again, I give pretty unbiased feedback my dude. I have no reason to lie to you or propose secret agenda Ranger defense threads. I'm being completely 100% serious about this, Arenanet needs to leave Ranger alone, and in general they need to ignore feedback coming from players who haven't even fully learned the game yet.

 

 

Edited March 31, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Crozame.4098]

8 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

That's because I'm one of like 5 people left between NA and EU that actually understands how to play Ranger at that level and get way with it amongst higher tiered players. You guys should listen to what I'm saying instead of arguing against it all of the time. I have no reason to lie to you.

This is exactly the reason you are biased mate. And also, all your arguments are flawed. TBH, I really dont have problems with power ranger builds. If anything, I would like ANET to nerf condi rangers trapper builds. I am here mainly to make counter arguments to your reasonings.

Quote

All I do is point out how things differ in dynamic vs. Ranger, between low tiers to high tiers. And I especially feel the need to point out when people are throwing around low tiered outlooks on Ranger balance, because what they see pan out in low to middle tiers, is nothing like how it pans out in middle to high tiers.

Someone needs to keep it real man, because if Rangers are nerfed even further than they already have been, the class will fall out of viability completely for middle to high tiers of play. Again, I give pretty unbiased feedback my dude. I have no reason to lie to you or propose secret agenda Ranger defense threads. I'm being completely 100% serious about this, Arenanet needs to leave Ranger alone, and in general they need to ignore feedback coming from players who haven't even fully learned the game yet.

 

 

 

Edited April 1, 2022 by Crozame.4098

[Abyssisis.3971]

2 hours ago, Crozame.4098 said:

This is exactly the reason you are biased mate. And also, all your arguments are flawed. TBH, I really dont have problems with power ranger builds. If anything, I would like ANET to nerf condi rangers trapper builds. I am here mainly to make counter arguments to your reasonings.

 

You can be biased and still prevent the facts as they are.

[Crozame.4098]

1 hour ago, Abyssisis.3971 said:

You can be biased and still prevent the facts as they are.

But most of his/her writings were opinions not facts...

And I said, i believe Sind can write detailed methods to counter thief, Boyce about war/ranger/rev, Zan about Engi, etc etc. But that does not mean those classes are not op or need buffing...

 

Edited April 1, 2022 by Crozame.4098

[Hotride.2187]

On 3/31/2022 at 8:37 PM, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Not lying to you here bro. This is how it goes. Soulbeast DPS is a mediocre build that works great in middle to low tiers while exploiting l2p issues, but struggles to maintain viability at all in higher tiered matches.

Well I guess thanks for taking your time to explain what you mean with counter. I thought I'm meant to kill it 1v1 or something.

[Nezekan.2671]

One shot soulbeast present in highest level of play (AT). Tedantic is using it and actually one shot both on of the best thief players in GW2 ever (Sind) and Goku among other players.. Where are the people saying this will not see any play in high level? Watch Teapot's stream, it happened as I was typing this, but it will be in vod later.

Edited April 2, 2022 by Nezekan.2671

[Khalisto.5780]

fun build, being able to one shot pretty much every single class doesn't matter the build is a strong carry power

 

good thieves may farm you if they're better than you

 

i think mesmer is your strongest counter, since you need that target and condition counters you so much

 

tempest might be a hard target to kill, since shocking aura will kitten up your combo, a lot of projectile denial and a no crit trait will make your life a lot hard than it seems

 

i play sword/warhorn, lb, both weapon sets have dmg and scaping tools, with leaps and stealth. It's less dmg than running axe/wh but once you go higher ranks you need to survive when your combo goes wrong

 

I've been spamming this build with some level of success, i just play another build when i see more than 1 thief or mesmer in the other team, or a thief player that i know is more mechanically skilled than me

 

 

 

 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

Let's dive in and take a look at how the community has rated Soulbeast:

GW2 - Soulbeast Tier Listing - For Forum - Twitch

[Khalisto.5780]

11 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Let's dive in and take a look at how the community has rated Soulbeast:

GW2 - Soulbeast Tier Listing - For Forum - Twitch

it's the same case as dh, strong ranked carry prolly a -1 build if 2 or 3 players know what they're, which honestly will only happen at ATs and primetime games

the build we're talking about is not even that sic'em from metabattle, is a glassier variant using skirmishing which would prolly be rated even lower cuz it would die much easier in unexperieced hands

Edited April 11, 2022 by Khalisto.5780

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

16 minutes ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

it's the same case as dh, strong ranked carry prolly a -1 build if 2 or 3 players know what they're, which honestly will only happen at ATs and primetime games

Correction: It's only a strong carry build if it has the right comp with it and it is against a niche type of comp. Exactly the same as DH, which is why it isn't listed as meta or even great. They need specific circumstances to operate well and in the wrong circumstances those two builds are rendered almost entirely useless.

IE for Soulbeast DPS: If even one good Power Herald is on the enemy team, it can ride you all game and even if you keep winning the 1v1 against the Power Herald, it doesn't happen quickly and the Soulbeast contributes nothing to its team while being neutralized like this. He can't stand on a node, can't focus on decaps, can't focus on +ing, can't focus on nuking team fights. Even if the Power Herald keeps losing the 1v1, he is actually doing more for his team by neutralizing the Soulbeast DPS than the Soulbeast is doing by winning the 1v1. And no, the Soulbeast cannot simply ignore the Power Herald or it can one-burst him.

It's things like this ^ even when applied to the DH, why they aren't ultimately as reliable as other build structures. In the DH's case, a single class with reveals like a Bladesworn now that is rattling off constant reveals with shouts, completely counters DH into the ground and pretty much neutralizes him from play.

The things that are listed as Meta are things that only endure soft to medium counters due to their build structures. The things listed in great are builds that endure soft, medium, and even hard counters against them. But nothing in Meta or Great have any glaring weaknesses that essentially remove them from play. The things that have glaring weaknesses, are the things listed down in Good category, which pretty much means: "It's good but it's not great, and it definitely isn't meta".

After EOD dropped, there was an inordinate amount of super extra anti-projectile added to the game AGAIN, along with some new specs that are just really strong vs power damage, like Mechs on side nodes. If anything after EOD launch, Soulbeast DPS is less valuable than it's ever been, which is why I had to start running condi damage in probably about 50% of my matches lately, to deal with this EOD meta. And that's not to mention how some other classes like Harbinger are outputting similar burst damage to Soulbeast DPS every 9s instead of on a 30s and 60s cool-down.

Again, Soulbeast DPS looks good in bell curve play or bellow, but it really does struggle in higher tier play. There are some Ranger players who can make it look good in p2+ vs p2+ AT type scenes, but they are far and in between. What they are doing is not easy.

When a player come across a legend tier Ranger main on a Soulbeast who actually knows how to run that spec kitten near perfectly and mulches the game up, this is not a reason to come and complain the forum about "how strong Soulbeast is" because it is not the build that they are losing to, it was the legend tier Ranger. The same can be said for any other legendary veteran who is on their main. Just because a player gets mulched by a great Holosmith, does not mean the build in general is overperforming. Too many are posting in this forum lately who seem to not understand this.

Edited April 11, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Kozumi.5816]

On 3/23/2022 at 6:36 PM, FrownyClown.8402 said:

There is currently this build going around that effectively one shots in seconds that can only be xountered by a block or shocking aura.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POAFcEG7TZGsQGILiZiF719DYEpB-zZIDBzB

It essentially uses one wolf pack+hunters call+smoke assualt to kill anyone regardless of their build.

I am not saying its op or meta and the burst is limited to long cooldowns, but its pretty unhealthy in the way that it does damage and takes advantage of soulbeasts modifiers and should be addressed at some point. Just wanted to let anet know this exists.

Bigger issue in WvW. Probably the #1 build that causes new players to immediately quit pvp/wvw - which probably happens after dying to it once.

One wolf pack should do -99% dmg in pvp/wvw.

[Khalisto.5780]

2 minutes ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

Bigger issue in WvW. Probably the #1 build that causes new players to immediately quit pvp/wvw - which probably happens after dying to it once.

One wolf pack should do -99% dmg in pvp/wvw.

yup, wvw has always been more broken, more gear options, runes, infusions, foods + hitting ppl with zerg builds + kiting space

[Khalisto.5780]

9 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

When a player come across a legend tier Ranger main on a Soulbeast who actually knows how to run that spec kitten near perfectly and mulches the game up, this is not a reason to come and complain the forum about "how strong Soulbeast is" because it is not the build that they are losing to, it was the legend tier Ranger. The same can be said for any other legendary veteran who is on their main. Just because a player gets mulched by a great Holosmith, does not mean the build in general is overperforming. Too many are posting in this forum lately who seem to not understand this.

Not their fault tho, a g2 player shouldn't ever be matched agaisnt a legend player, as the time goes by they start looking at the leaderboards and realise they being farmed by a player 300 to 500 rating higher.

 

This doesn't take that much time to happen, as they get matched 3 matches in a row with/against a plat 2+ and the matches go 500-125 and they like "oh, i win no matter how badly i play when i'm in their team, i lose no matter how good i play when i'm against them" i quick look at leaderboards and this guy is prolly out of pvp for good.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

21 minutes ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

Bigger issue in WvW. Probably the #1 build that causes new players to immediately quit pvp/wvw - which probably happens after dying to it once.

One wolf pack should do -99% dmg in pvp/wvw.

 

15 minutes ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

yup, wvw has always been more broken, more gear options, runes, infusions, foods + hitting ppl with zerg builds + kiting space

I still feel like it's all l2p issues though. I mean yeah, Soulbeast is definitely a top 3 roamer in wvw, regardless of the build it uses. It can run extreme ranged DPS or it can even stat to be nigh invulnerable with damage reduction stacking, while still having somewhat dangerous DPS output in close to mid range with Axes & Greatsword.

However, the same can be said for many other classes. Due to the gear options provided and different skill splits, certain other things are definitely in that same category of top 3 roamers. A good Mirage as example is still a nightmare 1v1 that can only be stalemated and never actually won. And no I'm not talking about gold players on Mirages, I'm talking about when you actually run into a p2+ player in wvw who knows how to play Mirage. You can't actually kill it in a 1v1, doesn't matter what you're running. But it can kill you eventually, if you don't retreat and run.

Now listen to this as it is important:

Also honestly, I find that MOST classes have builds that can do the exact same things. Either be nigh invulnerable or have an unstoppable offense. It's just that people never experiment with anything outside of what metabattle tells them. The amount of players willing to take the time to get a hold of or craft more rare gear options is also much smaller than the amount of people who just want to throw together something that can be built cheaply with just gear provided from TP sales, which is easy to get a hold of.

The real sole reason why we see so many Longbow Soulbeast roamers, is because that entire gear outfit is built from simple cheap purchases from the TP. It doesn't require dungeon runs to make, or HOT currencies to get sigils, no craft level requires to build anything. No, you can just purchase Berserker/Pack Runes/Force&Impact/SweetSpicyButternut&SharpStone and be like "Alright' let's do this" <- That really is why there are so many of them. Other things are more difficult to build but are honestly far more rewarding than a simple LB Soulbeast in wvw. When you build something like a very expensive setup with Celestial gear and Absorption/Draining sigils as example, you can make builds that can legit win 1vX situations, no matter what classes they are against.

If there were more people who were REAL SERIOUS about wvw again, like back in the old wvw tournaments on release, you'd see people pushing to build the real meta again, and I guarantee you that you'd see a serious decline in Soulbeast play when godly expensive Mirages & Eles of all types began to show up on the scene. These are just two of the classes that can stat be nigh invulnerable in wvw and still have really heavy DPS output. These Eles as example, also qualify as straight zerg builds or even capable of commanding the zerg. They're aren't just niche roamers.

Edited April 11, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Khalisto.5780]

17 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

I still feel like it's all l2p issues though. 

I always think most of this wvw roamer players are the same ppl that camp low level respawns when pk is allowed.

 

They just feel good farming weaker ppl, in this case ppl trying to reach their zergs with builds not suited for 1v1

[Kozumi.5816]

5 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

I still feel like it's all l2p issues though.

It is, you can dodge it or use a stun break. The issue is that it's downright unfun and makes new players quit, which you NEVER want to have happen if you care about your game growing and staying alive.

There's no reason to have one shot builds like this in the game. It's very detrimental to the life of the game.

Edited April 12, 2022 by Kozumi.5816

[Mell.4873]

Honestly I do feel like a nerf is incoming hopefully just with Soulbeast. 

Im saying this because when the spirit charges are made and they now pulse something like quickness. Soulbeast will be that much stronger so I imagine they will nerf the burst synergy a little bit and Soulbeast will be some is a sort of stance quickness support. (right now it's just stances that are good boons for WvW burst) 

Edited April 12, 2022 by Mell.4873