Weaver and Tempest overnerfed and forgotten

[Kozumi.5816]

Tempest - Add alacrity share.

Weaver - Self 100% uptime alacrity(the spec feels horrible without alacrity). Revamp bottom traits to be barrier sharing.

Please help these underpowered elites.

[Puck.3697]

I think if they gave it to weaver everyone would scream for it, every proffession feels bad without alacrity realistically except auto attack centric builds ofcourse. 

They'd open a serious can of worms giving self alacrity uptime to dpsers. 

Imho alacrity shouldn't exist and they shoulda just buffed GCD speeds... They'd have alot more control of every specc seperately how fast they attack the scale it through properly but you know they won't go back on that now. 

Tempest defintly needs alacrity share tho. As soon as druid gets that and machinist already having it... Tempest will be made redundent sadly. 

 

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Weaver : Good balance would be to "oblige" sustain trait in the spec rather than running full DPS traits.
For example move Weaver's Prowess and Swift revenge to Grandmaster, and put only sustain traits in Master; and obviously tweak to maintain DPS.
So in Pve you could trait with Bolstered element trait + primordial stance, aqua stance, with no  dps loss.

 

I don't think Alacrity would be healthy; "bad" players won't benefit of a boon when they already struggle to survive or rotate skills while it will just make uber elementalists godlike once again. Before they nerf the class, once again, for everybody.

 

For tempest. Why not alacrity/quickness. But it's not just boon, you need unique buff to share.
Give active/offensive buffs with auras in pve. Like +5% strike and condi damage on fire aura, +10% critical damage on schoking aura, etc.

[Jski.6180]

Weaver should have a means of speeding it self up in casting for sure maybe an self quickness. Even if its just a trait where weaver cast faster with its wepon skills.

I would love to see Tempest get support alacrity the effect works so well with support classes over all. If they do give tempest quickness it needs to be a pure quickness shier not an quickness generation. Heat Sync needs to shier all aggressive boons on the tempest and Sand Squall needs to shier all def boons on the tempest (sadly the 3 + sec boon duration has been comply power creeper by the new rev dodge +2 sec boon duration effect.)

I must say this the new transmutation buff to making the skill a pure resources skills (3 sec cd is not long enofe to call it a cd skills) from it being an resources and cd skill helped out tempest a lot in support. I am very happily with the update and i do hope they expand on transmutation effects from just being a 1 trate effect skill.

[Kozumi.5816]

3 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

I think if they gave it to weaver everyone would scream for it, every proffession feels bad without alacrity realistically except auto attack centric builds ofcourse. 

Just to name a few: Reaper, Catalyst, and Harbringer, all feel fine without alac.

[Ragnarox.9601]

Weaver needs quickness maybe little alacrity. 

 

Tempest needs a lot of things cause it is bad for roaming.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

As I have said in the previous thread: weaver doesn't need quickness or alacrity.  It needs higher damage coefficients and the traits re-organized to give better health/sustain/defenses to the maximum DPS builds.  The reason for this is pretty simple: adding quickness or alacrity to the spec would only benefit specific solo-DPS specs that can take the traits, and nobody else.  Weaver needs buffs to all specs: more defense on the offensive builds, more offense on the defensive and utility builds.  

[Coldtart.4785]

6 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

They'd open a serious can of worms giving self alacrity uptime to dpsers. 

The golden child has already opened that can.

[Puck.3697]

48 minutes ago, Coldtart.4785 said:

The golden child has already opened that can.

I'm pretty certain guardian does not have self alacrity?. 

If we are talking willbender that is shared alacrity?  And no Condi builds gonna keep that up 100% 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Daddy.8125

[Coldtart.4785]

Willbender's alac traits are self-only by default and only become aoe if battle presence is used. Restorative virtues doesn't add much alac but is used in dps builds due to having an additional effect that's similar to self alac. Phoenix protocol isn't the main choice for dps builds but does see a lot of use in solo builds due to being able to maintain some decent uptime.

[bluberblasen.9684]

Don't forget to buff core elem too 🤫

[Puck.3697]

1 hour ago, Coldtart.4785 said:

Willbender's alac traits are self-only by default and only become aoe if battle presence is used. Restorative virtues doesn't add much alac but is used in dps builds due to having an additional effect that's similar to self alac. Phoenix protocol isn't the main choice for dps builds but does see a lot of use in solo builds due to being able to maintain some decent uptime.

 

well yeah, if we're gonna go "Oh well 20% Uptime counts" then Chronos has held onto this for ages.. so has Renegade.

but thats not whats being asked for here. the statement is 100% Uptime on alacrity Self applied. all Alacrity builds have base Alacrity. the point is ofcourse theres a large large difference between being able to give yourself a few seconds of alacrity every now and then and quite litterally Ramping a 100% Uptime in a pure DPS build.

there are certain things about weaver i think should have alacrity built in, I.E Weave self should have alacrity during use to reduce its boon Dependency dramatically. but i think 100% Alacrity uptime would be Extreme realistically.

Every proffession feels bad without it, the same argument is Applicable to quite litterally every specc in the entire game, Tbh i will go as far to say Litterally every proffession in the game Feels Worse without Any boon in the entire game.

u hit like a wet noodle compared to when u have boons. hence why Reaper became a HUGE Flock to, because Self-boon Reliance is ALOT more fun then trying to play something without any self-boons, the boon system of this game geninuely Damages the Open world / Solo enjoyment of the game realistically, because balance is so centred around it.

6 hours ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

Just to name a few: Reaper, Catalyst, and Harbringer, all feel fine without alac.

Reaper agreed, its a auto attack build, ofcourse it feels fine without Alacrity hence where i excluded auto attack builds

Catalyst Doesnt really feel fine without Alac however... its Just as boon reliant as Weaver realistically.

Weaver doesnt feel bad without alacrity in the same way and i've never understood the argument that is is... Cele Fire weaver does 16.8k DPS With self-boons only. its actually really strong and can pump for a Open world build given it also brings a SHED ton of Sustain ontop.

Weaver without alacrity feels as bad as anything else.

why? Because being behind a Slow GCD Feels bad in itself, Its common knowledge ALOT of people favor fast paced stuff.

First Critism u hear of people in FFXIV. Its boring to begin with due to a 2.5 sec GCD.

what caused the Uproar of WoW during a Period. GCD Changes making it feel slower.

its very typical. people assossiate ANYTHING slowing this down (I.E lack of Alacrity etc etc) is very negative overall.

As i said. Alacrity should have never been a thing. 100% Uptime should of never been a thing absolutely, Its Mental that every Proffession in the game Sits on a Identical GCD Because they've applied a System that makes Proffessions Play correctly.

Moving from Open world Enviroments into Organised Runs as a New Player quite litterally Identifys this immediately. because you learn your proffession on a Base GCD and walk in and Suddenly have to do that 2x Faster, its Extrmely Jarring and Uninituitive because Nothing in the game Warns you about this Prior it happening.

It feels bad across the board.

Open World players are Restricted Because of boon existence.

Once you've Experience it, its jarring and you have to relearn Ability pacing + Animation cancels because everythings faster.

Once you've gotten used to it, the entire game Excluding it feels Extremely bad.

its a Cycle with no positives... it Exists because Anet want to enforce some sorta trinity on the game due to the fact they decided to do a 180 on the orginal Design to push PvE into the game, and seemed unable to come up with anything more creative then Just enforcing boons as Harshly as possible.

 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Daddy.8125

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

I don't know what GCD stands for.

[The Boz.2038]

Global Cool Down. 
Basically, in Other, Older, Less Good Games, you could only press a skill once every 1.5-2.5 seconds. Using a skill put *all* your other skills on the 1.5-2.5s global cooldown. The only exceptions were "instants", stuff like your stun break. Makes combat hella slow, hella dull.

[Kozumi.5816]

11 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Weaver without alacrity feels as bad as anything else.

It really doesn't, I'm constantly waiting 2s+ on attunement CDs without alacrity and can't fluidly do my rotation. With alac I can.

[SeTect.5918]

10 minutes ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

It really doesn't, I'm constantly waiting 2s+ on attunement CDs without alacrity and can't fluidly do my rotation. With alac I can.

Agree. Maybe they should just add self alac on arcane spec. 

Bc its the QoL spec of ele. It neednt even be perma. Like 1 or 1.5 sec on attunement swap or something. That would also give weaver bigger advantage out of it bc it can swap faster. Also bc weaver is in bigger need of alac than cata or temp. 

Mesmers also have self quickness (even perma / almost perma) on their QoL spec on core (Illusions). 

Not saying that mesmers would be op. Just saying that ele wouldn't be alone with a top tier boon on their QoL spec.

Edited April 5, 2022 by SeTect.5918

[Puck.3697]

23 minutes ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

It really doesn't, I'm constantly waiting 2s+ on attunement CDs without alacrity and can't fluidly do my rotation. With alac I can.

In open world a full rotation doesn't exist. In group / raid content you have a alacrity provider. 

Self alacrity would only be reasoned as a solo build realistically. 

Also as someone who plays cele fire weaver solo I really don't see these 2 sec auto attack wait times..

Generally with weaver Im permanently pressing buttons. Weaver is one of the few proffessions in open world I am never sat there waiting on CDs. 

Attunements as weaver has a 4 second CD. Between using its utilities certain animation lengths and more I rly don't ever sit around on CDs. 

Also talking attunement CDs. 

How can you complain a 4 second CD on attunements is too long but say a 10 second CD on them is better? 

Edited April 5, 2022 by Daddy.8125

[Ruisen.9471]

I don't think Anet ever figured out the role for Tempest.  It was designed as a support, but used as a DPS because Druid existed and it was a great DPS for awhile.   Would be nice to get alac.   

Weaver really just needs higher DPS.   It was actually played in raids back when it benchmarks over 40k.   A higher DPS ceiling also lowers the skill floor because it means beginner rotations will also do better.

 

Edited April 6, 2022 by Ruisen.9471

[TheQuickFox.3826]

On 4/5/2022 at 10:40 AM, bluberblasen.9684 said:

Don't forget to buff core elem too 🤫

 

Community has been numbed so far that most stopped asking for core ele buffs. After years of asking, it never happened.

Core ele died with the introduction of Tempest, was buried with the introduction of Weaver and it's existence was forgotten with the introduction of Catalyst.

Edited April 6, 2022 by TheQuickFox.3826

[AliamRationem.5172]

Just now, TheQuickFox.3826 said:

 

Community has been numbed so far that most stopped asking for core ele buffs. After years of asking, it never happened.

Core ele died with the introduction of Tempest and was buried with the introduction of Weaver.

They would need to rethink the design of elite specs to make core specs relevant.  That elites have access to everything the core spec does in addition to an exclusive weapon, set of utilities, trait line and class gimmick (e.g. overloads, dual attunements/skills) makes it pretty difficult for the core spec to compete.

It could be done, but it would probably require adding an exclusive set of utilities, a core F5 skill, and some sort of bonus for taking a third core trait line at the very least.  This might be worth looking into since they are planning to go back and revamp underutilized weapon sets and redoing LS1.

[Ruisen.9471]

But is there really a difference between core ele experience and playing catalyst without a hammer?

 

On a serious note, elite specs use core traits too, so buffing core would also power creep every class.   I think it would be much easier to increase variety if they could just balance different weapons to be viable.

[Kozumi.5816]

23 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

In open world a full rotation doesn't exist.

There's plenty of champions, legendaries and world bosses open world. 

Edited April 6, 2022 by Kozumi.5816

[Puck.3697]

17 minutes ago, Kozumi.5816 said:

There's plenty of champions, legendaries and world bosses open world. 

True, and weaver does very well v those, id still argue the fact it's completely melee without ranged options is a much larger issue to those fights however. 

[AliamRationem.5172]

2 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

True, and weaver does very well v those, id still argue the fact it's completely melee without ranged options is a much larger issue to those fights however. 

Yeah, that lack of a weapon swap really gets in the way for a pure melee build with no ability to swap in combat.  I hope they update conjured weapons to better compensate for that.

[Ruisen.9471]

3 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

True, and weaver does very well v those, id still argue the fact it's completely melee without ranged options is a much larger issue to those fights however. 

Weaver used to be ranged, staff was meta for years until they nerfed it to the ground.