Why Core guardian support is preffered over firebrand support?

[Serperior.6541]

dosen't firebrand has the same stuff as core guardian but way more with books? then why core is meta over firebrand? it is not that i find it weird i wanted to know why

[Tescao.3042]

Perhaps 5vs5 is holding back FB. As in WoW, the Death Knight is held back to some extent by the arena, on the battlefield, he begins to control mass death. (Unholly and Blood. Frost is more explosive in solo target)

Edit: Maybe someone is interested. Arthas was created by the Nathrezim, the representatives of death. Arthas was unholly DK, Blood DK is the Nathrezim themselves. DKs were created from Warriors and Paladins who fell in battle.

Edited May 28, 2022 by DomHemingway.8436

[Zyreva.1078]

Core virtues are on shorter cd and instant. FB also has to give up a core trait line (valor) which decreases it's self sustain. As a result FB can't survive when getting focused. And a dead support is a worthless support.

(In WvW more stability, minstrel's gear and sheer numbers make it much easier to survive for support players, so FB is still the preferred choice there).

Edited May 28, 2022 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Bazsi.2734]

There is a joke about hunting rabbits. While trying to shoot one, you shoot ahead of it by 1 meter, than behind it by the same distance... if you average those out, statistically you shot the bunny twice.

I guess this is what A-net is going for with FB and scourge, as for 3 years they were absolutely SS+ tier monsters in sPvP... so here comes 3 years of absolute uselessness. If my calculations are correct(which I base on the rabbit joke, so they must be), we'll see FB rebalanced properly in 2024.

[Dadnir.5038]

I'm pretty sure the reason is that FB support have pretty much been nerfed to the ground in sPvP after people complained that it was "OP". For example, Mantra of solace going from healing and giving aegis to your allies to... well... the joke it is right now.

[Vancho.8750]

2 hours ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

There is a joke about hunting rabbits. While trying to shoot one, you shoot ahead of it by 1 meter, than behind it by the same distance... if you average those out, statistically you shot the bunny twice.

I guess this is what A-net is going for with FB and scourge, as for 3 years they were absolutely SS+ tier monsters in sPvP... so here comes 3 years of absolute uselessness. If my calculations are correct(which I base on the rabbit joke, so they must be), we'll see FB rebalanced properly in 2024.

It will be longer, Berserker was benched 2017 and it wasn't as meta as those two, it was relevant for a week after the rework but it got nerfed quite quickly, so scourge and FB popping in SPVP will have to do with some kind of rework or changes to core that somehow buff them, but Arenanet does barely any meaningful mechanical changes every 6 months supposedly, so old specs probably will stay dead in a ditch .

The whole dampening meta that those two did was not exactly fun for anyone but the current surprise teleport and spam aoes kind of deserves kitten like FB/Scourge. 

[Shao.7236]

Overly nerfed with skills that have no impact whatsoever.

[Buran.3796]

   FB was so overnerfed (support, damage and sustain) that in PvP without the stats available in WvW is trash; it also has to waste a traitline in "Firebrand", which doesn't benefit the support role core Guardian mostly does. Also the axe has 0 synergies with that function. So no reason to run FB. Core Guard is just better.

[Gashi.4327]

You don‘t play Firebrand, because you lose out on too much when playing it over Core Guard. You have no more instant cast, insanely short boon durations, a mantra heal that heals for 200HP per cast on Avatar amulet and long virtue cooldowns.

 

The actual issue is that Anet tends to overnerf specs and never actually tries to rebalance them after they kill them. Firebrand isn‘t the only example - Chrono, Berserker & Druid are as well members of that club 

[Stand The Wall.6987]

to be more specific, its cuz the accumulated nerfs to tomes and the condi cleanse mantra. to be a viable support, you need team heals and cleanse as well as self sustain. when you take firebrand, you take virtues and honor and lose valors altruistic healing which is a great self sustain tool and currently nothing in firebrand replaces the self sustain loss.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Stand The Wall.6987

[otto.5684]

On 5/28/2022 at 6:56 AM, Serperior.6541 said:

dosen't firebrand has the same stuff as core guardian but way more with books? then why core is meta over firebrand? it is not that i find it weird i wanted to know why

It was, but between the nerfing of tomes, boons and mantra’s, you are better off running Valor over FB. For kittens sake, the heal mantra does not heal.

Edited May 30, 2022 by otto.5684